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Smash Wii U & 3DS Downloadable Characters Discussion and Information on Smash Ballot
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
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Again, I'm hoping the NX launches with a definitive version of Smash that doesn't have to worry about the problems presented by the launch model 3DS. It sounded like they made Doc, Lucy, and Pittoo in only a couple months' time or so; I'm sure a de-alted Alph could be an easy-to-make newcomer to sweeten the deal of a new version of the current Smash Bros.
Granted, maybe I'm putting way too much stock in people wanting Alph; outside of a few of us here on GAF, I don't really see anyone clamoring for him, and the only thing he can offer is Rock Pikmin, really. Still, if they want a quick-and-dirty newcomer, unless they have a 3/4-finished character laying around (Which I'm pretty sure happened to the Ice Climbers and Chorus Kids), a de-alted Alph's probably their easiest option.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Imagine if they patched in Alph as a freebie, but he lacked customs.
He'd be the only (technically) stock character without customs and that would be really silly. He'd also share a guidance with Olimar, as they made Olimar's generic as to reference both.
Things they'd need to add to make Alph work
- 4 new alts for Alph and Olimar. Olimar is easy, just grab some colors from Brawl.
- Rock Pikmin
- Exactly two new sound effects, Rock Pikmin's unique throw voice and bounce sounds
- Remove Purples/Whites (maybe?)
- Minor stat changes
- 3 new taunts
- 3 new victory animations (in Melee, Doc shared one with Mario, so maybe he doesn't even need 3 new ones).
- Drake instead of Olimar's Ship for his entrance and final smash
- 2 New Trophies (3DS/Wii U)
- Final Smash trophy (Wii U)
- Re-categorize his original trophy as to not be categorized as "Fighter Related"
- Add to 2006-2013 All Star
- Kirby hat
All things considered, that's not really a lot of work compared to other characters. Or even other clones, since Alph doesn't require new voice lines.
imo, even the alt for Alph feels really rushed
- Same pose as Olimar, despite the Koopalings/Robin not sharing poses. Wii Fit Trainer and Villager share poses, but Alph is a bigger alt than they are.
- Same Guidance as Olimar, despite literally every other alt in the game having minor variations (even just changing pronouns). Alph's does nothing, they just call him "Space Traveler" so it works for both. So both Olimar and Alph get a lame guidance.
- Only alt in the game that could be a clone, that isn't one.
- Was announced randomly after he was accidentally revealed during a demo tour days before release. His announcement was really awkward. Every other alt was hyped/teased, being big features of their trailers or explained out in a detailed post. Saying "oh hey, it's Alph. He's the same as Olimar, cool, right?" days before release after everyone knew about it was just weird. Like they were working right up to the last minute to make him a clone and didn't want to announce him as an alt until they exhausted all possibilities. Olimar was one of the earliest characters announced.
- We know Rock Pikmin were cut late in development.
- Alph using Olimar's ship looks weird, and this was what made Dark Pit a clone.
My theory is something went wrong or took too long to make Alph a clone, so they had to quickly turn him back into an alt.
He'd be the only (technically) stock character without customs and that would be really silly. He'd also share a guidance with Olimar, as they made Olimar's generic as to reference both.
Things they'd need to add to make Alph work
- 4 new alts for Alph and Olimar. Olimar is easy, just grab some colors from Brawl.
- Rock Pikmin
- Exactly two new sound effects, Rock Pikmin's unique throw voice and bounce sounds
- Remove Purples/Whites (maybe?)
- Minor stat changes
- 3 new taunts
- 3 new victory animations (in Melee, Doc shared one with Mario, so maybe he doesn't even need 3 new ones).
- Drake instead of Olimar's Ship for his entrance and final smash
- 2 New Trophies (3DS/Wii U)
- Final Smash trophy (Wii U)
- Re-categorize his original trophy as to not be categorized as "Fighter Related"
- Add to 2006-2013 All Star
- Kirby hat
All things considered, that's not really a lot of work compared to other characters. Or even other clones, since Alph doesn't require new voice lines.
imo, even the alt for Alph feels really rushed
- Same pose as Olimar, despite the Koopalings/Robin not sharing poses. Wii Fit Trainer and Villager share poses, but Alph is a bigger alt than they are.
