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Smash Wii U & 3DS Downloadable Characters Discussion and Information on Smash Ballot

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Boss Doggie

Boss Doggie

all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I get the idea, but even if it's a lame music for fighting, Xenoblade Title feels like it should always be part of the "gang", you know, the "Guar Plains - You Will Know Our Names - Engage the Enemy - Mechanical Rhythm" gang.

And I forgot about Xenosaga DS existing.
 
F

FSLink

Banned
NotLiquid said:
Random thought

Wondering whether the "awesome news" that Roger was actually hinting at was Twilight Princess HD
Click to expand...

Twilight Princess HD with Wolf Link Smash DLC. GET HYPE

Would be worth it just for the meltdowns of "WHY ANOTHER ZELDA CHARACTER"

Golnei said:
The regular battle theme and the night variation of Gaur Plain have no business being there, I agree. The medley is pretty bad as well - given the choice, I'd have replaced them with Unfinished Battle, Tragic Decision and either
Zanza
or Mechonis Field. (Actually, I wouldn't have minded it if Unfinished Battle replaced Time to Fight in Xenoblade itself...)

Some Xenosaga music would have been nice as well, but Sakurai seemed reluctant to acknowledge its existence at all.
Click to expand...

I don't mind the regular battle theme since it basically sounds like something out of Kingdom Hearts.

Gaur Plains should have transition into Gaur Plains (night) in some sort of medley made for the stage's transition.

And the medley is mostly meh overall, yes.
 
Dr. Buni

Dr. Buni

Member
Neoxon said:
We know that his news is Smash-related.
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Assuming he is telling the true. :p
FSLink said:
Twilight Princess HD with Wolf Link Smash DLC. GET HYPE

Would be worth it just for the meltdowns of "WHY ANOTHER ZELDA CHARACTER"
Click to expand...
Wolf Link with Midna would be great. Wolf Link by himself not so much.

And I doubt people would complain about a Zelda newcomer, in fact I find more people complaining about the lack of Zelda newcomers, especially non-clone newcomers.
 
F

FSLink

Banned
BGBW said:
For a series that hasn't had a newcomer since Melee?
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?

I have no problem with Wolf Link (with or without Midna). A new character means new moveset possibilities after all.

I just think the internet would not be pleased over him over Inklings and other characters and that'd be hilariously sad as usual.

Reila said:
And I doubt people would complain about a Zelda newcomer, in fact I find more people complaining about the lack of Zelda newcomers, especially non-clone newcomers.
Click to expand...

Maybe not here on NeoGAF, but I'm sure there'd be plenty of whining.
 
Dr. Buni

Dr. Buni

Member
FSLink said:
Maybe not here on NeoGAF, but I'm sure there'd be plenty of whining.
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There will be whining for any character that is included. It is impossible to please everyone. I think people would complain more about another Mario/Pokémon or worse, Fire Emblem character getting in. Zelda though... It is lacking a proper newcomer since Melee.
 
R

Ryce

Member
BGBW said:
Do you consider Link a newcomer because he now sports a TP look? Toon Link is just Young Link given his latest appearance much like the other Zelda characters.
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No, because a character named Link appeared in the previous installments. "Toon Link" first appeared in Brawl, and as such he is a newcomer. Young Link is a child version of Melee's regular Link, but Toon Link has a completely different relationship to Brawl/4 Link.

nBBlv4C.png

It's even more new Brawl challengers! There's a total of eight. Defeat them all.
 
NeonZ

NeonZ

Member
Ryce said:
No, because a character named Link appeared in the previous installments. "Toon Link" first appeared in Brawl, and as such he is a newcomer. Young Link is a child version of Melee's regular Link, but Toon Link has a completely different relationship to Brawl/4 Link.

nBBlv4C.png

It's even more new Brawl challengers! There's a total of eight. Defeat them all.
Click to expand...

And yet he inherited many gameplay elements from Young Link, like the wall jump, 2-step Smash attack where the first strike doesn't launch the foe and multiple hit spinning attack. Toon Link also only got the horizontal moving spinning attack from Wind Waker as a custom move in SSB4, so, kind of like Ganondorf, he seems to be restricted by the Melee established moveset over actually representing his Wind Waker abilities.

