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[NeonZ]

Debatable, but Chrom was Sakurai's initial go to Fire Emblem character before realizing how boring he'd be. Even beyond story importance or game functionality, Chrom is the de facto lead of the game by a marketing stand point, much like however much people claim Ashe is the lead of Final Fantasy XII, Vaan's the lead as far as SE is concerned.

Yes, Chrom was the lead in the pre-release promotion, but that's because they wanted to avoid making an official image of Robin, due to his customizable nature. Before Cipher, Robin didn't even have any official artwork aside from the in-game mugshot and character design sheets.

If we look at post-release material, even though she wasn't the actual lead in-game, Lucina is often promoted as Awakening's 'mascot'. She's the one on the cover of Knights of Iris, she also was the one representing Awakening and standing alongside Marth when they were promoting the first Ylisse and Archanea collections of the Cipher card game.

But even outside characters, Fire Emblem, for some inexplicable reason, has a new stage in both versions while most veteran franchises don't. So we have both of Brawl's veterans returning, a newcomer, a new clone, a returning clone as DLC, a returning stage, and two new stages across both versions. Meanwhile, Zelda has essentially sat stagnant with its characters for two games (the amount of which Fire Emblem currently meets?!), Star Fox shrank, and Donkey Kong can't even be arsed to get a fucking Assist Trophy. And now Fire Emblem "needs a newcomer." Yeah, okay.

Donkey Kong had 3 enemy types in Smash Run, while FE has none. FE also has no items. I'm not saying that's equivalent at all though. It's obvious that DK has less representation than FE in Smash 4.

In Zelda's case specifically, it feels like Sakurai thought that the extra items it got this time, alongside the new attacks due to separating Zelda and Sheik make up for the lack of actual new playable representation. I agree about it being a mistake though.

FE's new stages are also kind of odd though in that in spite of both being technically completely different, they share the same theme (arenas) and also reuse the same gimmick (changing layout due to machinery that pops up from the floor). Many other series in Smash suffer from reused themes, like Mario's 1-1 stages, but I don't think any of the other stages added in SSB4 basically reuse the same gimmicks like that.

 

[PK Gaming]

Yeah, I apologize for going too far in there, it's been a rotten day over here.

No worries dude, it's all good. I mean, can't say I'm too unhappy with how things turned out (i'm a hopeless fire emblem stan) but I definitely sympathize with your frustrations.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Ugh, I hope the removed stage from the website and trailer wasn't a promo stage for Zero that got delayed because of the Zero delay.

And I really hope Wolf wasn't impacted. I'd appreciate him sooner, rather than later. He's the one vet I feel the roster needs to be perfect, everything else would just be bonus characters.

 

[Sponge]

Ugh, I hope the removed stage from the website and trailer wasn't a promo stage for Zero that got delayed because of the Zero delay.

And I really hope Wolf wasn't impacted. I'd appreciate him sooner, rather than later. He's the one vet I feel the roster needs to be perfect, everything else would just be bonus characters.

I'm hoping this isn't the case either.

 

[IntelliHeath]

I'm hoping this isn't the case either.

me too.

 

[UglyRareCharacter]

DK has two enemy types, unless stuff like the different color Shyguys count as different enemies

He got so screwed, y'all

K. Rool AND Dixie, Cranky AT, Gangplank Galleon stage with lots of not-jungle songs and an animal buddy crate item would fix all

Also Wolf can still be promotional, it would just have to be for some Star Fox trailer instead of the release, unless DLC extends all the way into 2016 now

 

[Starphoenix]

There better be some kind of medley or rip of this on Super Mario Maker.

https://youtu.be/rrHSylEV5wE

 

[UglyRareCharacter]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...-b4JHJ0_cGRKU15KYlTe1E/htmlview#gid=729442469

This came from Tumblr from that ssb4dojo guy, it has like almost 45,000 votes counted right now

 

[Karsticles]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...-b4JHJ0_cGRKU15KYlTe1E/htmlview#gid=729442469

This came from Tumblr from that ssb4dojo guy, it has like almost 45,000 votes counted right now

15 people voting for K. Rool over and over.

