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[Wonko_C]

Eat crow Wonko_C I was right and Sony did it.

At least quote me on what I said because I don't remember every single thing I post on forums.

 

[delirium trigger]

I don't exactly know how they calculated the cost but at 260 dollars, they could easily be losing money on this. The retailers make money, too.

 

[fart town usa]

You can't say you know that support from Sony would be "fuck all" even if the headset sold well, and even there was no change, what about third parties? My point stands...

The headset has been out for like 18 months or so. We know what Sony has been working on, what they've cancelled, who they shut down, etc. They already have 2 VR games in production, that was a pleasant surprise considering that news came out when the production of the headset was put on hold. That's two more games than most people expected. There's no way in hell that Sony would have rushed some VR game into production if the headset would have sold double, the audience is so small.

and even there was no change, what about third parties?

I pointed out the third party support and that it's been carrying the headset. Third parties would have ported more games, that's a given considering some studios have already come out and said that PSVR2 is risky due to how small the market is and how many resources it takes to port to PSVR2..

I'm not saying any of this stuff to shit on the headset, I'm one of its biggest fans on Gaf. I hope the price cut becomes permanent but it's still not going to cause Sony do anything more than they've done already.

 

[the_master]

The Shortcut reports a source showed it retailer data revealing a 2350% increase in PSVR 2 headset sales on the first day of the sale compared to the day before, and that this represented more units in one day than had been previously sold all year so far.

It seems that price is ultimately the deciding factor. It could be partly due to the recently announced Steam VR compatibility, but considering that the PSVR 1 market was bigger than the Steam VR market, I would bet that the price just wasn't right.

It's unbelievable that after all these years in the market, and considering that price was a key factor in the success of the PSX and the initial failure of the PS3, Sony still hasn't learned the lesson.

Source

This numbers don’t make much sense to me.

It sold 23 times and a half more than the day before, but this year has had 7 months already, so about 140 working days…
So the day before the prive drop still sold a lot compared to the 139 other days, considering that 23,5 times that day are more than the 139 other days together. Maybe the price was not the only thing at play.

 

[BlackTron]

The headset has been out for like 18 months or so. We know what Sony has been working on, what they've cancelled, who they shut down, etc. They already have 2 VR games in production, that was a pleasant surprise considering that news came out when the production of the headset was put on hold. That's two more games than most people expected. There's no way in hell that Sony would have rushed some VR game into production if the headset would have sold double, the audience is so small.

Double? This says they sold more in one day than they had all year, suggesting way more than double.

Maybe this is where our disconnect is. It appears to me the difference would be massive. We're talking the difference between launching with Zelda and launching with 1-2 Switch massive. With that kind of numerical difference I'd simply expect more support for it.

 

[fart town usa]

As previously pointed out by another poster, it was priced for early adopters to recoup RnD and keep skin in the game, it was worth it for me considering how much fun I had with it

Yea, I was totally fine paying the price at launch. Even if Village was the only game I owned I'd still be fine with it. I have roughly 70 games now, absolutely worth the money. Some of the recent additions to favorite games of all time list are PSVR2 games; Organ Quarter, Propagation: Paradise Hotel, Foglands, Legendary Tales, Hubris, Cactus Cowboy: Desert Warfare, Soul Covenant. The headset is amazing if you have a bit of patience and keep an open mind. Organ Quarter especially, I just figured it'd be some janky mediocre horror game, it's seriously one of the best games I've ever played. I was in absolute awe when it dawned on me that I was playing a PSX-era Survival Horror masterpiece.

 

[K' Dash]

That thing is $550?

 

[CLW]

 

[Battlesmurf]

2 things kept me from it- lack of backwards compat and price. Otherwise- the specs and hardware seem good!

 

[skit_data]

 

[sncvsrtoip]

delete

 

[sncvsrtoip]

2 things kept me from it- lack of backwards compat and price. Otherwise- the specs and hardware seem good!

to be honest without patches increasing resolution backward compatibility would be mostly useless (at least for me, couldnt stand bluriness of psvr1)

 

[thismeinteil]

So they sold 10 of them?

