Yea people were saying that Killian borrowed the Ten Rings stuff even before Hail to the King came out.
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Spider-Man is Entering The Marvel Cinematic Universe
- Thread starter Colonel Nasty
- Start date
Yea people were saying that Killian borrowed the Ten Rings stuff even before Hail to the King came out.
Oh, that's nothing then. Basically just a token if they have want to continue that villain arc in a future film.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Yup, pretty much.
They won't, at least not for a long ass while. If they wanted to do a Mandarin movie, they would have done it in the first place.
If its a token to bring back the villain arc or not doestn matter. Its that what happened in the MCU. A One Shot is canon.
They stated that there is a real ten rings organisation with a real mandarin and Killians group were fakes. So thats what happend. Doesnt matter what you make of it.
They stated that there is a real ten rings organisation with a real mandarin and Killians group were fakes. So thats what happend. Doesnt matter what you make of it.
DonasaurusRex
Online Ho Champ
i think thats part 2 though, not amazing.
I haven't seen it, but from what people described, how is that a retcon?
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Yeah but he's still a classic villain that is both heavily tied to Iron Man and could actually provide a challenge for the Avengers at some point. It would have been smart to establish him earlier instead of setting up all that Ten Rings stuff then throwing a curve ball with Slattery/Killian.
The Mandarin was modernized in recent Iron Man runs and used heavily in stuff like Fraction's run, would have provided a good basis for bringing the character into the films.
Whether or not RDJ sticks around for it, I hope they give us that payoff with the real Mandarin in Iron Man 4.
Retcon's just a bad choice of words, it serves a similar purpose to a retcon in that it allows for something they couldn't have narratively accomplished with what they had previously established, but it doesn't retroactively change any of the existing canon. Just adds to it.
We had to assume, that Killian was the mandarin/leader of the real and one and only ten rings organisation. This turned out to be wrong.
EliteSpartan
Neo Member
This is a good move indeed. I always thought the earlier spiderman movies were just ok and it's exciting to see them find someone else to fill the role.
E the Shaggy
Junior Member
I would certainly hope so. Norman Osborn creating a Dark Avengers team in the movies would blow my mind.
I'm just glad Amazing Spiderman is dead due to this reason. They basically ruined everything moving forward for villains in that train wreck of a sequel. Those characters are mostly well known and living and breathing.
I get The Mandarin though, and have seen him pop up more in the previews lately. The Iron Man comics are kind of its own breed right now due to the films. Kind of like the old Wolverine push. It's just tough to toss in some of the lesser known villains and expect a large reaction from the audience. For that, I appreciate the Shane Black film for not taking him seriously. Not saying you can't touch back on that character again.
I get The Mandarin though, and have seen him pop up more in the previews lately. The Iron Man comics are kind of its own breed right now due to the films. Kind of like the old Wolverine push. It's just tough to toss in some of the lesser known villains and expect a large reaction from the audience. For that, I appreciate the Shane Black film for not taking him seriously. Not saying you can't touch back on that character again.
Succinct Verbosity
Member
Didn't Orci write the ASM2 script? Maybe the shitty Star Trek script wasn't the only reason he was chucked off that project... Hopefully Orci and friends can't find work at Sony, Paramount or Disney now. Best news to come out of all this.
Fox has no Spider-Man.
Sony and Marvel are going to share Spider-Man AFAIK. Both actor- and story-wise.
The first two movies also already established a real Mandarin and a real Ten Rings terrorist group.
I would've thought that IM3 would reveal Killian was behind those operations, but they never made that connection and even went out of the way to make Killian and Slattery their own thing.
E the Shaggy
Junior Member
TOTALLY. Remender knocks it out of the park with Flash, and especially with Jack O'Lantern.
Then it all goes to shit when Cullen Bunn takes over.
The ten rings were established in IM1, they are the guys who abducted Tony and set the whole thing off.
The short "All Hail The King" confirms it.
Slattery gets a visit from someone from The Ten Rings, who tells him he works for someone who'd like his name back.
So does Kevin have any say in the 2017 Spider-man? Or is just the spin-off's he has no say in?
Kevin has all the say in 2017 SM. He has no say in the spin-offs.
Generic Power Ranger
Member
Iron Man 3 kind of spoiler.
I was really positively surprised how heavily the avengers had affected him mentally. I thought it was exceptionally cool as I'd expected them to practically ignore that it happened as if it was old school spinoff.
I will. Hoping for a netflix release soon.
I disagree. Heavily. There were plot holes, but there are in a lot of modern blockbusters (unfortunately). I also really hope they are still planning those spinoff movies.
RyanardoDaVinci
Member
All I know is that I don't want to see Green Goblin for quite some time.
KLH would be a great end/near end to this Spidey's whole run. It all depends on how many films the deal is for. I'd like a 6 solo-film deal + 3 crossovers so they could do something like:
1. Spidey at his start, less-used villains like Shocker, Mysterio etc. Osborn just a CEO with mental issues. Brock is Parker's rival throughout whole series, don't hate each other but not friendly.
2. Kingpin, spider-slayers co-developed by Osborn. Maybe a Daredevil or Punisher appearance/team-up? Octavius introduced.
