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Smash Wii U & 3DS Downloadable Characters Discussion and Information on Smash Ballot

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The DKC show was... unique

srBUKqY.png

Now if Rare retweets this then we have the IP holder, the IP holder's abusive overlord AND people who made Banjo-Kooie when they were at their prime. Critical mass.
 

Hatchtag

Banned
Anything is possible, but it doesn't even seem like a conversation worth having anymore. Sakurai doesn't think Ridley should be playable, so he gave him a major gameplay role instead. It's going to take several years and a new Smash Bros. to get Sakurai to rethink his position on Ridley.

I donno. I'm hoping people don't stop voting for Ridley because of Sakurai's comments.

I mean, shit, Bowser's playable in Melee despite Giga Bowser being a major boss character.
 
I donno. I'm hoping people don't stop voting for Ridley because of Sakurai's comments.

I mean, shit, Bowser's playable in Melee despite Giga Bowser being a major boss character.

Totally different. I've always been saying that you'd really lose what makes Ridley the revered Metroid boss that he is if you shrunk him down and balanced him. Turns out, that's EXACTLY the reason Sakurai won't make him playable. Ironically, Giga Bowser is a Smash exclusive creation and I think the only way they'd include Ridley is to make some kind of Smash exclusive playable form with his familiar "true form" as a Final Smash transformation. To me, it's like asking for Master and Crazy hand to be toned down and playable.

While I'm against Ridley being playable, I do still wish they'd make some kind of playable boss mode where someone with the gamepad controls a boss character and the remaining players have to try and take him out. Perfect compromise and balance.
 

Hatchtag

Banned
Totally different. I've always been saying that you'd really lose what makes Ridley the revered Metroid boss that he is if you shrunk him down and balanced him. Turns out, that's EXACTLY the reason Sakurai won't make him playable. Ironically, Giga Bowser is a Smash exclusive creation and I think the only way they'd include Ridley is to make some kind of Smash exclusive playable form with his familiar "true form" as a Final Smash transformation. To me, it's like asking for Master and Crazy hand to be toned down and playable.

While I'm against Ridley being playable, I do still wish they'd make some kind of playable boss mode where someone with the gamepad controls a boss character and the remaining players have to try and take him out. Perfect compromise and balance.

I donno. Look at Bowser or Ganondorf. They're both pretty menacing while being balanced, because they hit really hard and can kill you in significantly less moves than most other characters. So I think it's possible for Ridley to be playable without losing his menace. It'd be hard-Bowser's been complete shit in two games and Ganondorf's been complete shit in one. But it'd be possible.
 

Fandangox

Member
Is anyone even interested in the Mii costumes? The Proto Man one looks nice, but I never play Mii Fighters so I won't be buying it.

Would be a hilarious (and awful) troll though to put a requested fighter in as a Mii costume. Like say a Wonder Red costume for Mii Brawler and Wonder Blue costume for Mii Swordfighter.

...I'll take it.
 
So I was thinking, I'm not sure they really can use the poll all that much, or at all.

It costs a lot of money to bring the announcer and the Kid Icarus cast in every single time to record new lines, it's far cheaper to do it all at once. And with Mewtwo a week away, obviously that recording session has happened already.

Now they could have had them record a bunch of lines awhile ago for a bunch of likely suspects, but still, if they didn't, will they want to bring them in to record lines because some random character did well in the poll?

And they can't really just use the generic error message one either because it sounds stupid on any Brawl vet unless Pit has the memory of a goldfish. And it's sloppy and just not what I'd expect from Sakurai.

Just something to think about.
 

TDLink

Member
So I was thinking, I'm not sure they really can use the poll all that much, or at all.

It costs a lot of money to bring the announcer and the Kid Icarus cast in every single time to record new lines, it's far cheaper to do it all at once. And with Mewtwo a week away, obviously that recording session has happened already.

Now they could have had them record a bunch of lines awhile ago for a bunch of likely suspects, but still, if they didn't, will they want to bring them in to record lines because some random character did well in the poll?

And they can't really just use the generic error message one either because it sounds stupid on any Brawl vet unless Pit has the memory of a goldfish. And it's sloppy and just not what I'd expect from Sakurai.