So it's outselling the Xbox Series, now? Nice.

 

[mckmas8808]

As previously pointed out by another poster, it was priced for early adopters to recoup RnD and keep skin in the game, it was worth it for me considering how much fun I had with it

Yeah but a 100% profit is INSANE man. Like COME ON Sony! I bought one too and happy about, but that much profit is just stupid.

 

[FoxMcChief]

So it's outselling the Xbox Series, now? Nice.

If that’s the metric you need to use, then shit is dire.

 

[thismeinteil]

If that’s the metric you need to use, then shit is dire.

For an accessory. Imagine how bad it is for Xbox being the main piece of kit.

 

[FoxMcChief]

For an accessory. Imagine how bad it is for Xbox being the main piece of kit.

Sales for both are horrible.

 

[RJMacready73]

Yeah but a 100% profit is INSANE man. Like COME ON Sony! I bought one too and happy about, but that much profit is just stupid.

How do you think Sony pays for all these risks?

 

[MarkMe2525]

Again, try to keep up.

Sony didn't put out the PSVR2 thinking it was going to sell 20 million units. They built a VR headset to stay engaged in the market in case the market turned heavily towards VR. Not every product is positioned to be a big market seller.

Sony could have designed the PSVR2 to be a stand-alone unit, they didn't. They could have made it wireless, they didn't. The reality is they probably made it as cheap as they could given the minimum viable product. And like I said, post sales Sony could have released a version that did not have OLED. You ignored this because it doesn't fit into your narrative. Sony probably looked at a non-OLED model and determined the price wouldn't be considerably less and it would require additional marketing resources, and still not shift significant units.

There is no real price they could have sold this for significantly less from the get go and still had this be a measurable improvement over the PSVR1, which was still had an MSRP of above 300 dollars. Certainly not from launch.

For some reason people struggle to understand product goals. If the goal is to stay involved in VR to potentially catch market winds, but NOT take a loss in the process, you get exactly what you get with the PSVR2.

Just like Sony has an accessibility controller, they're not expecting people who aren't in the market for that controller to buy it. They sold PSVR2 to die hard VR fans, who paid a premium to buy it.

The only question that remains is whether they're out of the VR business or if they're squeezed enough blood from the core VR community and are now aiming for something more mainstream with PC compatibility.

You ask me to keep up, yet you continue to run off the rails with strawmen and speculative assertions.

Sony didn't put out the PSVR2 thinking it was going to sell 20 million units. They built a VR headset to stay engaged in the market in case the market turned heavily towards VR. Not every product is positioned to be a big market seller.

Another strawman, no one is suggesting that Sony needed to sell 20 million units to build a viable market for the platform. The rest is you speculating on the inner workings of Sony's decision making. Also, while I would agree that not every product is positioned to be a big market seller, that doesn't discount the reality that Sony (unknowingly) positioned the PSVR2 to be a market failure, at least currently.

Sony could have designed the PSVR2 to be a stand-alone unit, they didn't. They could have made it wireless, they didn't. The reality is they probably made it as cheap as they could given the minimum viable product.

The fact that various actions could have been taken does not validate your claim regarding the "minimum viable product" status of a PlayStation VR headset. You just can't define it as so and have reality conform to your definition. Your use of MVP also seems to be in direct contradiction to what the term actually means. (Which is humorous considering you were claiming that I didn't understand the concept of a MVP.)

Frank Robinson, who coined the term, defines MVP as "The MVP is the right-sized product for your company and your customer", an explanatory example is given and goes as follows, "Let's say we have a product that was built from scratch with many features that consumed a lot of time, effort, and money. When it was launched to the market, users didn't like the idea and the product was a failure. In this example scenario, the product team wasted all its resources to create something big that was not even needed in the market. The principle of MVP states that product teams should instead aim to build something useful with minimal features and effort."