3. Green Goblin, someone close to Peter dies by the hands of Osborn. Osborn apprehended. Doc Ock's unfortunate accident.
4. Darker time for Pete, Symbiote origin of the 90's animated series. Ock goes mad-scientist, Spidey uses the symbiote to defeat Ock but almost kills him, gets rid of it. Brock becomes Venom, fights and defeats Spidey just to prove he can, isn't a straight-up villain.
5. Kraven's Last Hunt. Pete/Spidey and Felicia/Black Cat friendship/romance. Ends with Osborn escaping prison and builds the Sinister Six. Kraven offs himself.
6. Sinister Six. Goblin, Ock, Sandman, Electro, + 2 others. Spidey is overwhelmed and barely escapes the first battle. The 6 kidnap/kill Aunt May/whoever and Pete goes off (still recovering) to rescue/get revenge, Venom finds him and the two of them fight the 6 and win.
Crossovers would be Civil War and 2 Avengers.
If they only plan 3 solo movies, I don't want to see a Goblin at all. They could do whatever they want then, it doesn't really matter to me.
Munkyspace
Member
I feel like Spider-Man's been done to death at this point with everyone scrambling to retain the rights to the character.
Good news for Marvel, I suppose.
Good news for Marvel, I suppose.
But let's be honest, those spin-offs aren't happening. Sony wouldn't make this deal, that's gonna save the Spider-Man brand, only to screw it over with those spin-offs. Plus since they're sharing, Spidey now fits into the MCU slate. Phase [Insert Number Here] would be bloated as hell with a ton of Spider-Man spin-offs.
I like this, but can't see them doing 6 films with the same Spidey in the MCU. Especially with their current (unofficial?) trilogy rule. At most they'd probably do what they're rumored to be doing with Cap (Winter Soldier taking the mantle for his own set of movies). Just with Miles Morales (or Ben Reily?! I want my Scarlet Spider) instead.
I just want them to play up Peter being influenced by the current Avengers. I posted this in one of the trillion current Spidey threads as an example:
This has to be in either Civil War or his solo flick! Such an underrated iconic ending to one of the best movies in the MCU. Deserves a callback IMO.
Way too may movies there. At most, we'll get a tetrology but most likely just your standard trilogy. Planning for 6 is asking for way, way, way too much.
RyanardoDaVinci
Member
Well, that's what I want.
And as my dad always said, "What you want and what you get, are two different things."
All reports indicate that the Spider-Man of the MCU will be in high school, & be played by someone younger than Andrew Garfield (who's 31 I believe).
Booooooo 👎
bananafactory
Banned
Spidey proper is part of the MCU but I'm not sure that Marvel will consider the spinoffs part of it. Can't imagine they'd want films they have no say in dictating what happens in their universe.
Marvel was insistent on it being a high-school aged Parker in the Sony leaks. And the rumored actors in contention line up with that as well.
But assuming Sony uses the same actor, it would damage the brand which would in turn damage the MCU. I'm sure Marvel wouldn't want that.
Ugh. I'm so goddamn sick of high school Spiderman. Now we get to have yet another movie focused on a twenty something surround by other twenty and thirty somethings all pretending to be highschoolers. Ugh. At least make him a senior and have him graduating by the end of the movie so he can at least appear to be an adult next to the rest of the Avengers.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
Either way if you have the same actor in both people will assume anyway.
The whole idea around a teenage Spider-Man is to make him a contrast to the older Avengers. Like I said before, Marvel doesn't have a lot of young heroes that are compelling & are able to be used right now (their best one currently is Kamala Khan, & she requires Captain Marvel & the Inhumans to be well-established). On top of that, Marvel wants Spider-Man to headline the MCU in the foreseeable, so they need to future-proof him as far as casting goes.
pulga
Banned
Actually yes, I do get tired of it. But people don't read my older posts & get what I'm trying to say.don't you get tired of repeating yourself so much man
jesus, i know i'd be
It IS a pretty big thread.
The spin-offs by will be canon regardless if Marvel intends them to be or not. The solo Spider-Man film is officially MCU and this Spider-Man will appear in movies like Civil War.
When characters from these Marvel "approved" movies appear in spin-offs as the same characters played by the same actors and impacting what goes on in the mainline Spider-Man movies....that makes them pretty clearly canon. Feige involvement or otherwise.
If the spin-offs go through still with no Marvel Studios involvement that puts Marvel Studios in the position of letting Sony have free reign to play around in the MCU which is why I am thinking in the end the spin-offs won't happen or Feige and co. will eventually sign on as producers.
But any movie Sony puts out that takes place in this Spidey-verse using the same universe/characters as the mainline Spider-Man films will be canon by proxy for the MCU.
When characters from these Marvel "approved" movies appear in spin-offs as the same characters played by the same actors and impacting what goes on in the mainline Spider-Man movies....that makes them pretty clearly canon. Feige involvement or otherwise.
If the spin-offs go through still with no Marvel Studios involvement that puts Marvel Studios in the position of letting Sony have free reign to play around in the MCU which is why I am thinking in the end the spin-offs won't happen or Feige and co. will eventually sign on as producers.
But any movie Sony puts out that takes place in this Spidey-verse using the same universe/characters as the mainline Spider-Man films will be canon by proxy for the MCU.
For you.
darkhunger
Member
The spinoffs might not need Spidey to have a big role and they don't need him unmasked, so it's not an absolute necessity for them to use the same actor.
The new Spidey actor will be under contract with Marvel since he's appearing in Cap CW, so Sony might not even get to use him for anything Marvel's not involved with.