I would disagree. I would say the difficulty is very comparable between the two games. I think I died a few more times on Puppeteer, actually.
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Puppeteer |OT| $40, No Strings Attached
- Thread starter PhantomOfTheKnight
- Start date
I would disagree. I would say the difficulty is very comparable between the two games. I think I died a few more times on Puppeteer, actually.
Wolfgunblood Garopa
Member
That is surprising, as Puppeteer hands you the game on a platter and only has a few moments of complex platforming on the level of RL (which is a much more demanding game all around).
I don't want to hate on the game, it's just really disappointing. Everything else about it is almost too good.
Hmm, yeah, I don't know, I didn't have any issues whatsoever on Rayman Legends besides the bonus world (absolutely loved the game, though). I thought it was probably easier overall. That not to say I think Puppeteer is HARD - it's definitely not - but it wasn't easy, either.
Nocturnowl
Member
My impressions for this game have been in a jumble ever since I finished it, in a sense I wasn't quite sure how I felt about it.
So i've given it a few days complete with replaying a few stages and I think i've come to a conclusion.
This is a good platformer that falls short of being truly great, I find it very "Kirby-esque" in a sense, no not in how it outright plays but in how i'm left feeling about the whole game. To explain I find that It's a thoroughly charming (not a descriptor I like using but it really fits here) and visually pleasing game that's enjoyable to play and overall satisfying but it never quite pushed my grin-o-meter from slight smile into widespread super grin, outside of the Moon Bear King that is, more on him later. Creative but lacking that extra factor that elevates the whole experience to the top of the platforming pile, when I say that its reminiscent of Kirby titles in this respect that's no bad thing, there's still fun to be had with a game that's bursting with a sense of joy and aks that you just sit back, relax and enjoy the show.
The presentation is through the roof living and breathing its theatre dynamic in a way that one must truly applaud but the gameplay doesn't reach the same heights despite a nice bagful of tricks at Kutaro's disposal. Even with the hero heads and enjoyably snippy scissor shenanigans it all begins to blend together, while the settings are constantly shifting scenes of visual splendour from start to finish overflowing with new assets and painstaking attention to detail every step of the way what you do in the stages themselves is often the same set of actions. Say that you'll ascend upwards by snipping up various moving objects, this could occur through pulling scenery towards you with the grapple, using bombs wisely and shaking things up with a ground pound and while the game ties these various mechanics together in a nice organic way the actual progression is overly familiar at times as these simple actions lead to similar results. Kutaro doesn't have much to his jumping skills either, a satisfyingly springy sound accompanying a rather low jump that opts for full control in movement over all else and as such doesn't take momentum into account which is fine, it's still fun to bounce around and make the various jumps presented to you, it's just that the jumps are never that taxing as a result.
There's also a very automated feel at a few points, while the games dynamic "mine cart" like sections play well with this style of gameplay appearing relatively infrequently and being gripping enough that it's enjoyable in its simplicity I can't really say the same for the parts where you cut across the pre set lines for extended periods of time. Overall I get the impression that while the game had more than enough visual content to spread across the 7 acts (that are quite lenghty at that) there never felt like quite enough variation in what you as the player do so the main mechanics end up spread a bit too thin, take for example how often the springy object idea is repackaged in various visual forms across the game. That said some stages still stand out more than others, Act 6 (especially Scene 1, lovely stuff in
) and Act 5 came across as noticeably stronger than the other acts in my book.
Despite these small faults with the platforming side of things the game itself plays well, controls are snappy, they nailed the feeling of cutting through fabric and it's all polished up to a lovely sheen. Can't say i'm much of a fan of poking around the scenery with Pikarina (who is also a character I find really grating at times, narrator is tops however), scenery prodding while leading to some nice visual results can hamper the flow at points and the way heads and collectables are handled can be a tad frustrating like when you lose the head you need for a secret because another head dropped in your lap, really need to remember to keep those new heads in the backlog. The stage length factors in here as well as missing a single soul or head and then having to go back through a rather long and leisurely paced stage once again isn't really appealing. Some stages/scenes with multiple area themes and even multiple bosses really come across like you could've cut them into two separate stages which would help replayability but while helping gameplay flow it might mess with the narrative flow so that's not really a solution.
But hey lets mention something this game gets very much right where the rest of the genre so often goes wrong, boss battles. Puppeteers boss battles are frequent, maybe too frequent and kind of long at times yet they never really bugged me due to how well they're handled. Often my complaint about bosses in platformers is how thay don't play to the games strengths as far as mechanics go, but the abilities given by the hero heads as well as Calibrus itself are all used wonderfully against beautifully animated screen filling bosses. In a way these bosses feel almost like a dungeon boss in a Zelda title which is to say they function in an almost puzzle like way that tests your ability to use your arsenal to expose the weak points and then lay the smackdown while also keeping you on your toes with a variety of attacks. Bosses don't feel separate from the actual stages, they almost feel like part of the stage itself, entwined with various platforming moments in between striking their weak points which makes them more varied than most "rule of three hits" bosses. Much like the level design the bosses do sometimes come across as a bit more of the same, there's only so many moves available so snipping up high above a bosses head and pounding down can be a bit too frequent but it's a small qualm in the grand scheme of things, bosses have been done right and that's more than good enough for me.
