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[mysteriousmage09]

Their TV division is not good. It hasn't been good for 7-8 years now. It's probably one of the, if not biggest, money sinks the company have right now. Their TV business is unsustainable. There's a reason they took an $800 million hit on selling their part of the S-LCD venture with Samsung. It probably would have cost them more money to keep the partnership going than to take that hit. I also read somewhere that selling off that venture will help save them a lot of money immediately, which they desperately need.

Should have worded it it better, they are widely known in the TV market but the money is just thrown around all over the place like the 3D TV's which are expensive as shit. They have the resources but the focus is always on the wrong thing.

 

[NemesisPrime]

The irony is dat Mr Howard will get a huge bonus for doing "a good job" and Kaz will inherit a sinking ship.

Kaz will need to do a Steve Jobs... review ALL Sony products and dump the ones that are not a focus. Sony has WAY to many products on the market and a lot of them do not make sense (SLRs for example). Even if some of those make money, they will need fewer products and focus on those.

Also... if I was Sony I would not go for a very expensive PS4. PS still has a good name, so a mid range affordable console with a lot of software support will actually make them some good money. They probably can't compete with MS spec wise anyway... look what happened to PS3 (and I mean that in a finacial way, not a technical).

Oh... and STOP sinking money in 3D bullshit Kaz!!!!

 

[SlipperySlope]

The question now is what divisions get sold/get the ax.

 

[Krilekk]

Oh? I thought Vita made a loss and it was going to take them a long time to make a profit on it. I assumed they were talking about the hardware because they said the Vita ecosystem as a whole was break even (SW, Accessories, ect) I might have that wrong though.

Interview from last E3:

Speaking to GameTrailers in a recent interview, Senior VP of SCEA Scott Rohde said that they’ll do “well” with PS Vita.

“I think that we’re going to do very well with this,” he said. “And this price point – it’s also not going to lose money for us on day one. We’re going to do well with this thing.”

 

[jonno394]

If Nintendo was doomed with a $575 million loss, what is sony?

 

[DopeyFish]

They doubled their projected loss

Their stock is going to take a beating :x

 

[Pachterballs]

where are the losses coming from? I find it hard to envision sony being in business for much longer if that's only for 1 quarter.

 

[Mpl90]

If Nintendo was doomed with a $575 million loss, what is sony?

Negative zone.

But really, BAD result for Sony. How much of cash do they have, however? I don't remember it now...

 

[JaseC]

where are the losses coming from? I find it hard to envision sony being in business for much longer if that's only for 1 quarter.

See post #76.

 

[Auto_aim1]

Negative zone.

But really, BAD result for Sony. How much of cash do they have, however? I don't remember it now...

$7-8 billion.

 

[Dalthien]

Interview from last E3:

Speaking to GameTrailers in a recent interview, Senior VP of SCEA Scott Rohde said that they’ll do “well” with PS Vita.

“I think that we’re going to do very well with this,” he said. “And this price point – it’s also not going to lose money for us on day one. We’re going to do well with this thing.”

Yeah, but then there was this quote from Hirai on Vita at the same E3:

“If we were able to hit that 70 million mark for PlayStation Portable, we want to exceed that both in terms of numbers and timing to get to that number,” Sony’s Kaz Hirai told Reuters, adding that the firm expects Vita to be profitable in less than three years.

 

[Krilekk]

So ... Sony will be the one that skips next gen, right? Like the Gakai lady suggested?

 

[GavinGT]

Forget console sales and 1-year leads. 360 has no doubt trounced PS3 in terms of software sales, which is what really counts for these two companies.

 

[Tunavi]

I just don't understand how do they lose so much money

 

[NemesisPrime]

Are you crazy? A PS3 without Bluray? How would that even work, in retrospect.
What kind of technology should they have used instead, DVD? Lol look at the 360, the DVD drive backfired hard on them

Lol.. the things you can read on the internet.

 

[GavinGT]

Forget console sales and 1-year leads. 360 has no doubt trounced PS3 in terms of software sales (both physical and digital), which is what really counts for these two companies.

 

[Krilekk]

Yeah, but then there was this quote from Hirai on Vita at the same E3:

“If we were able to hit that 70 million mark for PlayStation Portable, we want to exceed that both in terms of numbers and timing to get to that number,” Sony’s Kaz Hirai told Reuters, adding that the firm expects Vita to be profitable in less than three years.

