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[tolkir]

This is why NOE provides Xenoblade, Last Story, and Pandora's Tower and NOA does jack.

Will next Zelda be region locked?

 

[guek]

But to say this game wouldn't be possible without them is pretty ignorant.

Wait, no, I'm pretty sure this game specifically wouldn't be possible with motion controls. MP3, your DKC example, sure, but SS is pretty unique in that regard. It's like saying you could make boomblox with traditional controls...you really couldn't make the same game.

 

[UltimateIke]

If by best you mean worst yeah.

When people actually play the game they're going to see why his review stinks.

Most of his complaints are dumb

Don't get carried away. It's his opinion, and he's allowed it.

 

[oatmeal]

If by best you mean worst yeah.

When people actually play the game they're going to see why his review stinks.

Most of his complaints are dumb

Your Zelda Defense strategy is wholly annoying.

I've been hesitant to get excited about the game since the Tears were announced. Everything he said against the game were all fears of mine going in.

I have no doubts this will fall in the middle of the pack of best Zelda games.

 

[LegendofJoe]

TSA has still had the best review so far.

The guy is the definition of a negative Nancy, so I doubt that.

 

[Goldmund]

So looking at gamerankings.com, it looks like the game did pretty good for itself so far.

Looking at the OP and some of the quotes, whenever I see reviews of any kind, I can tell which ones to ignore. When reviewers throw in keywords like "identity crisis", "linear", and other crappy rhetoric I can tell someone is taking games way too damn seriously. They sound like comic book guy off the simpsons. Some of the greatest games ever made were linear, like the Super Mario Bros series, that's not explaining why something is bad or good.

Also people who feel the need to write a thesis on a game, I can tell take a game too seriously. Reviews should be concise, to the point, without ridiculous rhetoric or tired nerd gamer catchphrases.

Everyone should be free to write their review as they see fit. Whether that means using the game as kick-off point for a thesis on why Japanese games should quit living in the past or praising the compelling moment-to-moment gameplay viscera.

 

[hyduK]

Wait, no, I'm pretty sure this game specifically wouldn't be possible with motion controls. MP3, your DKC example, sure, but SS is pretty unique in that regard. It's like saying you could make boomblox with traditional controls...you really couldn't make the same game.

The big effect the motion controls has had on this game is the depth of combat, unless there's something I've missed on the way. I'd say that's pretty possible with a classic controller. The stuff like the sword following your every move, no, but that doesn't really effect the gameplay.

 

[mclem]

See, my issue is that you're effectively saying that you can't dock points for a choice a developer made.

I don't think that's quite right. If it's an objectively *bad* choice, of course you need to factor it into your assessment. But I quite often see reviewers complaining about something because they didn't do it the way the reviewer wanted them to, and that's a different matter.

Review what the game *is*, not what you *want* it to be.

 

[oatmeal]

The guy is the definition of a negative Nancy, so I doubt that.

Having issues with a games design =/= negative nancy.

Read his impressions and then read the joke of a review by Rich at IGN.

Man, IGN is so bad now.

I'm glad it got a 10, but Jesus, it's some fanboy wankery in that review.

 

[Cygnus X-1]

TSA has still had the best review so far.

Link please?

 

[walking fiend]

OK. So the only major publications left are GT and GS. I wonder what they will give. Probably a 8.5-9.5, 9.0 probably.

Though, I think I'll just go back to my media black out; and for now, off to playing the Demo once again. There's a joy in beating Ghirahim.

 

[Quadrangulum]

The concept of a "best" review is silly.

 

[Goldmund]

OK. So the only major publications left are GT and GS. I wonder what they will give. Probably a 8.5-9.5, 9.0 probably.

Though, I think I'll just go back to my media black out; and for now, off to playing the Demo once again. There's a joy in beating Ghirahim.

Gamespot is probably still testing the online.

 

[mclem]

The big effect the motion controls has had on this game is the depth of combat, unless there's something I've missed on the way. I'd say that's pretty possible with a classic controller. The stuff like the sword following your every move, no, but that doesn't really effect the gameplay.

It's completely possible to play DDR with a joypad.

 

[guek]

The big effect the motion controls has had on this game is the depth of combat, unless there's something I've missed on the way. I'd say that's pretty possible with a classic controller. The stuff like the sword following your every move, no, but that doesn't really effect the gameplay.

how is it possible to dynamically input 9 different slash inputs seamlessly on a classic controller? Seems like it'd be pretty cumbersome or just downright unplayable.