 

[UglyRareCharacter]

How do you figure that? xD

 

[Sponge]

K. Rool AND Dixie, Cranky AT, Gangplank Galleon stage with lots of not-jungle songs and an animal buddy crate item would fix all

I still say Cranky should be playable one day. He is THE arcade Donkey Kong after all. Can't get much more old school then that.

 

[GustyGardner]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...-b4JHJ0_cGRKU15KYlTe1E/htmlview#gid=729442469

This came from Tumblr from that ssb4dojo guy, it has like almost 45,000 votes counted right now

Can no one spell Micaiah's name correctly?

Spoiler

Why is she even on there?

 

[balladofwindfishes]

The way he came to the "Top Global Percent" is just weird. Half of some US/Euro poll and half of SourceGaming's observations? That's mashing the results of basically two unrelated methods of measuring interest and pretending you can just combine the data.

 

[SenorArdilla]

Why is she even on there?

 

[UglyRareCharacter]

I still say Cranky should be playable one day. He is THE arcade Donkey Kong after all. Can't get much more old school then that.

Yeah I would love him too but I think K.Rool and Dixie have the upper hand and that three newcomers for one series is a lot.

Now if Sakurai developed a new DK game.......

 

[GustyGardner]

Heh, I asked for that.

I still say Cranky should be playable one day. He is THE arcade Donkey Kong after all. Can't get much more old school then that.

Honestly I would rather Cranky be playable than K Rool or Dixie, not that I have a problem with either. Regardless, DK really does need a new character soon.

 

[Karsticles]

How do you figure that? xD

Just a joke about how wack those results probably are.

 

[Regulus Tera]

Poor, poor Sakurai: http://www.sourcegaming.info/2015/09/18/cero-and-palutenas-censorship/

 

[MrSaturn99]

Poor, poor Sakurai: http://www.sourcegaming.info/2015/09/18/cero-and-palutenas-censorship/

Sakurai: Precisely. Super Smash Bros. for Wii U almost didn’t make its scheduled release date because of ratings issues. We had to revise Palutena and Wonder Pink’s models over and over again.

Er, wow. Really?

 

[Ryce]

CERO's probably why the Tharja trophy was pulled, too.

 

[Regulus Tera]

The best part is that what Palutena is wearing are basically granny panties.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

A skin tight latex jumpsuit on a supermodel is just fine though.

Ratings are kind of silly. Wonder Pink is dressed like a cheerleader and looks like a chibi cartoon character that's not worth a ratings bump. How are Palutena's shorts any different than ZSS'!? ZSS' are shorter and she's a more sexualized character as a whole...

 

[Gonzo The Great]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...-b4JHJ0_cGRKU15KYlTe1E/htmlview#gid=729442469

This came from Tumblr from that ssb4dojo guy, it has like almost 45,000 votes counted right now

K. Rool fans are just a vocal minority. Stop being delusional.

 

[RomanceDawn]

K. Rool fans are just a vocal minority. Stop being delusional.

Finally you've come around! Waluigi for DLC right?!

 

[Platy]

Poor, poor Sakurai: http://www.sourcegaming.info/2015/09/18/cero-and-palutenas-censorship/

....this is not how censorship works =P

 

[IntelliHeath]

A skin tight latex jumpsuit on a supermodel is just fine though.

Ratings are kind of silly. Wonder Pink is dressed like a cheerleader and looks like a chibi cartoon character that's not worth a ratings bump. How are Palutena's shorts any different than ZSS'!? ZSS' are shorter and she's a more sexualized character as a whole...

It's probably because it's white. Yeah, I didn't think that they would be more stricter with rating in Japan.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

CERO's probably why the Tharja trophy was pulled, too.

they need to be stopped

 

[PK Gaming]

Yeah i'm surprised they didn't make a fuss about ZSS who has a body that's burning like the sun

 

[SenorArdilla]

Yeah i'm surprised they didn't make a fuss about ZSS who has a body that's burning like the sun

Probably because no panties.

 

[Boss Doggie]

More like panties in Japan have an associated fetish there more so than just a skin-tight figure.

And in a way I'm glad I was banned - the Ganondorf drama made me annoyed since it's using personal bias as a form of objective argument, especially on how a single character could apparently affect the game.