Those are different things. Hirai is talking about the project as a whole. R&D costs and all. The console itself is not sold at a loss, it just takes them a couple of years to break even with the initial costs (R&D, marketing, game development).

 

[cyberheater]

Are you crazy? A PS3 without Bluray? How would that even work, in retrospect.
What kind of technology should they have used instead, DVD? Lol look at the 360, the DVD drive backfired hard on them

You clearly don't know what your talking about. The DVD Xbox360 has been a huge success for MS and the dual SKU's has proven to be the correct approach.

 

[Auto_aim1]

Forget console sales and 1-year leads. 360 has no doubt trounced PS3 in terms of software sales, which is what really counts for these two companies.

I think this just shows how important the US market is.

 

[szaromir]

Thanks for the insult. no problem with comparisons on marketing standpoints on why MS is selling more 360's then Sony is with PS3's, however, the comments in this thread are nothing more then stupid statements that do nothing but go "lol MS is better then Sony!".

Yep, those are great comparisons open up to lots of discussion.

Sp what's wrong with highlighting that 360 revenues were bigger than Playstation's? I find it interesting that MS's one platform brought more money that Sony's four, profitability aside.

The irony is dat Mr Howard will get a huge bonus for doing "a good job" and Kaz will inherit a sinking ship.

Rest assured Kaz will also enjoy some hefty bonuses.

 

[NemesisPrime]

So ... Sony will be the one that skips next gen, right? Like the Gakai lady suggested?

I doubt it... but it actually could make sense to do something like that. They could redesign the PS3 again and keep it for another 5 years on the market (maybe even give it a new name and totally different look). But like I said... I think Sony doesn't wanne do this because they might lose some "status" in the eyes of consumers.

 

[CrytothePrinceofPeace]

Does anyone think it may be in Sony's best interest profit wise to go 3rd party?

It would be a pleasure to play their games on WiiU.

 

[cyberheater]

hopefully part of that loss is because of super powerful PS4 R&D.

Sony have stated repeatedly that they will not make the same mistake with PS4 as the did with PS3. They are not going to sink a ton of cash in R&D for PS4.

 

[Dalthien]

Those are different things. Hirai is talking about the project as a whole. R&D costs and all. The console itself is not sold at a loss, it just takes them a couple of years to break even with the initial costs (R&D, marketing, game development).

Well, that's just it. We don't know exactly which elements of the platform he was talking about, or what the SCEA guy was talking about (although I would trust Hirai to have a far better grasp of it than Rohde).

But I can promise you that if Vita hardware was profitable from day 1, it would not take anywhere near three years to recoup the initial R&D/marketing costs. Those costs would be recaptured very quickly from software/memory cards/accessories if hardware was also chipping in a profit from day 1.

My guess is that it's somewhere between the two statements. The SCEA guy is probably including memory cards and stuff in the equation and is probably only referring to the most expensive 3G unit. Whereas Hirai is probably talking about hardware only (no accessories/software, etc.) and is probably even factoring in planned price cuts, etc.

But yeah - it's impossible for us to know the exact situation based on the several contradictory statements that have come out of Sony.

 

[JaseC]

I doubt it... but it actually could make sense to do something like that. They could redesign the PS3 again and keep it for another 5 years on the market (maybe even give it a new name and totally different look). But like I said... I think Sony doesn't wanne do this because they might lose some "status" in the eyes of consumers.

PS3.14: the PSPi.

 

[HomerSimpson-Man]

So ... Sony will be the one that skips next gen, right? Like the Gakai lady suggested?

The Playstation brand is their most viable product. Just when it's time to start a new and refocus another new system with the chance to not follow the previous mistakes while finally cutting losses, you skip a generation?

That would be their biggest foolish mistake on a pile of big mistakes as most of their other divisions don't seem fit to handle anything.

 

[GavinGT]

Sp what's wrong with highlighting that 360 revenues were bigger than Playstation's? I find it interesting that MS's one platform brought more money that Sony's four, profitability aside.

You're hurting his feelings, that's all.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

Judging by Sony's financial record in the last few years and Vita it's pretty much a lock that PS4 will be conservative in hardware design.