 

[jarosh]

one thing i gotta say: it's so nice to finally be playing a zelda game with an orchestrated soundtrack. makes a big difference... from the opening story segment to the first few cutscenes and gameplay segments in skyloft. it's so beautiful and such a perfect fit, truly something that was missing from past zelda games.

and i kinda wish (hope?) the fairy fountain rendition from the anniversary cd was in the game. so amazing.

 

[EatChildren]

Your Zelda Defense strategy is wholly annoying.

I've been hesitant to get excited about the game since the Tears were announced. Everything he said against the game were all fears of mine going in.

I have no doubts this will fall in the middle of the pack of best Zelda games.

That's nice. Thankfully I don't hold, and see zero reason to hold, TSA's opinion any higher than average Joe's, and his review joins all the others I wont be reading until I finish the game for myself.

 

[Souldriver]

Is Eurogamer regarded highly or something (and why)? Many people anticipated that score, and it got the thread title updated.

 

[oatmeal]

Link please?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=32607378&postcount=9859

That's nice. Thankfully I don't hold, and see zero reason to hold, TSA's opinion any higher than average Joe's, and his review joins all the others I wont be reading until I finish the game for myself.

The guy knows Zelda, and from his previous reviews, his views of the franchise hit closer to home than other reviews I've seen.

A review like EGM where their main complaint is the poorly implemented waggle, I don't buy. But he broke it down into the strengths and weaknesses and some of those weaknesses are big red flags for me.

 

[TheNatural]

Also to add to my last post, I just saw a couple reviews, one on 1UP that a negative was it doesn't escape completely from "the grip of its predecessors." An EGM review that gave the motion controls a big con, and put a hole in the wall by throwing the Wii remote in frustration.

Really?

I wonder how many gaming "journalists" actually went to school to learn how to write. It's funny that I can read 20 different reviews on 20 different games, and the same things listed as a big negative in one game are a big positive in another, and how much filler rhetoric is put into the review. I don't see many so-called "writers" explaining why something is positive or negative in a clear and concise manner with a clear example.

 

[walking fiend]

Gamespot is probably still testing the online.

slowclap.gif

 

[LegendofJoe]

Having issues with a games design =/= negative nancy.

I was talking about his general attitude as a poster, he is extremely negative. So much so I don't really trust his opinions.

 

[Goldmund]

one thing i gotta say: it's so nice to finally be playing a zelda game with an orchestrated soundtrack. makes a big difference... from the opening story segment to the first few cutscenes and gameplay segments in skyloft. it's so beautiful and such a perfect fit and truly something that was missing from past zelda games.

and i kinda wish (hope?) the fairy fountain rendition from the anniversary cd was in the game. so amazing.

Has the reversed lullaby been used strikingly so far? It goes with everything, like Guile's theme.

 

[ASIS]

Yep, the TSA's pros and cons is personal appreciations (collecting the Tears of Light in Twilight Princess are the best of the game ) but it's good not to be influenced by the hype. No Zelda game was perfect. I have no problem with this.


Other thing:

Where did it comes from, solblade00?

This is something that I wanted to bring up, why is it that only with Zelda that we need to be reminded again and again that it has flaws? It's not like any other game out there is absolutely perfect anyway.

 

[Big One]

Your Zelda Defense strategy is wholly annoying.

I've been hesitant to get excited about the game since the Tears were announced. Everything he said against the game were all fears of mine going in.

I have no doubts this will fall in the middle of the pack of best Zelda games.

Yeah...sorry but TSA has never had a legitimate opinion in his entire life. Most of his cons are fucking retarded including:

The Warp System - He complains about a warp system that is easy to get around
The Sky - He complaints the sky isn't the Ocean, even though it isn't trying to be
The Overworld - He says the areas are barren and empty, even though this is factually wrong
Faron, the Dragon - He goes on a rant about how stupid this character is
Dungeon Music - Makes an ass statement by saying the dungeon music is ear bleeding, even though we know otherwise
Item Variety - Complains about using items in every dungeon rather than dungeons focusing on a single item and never use them again
Lack of Memorable Characters - He goes on a rant about how stupid the characters are except for Zelda and Link, even though those are the only two the story is focused on (SPOILERS!)
Ghirahim, the Villain - He goes on a rant about how stupid this character is
You Don't Lose Health if You Fall in a Hole - Complains about something that doesn't really matter to the gameplay experience
The Visuals - Says the game has N64 textures, another factually wrong statement.