 

[Crayolan]

Ugh, I hope the removed stage from the website and trailer wasn't a promo stage for Zero that got delayed because of the Zero delay.

And I really hope Wolf wasn't impacted. I'd appreciate him sooner, rather than later. He's the one vet I feel the roster needs to be perfect, everything else would just be bonus characters.

Ice Climbers?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...-b4JHJ0_cGRKU15KYlTe1E/htmlview#gid=729442469

This came from Tumblr from that ssb4dojo guy, it has like almost 45,000 votes counted right now

The truth comes out: no one gives a shit about Rhythm Heaven.

I think a RH rep will find their way into smash eventually nonetheless.

Poor, poor Sakurai: http://www.sourcegaming.info/2015/09/18/cero-and-palutenas-censorship/

Sakurai spitting those truth facts. So silly that a panty shot is considered sexual but ZSS isn't.

 

[Regulus Tera]

In an alternate timeline, we got a gritty adult Factor 5 Pit instead of Dark Pit. I'm not sure which is worse.

 

[IntelliHeath]

In an alternate timeline, we got a gritty adult Factor 5 Pit instead of Dark Pit. I'm not sure which is worse.

Gritty Adult factor 5 Pit is worse for me at least because I felt that the design was pretty terrible.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Probably because no panties.

Well yea, that's obvious from looking at ZSS' model ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Ice Climbers?

We know exactly why they were cut and we know it's not happening. Wolf on the other hand doesn't really have an excuse, especially since they brought Roy and Lucas back, who are probably less popular than Wolf.

 

[UglyRareCharacter]

I feel like it is horrible that The Climbers got cut because of stupid reasons about roster-sameness between systems. But Wolf is a big character in his series while Climbers are a dime a dozen of retro characters that most people like because of Melee and their playstyle. Wolf has that plus all his fans from Star Fox.

Both should come back but I can see why people focus on Wolf first

 

[Regulus Tera]

http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=179321905


TOO MUCH FUCKING FIRE EMBLEM DAMN IT SAKU...rai?

Anyway this shows why Lucina ain't going anywhere. She is very very popular.

 

[IntelliHeath]

http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=179321905
Anyway this shows why Lucina ain't going anywhere. She is very very popular.

Like I said, it's matter of her getting luigication or not. I haven't play the game yet but is there any way that we could make her not being marth clone despite that her role is Masked Marth. Yes, I'm pretty clueless with her potential moveset.

 

[Kjellson]

Fiora.

Smash.

Now.

 

[Sponge]

http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=179321905


TOO MUCH FUCKING FIR EMBLEM DAMN IT SAKU...rai?

Anyway this shows why Lucina ain't going anywhere. She is very very popular.

That's really cool to have some Nintendo characters in that game! That's awesome.

Also there was some new Jakks Pacific figures shown at SDCC a while back. One's Dixie ;_;

Sell me Dixie as DLC already, Nintendo! The Skull Kid fig is cool, too.

 

[TheDinoman]

I'm aware Sakurai doesn't like to change characters too much (and I can see why) but I hope in the future Lucina is able to become more than just "Marth with the tipper". As it currently stands, she's just completely outclassed because there's another character whose the same thing but actually has a gimmick or purpose.

Similarly, I wouldn't mind Dark Pit staying if he was more than just "Pit with like three differences". They don't even have to totally Luigify him, they could just "Melee Falcofy" him if you know what I mean.

 

[IntelliHeath]

Sell me Dixie as DLC already, Nintendo! The Skull Kid fig is cool, too.

If anything, I felt that Dixie might be one of no-brainer characters that would be available as downloadable character but again, Sakurai might have something in his sleeves to surprise us.

 

[UglyRareCharacter]

Again, as hyped as she is years away from Smash5, unless Lucina becomes more liked than Marth Ike Robin Roy or New FE Rep, she is severely outmatched. Sakurai surely has no qualms about adding six characters for his favorite series but if development time is a thing then she might just go back to being a costume as was the original plan

Also wasn't there a Cranky figurine in that same set?

 

[Sponge]

Also wasn't there a Cranky figurine in that same set?

There was! I ended up picking it up since I don't think a newer Cranky figure existed before this one.