As we can see, my position is Sony should have built a simpler, lower cost headset that leveraged the power of the PS5 and software as its defining feature, which perfectly aligns with the ethos of building an MVP. Your position seems to be a speculative assertion that the PSVR2, in its current form, is a mvp product, the market reaction has shown this not to be the case.

And like I said, post sales Sony could have released a version that did not have OLED. You ignored this because it doesn't fit into your narrative. Sony probably looked at a non-OLED model and determined the price wouldn't be considerably less and it would require additional marketing resources, and still not shift significant units.

More baseless and speculative assertions that pretend to know the mind and reasonings of the people designing the PSVR2. You incorrectly assert that I have "ignored the fact that Sony could be releasing a non OLED version, post sale." In reality my very first post in this thread postulated that maybe they were clearing inventory for a new revision of the PSVR2.

There is no real price they could have sold this for significantly less from the get go and still had this be a measurable improvement over the PSVR1, which was still had an MSRP of above 300 dollars. Certainly not from launch.

Speculation and a false dilemma, your premise seems to be that the only way to have a "measurable improvement over the PSVR1" was to release a PSVR2 in its current configuration or something close to it. Just bad reasoning. A like for like product to the PSVR1, with inside out tracking, displaying native PS5 VR games would produce a "measurable improvement." Hell, a PSVR1 itself that took advantage of the PS5 graphical capabilities would be a measurable improvement. While I concede that PSVR1 like headset would not be super attractive at face value, this point invalidates your premise.

For some reason people struggle to understand product goals. If the goal is to stay involved in VR to potentially catch market winds, but NOT take a loss in the process, you get exactly what you get with the PSVR2.

You imply I don't understand the product goals, which is not true. I am stating that their "product goals" did not align with what the market wanted. You end with another false dilemma, that the only way to "potentially catch market winds, but not take a loss" was to build a headset with the PSVR2's configuration. That's just your opinion dude (another assertion) and not backed up by any demonstrable evidence.

Just like Sony has an accessibility controller, they're not expecting people who aren't in the market for that controller to buy it. They sold PSVR2 to die hard VR fans, who paid a premium to buy it.

More speculation. I can do that too. "I believe that Sony wanted to build a VR headset that would captivate gamers to grow their VR market. Unlike the accessibility controller, who is not aimed at mainstream markets, they hoped to attract gamers, with next level VR features, that looking were for the next big thing in gaming."

So I ask, can you formulate an argument, that does not rely on fallacy or speculative assertions, that refutes my premise. I will repeat it for a third time for you, please try to not to go off the rails. "It seems reasonable to argue they should have built a cheaper to produce headset, as the price point has obviously affected the growth, of their VR platform, in a negative way."

 

[CitizenKratos]

Wow. Considering he usually makes content with a lot of critical sarcasm this went pretty well.

Now play the top end games Bosman!

 

[fart town usa]

Thats actually a really cool video. I expected a hate boner but not at all. So easy to get downright sick in those early sessions, he handled himself well.

 

[saintjules]

Edit: Beaten

 

[night13x]

The combo of cutting the price by $200 and pcvr support coming next week has made me go from "this is dead in the water" to "hmmmm im now interested"

Picked up the horizon bundle, G923 with the stick shifter, charging set, and no man's sky today. Will get the pc adaptor next week when it releases.

 

[hemo memo]

I’ve said it before and I will say it again, even at $350 it’s still high.

 

[alphachino]

I’ve said it before and I will say it again, even at $350 it’s still high.

nah... 350 is cheap. I think it's at the cusp of impulse purchase territory for many working folk in the western hemisphere at least.

 

[MarkMe2525]

nah... 350 is cheap. I think it's at the cusp of impulse purchase territory for many working folk in the western hemisphere at least.