There's many reasons why to think his impressions are a joke no matter how detailed they are.

 

[jts]

I sincerely have no idea. Is this game 60fps?

 

[Dartastic]

Finally starting to read some of these reviews, and ROFL @ the EGM review, and all the comments below it that perfectly demonstrate why that review is crap.

Twilight Princess’ motion controls worked because the game was more forgiving of your movements; simple flicks of your wrist would provide the desired results. Now, due to the enemy design revolving around the motion-control gimmick and being forced to use the MotionPlus—which follows you too well—you’re often pulled out of the immersion, because you’re constantly reminded that you are holding a controller whenever the controller doesn’t do what you want.

A perfect example is the miniboss you face in the first temple. It’s a Stalfos, a Zelda enemy staple from the very beginning. This dual-sword-wielding skeleton towers over Link, so in order to do damage, you must swing where the Stalfos isn’t blocking. If he’s holding his swords horizontally, you must swing horizontally through the gap; if he’s holding them vertically, you strike vertically. Unfortunately, if you’re like me and have played a good amount of button-mashers over the years—or even just older Zelda titles—your instinct is to attack hard and fast. But if you swing too fast, even with MotionPlus, Link won’t be able to catch up to you.

Homeboy just doesn't get it.

 

[ivysaur12]

The big effect the motion controls has had on this game is the depth of combat, unless there's something I've missed on the way. I'd say that's pretty possible with a classic controller. The stuff like the sword following your every move, no, but that doesn't really effect the gameplay.

But it does. Because the enemies are specifically designed to be attacked in certain patterns. Every single enemy revealed so far is designed around MotionPlus and blocking your attacks from certain angles.

You literally couldn't do the first mini-boss, the Stafos fight, without MotionPlus. He blocks your attack unless you attack from the right angle. That's true for every other enemy in the game. It's all about finding their weak points and attacking them from that angle and bypassing their defenses.

So, no, you're objectively wrong on that count.

 

[jarosh]

That's nice. Thankfully I don't hold, and see zero reason to hold, TSA's opinion any higher than average Joe's, and his review joins all the others I wont be reading until I finish the game for myself.

same here. besides, i can't remember ever agreeing with tsa's reviews/rankings of past zelda games specifically.

i still love twilight princess and hate both the ds games.

 

[apana]

I sincerely have no idea. Is this game 60fps?

30 FPS is standard for Zelda games I think.

 

[Goldmund]

Finally starting to read some of these reviews, and ROFL @ the EGM review, and all the comments below it that perfectly demonstrate why that review is crap.
Homeboy just doesn't get it.

If you're playing it wrong, the game won't reward you. How dare it.

 

[Regulus Tera]

If by best you mean worst yeah.

When people actually play the game they're going to see why his review stinks.

Most of his complaints are dumb

His complaints actually address specific problems regarding item usage and pacing. That to me is much more valuable than just another write-up about how the graphics are gorgeous and controls are responsive. Game design encompasses more than just how the game plays.

 

[jarosh]

Has the reversed lullaby been used strikingly so far? It goes with everything, like Guile's theme.

well, zelda singing it has been really pretty

 

[Big One]

His complaints actually address specific problems regarding item usage and pacing. That to me is much more valuable than just another write-up about how the graphics are gorgeous and controls are responsive.

His pacing issues are perfectly valid, however how is his issues with item usage? He COMPLAINS that you use the items throughout the game. That's just comical

 

[ShockingAlberto]

See, my issue is that you're effectively saying that you can't dock points for a choice a developer made. The game is based entirely on M+ because Nintendo chose so. They did this for a deeper combat system, something which is easily obtained without the use of M+. If I was complaining about the game being sub-HD in 2011, that might be a bit unfair (though it is a Nintendo game...so they're being restricted by their own decision to make their consoles hardware outdated).

DKCR would have been better if it had a roll button, instead of (or with an option of) the flicking mechanic. In your mind this isn't a valid complaint.
MP3 would have been better had it kept the original control scheme. Again, in your mind not a valid complaint.
Theoretically Speilberg could choose to film a movie from horrendous angles...but he chose to do so, so it's not a valid complaint.

