http://nintendoeverything.com/sakurai-talks-a-bit-about-smash-bros-dlc/
Awesome.Masahiro Sakurai said:
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Smash Wii U & 3DS Downloadable Characters Discussion and Information on Smash Ballot
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
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IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
Is it almost same thing that he already mentioned awhile ago? At least, we are getting good batch of dlc!
Now I'm hoping for something completely out of left field. Maybe a costume pack which gives the original 8 (or 12) retro sprite costumes.
"It will take a while from now" is why I'm excited.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
They should grab some Mii Costumes from NintendoLand. Takamaru pls!
I wonder how long is "a while?" since it seem to be subjective since it could meant 6 months or so?
Gonzo The Great
Banned
So am I, because it implies that the ballot is actually being taken seriously. Sorry to disappoint, conspiracy theorists.
Also
It is a lot to take on, but hopefully DLC development isn't quite as straining since they don't have to meet Holiday deadlines or anything.
That and I imagine Sakurai appreciates the extra paychecks
It's not much of a "conspiracy" anymore tbh. If Ryu really does get in now then we know that has jack shit to do with the ballot.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Based on that, I'm inclined to believe the 6 character DLC slots we have now are probably all we're going to get.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
You mean they were planning characters before they announced the ballot? Say it ain't so. Are people really cynical enough to believe that Nintendo will try passing off a character like Chorus Kids as the ballot "winner"?
superNESjoe
Member
Honestly? No. There are plenty of very capable people who can manage and build new content for Smash without Sakurai putting in unhealthy amounts of work. I'm not sure if it's pressure from Nintendo or pressure he puts on himself, but with everything we hear it sounds more like he needs to learn to trust his staff and walk away.
I would like Smash DLC to continue without Sakurai, or I suppose preferably with him serving as an advisory role. I want choices, movesets, and updates created from a new perspective for DLC characters.
StreetsAhead
Member
Well, yeah, but they never promised that all the future DLC fighters would be based off the ballot, either, did they?
balladofwindfishes
Member
imo if Sakurai wasn't working on DLC, Roy probably wouldn't have had any shot at all.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
No, but for some reason many people have convinced themselves that the ballot is a sham and they've planned all of the DLC characters in advance. I really don't think this is the case.
A Link to the Past
Banned
Sakurai needing lots of time doesn't prove they're listening to the ballot. It just proves they need lots of time, which could be due to any number of reasons, like reduced staff and resources, and/or a huge volume of content that's already planned for development.
It's hard to say how much the ballot will actually influence things. I'm also curious how they're handling ballot-stuffing, i.e. people voting for the same character multiple times. I'm sure there are some lunatics out there you have made a daily ritual of voting for their favorite character.
I'm not tech-savvy, but maybe Nintendo can discount votes sharing the same IP address, or coming from the same location (i.e. many votes coming from a public library all around the same time). If it's one person doing it over and over and over, that's obviously not useful marketing data that a character will sell.
I also suspect there are some eligible characters charting well beyond the most publicized characters, but the people voting for them simply don't talk about them much.
It's hard to say how much the ballot will actually influence things. I'm also curious how they're handling ballot-stuffing, i.e. people voting for the same character multiple times. I'm sure there are some lunatics out there you have made a daily ritual of voting for their favorite character.
I'm not tech-savvy, but maybe Nintendo can discount votes sharing the same IP address, or coming from the same location (i.e. many votes coming from a public library all around the same time). If it's one person doing it over and over and over, that's obviously not useful marketing data that a character will sell.
I also suspect there are some eligible characters charting well beyond the most publicized characters, but the people voting for them simply don't talk about them much.
Yeah, it makes sense to create dlc characters people actually want.
On another note, regarding the K. Rool moveset that Gonzo posted, I wonder how much he would reference his DKC2 and DKC3 forms. I say this because according to the trophy entry in Brawl, the Kaptain is a separate character from the King:
At any rate, while I think K. Rool is unlikely, I still want him, and I think one cool move would be to set a Klaptrap on the ground. Think Bowser Jr.'s Mecha Koopa, but it hits multiple times rather than self-destructing.
I would imagine Baron K. Roolenstein is a separate character, as well. I mean, the King could reference them, but they're technically three separate entities, according to canon. (Although in my heart, I will continue to think they're the same guy in different costumes, just like how I continue to see the Koopalings as Bowser's children!)
At any rate, while I think K. Rool is unlikely, I still want him, and I think one cool move would be to set a Klaptrap on the ground. Think Bowser Jr.'s Mecha Koopa, but it hits multiple times rather than self-destructing.
Babymario26
Member
What he said in the quotes gives me hope for Adventure mode as DLC.
I was actually thinking a while ago that they may purposefully have avoided mentioning an one-vote-per-IP restriction. If they had mentioned it, it would encourage people to spam votes from multiple IPs, which would be much harder to deal with.
I was also thinking that they might be throwing out votes from multiple IP after grouping them by character. Because if people votes for multiple times but for different characters, that would still help you learn which characters are the most popular.