Speaking of bosses, the Moon Bear King himself is just fantastic, he borders on scenery chewing levels of gleeful villainy with his sweeping motions and booming voice, the perfect villain for a piece such as this and I adored every scene he was a part of along with his formidable theme music. The plot is nice and simple with optional extra reading via the books you unlock to explain more about certain side characters in an enjoyably grim way. A quick shout out to the writing in the head gallery, I loved reading the little bits of witty dialogue for each head and some of the head actions/animations are great fun to watch, gives me something to do if I encounter the rare instance of unskippable dialogue on stage replays.
As i've been typing this i've been listening to the soundtrack by Patrick Doyle, it's good stuff but to my dismay this soundtrack here is missing a few notable tracks, the music from the previously mentioned head gallery is so damn good but it's not on here, such a shame. The soundtrack overall has a tone to it that straddles the line between whimsical and spookily sinister a lot of the time with its orchestration that gives off a fairy tale like feel. It's leans more towards that movie style than video game catchiness but that's never been much of an issue for me, it fits like a glove.
So as usual I waffled on far more than I initially planned to, I enjoyed my time with Puppeteer even if i'm more of a guy who gave light applause at the dropping of the final curtain as opposed to a standing ovation. I'm more of a gameplay first and plot distant second kind of guy and moreso in this genre so it doesn't aim to topple any of my favourites but I understand the direction it went for and I appreciate more style diversity within the genre as well as more retail release platformers crafted with care like this one. It's a pleasant ride, the game flow can be a bit stop and go while the difficulty level remains consistent in not asking much of the player but it's still worth a trip to the theatre which for further added authenticity comes with a "programme" in PAL copies which is a nice touch (it's the instruction manual by the way).
So i've given it a few days complete with replaying a few stages and I think i've come to a conclusion.
This is a good platformer that falls short of being truly great, I find it very "Kirby-esque" in a sense, no not in how it outright plays but in how i'm left feeling about the whole game. To explain I find that It's a thoroughly charming (not a descriptor I like using but it really fits here) and visually pleasing game that's enjoyable to play and overall satisfying but it never quite pushed my grin-o-meter from slight smile into widespread super grin, outside of the Moon Bear King that is, more on him later. Creative but lacking that extra factor that elevates the whole experience to the top of the platforming pile, when I say that its reminiscent of Kirby titles in this respect that's no bad thing, there's still fun to be had with a game that's bursting with a sense of joy and aks that you just sit back, relax and enjoy the show.
The presentation is through the roof living and breathing its theatre dynamic in a way that one must truly applaud but the gameplay doesn't reach the same heights despite a nice bagful of tricks at Kutaro's disposal. Even with the hero heads and enjoyably snippy scissor shenanigans it all begins to blend together, while the settings are constantly shifting scenes of visual splendour from start to finish overflowing with new assets and painstaking attention to detail every step of the way what you do in the stages themselves is often the same set of actions. Say that you'll ascend upwards by snipping up various moving objects, this could occur through pulling scenery towards you with the grapple, using bombs wisely and shaking things up with a ground pound and while the game ties these various mechanics together in a nice organic way the actual progression is overly familiar at times as these simple actions lead to similar results. Kutaro doesn't have much to his jumping skills either, a satisfyingly springy sound accompanying a rather low jump that opts for full control in movement over all else and as such doesn't take momentum into account which is fine, it's still fun to bounce around and make the various jumps presented to you, it's just that the jumps are never that taxing as a result.
There's also a very automated feel at a few points, while the games dynamic "mine cart" like sections play well with this style of gameplay appearing relatively infrequently and being gripping enough that it's enjoyable in its simplicity I can't really say the same for the parts where you cut across the pre set lines for extended periods of time. Overall I get the impression that while the game had more than enough visual content to spread across the 7 acts (that are quite lenghty at that) there never felt like quite enough variation in what you as the player do so the main mechanics end up spread a bit too thin, take for example how often the springy object idea is repackaged in various visual forms across the game. That said some stages still stand out more than others, Act 6 (especially Scene 1, lovely stuff in
the hourglass and the following Rabbit fight
Despite these small faults with the platforming side of things the game itself plays well, controls are snappy, they nailed the feeling of cutting through fabric and it's all polished up to a lovely sheen. Can't say i'm much of a fan of poking around the scenery with Pikarina (who is also a character I find really grating at times, narrator is tops however), scenery prodding while leading to some nice visual results can hamper the flow at points and the way heads and collectables are handled can be a tad frustrating like when you lose the head you need for a secret because another head dropped in your lap, really need to remember to keep those new heads in the backlog. The stage length factors in here as well as missing a single soul or head and then having to go back through a rather long and leisurely paced stage once again isn't really appealing. Some stages/scenes with multiple area themes and even multiple bosses really come across like you could've cut them into two separate stages which would help replayability but while helping gameplay flow it might mess with the narrative flow so that's not really a solution.
But hey lets mention something this game gets very much right where the rest of the genre so often goes wrong, boss battles. Puppeteers boss battles are frequent, maybe too frequent and kind of long at times yet they never really bugged me due to how well they're handled. Often my complaint about bosses in platformers is how thay don't play to the games strengths as far as mechanics go, but the abilities given by the hero heads as well as Calibrus itself are all used wonderfully against beautifully animated screen filling bosses. In a way these bosses feel almost like a dungeon boss in a Zelda title which is to say they function in an almost puzzle like way that tests your ability to use your arsenal to expose the weak points and then lay the smackdown while also keeping you on your toes with a variety of attacks. Bosses don't feel separate from the actual stages, they almost feel like part of the stage itself, entwined with various platforming moments in between striking their weak points which makes them more varied than most "rule of three hits" bosses. Much like the level design the bosses do sometimes come across as a bit more of the same, there's only so many moves available so snipping up high above a bosses head and pounding down can be a bit too frequent but it's a small qualm in the grand scheme of things, bosses have been done right and that's more than good enough for me.