It really is amazing how much more attractive the bundle looks at $350. Hopefully someone will figure out a way to get the PSVR2's distinguishing features working on PC. If that were to happen, it would give the Quest 3 a run for its money as the go to affordable headset for PCVR.

 

[hemo memo]

nah... 350 is cheap. I think it's at the cusp of impulse purchase territory for many working folk in the western hemisphere at least.

350 is cheap? You have the options of smartphones, tablets, laptops, smartwatches and headphones that are far better investment at that price or less. 350 is not cheap.

 

[Resenge]

350 is cheap? You have the options of smartphones, tablets, laptops, smartwatches and headphones that are far better investment at that price or less. 350 is not cheap.

 

[R6Rider]

350 is not cheap.

 

[Gameplay Gods Bless]

The Shortcut reports a source showed it retailer data revealing a 2350% increase in PSVR 2 headset sales on the first day of the sale compared to the day before, and that this represented more units in one day than had been previously sold all year so far.

It seems that price is ultimately the deciding factor. It could be partly due to the recently announced Steam VR compatibility, but considering that the PSVR 1 market was bigger than the Steam VR market, I would bet that the price just wasn't right.

It's unbelievable that after all these years in the market, and considering that price was a key factor in the success of the PSX and the initial failure of the PS3, Sony still hasn't learned the lesson.

Source

Yes and sales would increase by a billion if they sold it for $0.01.

 

[CoreyFlawless]

Cause, 500 is just to much for something I made use here and there or not use again after the first month. When it 200, I bite then for the hell of it

 

[willothedog]

At this price sony is still earning money

That is just BoM. Do you think manufacturing, marketing and distribution are free?

 

[sncvsrtoip]

That is just BoM. Do you think manufacturing, marketing and distribution are free?

Thx for info captain obvious ;d

 

[Melon Husk]

It still can't compete with Quest which is all-in-one. It should be $250 tops. Sony is used to selling their consoles at a loss, why not the headset?

Because it's an R&D project paid by early adopter consumers? Possibly. Sony is not serious about VR until they make a new headset that sells at a loss.

 

[sncvsrtoip]

It still can't compete with Quest which is all-in-one. It should be $250 tops.

Its like saying ps5 cant compete with iphone, it is all in one but some people prefers gt7 vs mobile gaming.

 

[fart town usa]

It still can't compete with Quest which is all-in-one. It should be $250 tops. Sony is used to selling their consoles at a loss, why not the headset?

Because it's an R&D project paid by early adopter consumers? Possibly. Sony is not serious about VR until they make a new headset that sells at a loss.

PSVR2 absolutely competes with Quest when you factor in the need to upgrade the headstrap and buy extra batteries, which every Quest owner tells newcomers to do. Quest builds are easily more expensive than the stock $550 PSVR2.

I also agree that $550 is way too much for 9/10 buyers.

 

[Melon Husk]

PSVR2 absolutely competes with Quest when you factor in the need to upgrade the headstrap and buy extra batteries, which every Quest owner tells newcomers to do. Quest builds are easily more expensive than the stock $550 PSVR2.

I also agree that $550 is way too much for 9/10 buyers.

PSVR2 requires a PS5... or a gaming PC for a reduced experience. I know mobile graphics suck but it doesn't matter when you're playing Beat Saber. Quest works anywhere, wirelessly. PSVR2 can't compete.

 

[Resenge]

PSVR2 requires a PS5... or a gaming PC for a reduced experience. I know mobile graphics suck but it doesn't matter when you're playing Beat Saber. Quest works anywhere, wirelessly. PSVR2 can't compete

It sure matters when your playing the newest Resident evil games or Gran Turismo games. I have multiple headsets including all Quests and both PSVR's, I play my Quest 3 way more than the PSVR2 but to say that it cant compete is bad argument imo. I would be much more excited with a PSVR2/PCVR port big budget title than a Quest 3 port.