I was also thinking that they might be throwing out votes from multiple IP after grouping them by character. Because if people votes for multiple times but for different characters, that would still help you learn which characters are the most popular.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Smash trophies aren't canon. All of those K Rools are the same person, the Brawl trophy is well known for being wrong.
If Trophies are canon there's a Pokemon called Onyx and Bubbles from Zelda were enemies in the Subspace.
I'm at the point where I think K. Rool or Inkling is winning the ballot
which is why I really hope they don't look just at the winner
Gonzo The Great
Banned
Don't worry your little heart out; the trophy description is wrong. They're clearly intended to be the same character. Some people have speculated that the trophy description was intentionally misleading because his Kaptain alias is supposed to be a "disguise". The Game Boy Advance version of Donkey Kong Country 2 specifically mentions that K. Rool is "out for revenge", if it wasn't obvious enough.
Basically, if they're looking for useful data (i.e. how much a character will sell), they'll look for suspicious trends and discard those votes accordingly. Say the Kremling Kampaign is crazy enough to have a handful of members use multiple computers at multiple libraries to stuff the ballot box on a weekly or daily basis. Nintendo will pick up on that and discard those votes. All they suggest is the work of one individual (or a handful of individuals) crazy enough to try and inflate their numbers. It could be 10,000 votes, but only 100 people buying that character once it's actually made, because it was 100 people driving those 10,000 votes all along.
Again, this is all assuming the ballot is more than a marketing ploy. It's still perfectly possible that they already have characters lined up that they know will sell, and that when all is said and done, they'll cherry-pick supporting ballots and show them as evidence of fan demand in a Direct.
Out for revenge... for his brother?
I like to think they're the same person -- the DKC2 instruction manual, for what it's worth, seemed to depict them that way -- but I've heard that in Japan it's accepted that they're separate characters.
So I don't know what to believe anymore. I just know I like the idea of the King, Kaptain and Baron all being one and the same. Or at least the King and the Kaptain. I can accept the Baron being a crazy uncle or cousin. He did have a different vibe going for him with his references to his wife, etc. (Used all her pots and pans to make Kaos!)
Gonzo The Great
Banned
People underestimate K. Rool because, unlike Ridley, he actually has a Japanese fanbase. I'm not smug enough to claim that he's winning, but I'm sure he's doing well enough to be "recognized" by Sakurai. Whether that translates to DLC or not is uncertain, but it's safe to say that, at the very least, Retro Studios has taken notice. The next few years are going to be interesting, I know that much.
It's the same character, I promise you. His entire gimmick is that he changes costumes depending on the situation. Have you ever played Donkey Kong 64? He wears a blue spandex suit and boxing gloves into the final battle. He was also going to don an aviator outfit in the cancelled Diddy Kong Pilot. I'd love to see Retro play this up to ridiculous extremes. Karnie K. Rool, Kosmic K. Rool, K. Rool the Kidd... the possibilities are endless.
MrSaturn99
Member
I'd like to think Sakurai stating he'd like "to feel refreshed" after development is done means he'll take a long vacation.
Dude needs it.
I'm glad you're at least acknowledging it's not a sure thing he will win. I'm willing to acknowledge that Sakurai will notice K. Rool has his fans, but I'm not confident enough to say he'll be deemed Smash material by the man himself. But like I said before, I think he'd be a good character. He's funny in a Wario sort of way, and I think another fast but heavy character would be a blast to play.
All that being said, though... Can you show some evidence that K. Rool actually has a sizable fan base in Japan? I mean, I'd like to believe it, but that's news to me.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
hmm no one seemed to check Wii U data
I have no idea if K.Rool in particular is popular in Japan, but apparently the TV show was popular enough to get unique merchandise for the region.
(There's probably other stuff, that's just the first example I found.)
(There's probably other stuff, that's just the first example I found.)
Yes, I played DK64. I was insane enough to get every last collectible back in the day. I still have the player's guide, too. I remember the game's ending, but what's not to say that boxer outfit was the only time King K. Rool ever donned a costume, and the others aren't separate entities?
Conflicting messages from Nintendo on this matter. I'll just view them all as one and the same.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
It's all anecdotal, really. But considering how well the DKC games sell in Japan, and considering how successful the DKC cartoon was over there, it's no surprise that K. Rool is more popular overseas than characters like Ridley. All I can do is link you to poll results, but Snakey's findings from 2012 are probably worth posting. K. Rool is literally the only "A-tier" character on this list who didn't make it into the final game. And this was back in 2012 before his popular "exploded", so to speak. Again, I'm not naive enough to believe that he's guaranteed as DLC, but all of this K. Rool talk can only mean good things. I don't think the character has ever had this much exposure.
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/633202-super-smash-bros-for-wii-u/64873505
Thanks for sharing this. What do you mean by his popularity exploding, however?
On another note, regarding the King/Kaptain/Baron, it would seem that at least the Baron is a separate character, since the Kaptain was reduced to a ghost in DKC2.