Speaking of bosses, the Moon Bear King himself is just fantastic, he borders on scenery chewing levels of gleeful villainy with his sweeping motions and booming voice, the perfect villain for a piece such as this and I adored every scene he was a part of along with his formidable theme music. The plot is nice and simple with optional extra reading via the books you unlock to explain more about certain side characters in an enjoyably grim way. A quick shout out to the writing in the head gallery, I loved reading the little bits of witty dialogue for each head and some of the head actions/animations are great fun to watch, gives me something to do if I encounter the rare instance of unskippable dialogue on stage replays.
As i've been typing this i've been listening to the soundtrack by Patrick Doyle, it's good stuff but to my dismay this soundtrack here is missing a few notable tracks, the music from the previously mentioned head gallery is so damn good but it's not on here, such a shame. The soundtrack overall has a tone to it that straddles the line between whimsical and spookily sinister a lot of the time with its orchestration that gives off a fairy tale like feel. It's leans more towards that movie style than video game catchiness but that's never been much of an issue for me, it fits like a glove.
So as usual I waffled on far more than I initially planned to, I enjoyed my time with Puppeteer even if i'm more of a guy who gave light applause at the dropping of the final curtain as opposed to a standing ovation. I'm more of a gameplay first and plot distant second kind of guy and moreso in this genre so it doesn't aim to topple any of my favourites but I understand the direction it went for and I appreciate more style diversity within the genre as well as more retail release platformers crafted with care like this one. It's a pleasant ride, the game flow can be a bit stop and go while the difficulty level remains consistent in not asking much of the player but it's still worth a trip to the theatre which for further added authenticity comes with a "programme" in PAL copies which is a nice touch (it's the instruction manual by the way).
Wow, excellent impressions. Very thorough, and you articulated a lot of observations I found difficult to put into words. I agree with your individual observations, save for cutting along the seams, which I found consistently fun due to the addition of jumping and branching paths. I also see the game as more of a puzzle/platformer hybrid, with item-based traversal/puzzles like the dungeons in a Zelda game, so it's a bit of an "apples and oranges" situation when it comes to other platformers.
I'd also say that, while I agree with your individual observations, for the most part, and while I'm happy you liked the game, I have to say that for me, the game as a whole was far more than the sum of its parts. Truly one of my favorite games this year and this generation. If I were made of money, I'd buy a copy for everyone on these boards. As per my other thread, I hope everyone finds the opportunity to play it. Borrow it (and the system) from a friend, rent it, whatever -- it's just such a magical feel-good experience, not quite like anything else in games.
batman2million
Member
Really want to pick this up but already cluttered with so many games. By any chance i happen to catch up i'll pick this up right away or once I find a really good deal.
This game caught my eye when I first saw it, been looking forward to it since.
This game caught my eye when I first saw it, been looking forward to it since.
It's MAGIC! I find myself rewatching levels on YouTube just for fun, I love the presentation so much, and seeing the gameplay I get this twitchy desire in my hands to cut stuff and bounce off of things, lol.
Honestly, making this available on PS4 and giving it some sort of marketing push this time is what the game deserves. As it stands, it's currently being overlooked on PS3 due to GTAV and the approaching next-gen consoles.
weremichael
Member
I completely agree. I'm afraid that it is truly going to be one of those games that has a cult following (for a very good reason) and yet never gains the momentum to get it beyond critical acclaim. Bummer.
This game is so charming. I can't help but being mesmerized by the presentation. Everything looks so good. I'm sad that this is going to be overshadowed by GTA V thanks to unfortunate release timing.
I agree that they should try to re-release this as PS4 title. I will seriously double-dip if they package it inside a Steelbook.
I agree that they should try to re-release this as PS4 title. I will seriously double-dip if they package it inside a Steelbook.
Jigolo
Member
came to post this. Good on Sony for doing this
EDIT: the soundtrack is AMAZING. holy crap
Cave Johnson
Member
Just want to ask: Does this game have frame-rate issues? Because that's pretty much a cardinal sin in platformers especially 2D ones. That being said, you think the game should've been better off as a PS4 release title being at 1080p/60fps to actually maximize the potential and control issues of the game?
Nocturnowl
Member
Thanks.Wow, excellent impressions. Very thorough, and you articulated a lot of observations I found difficult to put into words. I agree with your individual observations, save for cutting along the seams, which I found consistently fun due to the addition of jumping and branching paths. I also see the game as more of a puzzle/platformer hybrid, with item-based traversal/puzzles like the dungeons in a Zelda game, so it's a bit of an "apples and oranges" situation when it comes to other platformers.
I'd also say that, while I agree with your individual observations, for the most part, and while I'm happy you liked the game, I have to say that for me, the game as a whole was far more than the sum of its parts. Truly one of my favorite games this year and this generation. If I were made of money, I'd buy a copy for everyone on these boards. As per my other thread, I hope everyone finds the opportunity to play it. Borrow it (and the system) from a friend, rent it, whatever -- it's just such a magical feel-good experience, not quite like anything else in games.