Just something to think about.

The only brawl vets who will return are likely in the pre-planned (non poll) DLC like Lucas, so the generic messages could indeed be used. The announcer also publically stated he recorded names for characters not in the game.

Even if they had to do a new recording session for Palutena/Pit/The Announcer, they could just do it after they decide which ballot characters they are doing.
 
The only brawl vets who will return are likely in the pre-planned (non poll) DLC like Lucas, so the generic messages could indeed be used. The announcer also publically stated he recorded names for characters not in the game.

Even if they had to do a new recording session for Palutena/Pit/The Announcer, they could just do it after they decide which ballot characters they are doing.

Using the generic message which is nothing more than a glorified error would seem really lazy and sloppy.

My thought is that they're going to try and make the DLC as seamless as possible. A person 5 years down the line getting the game and all DLC would have no idea what was DLC or not, there would be no difference between Mario added at release and K Rool added 2 years later, or whatever. That seems more Sakurai's style.
 

TDLink

Member
Using the generic message which is nothing more than a glorified error would seem really lazy and sloppy.

My thought is that they're going to try and make the DLC as seamless as possible. A person 5 years down the line getting the game and all DLC would have no idea what was DLC or not, there would be no difference between Mario added at release and K Rool added 2 years later, or whatever. That seems more Sakurai's style.

Most people don't even see the Palutena/Pit conversations. Those who do mostly view them once and that's it. It's a pretty minor thing.

All that taken into consideration, like I said before, it really wouldn't be that complicated to do another recording session with the voice actors. Those kinds of costs are built into the budget for each additional character.
 
So I was thinking, I'm not sure they really can use the poll all that much, or at all.

It costs a lot of money to bring the announcer and the Kid Icarus cast in every single time to record new lines, it's far cheaper to do it all at once. And with Mewtwo a week away, obviously that recording session has happened already.

Now they could have had them record a bunch of lines awhile ago for a bunch of likely suspects, but still, if they didn't, will they want to bring them in to record lines because some random character did well in the poll?

And they can't really just use the generic error message one either because it sounds stupid on any Brawl vet unless Pit has the memory of a goldfish. And it's sloppy and just not what I'd expect from Sakurai.

Just something to think about.
There is already a generic KI dialogue for DLC characters.
 
There is already a generic KI dialogue for DLC characters.

No there isn't. There's fallback dialog in case there's an error.

Pit apparently doesn't recognize Lucas in that case and is an idiot.

Saying
"Who is this!? I've never seen this fighter!?" when facing a fighter he's clearly already faced is sloppy and actually almost DLC ruining for me because it would just be so lazy it would tell me they just don't care enough about DLC to bother making it work right.
 

TDLink

Member
No there isn't. There's fallback dialog in case there's an error.

Pit apparently doesn't recognize Lucas in that case and is an idiot.

Saying
"Who is this!? I've never seen this fighter!?" when facing a fighter he's clearly already faced is sloppy and actually almost DLC ruining for me because it would just be so lazy it would tell me they just don't care enough about DLC to bother making it work right.

That line works for anyone that isn't Lucas, Wolf, Ice Climbers (which we know had a recorded line), or Snake. Like I already said, you're making a big assumption that is how it's going to work. It's not hard to get actors back in to record more lines for a game.
 
That line works for anyone that isn't Lucas, Wolf, Ice Climbers (which we know had a recorded line), or Snake. Like I already said, you're making a big assumption that is how it's going to work. It's not hard to get actors back in to record more lines for a game.

It's not hard or that expensive, but it may limit DLC potential. And the speed at which they can release DLC.

For example alt character costumes, Palutena's Guidance poses a potential problem for these and in increase in cost of DLC that might not make that money back.
 

TDLink

Member
It's not hard or that expensive, but it may limit DLC potential. And the speed at which they can release DLC.

For example alt character costumes, Palutena's Guidance poses a potential problem for these and in increase in cost of DLC that might not make that money back.

I just don't think it will. It's something that would be built into the budget for each character. And it's probably one of the cheaper parts of each character. I doubt the budget from character to character is going to differ that much since they are selling each at the same price.