- Same Guidance as Olimar, despite literally every other alt in the game having minor variations (even just changing pronouns). Alph's does nothing, they just call him "Space Traveler" so it works for both. So both Olimar and Alph get a lame guidance.
- Only alt in the game that could be a clone, that isn't one.
- Was announced randomly after he was accidentally revealed during a demo tour days before release. His announcement was really awkward. Every other alt was hyped/teased, being big features of their trailers or explained out in a detailed post. Saying "oh hey, it's Alph. He's the same as Olimar, cool, right?" days before release after everyone knew about it was just weird. Like they were working right up to the last minute to make him a clone and didn't want to announce him as an alt until they exhausted all possibilities. Olimar was one of the earliest characters announced.
- We know Rock Pikmin were cut late in development.
- Alph using Olimar's ship looks weird, and this was what made Dark Pit a clone.
My theory is something went wrong or took too long to make Alph a clone, so they had to quickly turn him back into an alt.
That's a really good theory, honestly. I'd love to see him become his own character, but I still feel that his problems are tied to the standard 3DS in some way. They're either going to need to find a way to "cheat" around its limitations, or wait until a hypothetical NX version that is either inherently tied to stronger portable hardware, or doesn't even work with portable hardware at all.
Having Alph as a "freebie" wouldn't be hard because it'd be an easy process. As Ballad said, they just need to add SFX from Pikmin 3 for the Rock Pikmin, and maybe a few bits of Alph's gibberish language while giving Olimar a few of his own, since neither characters are mute in their games (Granted, I also want DK's, Bowser's, and Dedede's voices fixed, too, so maybe I'm just bitter).
The rest would just be short animations, adding in the mostly-finished Rock Pikmin, and slight tweaks to his stats (Maybe a new Final Smash, since Alph's ship is already in the background of the Wii U Pikmin stage). I mean, they haven't bothered to give any of the other DLC fighters customs, anyway, and they already have a Punch-Out!! Nickname and a Palutena's Guidance for him. If it wasn't for the possible tie-ups due to the 3DS, it seems like separating Olimar and Alph would be a 2-3 month job at most.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
Sound design is another one of those things that has been going down since the first game. Personally, my favourite sound is the bowling pins when you get smashed from the first game.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Brawl had the best cheers. Also Brawl had that same sound test (complete stuff, with cheers). It's 4 that has been lacking in that.
RomanceDawn
Member
Hey I heard that Gamexplain found out that when voting on the Smash Ballot every new vote from the same person over writes the last one. Anyone know if this is true? And does anyone know how aha explain even found it out if it is?
balladofwindfishes
Member
Waluigi time?
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/633202-super-smash-bros-for-wii-u/72178994
Apparently the guy was involved in the ESRB leak
Also Nintendo didn't list Wolf, but Namco want him. He mentions it later in the thread. Namco also want Inkling.
If Inkling get in they'd look like Agent 3 apparently
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/633202-super-smash-bros-for-wii-u/72178994
Apparently the guy was involved in the ESRB leak
Also Nintendo didn't list Wolf, but Namco want him. He mentions it later in the thread. Namco also want Inkling.
If Inkling get in they'd look like Agent 3 apparently
There's no way of knowing if NR001 is actually Nicholas2222. DragonoSterling "verified" him, but he didn't say how. And even then, Nicholas2222 had a very loose connection to the leak in the first place. It just doesn't sound very believable to me, especially the "Nintendo has final say over Sakurai" part. NR001 is really downplaying Sakurai's involvement, but we know through countless interviews and columns that Sakurai alone is responsible for determining the roster.
EDIT: Nicholas2222 closed his account for losing a bet. He claimed that Ridley was playable.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
The ESRB doesn't rate online content. Why would the ESRB leak guys know anything about the DLC chadacters?
balladofwindfishes
Member
Waluigi obviously bumps the rating up to M
But which Agent 3 color would be the default? Green is used in the concept art, but Orange is used in the final boss. I'm going on the assumption that the Inkling Girl would be the default.