Puzzle/Platformer hybrid does fit quite well (not to be confused with actual Puzzle Platformers), then you've got to factor in its narrative and presentation approach which further gives it its own identity among platforming games.
I know that people have thrown some fear around regarding 30FPS which isn't entirley unwarranted (for example DKCR 3D loses something with the lower frame rate compared to the original) but I never noticed anything that bothered me about how well the game runs, its pace must work well the frame rate because it comes out pretty smooth to me but then again i'm not often affected by these details as much as others.
No control issues that i'm aware of, though being a PS4 title would likely have helped in stand out a bit more due to the limited offerings and release gaps that come with the early console period.
Acquiescence
Member
Replaying through the game isn't the exercise in frustration I feared it would be. A copious amount of cutscenes there may be, but they can all be skipped quickly enough, and tutorials can now be bypassed by running straight into newly added teleporters - quite considerate of the developers!
Getting all the souls is proving to be a real bitch though.
No frame-rate issues for me. As far as I could tell, no matter how busy the game got, it always remained locked at 30.
Getting all the souls is proving to be a real bitch though.
No frame-rate issues for me. As far as I could tell, no matter how busy the game got, it always remained locked at 30.
RpgN
Junior Member
Gameplay wise, the game is really coming together in act 4 I feel.
. The game was still enjoyable before that and it kept getting better, but now I feel it's hitting its stride. Not sure if there will be more that can affect the gameplay after that?
The game is absolutely charming and imaginative. Sometimes I feel like there are too many cutscenes but I still wouldn't change that as it suits the game so nicely. There are also so many references to movies and games, it makes it more enjoyable. It's weird how the game mixes references of other works along with capitalism in its jokes. It's like there's some irony in the game that is intended for the audience. As if the author is aware that a game like it being made in 2013 is very risky and you don't have many of it on consoles anymore. Or maybe I'm looking too much into it XD
After you unlock all the 4 main power ups and the power upgrade to Calibrus, the movements become more fluid and the puzzles become more varied
The game is absolutely charming and imaginative. Sometimes I feel like there are too many cutscenes but I still wouldn't change that as it suits the game so nicely. There are also so many references to movies and games, it makes it more enjoyable. It's weird how the game mixes references of other works along with capitalism in its jokes. It's like there's some irony in the game that is intended for the audience. As if the author is aware that a game like it being made in 2013 is very risky and you don't have many of it on consoles anymore. Or maybe I'm looking too much into it XD
Same here
I'm starting up Act 5 today. Goes without saying that the presentation is amazing and the star of the show. I love the Calibrus mechanics too. My biggest complaint is that I have to fight the urge to skip cut scenes at times. On one hand I want to see the visuals on the other the cut scenes can be too drawn out. The game can be a little sluggish at times too due to the frame rate.
Finished it earlier. Incredible game. My one gripe is that the ending could have been... more. After the spectacular presentation of everything else, and the clever stories in the storybooks, I kind of expected something a bit more clever and poignant.
Even so, one of the best games I've played all year. I loved everything about it so much.
Even so, one of the best games I've played all year. I loved everything about it so much.
GribbleGrunger
Dreams in Digital
having bought this yesterday and played it for 5 hours, I know (even without reading this thread) that the majority of people are either enjoying it or recommending it. I can tell you that I advocate BOTH. Do not let this be another ICO situation people. This game is pure joy and eye candy. It's difficult but not frustrating, which is the perfect combination in my opinion. BRILLIANT. And don't make the mistake of thinking it all happens on one stage, it doesn't.
Has anyone watched the story book sections? They've got a really well done sad sophistication about them like classic fairy tales (not the Disney-fied versions). The stories also give these melancholy pasts to all the characters. Check em out if you haven't! Best story books in a video game since Shadows of the Damned.
Yup, watched them all. They're excellent. I just wish there were more!
This game has a little bit too much of the bullshit features that pushed me away from AAA games almost entirely earlier this year.
It's a really good platformer -- when it actually let's you play the game. The tutorials are way too long and so are some of the cut scenes. Overall there are times when the game just won't shut up. When I first put this game in I was kind of expecting the gameplay to stand on its own as a sort of interactive puppet show. Because of that I don't really see how the cut scenes are necessary. The narrator is great, and they should've just had him preface each level.
Going ahead into Act 4 I hope there are more levels like the rotating castle in Act 1 or the rotating tree in Act 2.
It's a really good platformer -- when it actually let's you play the game. The tutorials are way too long and so are some of the cut scenes. Overall there are times when the game just won't shut up. When I first put this game in I was kind of expecting the gameplay to stand on its own as a sort of interactive puppet show. Because of that I don't really see how the cut scenes are necessary. The narrator is great, and they should've just had him preface each level.
Going ahead into Act 4 I hope there are more levels like the rotating castle in Act 1 or the rotating tree in Act 2.
Napalm_Frank
Member
Miles Quaritch
Member
I haven't been able to play more than a curtain every couple of nights (if I'm lucky)...kind of depressing as I want to get on and see some of the amazing later levels people are talking about but it's just not possible.
Kinda makes me wish there was a Vita version, if only so I could play it more...
Kinda makes me wish there was a Vita version, if only so I could play it more...
Katana_Strikes
Member
Oh my gosh /pikarina. This game is fantastic!!