 

[famousmortimer]

Gaming still made money, just not as much because of the price drop. The idea that they are going to get out of gaming is silly. Especially considering the PS4 is a much safer bet than the Vita... and they had no qualms with releasing that.



Sony as a company has had issues for many years. They usually have just a handful of products that carry the whole business. The Walkman, the PS1/2, etc. They always seem to be bleeding money elsewhere though. I think that's part of their business plan, build a whole bunch of shit and throw it at the wall and see what sticks. For the last decade it's been gaming.

 

[clockpunk]

PS3.14: the PSPi.

I'd buy that for a dollar!

 

[HomerSimpson-Man]

Judging by Sony's financial record in the last few years and Vita it's pretty much a lock that PS4 will be conservative in hardware design.

No need for exotic Cell research. Looking at how Nintendo and MS seems to work well with with ATI, Sony might do well to work with them this time around instead of Nvidia. MS got a better designed GPU with ATI than Sony and MS themselves got burned by Nvidia prior gen, so ATI is positioned to maybe take all the console makers. Plus no more pricey blu-ray diodes to worry about anymore.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Does anyone think it may be in Sony's best interest profit wise to go 3rd party?

It would be a pleasure to play their games on WiiU.

I don't think a good chunk of Sony's studios survive without the rationale of trying to prop up a platform.

The PS4 can be a powerful platform. Chances are increasingly likely that it will be out no later than 2013, it probably won't use Cell, it probably won't include an HDD in the box, and it will probably be in the same range (price and power) as MS' box. There's no way they concede two years to Nintendo in Japan.

 

[GavinGT]

Sony's stock prices over last ten years.

Yikes.

 

[user_nat]

Xbox revenues in the last quarter were bigger than the Playstation family revenues. Interesting.

Not by much..

Sony Game revenue - 3.74b
Xbox 360 revenue - 3.9b (Link)

Pretty amazing though considering Sony has 4 platforms (2 dying/dead, 1 very new) and the higher sale price of the PS3. XBL revenue must be nice.

Also, what's up with the lack of Vita mentions?

 

[Basileus777]

Does anyone think it may be in Sony's best interest profit wise to go 3rd party?

It would be a pleasure to play their games on WiiU.

It would probably make more sense for them to sell off their studios if they leave the console hardware business.

 

[Hammer24]

This is why Sony loses money like no other company loses money.

This is not the problem per se.
The problem is that they have a corporate culture where the different entities don´t talk to each other, thus negating any synergy effects. Which has bsically been the reason why they hired Sir Howard in the first place.
Now that its clear that he wasn´t able to change it, I got my doubts Kaz (as a product of said corporate culture) will be. The only way forward that I can see at the moment, is swinging a big axe.

 

[redblack85]

During Sony’s 2011 3rd quarter earnings call, former PlayStation boss and now newly appointed CEO Kazuo Hirai, had a good amount of explaining to do. Sony is 2 billion in the red, with all of their major businesses not performing up to par. When asked about PlayStation Vita sales in Japan, Hirai mentioned that despite losses across the board, they’re optimistic that the Vita will show strong success, adding that “he’s not concerned.”
When questioned about exact sales numbers in Asia, Hirai once again referred to the 500k unit sell-through that was announced previously on January 10th. He also noted (in typical corporate fashion) “at this time, we have nothing to announce.” Considering this is only the 3rd quarter results, with analysts predicting a full year loss of 2.9 billion, it’s in Sony’s best interest (if the Vita isn’t selling to expectations) that they hold that card close to the chest, at least until the device goes on sale in the West where if there’s a successful launch, they should be able to turn that ship (and only that ship) around.

http://www.dualshockers.com/2012/02/02/sony-the-vita-will-be-a-driving-force-behind-the-games/

 

[expel]

so, anyone wanna guess when sony will announce their bankruptcy? this year?

 

[amrihua]

How can Sony continue to lose money on TVs? 7 years in a row? If I were them I would have either turned things around by the 3rd year or exited the TV market.

I'm surprised Sony isn't bankrupt. They need to streamline their company fast. They make too many products and have too much variety.

That doesn't stop Samsung from making lots and lots of profits.