That being said, having the Inkling in Smash be Agent 3 would bypass any potential issues with the Mii Costumes, even though it wouldn't really be an issue in the first place since we also have Mii Costumes of other playable characters (Link's DLC Mii Costume being a prime example). Plus you'd bypass the new Inkling trophy (again, not that much of an issue, but you'd avoid confusion). But then again, the Inkling Girl used in the promotional material & the Amiibo is much more iconic in her design.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Agent 3 would also let them have an excuse to only have him use a standard gun. He could also have multiple grenade types.
FTFY, given that a majority of the promotional material concerning the Inkling is with the Inkling Girl. Granted, the boy will definitely be an alt, hence why I left he in there as the second option. But I see this as a Robin situation where like Male Robin, the Inkling Girl is the more prominent version of the Inklings of the two.
On what your quote is pertaining to, Agent 3 also used an Ink Charger & an Ink Roller in the Amiibo missions, so it's not like Agent 3 can't take advantage of multiple weapon types.
balladofwindfishes
Member
I'm too lazy to use the proper pronouns when typing on an iPhone
I doubt their move set references the Amiibo missions
I doubt their move set references the Amiibo missions
balladofwindfishes
Member
Both the Mewtwo and Lucas trophies were not touched
The original Mewtwo & Lucas trophies coexist with their playable counterparts.
But those Amiibo missions are still Agent 3-specific. And it'd be a huge missed opportunity if the Splat Charger & the Ink Roller aren't used in some way (Splat Charger as a Side Smash, Ink Roller as a Down B or Down Smash).
And I should note that while the Topic Poster for that rumor is reliable, his source has given him bad information in the past (he was told that Ridley was playable, which costed him his original account).
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
By the way, I snatched a copy of Melee today and played it for the first time in twelve years. I... don't like it. Everything feels too stiff, even to the point of doing Smash attacks. You have to be very precise, and I see myself doing tilt attacks when I don't mean to. It's weird.
Fair enough, but even then, the guy that leaked the video to his friends (who then leaked the images to the internet) was supposedly getting sued by Nintendo of America. Surely he doesn't work at the ESRB anymore.
On top of that, he was told that those characters were on a short list. If the guy was involved in the ESRB leak, how would the ESRB have a hold of the short list? And even if they did, Nintendo & the ESRB likely had those involved in the leaked fired.
balladofwindfishes
Member
The list is basically plucked right from the old fake leak days
A bunch of obvious characters, a rumored cut to a popular vet, and some oddball, but plausible characters.
It's basically every prerelease leak list ever, but it's been so long it's almost refreshing to see one
A bunch of obvious characters, a rumored cut to a popular vet, and some oddball, but plausible characters.
It's basically every prerelease leak list ever, but it's been so long it's almost refreshing to see one
Pretty much. :lol
I really want something cool to happen though. Even a small acknowledgement towards Team Taka's chances in the future with nothing from the ballot would be rad for me personally.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
lol doesn't he know in order to make semi-believable leaks he'd have to post in an imageboard or reddit? GameFAQs is small time
this plus evo is giving me total vibes of last summer
but the leak doesn't list ridley so let's all hope it's false
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
I found his story very fishy. I swear that I thought they fired the guy that leaked everything to his friends. If original source got fired then how the heck did they got more information so I would call bullshit on the story.
Waluigi being part of list made it even more fake since we know how Sakurai feel about Waluigi! :V
Waluigi being part of list made it even more fake since we know how Sakurai feel about Waluigi! :V
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
To be fair, the koopalings leak was revealed in gamefaqs way before the esrb leak.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
I thought the source is from smashboard.