The presentation is just sublime. The music is glorious. The gameplay keeps throwing at you so many wonderous things. It's never a dull moment in this game. And it's surprisingly long. Especially the acts/levels. Just when you think you're at the end of the act there's another long section afterwards, but they never outstay their welcome. Acts are varied and you're always doing something new or seeing new stuff. The heads are so cute and cool and the game has such great character and characters.
The presentation is just sublime. The music is glorious. The gameplay keeps throwing at you so many wonderous things. It's never a dull moment in this game. And it's surprisingly long. Especially the acts/levels. Just when you think you're at the end of the act there's another long section afterwards, but they never outstay their welcome. Acts are varied and you're always doing something new or seeing new stuff. The heads are so cute and cool and the game has such great character and characters.
olimpia84
Member
Just finished this game. Simply amazing, one of the best presented videogames in history. The audio/visual presentation is out of this world throughout the entire game and I really liked how each curtain level was vastly different from one another in terms of themes. The platforming was fun, maybe not top-notch stuff like a Mario or Rayman game but definitely fun and unique thanks to the use of Calibrus and the other moves you learn as you progress through this game.
Hopefully more people go out there and buy this game, I really want to see a sequel for this...don't care if it's on the PS3, Vita or PS4 just give more Puppeteer!
Hopefully more people go out there and buy this game, I really want to see a sequel for this...don't care if it's on the PS3, Vita or PS4 just give more Puppeteer!
papercan55
Member
only a 22 page thread for one of the top 5 ps3 games.
I can't wait for all those threads in a few years asking why puppeteer just disappeared.
You ask for beautiful and creative games all the time, and when they come you just ignore them.
for shame gaf.....for shame
I can't wait for all those threads in a few years asking why puppeteer just disappeared.
You ask for beautiful and creative games all the time, and when they come you just ignore them.
for shame gaf.....for shame
I've been replaying most of the game and i'd like to give some constructive feedback on the things that could have been better.
The biggest problem i had with this game, surprisingly, were the controls. Before this, i played a lot of Rayman Legends and somehow i never was really happy with the controls in Puppeteer. Sure, they weren't slow (i never had a problem with the LBP controls by the way since i accepted them in the context of that game) but they never felt as snappy and precise as i prefer my platform games to be. I never felt 100% in control. I've been trying to pin down why i don't like it as much as e.g. Rayman but i'm not sure. Is it the smoothness from higher framerate (30 versus 60)? I have the impression that Kutaro is a tad "over"-animated which makes him feel ever so slightly magnetic and rubbery (if that makes sense). It might even be that it isn't slow at all but that it is the level design and lack of some traditional platform mechanics that make me feel somewhat unsure about the controls.
Now one could argue that the game and level design was such that you didn't need ultra snappy and precise controls and that is indeed the case for most of the game. But i'd rather have ultra precise and snappy controls in a level design that needs it since it can result in a lot more satisfaction from a gameplay point of view. In Puppeteer, frankly i don't recall one moment when i was genuinely pleased or satisfied over completing something (in a challenge/skill/gameplay point of view).
I also missed some basic mechanics that can add a lot of fun to platform games: things like double jump or adjustable height jump (which would have made the body slam more fun in this game for example), wall jumping, some sort of float mechanic to correct a jump mid air,... I strongly believe that these mechanics could have added a lot to the gameplay. If you only allow single jump in your game, as a game designer, you're limiting yourself in the amount of things you can do with the jump mechanism level design wise, which is evident in Puppeteer.
On the issue of level design, most scenes are very short and compact parts consisting of rather simple gameplay lasting a couple of screens. There is rarely a larger open area where you can create a nice flow and gameplay rhytm. You jump a few times, throw a bomb, scissor some pathway, destroy an enemy or two and go to the next section, dialogue, cutscene, next section,... There were far too many interruptions and the gameplay areas felt small, with little room to manouver. The scenes felt a tad claustrophobic and lacked overview.
When you strip down the dazzling visuals, you're left with a pretty simple and easy game that never puts up any challenge to the player. I had masses of lives without even putting an effort into collecting them and i never felt like i had to put in an effort to progress. Now, i'm an average gamer and my games don't have to be very challenging to be fun but in this case, it bothered me. But that was probably because i didn't get enough satisfaction out of the platforming.
I felt that there were far too many boss fights in this game. Nearly each curtain had a boss. And while the bosses were creative and imaginative in how they looked, they never felt like any sort of challenge. Mind you, i don't like boss fights in games in general.
The head mechanism was somewhat of a missed opportunity. I still don't understand the logic behind the way the secrets needed to be unlocked with the head that you were actually wearing. Unless i'm missing something, there was no clue or way to know which head was going to be needed so it all came down to pure luck if you were wearing that particular head at that particular time in the level (you could easily have swapped it for another head just before you needed it). Re-collecting the heads that had fallen off (to not loose a life) was equally "luck" based since often the head just fell into an area you couldn't reach. Also, i'd rather had 20 heads with a real impact on the gameplay than 100 heads of which few did something substantial gameplay wise.
The scissor mechanic was a quite creative way to traverse the world. At times, it was fantastic to see pathways open up out of water, clouds, cards or an exploding chicken. But as a gameplay mechanic to traverse, it felt rather unprecise and not snappy enough. Cutting along the seams was used way too many times and didn't add enough to the gameplay.