 

[Orca]

Q3 shipments have been more or less flat for the last three years. Do they need better pricing to get sales up, or better promotions?

 

[Averon]

This is not the problem per se.
The problem is that they have a corporate culture where the different entities don´t talk to each other, thus negating any synergy effects. Which has bsically been the reason why they hired Sir Howard in the first place.
Now that its clear that he wasn´t able to change it, I got my doubts Kaz (as a product of said corporate culture) will be. The only way forward that I can see at the moment, is swinging a big axe.

Sony needs to give Kaz near unrestricted power to do what needs to be done. A neutered CEO (Stringer) can't right a ship as massive and complex as Sony. Many hard and risky decisions needs to be made decisively and quickly if Sony is ever to climb out of the rut they are mired in. I think Kaz will have a lot more leeway to do things than Stringer ever did. Whether that will be enough is another question.

 

[Auto_aim1]

How can Sony continue to lose money on TVs? 7 years in a row? If I were them I would have either turned things around by the 3rd year or exited the TV market.

It still brings in a lot of revenue, though. There is just too much competition from the Korean companies like Samsung and LG.

Q3 shipments have been more or less flat for the last three years. Do they need better pricing to get sales up, or better promotions?

I think the recent price cut for the PS3 was really inadequate, they should have gone for $100. But I think it's too late in the gen to increase sales via promotions though, they needed something extraordinary like Kinect to boost sales.

so, anyone wanna guess when sony will announce their bankruptcy? this year?

The situation isn't that bad yet.

 

[NHale]

Forget console sales and 1-year leads. 360 has no doubt trounced PS3 in terms of software sales, which is what really counts for these two companies.

Maybe this year. But last time I saw SW numbers it showed PS3 sold more software.

 

[user_nat]

Maybe this year. But last time I saw SW numbers it showed PS3 sold more software.

We have never had total software sales from MS..

 

[Celine]

are you sure? Xbox brand has went from "okay - but" to a serious Playstation level brand in two generations and has helped to push Sony (the previous market leader) down into last place. I don't see how that sort of turn around wasn't in part facilitated by a 1 year head start.

Agree.

It was a "fun" generation to witness.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Anti sony vibe is strong.

And this phrase is why so many have it all wrong. Instead of blaming the potential consumer for not buying the right brand, the answer is simply that there is a stronger and growing pro-everything else vibe while Sony has done so much to screw it all up through poor organization and a pathetic and stubborn clutching to its long-gone elite past in the CE arena. Sony needs to look it this way and find how to appeal better because what they've got isn't enough, apparently.

Even though some will claim it's a necessary learning step to a better PS4, I wouldn't be surprised to see Vita ending up a waste of resources after all is said and done. If anything, it will divide potential software development that could have been laser-focused on PS4. PS4 is definitely not going to be the over-engineered, overpriced mess that PS3 is just as it is highly unlikely that it will be seen as the most powerful compared to its peers. Maybe this continued financial failure will ensure that they focus on a feature set that matters most to potential console buyers as well as loyal fans. I kind of doubt it, though.

 

[Averon]

How can Sony continue to lose money on TVs? 7 years in a row? If I were them I would have either turned things around by the 3rd year or exited the TV market.

I think the next 2 years will either make or break the TV division. Sony made a lot of restructuring moves to their TV business recently (selling their S-LCD partnership, moving manufacturing to China, etc...) and are trying differentiate from the Korean competition with new tech (Crystal LED vs OLED). If these moves doesn't turn the TV business around quickly, I can see deep cuts coming to that division.

 

[Souldriver]

Jesus, Sony's bleeding so much money. :-/ Hopefully they get on the right track again sooner rather than later.

 

[Hammer24]

I think Kaz will have a lot more leeway to do things than Stringer ever did.

This I believe too. But is Kaz willing to do what needs to be done? Thats the big question mark for me.

 

[NHale]

We have never had total software sales from MS..

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=395262

Software NDS PSP PS2 360 PS3 Wii

FY 2009 151.6 44.4 35.7 103.1 115.6 191.8

LTD 718.5 251.6 1513.2 353.8 290.5 544.8

Unless Sony released fake MS numbers on their FY09 report, then at least in 2009 the myth that MS is the juggernaut of software sales was indeed false.