I can't say that I'm convinced by this "leak" at all, but Inkling sure would be nice... And the thought that it would use the Agent 3 design is interesting, and not something I had considered before. While it's certainly not the most iconic look for the Inklings, it would further differentiate an Inkling Smash Bros. fighter/amiibo from the Inkling Mii Fighter outfits, the Splatoon amiibo, and the Inkling trophy (not that trophies matters much, though, as we now know). Plus the alternates for it would be easier to make, since they'd just need two models (girl and boy) with different colored ink, whereas if they went with the standard multiplayer designs, I feel like they'd want to represent different gear instead of just different ink colors, which would mean having unique models for each alternate, like Villager.
But all this just makes me all the more disappointed that Inklings probably won't make it into Smash this time. It's frustrating, too, because the move set comes so naturally now! Ink mechanic aside (which I believe would be the number one issue), the move set just comes together perfectly:
Standard Moves: Splattershot
Standard Special: Splat Charger
Side Special: Splat Bomb
Up Special: Super Jump
Down Special: Splat Roller
Final Smash: Bomb Rush
But all this just makes me all the more disappointed that Inklings probably won't make it into Smash this time. It's frustrating, too, because the move set comes so naturally now! Ink mechanic aside (which I believe would be the number one issue), the move set just comes together perfectly:
Standard Moves: Splattershot
Standard Special: Splat Charger
Side Special: Splat Bomb
Up Special: Super Jump
Down Special: Splat Roller
Final Smash: Bomb Rush
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
There are many other weapons that they could use for Inklings, like Mines or Seekers. IT would be awesome to see rival battle between Snake and Inkling.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
The way I imagine the Inkling is as a slow ranged shooter with the ability to use squid form to travel fast through the ground and air, but who could only attack in close combats.
The transformation would have to be instantaneous though, so I don't know how that would translate to the 3DS. Maybe just available for certain attacks?
The transformation would have to be instantaneous though, so I don't know how that would translate to the 3DS. Maybe just available for certain attacks?
True, though that move set was crafted with the default weapons in mind. Splattershot, Splat Roller, and Splat Charger cover the three default main weapons of each type, and the Splat Bomb is the default Sub Weapon used in Octo Valley. Following this logic, the Bomb Rush would probably be the most likely Special Weapon for the Final Smash, too.
Of course, they could easily represent different weapons with custom special moves...if DLC characters had those, that is. =/
I don't think transforming into squid form would be an issue at all, assuming it's just an aesthetic thing and the squid doesn't have its own move set. It would essentially be like Samus's Morph Ball or PAC-MAN's classic form.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Maybe a unique crawl where Inkling's crawl is super fast?
Crouch turns into a Squid, with crawl being used to move quickly around.
Dowtilt could be a hilarious squid flop.
This is exactly what I was thinking, lol.
Also, I would imagine there'd be an ink gauge as well. Inklings would have long range and good power at the cost of their attacks being limited by an ink gauge that depletes as they attack (maybe just limited to Smash Attacks and Special Moves, kinda like Robin?). Since I don't think it'd be realistic to expect the stages in Smash Bros. to actually be able to be inked like in Splatoon, you couldn't actually ink the ground and hide in it in squid form to refill your ink faster, but maybe just crouching and turning into a squid would refill your gauge faster? Of course, it would fill up slower over time as well.
Mii Costumes aren't exactly a reason to rule a character out, either (as Link's Mii Costume proved). Plus unlike characters like Wonder Red, the Inklings have a legitimate shot at getting in the game even without the ballot.
I thought about this last week.
Smash Bros has no character with the 'energy gauge' gimmick
Inklings actually would be perfect for this one
And they have so many different weapons/abilities, its even possible to make every Smash/Tilt/Air/Special without repeating anything
Like using a quick circle motion with the brush as a DSmash
No, but I can see the Inkling Mii Fighter outfits being a bit of an issue. Unlike Link, Inklings have very similar proportions to Mii Fighters. The difference between the Inkling Mii Fighter outfits and an actual Inkling fighter wouldn't be nearly as obvious as the difference between the Link Mii Fighter outfit and the actual Link fighter. (Also, while it probably means little to nothing, the Link Mii Fighter outfit is actually Skyward Sword Link, not Twilight Princess Link like the actual fighter, so it's technically a different character.) Does it means an Inkling fighter with the same designs as the Mii Fighter outfits is impossible? No, of course not. But I do think it may be less likely because of it, and I have a good feeling that the Mii Fighter outfits were only made in the first place because we won't be getting them as an actual character. It's a different situation than the Link outfit, because that was added after the fact (with it being based on a different Link, no less), while the Inkling Mii Fighter outfits were released before there was ever an Inkling fighter.
balladofwindfishes
Member
I have actually confused my Lonk Mii with Toon Link on big stages when the camera zooms out.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
It's obvious that the leak is fake.