All in all, this game had a quite big arsenal of gameplay mechanics but none of them felt fleshed out enough to add something substantial to the game. And i understand that this game has it's own idendity when it comes to gameplay. It definately has a more slower, exploration based approach to the "platform" genre. But there were a lot of platform sections. So i think it's fair to judge it as a platform game "with a twist".
The best way to illustrate how i felt about the gameplay was the entire Act 4 (the wild west section). Upon replaying, it struck me how simple and basic the gameplay was throughout that entire act and it felt like i was just going through it without any feeling of actually playing a game.
In the end, i tend to agree with the eurogamer review (not necessarily the score though): "It comes frustratingly close to delivering something special. But despite multiple gameplay avenues bursting with potential, it leaves them largely unexplored, showing more interest in wowing you with surface sizzle."
If there ever is a Puppeteer 2, i hope the team will develop a compelling game first and only then add that amazing layer of presentation. If they manage to do that, it will be a fantastic game.
And i for one hope Japan studio will have another go at it. Because it was certainly a worthwile first attempt. There is much to love about Puppeteer. It just needed a bit more substance on the gameplay side of things.
The biggest problem i had with this game, surprisingly, were the controls. Before this, i played a lot of Rayman Legends and somehow i never was really happy with the controls in Puppeteer. Sure, they weren't slow (i never had a problem with the LBP controls by the way since i accepted them in the context of that game) but they never felt as snappy and precise as i prefer my platform games to be. I never felt 100% in control. I've been trying to pin down why i don't like it as much as e.g. Rayman but i'm not sure. Is it the smoothness from higher framerate (30 versus 60)? I have the impression that Kutaro is a tad "over"-animated which makes him feel ever so slightly magnetic and rubbery (if that makes sense). It might even be that it isn't slow at all but that it is the level design and lack of some traditional platform mechanics that make me feel somewhat unsure about the controls.
Now one could argue that the game and level design was such that you didn't need ultra snappy and precise controls and that is indeed the case for most of the game. But i'd rather have ultra precise and snappy controls in a level design that needs it since it can result in a lot more satisfaction from a gameplay point of view. In Puppeteer, frankly i don't recall one moment when i was genuinely pleased or satisfied over completing something (in a challenge/skill/gameplay point of view).
I also missed some basic mechanics that can add a lot of fun to platform games: things like double jump or adjustable height jump (which would have made the body slam more fun in this game for example), wall jumping, some sort of float mechanic to correct a jump mid air,... I strongly believe that these mechanics could have added a lot to the gameplay. If you only allow single jump in your game, as a game designer, you're limiting yourself in the amount of things you can do with the jump mechanism level design wise, which is evident in Puppeteer.
On the issue of level design, most scenes are very short and compact parts consisting of rather simple gameplay lasting a couple of screens. There is rarely a larger open area where you can create a nice flow and gameplay rhytm. You jump a few times, throw a bomb, scissor some pathway, destroy an enemy or two and go to the next section, dialogue, cutscene, next section,... There were far too many interruptions and the gameplay areas felt small, with little room to manouver. The scenes felt a tad claustrophobic and lacked overview.
When you strip down the dazzling visuals, you're left with a pretty simple and easy game that never puts up any challenge to the player. I had masses of lives without even putting an effort into collecting them and i never felt like i had to put in an effort to progress. Now, i'm an average gamer and my games don't have to be very challenging to be fun but in this case, it bothered me. But that was probably because i didn't get enough satisfaction out of the platforming.
I felt that there were far too many boss fights in this game. Nearly each curtain had a boss. And while the bosses were creative and imaginative in how they looked, they never felt like any sort of challenge. Mind you, i don't like boss fights in games in general.
The head mechanism was somewhat of a missed opportunity. I still don't understand the logic behind the way the secrets needed to be unlocked with the head that you were actually wearing. Unless i'm missing something, there was no clue or way to know which head was going to be needed so it all came down to pure luck if you were wearing that particular head at that particular time in the level (you could easily have swapped it for another head just before you needed it). Re-collecting the heads that had fallen off (to not loose a life) was equally "luck" based since often the head just fell into an area you couldn't reach. Also, i'd rather had 20 heads with a real impact on the gameplay than 100 heads of which few did something substantial gameplay wise.
The scissor mechanic was a quite creative way to traverse the world. At times, it was fantastic to see pathways open up out of water, clouds, cards or an exploding chicken. But as a gameplay mechanic to traverse, it felt rather unprecise and not snappy enough. Cutting along the seams was used way too many times and didn't add enough to the gameplay.
All in all, this game had a quite big arsenal of gameplay mechanics but none of them felt fleshed out enough to add something substantial to the game. And i understand that this game has it's own idendity when it comes to gameplay. It definately has a more slower, exploration based approach to the "platform" genre. But there were a lot of platform sections. So i think it's fair to judge it as a platform game "with a twist".
The best way to illustrate how i felt about the gameplay was the entire Act 4 (the wild west section). Upon replaying, it struck me how simple and basic the gameplay was throughout that entire act and it felt like i was just going through it without any feeling of actually playing a game.
In the end, i tend to agree with the eurogamer review (not necessarily the score though): "It comes frustratingly close to delivering something special. But despite multiple gameplay avenues bursting with potential, it leaves them largely unexplored, showing more interest in wowing you with surface sizzle."
If there ever is a Puppeteer 2, i hope the team will develop a compelling game first and only then add that amazing layer of presentation. If they manage to do that, it will be a fantastic game.