But then there's the question of where DK64 fits into the timeline.
(Oh god, we're discussing DK timelines!)
Starphoenix
Member
The fact that he always outdoes himself with the base games only spells good things for supplemental content. It's more for the man's personal sake I'm concerned...
Reading Snakey's observations of characters requested by the Japanese (see the link provided by Gonzo) is very interesting. It's dated back in 2012, but many of the characters have to pass. I do find that encouraging for K. Rool, as cynical as I can be...
It seems like classic Sakurai style at this point to set people's expectations low, and then blow them out of the water by outdoing himself yet again.
It's a much better approach than promising too much and then witnessing the thousands of downgrade posts here in GAF haha.
I wonder if the Smash DLC, when all is said and done, will have made more money for Nintendo than an actual new game by Sakurai would've (i.e. a lesser-known series like Kid Icarus). If Nintendo thinks so, I could see them more or less letting Sakurai go all-out with the DLC.
kunonabi
Member
I wouldn't mind since I really don't want to get stuck with his shitty American voice.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
K. Rool support rose substantially before the launch of Smash 4, but the roster had already been decided on in 2012. Neither K. Rool nor Dixie were present in Returns, so I don't think either character was given priority. I certainly don't agree with that decision, but I also understand the reasoning behind it. Almost everybody seems to be in agreement that the DK series has been heavily underrepresented, and that's not necessarily Sakurai's fault. He was hesitant to add any RareWare representation to Melee due to rumors of an impending buyout.
A moderator on SmashBoards said it best:
In the best case scenario, we'll get both K. Rool and Dixie as DLC. If Dixie was planned in advance, then Sakurai may decide against K. Rool because he doesn't want to include "two DK reps" as DLC. If popularity is the only thing that matters, then K. Rool will likely be considered. I don't think relevancy is a factor here, because they could use Smash as a gateway to reintroduce K. Rool into the DK series. I have no idea how the ballot is going to turn out, but I'm pleased nonetheless by all of the exposure K. Rool has been receiving.
Man, K. Rool and Dixie Kong would be amazing. I think they'd sell, too, since DK's universe is like a second Mario-verse. People who like one, tend to like the other.
I wish someone with Photoshop skills would help me make the roster I suggested at the top of the page. It features both DK reps. :-3
MaverickHunterAsh
Member
Interesting! Looks like our opinions both complement and diverge from one another, but the best thing about all this is that we now know stage DLC is coming for sure... so hopefully we'll both be happy with some of the new and/or returning stages they're bringing in.
And yeah, I originally overlooked the part where you said you liked stages like Shadow Moses Island too. My bad!I do find one specific instance of our differing opinions particularly interesting, though - the part where you call Orbital Gate Assault "like Poké Floats, but actually terrible." Fair enough, but I actually feel like OGA is more manageable due to there actually being more stable space to fight throughout the stage (as opposed to Poké Floats, where some of the floats are so irregular in shape that they make normal combat almost impossible)!
It's basically 100% unless it's a Kojima level troll. It's highly unlikely it'll end up being unused data in the end since it only showed up in a recent patch, it'd be a bit different if the files were there since the beginning and we still haven't heard anything about it. There's always the chance the idea gets scrapped later on, but we can't really guess that.
So yes it's not confirmed if you want to be anal about it.
I do admit that Roy and Ryu (the more I think about him... argh) are looking very likely given the data, especially because the evidence was found in the patch but not the base game. I just found it interesting and somewhat surprising that we had full-on graduated to talking as if they're 100% confirmed so quickly. But given what Sakurai just said about Smash DLC being "for the fans," that makes Roy's existence a little less surprising.
Nice. I hope someone translates that entire Famitsu column soon; I'd love to read it. Masked Man, we need you!
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
Yeah, I'm concerned about his health and his arm(s).
They already did and it was very clean.
I know enough people have said the DKC TV show was popular in Japan that its kind of been accepted as fact but how do we know this is true? Did somebody high-up at Nintendo actually say so? I'm not doubting so much I kind of want the original source - it feels like this could all be one long game of telephone at work.
Gonzo The Great
Banned
They had various merchandise (and an entire trading card game) based on the show. I mean, I don't have statistical evidence or Nielson Ratings to show you, but it's pretty much a sure thing.
Starphoenix
Member
balladofwindfishes
Member
Captain Toad really seems to hate Rosalina
Yeah, the Brawl trophy is a well-known mistake. K. Rool's entire deal is that he's a nutjob that gets way into roleplaying. They even give him a new costume in Mario Super Sluggers as part of this.
If K. Rool gets in, in my opinion, he NEEDS to have a ton of dumb costumes, he just wouldn't be the same if they just went with his standard appearance from the original DKC game.
(My personal Donkey Kong vote goes to Cranky Kong.)
Wow, thanks! Is it possible to get a clean version? Also, Toad looks pissed, lol.How is this?
EDIT: Whoops. Left my guideline text in the image.
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