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Some quick USB 2.0 and FireWire questions

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Ecrofirt

Member
1) Which is faster, USB 2.0 or FireWire?

2) If I get a FireWire card with 3 eternal FireWire ports, does the data rate drop if I have all three ports being used?

3) If I've got an external DH using FireWire or USB 2.0, how does the speed compare to an internal drive?

4) When did FireWire 800 come out?

5) Same as 2, but with FireWire 800

6) Same as 3, but FireWire 800

7) Does Microsoft currently support FireWire 800? I read something about having to wait for new drivers that supported the higher speeds, but I don't know how old that was.

8) How popular is FireWire 800? Is it's popularity growing?

9) Is there gonig to be a new USB that will compete with FireWire 800?
 

goodcow

Member
Firewire is 400Mbps.
USB2 is 480Mbps.
Firewire800 is 800Mbps.

In theory USB2 is faster than firewire. In practice, my firewire HD is faster than my USB2 HD by about 30%.

I'll leave the others to other people.
 

goodcow

Member
They're both just as fast in terms of actually doing everyday things... I mean, if I ran speed tests I'm sure the internals (well, mainly the Raptor) would win, but I have the externals for video storage and editing, and they're absolutely find in that regard.
 

CaptainABAB

Member
I have three externals hooked up to my laptop. WD 80GB, WD 160 GB, ACOM 250 GB (last one is for redundant backups of the others)

All of them are using USB2 and they feel as fast as my laptop drive. The only thing I have noticed is there is a pause when I access them for the first time and they "spin up" to life.

Tip: format them as NTFS when you first hook them up. They usually are preset to Fat32 for some odd reason.
 

Ecrofirt

Member
My dumbass self didn't think to check my motherboard for an open IDE slot when I bought my Barracuda.

Now I've got a 160GB Barracuda and a 120GB Maxtor (currently in another PC with data on it), that I either have to sell, or I've got to get two external enclosures.

I'm trying to figure out what my best options are.

Is it best to go with a FireWire 800 enclosure and get a FireWire 800 card?

And do the data transfer rates lower on cards when you've got multiple devices hooked up? Like 400Mbps with one device, 200 with two, etc. ?
 

CaptainABAB

Member
http://forums.computeractive.co.uk/thread.jsp?forum=7&thread=42516

Data transfer speed.
USB 2.0 is widely promoted as having a transfer speed of 480 Mbps -- a little faster than the original FireWire's 400 Mbps. However, this is a theoretical maximum for bulk transfers. Isochronous transfers, such as streamed audio and video, are limited to 192 Mbps (Section 5.9 of USB 2.0 spec.). In practice, the host controlled USB 2.0 bus is less efficient than FireWire and actual transfer speeds are rather lower. For a comparison see 'USB 2.0 Versus FireWire':
http://www.g4techtv.com/freshgear/features/39129/USB_20_Versus_FireWire.html

Quote: "Don't be confused by the rated speeds you see emblazoned across USB 2.0 and FireWire product boxes. Despite USB 2.0's 80 Kbps speed advantage over FireWire, our testing showed that the additional overhead of USB 2.0 made it slower than FireWire. For high-bandwidth devices such as external hard drives, the difference was as high as 70 percent."

Also see 'Flexible All-Rounder: External Drives from Western Digital with 200 and 250 GB':
http://www6.tomshardware.com/storage/20030411/wd_external_hd-09.html
Quote: "The performance of the Western Digital external combo drive in our tests displayed a trend that we have repeatedly observed with other hardware components: you can achieve a substantially better performance with FireWire than with USB 2.0, even though USB offers a theoretical throughput of 480 Mbps compared with "only" 400 Mbps with FireWire.
With FireWire, we achieved an excellent maximum data transfer rate of 38 MB/s. USB 2.0, on the other hand, maxed out at just 32 MB/s. So, the combo drive with FireWire is able to score 74 percent of the theoretically available maximum of 400 Mbps -- a fine achievement. USB 2.0 stops at 53 percent of its theoretical maximum."

Peer-to-peer operation.
FireWire is a bidirectional peer-to-peer bus where devices talk directly to each other. By contrast, USB is a host controlled bus that requires the computer's processor to act as a 'master of ceremonies'. This effectively halves the speed of inter-device transfers on the same bus since all the data has to travel to and fro via the host. The additional load on the processor can cause problems when transferring high-bandwidth asynchronous data such as video.
FireWire enables devices to be connected directly without the need for a computer -- a key requirement for consumer electronics as shown in 'Fire in the Wire -- The Future of Audio Interconnects':
http://www.audiorevolution.com/news/0702/11.firewire.shtml


BTW, most hard drives now have both connections and most expansion cards should support both as well. I'm not using firewire b/c my laptop came with the stupid 4-pin firewire port and I don't care about max performance. My externals are archives for all of the work/media/software I occasionally use.
 

mrklaw

MrArseFace
I have one firewire port on my laptop. If I daisy chain, will I be able to capture from a DV camera to a firewire external hard drive?
 

Ecrofirt

Member
goodcow, do you ever experience dropped frames or anything when dumping video to your external HD?

One of my drives is going to be for video editing, so I want to make sure there aren't going to be any problems when dumping the DV-AVI video.
 

goodcow

Member
Ecrofirt said:
goodcow, do you ever experience dropped frames or anything when dumping video to your external HD?

One of my drives is going to be for video editing, so I want to make sure there aren't going to be any problems when dumping the DV-AVI video.

Nope, never any dropped frames.

Of course, common sense says not to be using the external drive for anything else while you're capturing video, such as RARing files on the drive, etc.
 
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