And i for one hope Japan studio will have another go at it. Because it was certainly a worthwile first attempt. There is much to love about Puppeteer. It just needed a bit more substance on the gameplay side of things.
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
wouwie,
I agree with a lot of what you say, but I don't think you give enough credit to what Puppeteer does right.
There is some decent challenge in the game, and it's paced well within the linear structure of the game. It's not the most difficult game in the world, and I always managed to overcome any part that was giving me difficulty rather easily, but at the same time I always felt engaged with the game and there never seemed to be a dull or repetitive moment.
The combination of mechanics (cutting, slamming, blocking, grappling, bombing) comes together quite well at the end, and the game throws you these obstacles with enough regularity that you never really get bored doing any one thing.
And the boss battles to me are some of the best moments in the game. Sure, they're not hard once you figure out the patterns, but that's part of the fun of boss battles. The fact that nearly each curtain has a well-produced boss battle is one of the big highlights of the game for me.
I do agree that there's room for significant improvement in the challenge of the platforming and diversity of mechanics, as well as making the levels flow a bit more like a traditional platformer (without as many interrupting stage shifts), but overall even with the title's shortcomings, it's better than the vast majority of titles in the genre I've played in years.
I think Neiteio said it best when the whole was greater than the sum of its parts.
I agree with a lot of what you say, but I don't think you give enough credit to what Puppeteer does right.
There is some decent challenge in the game, and it's paced well within the linear structure of the game. It's not the most difficult game in the world, and I always managed to overcome any part that was giving me difficulty rather easily, but at the same time I always felt engaged with the game and there never seemed to be a dull or repetitive moment.
The combination of mechanics (cutting, slamming, blocking, grappling, bombing) comes together quite well at the end, and the game throws you these obstacles with enough regularity that you never really get bored doing any one thing.
And the boss battles to me are some of the best moments in the game. Sure, they're not hard once you figure out the patterns, but that's part of the fun of boss battles. The fact that nearly each curtain has a well-produced boss battle is one of the big highlights of the game for me.
I do agree that there's room for significant improvement in the challenge of the platforming and diversity of mechanics, as well as making the levels flow a bit more like a traditional platformer (without as many interrupting stage shifts), but overall even with the title's shortcomings, it's better than the vast majority of titles in the genre I've played in years.
I think Neiteio said it best when the whole was greater than the sum of its parts.
Yep, of all places I didn't really expect GAF to turn a blind eye on such a unique title.
Miles Quaritch
Member
That's not really fair. It might simply not be to everyone's tastes or perhaps it came along at a time where they couldn't justify buying it.
coughlanio
Member
I really want to buy this, just to support titles like this, but sadly I think I'll have to wait for a PSN discount, or the January lull, whichever comes first.
Katana_Strikes
Member
Oh boy the music in this game. The music. It's beautiful.
Is the soundtrack on PSN?
Also I never followed the development of the game but surely the devs were heavily inspired by LBP right? I mean a lot of the levels I felt looked and seemed like they could have come from LBP. I think that's a lot to do with the craft style artstyle of the games.
Is the soundtrack on PSN?
Also I never followed the development of the game but surely the devs were heavily inspired by LBP right? I mean a lot of the levels I felt looked and seemed like they could have come from LBP. I think that's a lot to do with the craft style artstyle of the games.
olimpia84
Member
I'm not sure what the devs have said but imo this game got inspiration straight up by the Marionetta level in LBP Vita
Lord Error
Insane For Sony
Started playing this last night. So far I absolutely love it - it was really hard to stop playing it when I had to stop. It's a game where you really want to see what comes next, everything it shows is so interesting and varied. Controls are spot on, tight and precise, and you won't be sliding off the platforms where it seems like you shouldn't be sliding when you start your jumps. Grab the ledge function also helps giving you a bit more leeway. Am I right in thinking that Two Player mode has 2nd player using Move to move the cat around the screen? If so, that's nice how any casual player can help out main player.
I also can't say enough how amazing this game looks. It's probably the best looking sidescrolling game I've ever seen.
I also can't say enough how amazing this game looks. It's probably the best looking sidescrolling game I've ever seen.
Sword Of Doom
Member
This game is just so beautiful. II constantly find myself excited about what I'm going to see next.
Also, I checked my message box and sure enough Sony had sent me a message with the theatrical pack attachment
Also, I checked my message box and sure enough Sony had sent me a message with the theatrical pack attachment
#1 defender
Member
Did anyone have problems finding the Vine Head? After replaying A1C2 a couple of times and having no success despite being very thorough, i've finally looked it up online and knowing where and how to get it, it still doesn't work for me. Is there a trick to it, or did i run into a glitch?
Edit: Nevermind, seems i was doing it wrong, found it now.
Edit 2: Might as well give my impressions on the game.
I've preordered the game but only got it a week ago. Like some of you, i was savouring the experience and only played through a curtain or two per night. I've finished it last night and it was a gleeful experience. I'm not a huge fan of platformers, but i like games like this one, where you can tell that tons of love and attention went into making it. The presentation is fantastic across the board, the game has a lovely art style and looks pretty clean. The backgrounds have so much detail and interactive hotspots. The score is great too and i'm glad i got the digital version of it, but it's a downer that some of the best tracks are missing from the tracklist. The humour is pretty good too most of the time, with lots of references to all sort of things. I didn't always laugh out loud, but i did smile constantly. I love how everything has been made with the theatrical theme in mind, not just the levels themselves, but also the menus, with the mechanical act selection map, the curtains, the head collection in which the heads are displayed like theater props, the pause screen (Intermission), and the manual (Programme). Then there are the genuinely funny descriptions and animations for each of the 104 heads, kudos to everyone involved!