I wouldn't expect more extensive alternate character costumes on DLC than characters already in the game...in which case true alternates are incredibly few and far between.
 

Gartooth

Member
Banjo and Kazooie was the newcomer I've always wanted in Smash ever since the beginning. I don't think it will ever happen since all MS could ever offer Nintendo at this point is the N64 games on VC. If Rare was still developing games for Nintendo handhelds I would feel slightly better about their chances.

This is starting to feel like an organized publicity stunt, because I'm 99% sure that Microsoft is going to announce a new Banjo game at E3.

I'd be massively disappointed if they didn't with all the teasing. Its been 15 years and I'm hoping we will finally see a true successor to Banjo-Tooie sometime in the next console generation.
 

TDLink

Member
I'd be massively disappointed if they didn't with all the teasing. Its been 15 years and I'm hoping we will finally see a true successor to Banjo-Tooie sometime in the next console generation.

Playtonic is make Ukelele. That's the true successor. Anything current day Rare does with the Banjo IP is almost certainly not going to live up to what that team (which is now basically Playtonic) did 15+ years ago.

It'd still be cool if somehow Banjo showed up in Smash, and MS is apparently willing. I don't see Nintendo going for it though.
 

Macka

Member
My perfect Smash roster would include pretty much everyone we have now (minus duds like Dark Pit and Lucina), while adding:

Isaac
Ridley
King K. Rool
Dixie

Ice Climbers
Wolf
Snake

Banjo & Kazooie
Simon Belmont

So if the ballot addition is one of those, I'm happy. I voted for Isaac ftr.
 
No there isn't. There's fallback dialog in case there's an error.

Pit apparently doesn't recognize Lucas in that case and is an idiot.

Saying
"Who is this!? I've never seen this fighter!?" when facing a fighter he's clearly already faced is sloppy and actually almost DLC ruining for me because it would just be so lazy it would tell me they just don't care enough about DLC to bother making it work right.
Hahahahaha!
 
1. Electivire
2. Wolf
3. Ridley
4. some other major nintendo villain
5. Bandana Dee

3rd-Party Extras would be Rayman, Travis Touchdown, and another Sonic character.
 

Gartooth

Member
Playtonic is make Ukelele. That's the true successor. Anything current day Rare does with the Banjo IP is almost certainly not going to live up to what that team (which is now basically Playtonic) did 15+ years ago.

It'd still be cool if somehow Banjo showed up in Smash, and MS is apparently willing. I don't see Nintendo going for it though.

I'm pretty skeptical about Ukelele at the moment. Playtonic is pretty small right now (granted B-K and B-T had small teams as well) and it might be years before we even see it. Even though this game hasn't come out yet, I'm still bummed about Mighty No. 9 so the whole nature of classic IP revivals has me keeping my hype in check. I'm really interested to see what they show though when they put up the Kickstarter page for Project Ukelele. On the bright side, at least 1 B-K like game will be seeing the light of day.

Regarding Banjo and Kazooie in Smash, I wonder what NCL thought about the IP during its heyday. I've seen a couple forum posts online mentioning Iwata saying something about the series, but I can never find a news story or anything to back it up. :/
 

TDLink

Member
It's a little dramatic, but if Nintendo doesn't care for consistency or quality, why should I care about their DLC?

I'd probably still buy it, but it would make me resent the fact they don't seem to care about DLC enough to go all the way with quality.

How about you wait until the DLC even comes out before continuing to assume the worst here?

Ultimately I don't think it's a big deal, but you should at least wait and see before freaking out about it like this.
 

JazzmanZ

Member
It's a little dramatic, but if Nintendo doesn't care for consistency or quality, why should I care about their DLC?

I'd probably still buy it, but it would make me resent the fact they don't seem to care about DLC enough to go all the way with quality.
Getting all the actors back just to do a few additional lines can cost a fuck ton of money and if I were Nintendo i'd rather save a little then care about a little inconsistency in a trivial thing.
 

Neoxon

Junior Member
As stated earlier, in my opinion it'll either be...