 

[Boss Doggie]

Wait, why are people giving stock at that google document?

 

[jph139]

I think that Lucina (and Roy) are the most likely FE characters to get Lucas'd for Smash 5. I think Sakurai would probably prioritize a newcomer over either of them. They're definitely both here to stay, though, in some way or another - they're popular enough to stay in rotation as second-stringers at least.

 

[Golnei]

I think that Lucina (and Roy) are the most likely FE characters to get Lucas'd for Smash 5. I think Sakurai would probably prioritize a newcomer over either of them. They're definitely both here to stay, though, in some way or another - they're popular enough to stay in rotation as second-stringers at least.

Roy maybe, but Lucina has become one of the most popular characters in the entire series; easily outstripping him, Robin and Ike. Her only Smash appearance being a direct clone would insulate her further, similar to Dr. Mario. Going by Wolf and Lucas' precedent, I actually think Ike is less likely to show up again if time constraints are an issue.

 

[anotherVegan]

Just voted again for Geno. Hope lives on...

 

[TheDinoman]

if development time is a thing then she might just go back to being a costume as was the original plan

Won't happen if Sakurai directs the next game.

http://www.gamnesia.com/news/sakurai-explains-why-dr-mario-is-his-own-character-in-smash-bros

"Actually all model-change characters that we have now were originally just supposed to be color configurations. Just like the Little Mac wireframe or how Olimar and Alph are included, we planned to just make the look and maybe the voice a possible configuration. But, when talking about Dr. Mario, including his abilities he had a lot of individuality in Melee compared to Mario. Also there were fans that said things like 'I'm a doctor!', or 'A back-alley doctor!' when they chose the black color config. When you have such fans and you just change the character-model and leave it at that and it becomes the same as Mario, we thought people might get angry. That's why we forced ourselves and changed that.

Basically what he's saying here is that he decided to make Doc his own character because he figured that his fans wouldn't be so happy seeing him with Fludd and such. He'd rather throw the character out entirely than shove their corpse on to another.

And to be honest, I can see where he's coming from. I always hated it when people suggested that Wolf, Falco, Lucas, etc should all be relegated as alts for Fox and Ness (those cases are even worse than Doc considering how different the former characters are from the latter at this point). Sure, Doc may technically just be Mario in a labcoat, but in terms of Smash, he's his own character, his own identity, and Sakurai acknowledged that by making him his own character slot.

A similar thing can be said for Lucina, whose identity currently is Marth without the tipper. If Sakurai thought fans wouldn't want to see Dr. Mario with FLUDD on, perhaps he thinks fans wouldn't want to see Lucina with a tipper, if you know what I mean here.

 

[Draxal]

Like I said, it's matter of her getting luigication or not. I haven't play the game yet but is there any way that we could make her not being marth clone despite that her role is Masked Marth. Yes, I'm pretty clueless with her potential moveset.

Yes and no, I think her role is non tipper Marth, however they could always class change as they did in the X Zone trailer.

Again, as hyped as she is years away from Smash5, unless Lucina becomes more liked than Marth Ike Robin Roy or New FE Rep, she is severely outmatched. Sakurai surely has no qualms about adding six characters for his favorite series but if development time is a thing then she might just go back to being a costume as was the original plan

Also wasn't there a Cranky figurine in that same set?

She's more popular than any character asides from Marth on that list. Ike's games sold like garbage (although Ike himself is fairly popular ... but I think it's because of the Smash effect), and Roy didn't come from a standout game. She also evens out the gender representation a bit.

The way I see it going is ... Marth > Lucina > Robin > Ike > Roy.

edit. I do think Ike represented well in a recent poll, even winning out. I just think the gender/weapon choice is hurting him a bit.

 

[TheDinoman]

Yes and no, I think her role is non tipper Marth. They could always class change as they did in the trailer.

I really do like Roy's aesthetics in Smash 4. Most of his attack animations were modified so that he uses his sword backhandedly or with two hands, emphasizing Roy's hilt sweetspot and giving his sword a more heavier and brute feeling, compared to how Marth lightly swings his Falchion with less effort. I'd like to see Lucina undergo changes like that.