I also liked the 3 curtain structure and how every act kept building up to the main boss confrontation. Another thing i appretiated in this context is how even though each act adhered to a certain theme, each curtain within them still had their own thing going on regarding the setting and gameplay. Speaking of bosses, the boss fights were very entertaining and even though they share some common elements, most of them put their own spin on it, so it doesn't feel too repetitive. The QTE finishers might bother some, but i didn't mind them, since they're practically rewards for getting past the traditional phases and let you finish off the boss in a flashy manner.
The gameplay itself felt perfectly good to me. I've had no problem with the mechanics, everything felt snappy and any comparisons in that regard with LittleBigPlanet were unfounded. It also never got dull, lots of variation and the game keeps mixing it up constantly. I see the consensus seems to be that the game is too easy and while it wasn't exactly balls hard, i felt that it got a bit more challenging later on. I think part of the reason the game feels easy is because you're being showered with sparkles and you're never in risk of running out of lives, with a generous checkpoint system on top of it. Undoubtedly this was done to keep the game from being frustrating, but maybe they could've cut down on the amount of lives to add a bit more challenge. Overall i didn't think it was quite as easy as some made it sound, at least not in the sense that you would never lose a head or have to repeat difficult parts. That's coming from someone of average platforming skills though, so your mileage may vary.
On top of the game being fairly lengthy in the first place, it will also be fun going back to replay and explore the levels using Kutaro's full skill set, chasing down all the missing heads, head secrets and bonus levels, as well as freeing all the remaining souls. Even though there are no time trials or whatever, i feel like the game is packed with enough content to replay it several times, not that it isn't fun enough even without those incentives to replay it.
As for ranking my favourite acts or curtains, there's so much variety that i have a hard time choosing my favourites, so that will have to wait a while, but there's some genuinely great stuff in there.
Btw, i don't want to spoil it for those that haven't finished it yet, but that message that pops up after you finish the game and go back to replay levels got a big laugh out of me. Once again, kudos to Gavin Moore and the rest of the team. Looking forward to whatever you do next.
Edit: Nevermind, seems i was doing it wrong, found it now.
Edit 2: Might as well give my impressions on the game.
I've preordered the game but only got it a week ago. Like some of you, i was savouring the experience and only played through a curtain or two per night. I've finished it last night and it was a gleeful experience. I'm not a huge fan of platformers, but i like games like this one, where you can tell that tons of love and attention went into making it. The presentation is fantastic across the board, the game has a lovely art style and looks pretty clean. The backgrounds have so much detail and interactive hotspots. The score is great too and i'm glad i got the digital version of it, but it's a downer that some of the best tracks are missing from the tracklist. The humour is pretty good too most of the time, with lots of references to all sort of things. I didn't always laugh out loud, but i did smile constantly. I love how everything has been made with the theatrical theme in mind, not just the levels themselves, but also the menus, with the mechanical act selection map, the curtains, the head collection in which the heads are displayed like theater props, the pause screen (Intermission), and the manual (Programme). Then there are the genuinely funny descriptions and animations for each of the 104 heads, kudos to everyone involved!
I also liked the 3 curtain structure and how every act kept building up to the main boss confrontation. Another thing i appretiated in this context is how even though each act adhered to a certain theme, each curtain within them still had their own thing going on regarding the setting and gameplay. Speaking of bosses, the boss fights were very entertaining and even though they share some common elements, most of them put their own spin on it, so it doesn't feel too repetitive. The QTE finishers might bother some, but i didn't mind them, since they're practically rewards for getting past the traditional phases and let you finish off the boss in a flashy manner.
The gameplay itself felt perfectly good to me. I've had no problem with the mechanics, everything felt snappy and any comparisons in that regard with LittleBigPlanet were unfounded. It also never got dull, lots of variation and the game keeps mixing it up constantly. I see the consensus seems to be that the game is too easy and while it wasn't exactly balls hard, i felt that it got a bit more challenging later on. I think part of the reason the game feels easy is because you're being showered with sparkles and you're never in risk of running out of lives, with a generous checkpoint system on top of it. Undoubtedly this was done to keep the game from being frustrating, but maybe they could've cut down on the amount of lives to add a bit more challenge. Overall i didn't think it was quite as easy as some made it sound, at least not in the sense that you would never lose a head or have to repeat difficult parts. That's coming from someone of average platforming skills though, so your mileage may vary.
On top of the game being fairly lengthy in the first place, it will also be fun going back to replay and explore the levels using Kutaro's full skill set, chasing down all the missing heads, head secrets and bonus levels, as well as freeing all the remaining souls. Even though there are no time trials or whatever, i feel like the game is packed with enough content to replay it several times, not that it isn't fun enough even without those incentives to replay it.
As for ranking my favourite acts or curtains, there's so much variety that i have a hard time choosing my favourites, so that will have to wait a while, but there's some genuinely great stuff in there.
Btw, i don't want to spoil it for those that haven't finished it yet, but that message that pops up after you finish the game and go back to replay levels got a big laugh out of me. Once again, kudos to Gavin Moore and the rest of the team. Looking forward to whatever you do next.