It's like let me make fake list with top 15-20 popular characters that would get a lot of votes then I would tell everyone that it's shortlist from nintendo/namco. It's really easy to do that.
To be fair, it could very well still be true or partially true even if it sounds ridiculous. I don't think I believe it, personally, but apparently the guy has been verified as legit, so I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss it. After all, everyone was so quick to dismiss the ESRB leak initially (myself included). Of course, even if it is true, it means little, since it's basically just a group of potential characters. And while it does seem odd that they imply that Nintendo has more say over these characters than Sakurai, which we know hasn't been the case before, who's to say that things aren't different regarding DLC? After all, non-DLC characters are all just part of a bigger package that's sold as one. DLC characters, however, are sold individually, and Nintendo's funding all this extra development, after all... Maybe the want to ensure that DLC characters will be characters that they believe will sell very well? I don't know. Anyway, all I'm saying is that we probably shouldn't completely dismiss it (nor completely trust it) just yet.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Nonsense. Waluigi is obviously the next DLC character.
I don't believe they'd even consider Waluigi, he's such a bottom of the rung character from a series already highly represented in smash. Like, I complain about Rosalina not being a significant enough Mario character, but Waluigi is several levels below her.
I had this same experience earlier this year after not playing Melee for a few months after the launch of Smash Wii U. It's a bit rough to transition back but IMO it feels better after you get used it. Melee just demands you be more precise with your inputs and doesn't let you spam things like smashes and rolls crazy fast.
Then again 12 years might be a much harder transition compared to the 5 or 6 months I had.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Smash hasn't promoted a Pokemon that hasn't appeared yet right?
balladofwindfishes
Member
Greninja is the newest overall, due to X/Y's global release.
In the US, Pichu and Lucario were only one year old when they appeared in Smash (same as Greninja). GS and DP came out awhile before that in Japan, though.
Smash is usually released too close to the start of a new generation to promote the next generation. Smash 64 is the only game in the series where a new Pokemon generation hadn't started just a year before (or a year and a half for Japan).
It's actually kind of interesting we've had a character in Smash for every new generation released right before Smash. Pichu, Lucario and now Greninja.
#freethepichu
DICKS AHOY
Banned
Still trying to follow the specifics behind that GameFAQ's post since the original thread is gone on Smash Boards, but I'd be fine with the characters they listed as DLC.
I mean, moreso K. Rool than someone like Waluigi or Paper Mario, but after hating the idea of Bowser Jr. and thinking Pac-Man/Ryu would be boring inclusions before they wound up being some of my favorite fighters I'm game for just about anyone.
Weird Inkling and Wolf are down as less likely tho. Wolf in particular seems like a no-brainer, what with having a pre-existing moveset, being even less of a clone than Lucas/Roy were and Star Fox Zero coming out soon while featuring him. I could see them holding back on Inkling to headline a Smash 5 (and maybe having stronger hardware to handle all the ink/liquid effects their moveset would have) tho.
I mean, moreso K. Rool than someone like Waluigi or Paper Mario, but after hating the idea of Bowser Jr. and thinking Pac-Man/Ryu would be boring inclusions before they wound up being some of my favorite fighters I'm game for just about anyone.
Weird Inkling and Wolf are down as less likely tho. Wolf in particular seems like a no-brainer, what with having a pre-existing moveset, being even less of a clone than Lucas/Roy were and Star Fox Zero coming out soon while featuring him. I could see them holding back on Inkling to headline a Smash 5 (and maybe having stronger hardware to handle all the ink/liquid effects their moveset would have) tho.
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