Yes, he officially counts as a newcomer, but the game is just being inconsistent there.
 
R

Ryce

Member
NeonZ said:
And yet he inherited many gameplay elements from Young Link, like the wall jump, 2-step Smash attack where the first strike doesn't launch the foe and multiple hit spinning attack. Toon Link also only got the horizontal moving spinning attack from Wind Waker as a custom move in SSB4, so, kind of like Ganondorf, he seems to be restricted by the Melee established moveset over actually representing his Wind Waker abilities.
Click to expand...
None of that is relevant to whether or not he's a newcomer, though.
 
NeonZ

NeonZ

Member
Ryce said:
None of that is relevant to whether or not he's a newcomer, though.
Click to expand...

It's pretty relevant to understand why people are complaining about the lack of Zelda newcomers since Brawl, rather than only SSB4. An official label doesn't change what they actually did.
 
R

Ryce

Member
NeonZ said:
It's pretty relevant to understand why people are complaining about the lack of Zelda newcomers since Brawl, rather than only SSB4. An official label doesn't change what they actually did.
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"There hasn't been a Zelda newcomer since Melee" is a factually incorrect statement. That's all I was trying to comment on.
 
R

Ryce

Member
BGBW said:
More like factually correct since he's just a re-skin which no one can argue against.
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"Newcomer" isn't a magical term. All it means is new character. Smash Bros. didn't have a character called Toon Link until Brawl -- therefore, he was a newcomer in that game. I'm not exactly saying anything controversial.
 
M

Muzy72

Banned
You guys are just arguing over semantics lol.

Obviously when they say no newcomer since Melee they're not including clones. People want an actual Zelda newcomer, not a clone. Toon Link is a newcomer, yes, but he's not unique.
 
B

BGBW

Maturity, bitches.
Reila said:
Still technically a newcomer, since Toon Link and Young Link are different characters.
Click to expand...

Based on the Zelda games in which case Link and Zelda are different characters as well. They just updated his appearance and gave him a new name. I don't consider that a new comer.

If they bring back "Young Link" as DLC I'll accept I'm wrong, but they won't because he was never cut and is already in the game.
 
Dr. Buni

Dr. Buni

Member
Some people want a Zelda newcomer, btw. As with Kirby and the main trio, I think the Zelda series is perfectly well represented with the Triforce bearers.
BGBW said:
but they won't because he was never cut and is already in the game.
Click to expand...
But he was. Unfortunately. YL > TL.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
ffs Toon Link and Young Link even share an idle animation. That's such a petty meaningless animation for two unrelated characters to share.

Along with their hit sounds.

Smash 4 added TL Fire Arrows and a White costume as well (so now TL has all of YL's alt colors)

Young Link was also considered "the original" Link in Smash, and low and behold, Toon Link's alts not based on Four Swords are based on "the original" Links.
 
R

Ryce

Member
Toon Link is Young Link's spiritual successor, but they're different characters in the Smash Bros. universe. I'll take the word of the guy who actually made the game over a couple of people on a forum.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
Ryce said:
Toon Link is Young Link's spiritual successor, but they're different characters in the Smash Bros. universe. I'll take the word of the guy who actually made the game over a couple of people on a forum.
Click to expand...

He's never actually said Toon Link wasn't meant to be Young Link. Toon Link is actually one of the only clones Sakurai has never really gone into detail about other than "yea, we added him late to Brawl"

There's also no reference to Young Link in Brawl's files at all.
 
J

jph139

Member
I mean, we could say "Zelda hasn't gotten a newcomer that's not a clone, a reimagining of a veteran, and is satisfyingly fresh to fans of the series since Melee" - but that's a bit pedantic. Intent is clear; no need to split hairs over precise terminology.
 
G

Gonzo The Great

Banned
Nintendo's radio silence is killing me. Like, I understand that Iwata died, but the world can't end because of that. If they aren't ready to host another Direct, at least deliver news in a somewhat coherent fashion instead of randomly announcing things on Twitter.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
Ryce said:
Because he was replaced by Toon Link. That doesn't make them the same character, though. There aren't any references to Pichu either, but it's clearly not the same character as Plusle & Minun.
Click to expand...