- Mewtwo, Lucas, Wolf, Chorus Kids, Ballot Character 1, Ballot Character 2
- Mewtwo, Lucas, Wolf, Chorus Kids, Ballot Character 1, Ballot Character 2, Ballot Character 3
- Mewtwo, Lucas, Wolf, Ballot Character 1, Ballot Character 2
- Mewtwo, Lucas, Wolf, Ballot Character 1, Ballot Character 2, Ballot Character 3

I don't expect anymore than 7 characters counting Mewtwo & Lucas. The only reason I mentioned the Chorus Kids is because, as stated, they're the only ones that have evidence that they were previously worked on as far as potential newcomers go.
To follow up on this, I was gonna give some explanation as to why I chose those two characters in particular outside of the ballot results.

- Wolf (Star Fox): I've said it before, but he's the only first-party character with no 3DS limitations holding him back from coming back. Going on the base assumption that characters will be released on a bi-monthly basis for the next year (give or take), that would leave August & October as months where the ballot won't be finished yet. And with Star Fox U inbound this year, it'd make the most sense to bring back Wolf. In fact, I feel like it's more of a when Wolf will be revealed than a when at this point, he's that big of a safe bet. That list is in chronological order as far as who comes out when, so that pegs Wolf for August of this year based on my estimate.
- Chorus Kids (Rhythm Heaven): While yes, the Chorus Kids are my secondary vote, there's a reason why they're only my secondary while I'm hardcore supporting Wonder Red (outside of my love of The Wonderful 101). We know from both the Gematsu leak & data found on the Smash U disc that the Chorus Kids were worked on. Of course, they could have been removed due to Sakurai getting too crazy with the AI (like the Ice Climbers), but given that Sakurai was trying to work around the 3DS's limitations for the Ice Climbers, I doubt that he was gonna set out to do the same for the Chorus Kids when he already had one troublesome duo that the 3DS couldn't handle. And when you factor in that there was a Rhythm Heaven stage in the works found in the data & the fact that the Chorus Kids themselves are overly simplistic in their design (something that cannot be said about the Ice Climbers), I highly doubt that 3DS limitations were what kept them out. I believe that, like Mewtwo, time constraints was what screwed the Chorus Kids out of Smash (hell, Bowser Jr. barely made the cut). Of course this is all speculation outside of the data on the disc or the numerous leaks, so take my logic for what you will, but for that reason I'm not 100% for sure on this like I am for Wolf. However I do feel somewhat strongly about this, & I would peg them for an October release (again, each list is in chronological order). Seeing as the poll closes during October, that isn't enough time to take the final results into consideration. And seeing as we know that the Chorus Kids already have work put in, it'd be a simple matter of finishing them up & releasing them as DLC after the release of Wolf. Granted, they could be saved for the ballot results, but I have a gut feeling that they're already on the way (granted, not as strong of a feeling as I have for Wolf, but you get my point).

As for the number of ballot characters, I went with 2-3 because of the wording of Iwata's statements as well as the statements that have come out. They've always said "characters" in plural, which leads me to believe at least 2 people form the poll are getting in the game. Of course we know that Sakurai isn't gonna go too crazy with the DLC characters, so keeping that & the ones we're already gonna get in mind, I kept my estimate at a modest number. As for when, since the poll ends in October, I don't expect the first DLC character to be from the poll until December at the earliest.
 

Regulus Tera

Romanes Eunt Domus
Totally different. I've always been saying that you'd really lose what makes Ridley the revered Metroid boss that he is if you shrunk him down and balanced him. Turns out, that's EXACTLY the reason Sakurai won't make him playable. Ironically, Giga Bowser is a Smash exclusive creation and I think the only way they'd include Ridley is to make some kind of Smash exclusive playable form with his familiar "true form" as a Final Smash transformation. To me, it's like asking for Master and Crazy hand to be toned down and playable.
I don't think size is the problem. Some Project M mods get really close to what Ridley should look like, were he playable.
 