You seem to like the motion controls, that's great, I'm sure you'll love the game (and I will too, despite them). But to say this game wouldn't be possible without them is pretty ignorant. And me saying I'd prefer a classic scheme wouldn't make me a shitty reviewer, I could objectively say that a classic scheme is more precise, and responsive, while allowing all the same actions to be performed.

You never answered my question earlier, but do you think it would be appropriate for a reviewer to knock Gears of War 3 or Uncharted 3 down a few points because they're not Kinect or Move games, respectively? Not just support, but ground up built for those accessories.

 

[EatChildren]

The guy knows Zelda

This shit right here is what doesn't fly with me. I hate this "no, seriously, this guy, this guy, he is Zelda man, he knows it" attitude. It means jack shit to me, because I don't give a flying fuck what TSA or anybody thinks, and in the case of TSA (who I have absolutely no beef with on a personal level), I've read enough of his post to disagree with any assertion that he 'knows Zelda', at least from the perspective of what I look for in a Zelda game and what draws me to the franchise.

Different strokes for different folks and all that. If you and others see eye-to-eye, well goody. He posted a lengthy, thought out review that's a great second (or even first) opinion for anybody who wants it. But I don't care what he thinks, anymore than I care what IGN, Eurogamer, Giant Bomb or anybody else thinks.

Yeah...sorry but TSA has never had a legitimate opinion in his entire life. Most of his cons are fucking retarded including:

The Warp System - He complains about a warp system that is easy to get around
The Sky - He complaints the sky isn't the Ocean, even though it isn't trying to be
The Overworld - He says the areas are barren and empty, even though this is factually wrong
Faron, the Dragon - He goes on a rant about how stupid this character is
Dungeon Music - Makes an ass statement by saying the dungeon music is ear bleeding, even though we know otherwise
Item Variety - Complains about using items in every dungeon rather than dungeons focusing on a single item and never use them again
Lack of Memorable Characters - He goes on a rant about how stupid the characters are except for Zelda and Link, even though those are the only two the story is focused on (SPOILERS!)
Ghirahim, the Villain - He goes on a rant about how stupid this character is
You Don't Lose Health if You Fall in a Hole - Complains about something that doesn't really matter to the gameplay experience
The Visuals - Says the game has N64 textures, another factually wrong statement.

There's many reasons why to think his impressions are a joke no matter how detailed they are.

And again you attack his subjective opinion on topics you haven't experienced, for a game you haven't played. This is your final warning. Cut the shit or you can take a break.

 

[mclem]

Is Eurogamer regarded highly or something (and why)? Many people anticipated that score, and it got the thread title updated.

It's a matter of personal taste, but they're certainly a review source I regard highly.

 

[TheNatural]

This shit right here is what doesn't fly with me. I hate this "no, seriously, this guy, this guy, he is Zelda man, he knows it" attitude. It means jack shit to me, because I don't give a flying fuck what TSA or anybody thinks, and in the case of TSA (who I have absolutely no beef with on a personal level), I've read enough of his post to disagree with any assertion that he 'knows Zelda', at least from the perspective of what I look for in a Zelda game and what draws me to the franchise.

Different strokes for different folks and all that. If you and others see eye-to-eye, well goody. He posted a lengthy, thought out review that's a great second (or even first) opinion for anybody who wants it. But I don't care what he thinks, anymore than I care what IGN, Eurogamer, Giant Bomb or anybody else thinks.

 

[jett]

Finally starting to read some of these reviews, and ROFL @ the EGM review, and all the comments below it that perfectly demonstrate why that review is crap.
Homeboy just doesn't get it.

I'm not one to attack reviews, but that is some serious stupid. "If I don't adhere to how the game wants me to play it, I will annoyingly be punished. These controls suck!". No shit, son. Why is anyone trying to waggle in this game to begin with.

 

[BertramCooper]

I've never understood TSA's elevated status within the Zelda community.

I don't have any beef with him; I just don't get why everyone cares so much about what he thinks.

 

[crustikid]

so much emotion right now.

 

[walking fiend]

Lack of Memorable Characters - He goes on a rant about how stupid the characters are except for Zelda and Link, even though those are the only two the story is focused on (SPOILERS!)
Ghirahim, the Villain - He goes on a rant about how stupid this character is

You sure he has been serious? What I have seem from Ghirahim in the trailers and little of the demo, he is already in the list of my most interested in characters.