With Toon/Young Link you're dealing with an entirely arbitrary made up name for a character.

For Pichu and Plusle/Minun you can't point at Plusle/Minun and call them Pichu. It doesn't make sense and isn't the character. But with Toon/Young Link, they're made up names. The character is just Link. You can point to Toon Link and call him Young Link and it still works because TL is still a younger Link.

Literally the only tangible difference that makes TL a "new comer" in Brawl is his name. Not even his visual appearance would matter if they had just called him Young Link, because that name is entirely made up and still makes sense on TL.

Zelda was basically cheated out of a new comer in Brawl. A petty rename and visual update to a character and it's supposed to be a new comer despite playing basically the same. Falco has more changes between Melee and Brawl than Young Link does with Toon Link.
 
NeonZ

NeonZ

Member
woopWOOP said:
I won't stop supporting more until we get an axe and/or spear wielder

Medeus would be alright too
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Medeus would be too big in the form that matters.

I wish Ike got some ax attacks. IS did an excellent job making each Smash FE character feel extremely distinct in Codename STEAM (although Ike ended up very weak...). Some of his sword strikes could easily be replaced by ax ones without really changing how he plays, but making him even more visually distinct.
 
Dr. Buni

Dr. Buni

Member
BKSmash said:
If clones doesn't count as newcomers, then Fire Emblems deserves at least one new character. Right?
dear god please no
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At this point, I think they should go ahead and make a Fire Emblem fighting game a la Persona 4 Arena, if only to stop plaguing Smash with countless FE characters.

I wish the Smash FE roster were composed by Marth, Ike and Robin. :p
 
G

Green Mamba

Member
Your terrible taste in Donkey Kong characters aside, just because something was recently trademarked by Nintendo doesn't mean they intend to do anything with it in the near future.
 
D

Draxal

Member
Reila said:
At this point, I think they should go ahead and make a Fire Emblem fighting game a la Persona 4 Arena, if only to stop plaguing Smash with countless FE characters.

I wish the Smash FE roster were composed by Marth, Ike and Robin. :p
Click to expand...

Honestly, I kinda consider a Lucina an alt in this game (tipper vs non tipper), and you know an option for stronger gender representation.

Roy was just dlc being dlc and had to get all reasonable vets (Ice climbers due to 3ds implications and the Trainer).

Honestly, I would have been content with Marth and Robin, Ike and Roy's popularity is 100% due to Smash and not their own games, and the main reason they're back is not to piss off old vets.
 
S

Sponge

Banned
I've always said I'll gladly take any new DK character, but DK Jr? It's so unexpected and I would be so happy if that happened.
 
Boss Doggie

Boss Doggie

all my loli wolf companions are so moe
So a faster, lighter, Donkey Kong clone?

Or Donkey Kong in a clown car who features the Kong family in the clown car rather than alt colors?
 
G

Gonzo The Great

Banned
kirby_fox said:
DK jr could have moves based on the arcade games. I'd be ok with this.
Click to expand...
You mean climbing vines? Because that's literally all he does. The arcade games are adequately "represented". Donkey Jr. was always known as the sequel that never lived up to the original, and Donkey Kong 3 is an abomination that nobody cares about.

DKC2, DKC3, and Tropical Freeze are the games that need more representation. ie; the sequel games that Sakurai likes to ignore for some reason.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
Throw in some minis and maybe a gag math move or taunt as well.

No need to be a clone. Plenty to work with just from DK, DK Jr, DK '94, and the MvDK series.

The first 15 years of the Donkey Kong franchise is basically ignored in Smash, besides one of the worst levels in the entire series.

Guess who also has a Mario Maker costume? That's right, Donkey Kong Jr does!

Green Mamba said:
Your terrible taste in Donkey Kong characters aside
Click to expand...
DK Jr is the inspiration for Diddy and appeared in several games before the DKC erased him from existence. For several years he was basically DK's right hand man, until Diddy came and stole that niche.
 
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