Getting all the actors back just to do a few additional lines can cost a fuck ton of money and if I were Nintendo i'd rather save a little then care about a little inconsistency in a trivial thing.
Which is why I believe every character that has the potential to be DLC has already been decided and accounted for in one single recording session, and the poll is only really for PR purposes and Smash 5 planning.
 

kirby_fox

Banned
It's a little dramatic, but if Nintendo doesn't care for consistency or quality, why should I care about their DLC?

I'd probably still buy it, but it would make me resent the fact they don't seem to care about DLC enough to go all the way with quality.

My bet is that they probably got the announcer to record lines for just a ton of characters so there was no way he even knew who was going to be in the game. You're in a booth just saying names and phrases over and over again to get it "right".

Pit & Palutena won't get new dialogue probably. If you're concerned about it "making sense" you should go back and see what some of the dialogue is-- some of it doesn't make sense already.
 

Neoxon

Junior Member
Which is why I believe every character that has the potential to be DLC has already been decided and accounted for in one single recording session, and the poll is only really for PR purposes and Smash 5 planning.
While yes, I do think the poll will play into things for Smash 5, I believe will be at least 2 characters from the poll that will be DLC for this game. The way the ballot was advertised was as potential DLC for this game. Plus who knows if Sakurai will still be around for Smash 5, & he was the one who agreed with Iwata on the ballot.
 

Watch Da Birdie

I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
So, people have asked "how would Wonder Red work since he's all about team-based combat?", and I actually had an idea for that that changes him up a bit while still remaining true to the character...I wrote this awhile back just for fun, but hey, now that he has a chance why not share it?

The leader of the Wonderful 101, Wonder Red jumps into battle! He's brought along the other 100 Wonderfuls as well, through a new wrist device built by Professor Shirogane named the "Wonder Brace". As Wonder Red strikes foes and builds up %, the "Wonderful Counter" next to his icon slowly rises from 0 to 100...this allows him to utilize miniature Unite Morphs by tapping into the power of the rest of his team! By charging Smash Attacks and Specials, Wonder Red can make them more powerful. The stronger they are, the more the Wonderful Counter drops, so mind it at all times!

Every 1% of damage inflicted is equivalent to 2 Wonderful, and damage inflicted with Unite Moves do not count. He also steadily gains 1 Wonderful every 10 seconds. Each Unite has a different Wonder Counter requirement to move up tiers, but you can tell which one is possible as when you begin charging, the line drawing appears that's either small, medium, or large, depending on the max you can charge too.

Wonder Red's taunts are quite long, but have a unique element...when a Taunt is done successfully, Wonder Red is temporarily surrounded by an aura, increasing his damage output by 1%.

Grab: Red's grab is unique, as he summons the Unite Whip, and can charge it...this increases its range, but the start-up time also goes up. He cannot pummel, instead foes caught by the whip are automatically damaged by its spikes as long as they're held, the bigger whip hurting them more. The move has start-up time, and is telegraphed so it's hard to capture foes unless they're not paying attention.

Forward Throw: Red snaps the whip, and throws the foe at a slightly diagonal forward angle. Weak knockback, but does a decent amount of damage.

Back Throw: Red whips the whip behind his back, and delivers a swift kick to the foe, sending them flying straight. Has highest knockback out of all the throws.

Up Throw: Red whips the foe into the air like a tornado, sending slightly into the air. Doesn't do a lot of damage, but leaves them open for a combo.

Down Throw: Red pulls whip into the air, and then slams the foe into the ground, a meteor smash, and does a signifcant amount of damage.

Forward Smash: Unite Hand Stinger! You can charge this up the higher your Wonderful Counter is, which extends its range and power. Red's fist morphs into a giant fist and punches straight forward, with powerful knockback. At higher levels, it also slides along the ground slightly, as well as has an initial "super-armor".

Up Smash: Unite Hand Rising! Works like the Unite Hand Stinger, but does an uppercut instead. At higher levels, also slightly rises through the air. Lacks the super-armor property, however, and has less knockback, but is faster.

Down Smash: Unite Hand Cyclone! Works like the other Unite Hands, but instead creates a fist and quickly spins around on the ground. Getting hit by the beginning of the spin hurts the most. At higher levels, draws nearby foes in. Medium speed and strength, but the weakest in terms of knock-back.