Unless they somehow seriously shit all over it in the rest of the game, I doubt this change. Even him being an equivalent of BP in my mind didn't change that (just kidding, I love both BP and Ghirahim)

I mean, how can a character with this line not be memorable:

"My name is Ghirahim.

In truth, I very much prefer to be indulged with my full name: Lord Ghirahim. But I'm not a fussy."

 

[jarosh]

the whole idea of there being some sort of authority on a game series whose opinion somehow cancels out or trumps those of the "common man" is so hilarious and misguided.

 

[Big One]

And again you attack his subjective opinion on topics you haven't experienced, for a game you haven't played. This is your final warning. Cut the shit or you can take a break.

But the problem is that the points he's listing isn't subjective, most of them are factually wrong statements based off what we know about the game. Saying the areas in the game are empty is factually wrong no matter how you look at it.

Points like hating Ghirahim is subjective yes, but still fanboyish rants that shouldn't knock a game down so hard

 

[oatmeal]

See inside the quote...

Yeah...sorry but TSA has never had a legitimate opinion in his entire life. Most of his cons are fucking retarded including:

The Warp System - He complains about a warp system that is easy to get around - The system, if it is as he claims, sounds broken. Forcing you to return to the sky and then back just to go to another warp spot on land? That's poor design.
The Sky - He complaints the sky isn't the Ocean, even though it isn't trying to be It's a pretty similar concept. Removing one large piece of land and replacing it with a larger piece of empty nothing. And when the places to explore are few and far between (and tiny and useless)...it's pretty similar to WW. So no, it's not a big ocean, but the idea is the same.
The Overworld - He says the areas are barren and empty, even though this is factually wrong From the map with its tiny 'planetoids', he looks right. Small little rocks that have one pointless enemy on it sounds pretty barren.
Faron, the Dragon - He goes on a rant about how stupid this character is I don't even know who this is...I have no comment.
Dungeon Music - Makes an ass statement by saying the dungeon music is ear bleeding, even though we know otherwise I think ear-bleeding is excessive, however, from the demo and from all of the videos I've seen the dungeon music has been quite bad. And the worst part is, the enemy encounter music is very bad, and that comes up all of the time. The boss music, at least from the Stalfos and Ghirahim battle, is great. But nothing kills the vibe of a good Zelda track worse than the encounter music.
Item Variety - Complains about using items in every dungeon rather than dungeons focusing on a single item and never use them again He used this as a positive and a negative. His negative view was that there were no surprises on the later dungeons because when you are using the same items, the puzzles start to repeat. It's valid, IMO.
Lack of Memorable Characters - He goes on a rant about how stupid the characters are except for Zelda and Link, even though those are the only two the story is focused on (SPOILERS!) I think he added Groose, too. But I wouldn't be surprised. We haven't had good ancillary characters since Anju/Kafei.
Ghirahim, the Villain - He goes on a rant about how stupid this character is I agree with him. From everything I have seen he is quite annoying, and has a terrible design.
You Don't Lose Health if You Fall in a Hole - Complains about something that doesn't really matter to the gameplay experience That's a non-issue...and it was in the neither good or bad section. That was just pointing it out as a side note.
The Visuals - Says the game has N64 textures, another factually wrong statement. Same thing was said about TP. And while they're not quite N64, they come close quite often. See TWW for how to do simple textures right. Not this.

There's many reasons why to think his impressions are a joke no matter how detailed they are.

 

[Regulus Tera]

His pacing issues are perfectly valid, however how is his issues with item usage? He COMPLAINS that you use the items throughout the game. That's just comical

He complains about the meaninglessness of the item upgrade system, the abundance of useless items, and the scarcity of items with unique gameplay mechanics. That seems like a serious thing to discuss.

He could be making shit up for all I know, but his review at least touches on stuff that actually interests me beyond a vapid scoreline.

EDIT: I gotta admit some of his character-specific complaints are incredibly subjective, and the thing about the hole is just laughable.

 

[Zekes!]

so much emotion right now.

Do you need a hug? I need a hug.

 

[mclem]

the whole idea of there being some sort of authority on a game series whose opinion somehow cancels out or trumps those of the "common man" is so hilarious and misguided.

At least, anyone who isn't *me*.

 

[crustikid]

Do you need a hug? I need a hug.

I need Zelda

 

[Chet Rippo]

I've never understood TSA's elevated status within the Zelda community.

I don't have any beef with him; I just don't get why everyone cares so much about what he thinks.

He's the silent assassin!