 

[BlackTron]

to be honest without patches increasing resolution backward compatibility would be mostly useless (at least for me, couldnt stand bluriness of psvr1)

I found PS4 Pro to improve VR1 games and I'm not so sure it's because they were all patched for Pro. Maybe they just have something like auto resolution scaling, there might be room for improvement without patches.

 

[sncvsrtoip]

I found PS4 Pro to improve VR1 games and I'm not so sure it's because they were all patched for Pro.

Psvr1 games with improvement on pro were patched (with exception for titles with dynamic res)

 

[BlackTron]

Psvr1 games with improvement on pro were patched (with exception for titles with dynamic res)

I think we're both right but I needed to make sure I wasn't just misremembering better games without patches, and found this from back in 2016 when it came out.

Well, it’s a complex answer. Objectively speaking, yes, PS VR games do look better when running on a PS4 Pro. After setting them both up, side-by-side, on the same television using the same headset, I can confirm that games are noticeably sharper and crisper, especially if they have received an official patch incorporating support for PS4 Pro. Games like Battlezone and PS VR Worlds were patched ahead of time for testing, but even games like Driveclub VR, which didn’t have official Pro patches yet, looked crisper and smoother inside the headset.

PlayStation 4 Pro Review: Does It Improve The PS VR Experience?

Sony has been awfully busy so far in 2016. Less than a month since the PlayStation VR headset released into the wild, the gaming giant is already releasing a brand new iterative upgrade on its flagship gaming console. This week, the PlayStation 4 Pro will release, offering 4K resolutions, HDR

www.uploadvr.com

Obviously patched games look better but again, the possibility exists for improvement without it. Of course there are other reasons VR1 BC would be very unlikely to work out.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Make me wonder if PS5 Digital would sell better if they lower the price to €299?

 

[cyberheater]

Looks like the sale has ended. I was hoping for a permanent price drop.

 

[John Wick]

I just see no point in it. I think Sony should have learnt from the first one. It's too niche and Sony don't have or wont support it enough to make it a hot item. 5 million of the first unit should have been the writing on the wall. Sony are struggling to make games for PS5 never mind PSVR2 as well. Just dilutes resources and wastes developer time.

 

[CitizenKratos]

I just see no point in it. I think Sony should have learnt from the first one. It's too niche and Sony don't have or wont support it enough to make it a hot item. 5 million of the first unit should have been the writing on the wall. Sony are struggling to make games for PS5 never mind PSVR2 as well. Just dilutes resources and wastes developer time.

I disagree. They’ve not spent much 1st party dev time to support it yet. I’m happy GT7 was hybrid. I’m happy for the RE support and other 3rd party support. They [Sony] are struggling to make games this gen but that’s another issue. Thankfully the software and hardware [VR2] have been on point and most likely profitable for all parties.

 

[yurqqa]

Would buy it instantly if they release new Astrobot VR game.

First one was definitely a masterpiece. İt felt like next 4th gen platformer after 3 generations defined by Mario games 2D->Mario64->Galaxy

 

[RJMacready73]

350 is cheap? You have the options of smartphones, tablets, laptops, smartwatches and headphones that are far better investment at that price or less. 350 is not cheap.

Are you for real kid? £350 is an absolute bargain at that price, considering the tech you are getting and how good the fecking thing actually is and one other thing £350 is gonna buy you a shit laptop and a shit smartphone, it'll get you a decent smartwatch mind, i paid nearly £6-700 for mine with all the best games for it and i consider it a bargain, 350 is a fucking steal.

Also check out the spec's compared to PCVR headsets and none of them come close to value for money, OLED, HDR, Eye Tracking, Haptics, Just works out of the box... 350 not cheap.. wtf

 

[dragonyeuw]

Looks like the sale has ended. I was hoping for a permanent price drop.

They need to permanently reduce to $399 before the year ends IMO.

 

[hemo memo]

Are you for real kid?

Relax. I’m older than you.

 

[RJMacready73]

Relax. I’m older than you.

so in yer early 30's ;-P