Neutral Special: Unite Gun! Red summons a green gun, and fires a strong projectile across the screen. The more the Wonderful Counter is and the longer it's charged, the more powerful the blast is, however start-up time increases. There are three tiers...the first is a basic rounded blast that goes about halfway across the screen, with little knock-back, but can be fired at a decent speed. Second is a beam that stretches across the screen, little knockback still, but hits multiple times. Third is a giant missile that shoots straight forward and picks up speed, with powerful knockback, but slow start-up.

Side Special: Unite Claw! Red summons white claws, and jumps forward and delivers a powerful slash. It's quick, does a lot of damage, but has little knock-back. There are three-tiers to it, and need to be charged, but charges quite fast. It actually gets faster the more its charged, and does more damage, but jumps farther so you may overshoot it. The final tier also freezes the foe upon striking them.

Up Special: Unite Sword! Red summons a blue sword, and does a spin akin to Link that lifts him up into the air. The tip of the sword causes the most damage, and has decent knock-back. Based on the Wonderful Counter, the recovery and size are increased, however it can't be charged, so it automatically uses the highest amount possible. Start up time goes down the higher level, as does the speed. Afterwards Red is helpless.

Down Special: Unite Hammer! Red summons a yellow hammer above his head, and slams it down to the ground. The hammer does the most damage when the head is parallel to the ground, and has a meteor effect. Using this in the air causes Wonder Red to fly downward, uncancellable, when the hammer drops. Chargeable, and has three tiers...range and strength increases, but start-up time and speed drop.

Final Smash: Unite Bomb! Red summons a black bomb, which explodes and creates a black field. Anyone caught by the explosion enters a rainbow-colored room, where a cinema plays where the main Wonderful 101 Team! Unite Up! and deliver a powerful combination attack. It quickly builds up damage, and at the end, anyone over 100% will probably be KO'd. Afterwards, the Wonderful Counter drops to 0.


Despite being Wonder Red, each of his costumes change his color...except the black markings and the red scarf always remain! His final color is a unique costume that depicts him in his civilian clothes!
1. Red 2. Blue 3. Green 4. Pink 5. Yellow 6. White 7. Black 8. Will Wedgewood

Hope this is easy to understand.

As you can see, all the main Unite Morphs are represented.
 

Neoxon

Junior Member
So, people have asked "how would Wonder Red work since he's all about team-based combat?", and I actually had an idea for that that changes him up a bit while still remaining true to the character...I wrote this awhile back just for fun, but hey, now that he has a chance why not share it?



Hope this is easy to understand.

As you can see, all the main Unite Morphs are represented.
Godlike
 

Gartooth

Member
So, people have asked "how would Wonder Red work since he's all about team-based combat?", and I actually had an idea for that that changes him up a bit while still remaining true to the character...I wrote this awhile back just for fun, but hey, now that he has a chance why not share it?



Hope this is easy to understand.

As you can see, all the main Unite Morphs are represented.

Balancing that power counter sounds like it would be a nightmare. lol
 

Masked Man

I said wow
How much longer until people just start campaigning for their shitty deviantArt Sonic recolors to get in?

Remember that "Search (your name) and 'the Hedgehog' and see what comes up" thread? Comic gold.


Masked Man, if you're around, please translate these lyrics. I beg of you...

Tried to keep it rhythmically similar so you can sing along in English without straying too far from the goofy lyrics...

When tomorrow rolls around, let's eat a bunch of bananas
I just wanna live my life, lazy like the flowing river
Somewhere out there, somebody is laughing and having a good time
So let's join in on the fun and keep on dancing
Somewhere out there, somebody is crying like a waterfall
That's the time to get together and lend a hand
And, out from behind the clouds, the sun comes shining through
But if you come on by and say hello to friends near and far
Your heart'll grow brighter, too
When tomorrow rolls around, we can see our friends again
So let's wish upon a star and enjoy a pleasant dream


(Playtonic supports B-K)

This makes me happy. :')

Not sure if this has been posted yet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HV4poIruIi4

lolwut.

Spongebob and Smash go together so perfectly!
 
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