LegendofLex
Member
Don't most people agree that the Rathtar sequence was very out of character for Star Wars but would be right at home in a Star Trek flick?
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[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Thread #3) - That's Not How the Force Works
- Thread starter Bobby Roberts
- Start date
I hated it.
They did push the idea of reincarnation as being a thing during the scene with Maz. She actually says, "You live long enough, you start to see the same eyes in people" or something to that effect.
Maybe nuTrek, but thats not really a Trek staple either. Honestly, that was straight out an Indianna Jones chase.
Nah, thats just the idea of passing the torch, and generations carrying it. Even more, its foreshadowing Reys familial lineage. And worse, its just bashing you over the head with the familiar plot elements repeating.
All this has happened before, and will happen again.
LegendofLex
Member
It's also interesting that both times she comments on people's eyes, it's about her ability to read people, not necessarily about having insight into their identities.
"You have the eyes of a man who wants to run."
"I see your eyes. You already know the truth."
Of course, I think there's some symbolic significance as well, about the past repeating itself.
Is it really though? Doesn't it kind of fit in with the trash compactor monster, the wampa, the rancor or the sarlaac (or that big fish thing in Phantom Menace or the creatures in that arena scene in AOTC), only done by JJ Abrams with 2015 sensibilities?
Liquidsnake
Banned
Judging by what TFA was, I don't see a push for reincarnation to be a theme here.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
That's definitely NOT reincarnation talk.
It's more like "I know a coward when I see one" in so many words.
It's more like "I know a coward when I see one" in so many words.
LegendofLex
Member
Sure, there have been monster scenes in Star Wars films before. That's not really what I'm pointing at.
I'm looking more at the presentation of the two factions that come to collect, the setting, and even the freighter itself.
So you're saying that time is a flat circle?
My wife is convinced that it was Kylo that left Rey on Jakku (since he'd have been 18 at the time Rey is left there), in either an attempt to protect her during a moment of weakness (succumbing to the light), or in an attempt to get her out of the way (maybe he moved her to Jakku to come back for at another time when she was old enough to be trained, and can overthrow Snoke with him).
I can actually buy Kylo leaving Rey on Jakku. If she was Luke's daughter, him thinking she was dead for 12 years could work. Kylo has been shown to be able to manipulate minds. I could see him taking 7 year old Rey to Jakku, wiping her memories, and telling her that he'd be back for her one day. He just seemed really upset that it was a "girl" who stole the droid on the Falcon. In either case, we'll find out the truth sooner or later.
My guess is, she's Luke's daughter, but I'd be fine if it turned out she was a daughter of one of the members of Luke's academy, thought dead by the other characters after the slaughter.
I can actually buy Kylo leaving Rey on Jakku. If she was Luke's daughter, him thinking she was dead for 12 years could work. Kylo has been shown to be able to manipulate minds. I could see him taking 7 year old Rey to Jakku, wiping her memories, and telling her that he'd be back for her one day. He just seemed really upset that it was a "girl" who stole the droid on the Falcon. In either case, we'll find out the truth sooner or later.
My guess is, she's Luke's daughter, but I'd be fine if it turned out she was a daughter of one of the members of Luke's academy, thought dead by the other characters after the slaughter.
TAJ
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
Maybe he's just a GamerGater.
As Rey vision was a combination of her memories, things seen through other's eyes and foreshadowing, I interpreted the part with the Knights of Ren as not being her really there and seeing those through the eyes of others. I even had the impression that those scenes looked different, like she was juxtaposed into the scene, but that might have been just an illusion.
So I don't think that she was really present there, at Luke's academy. Plus looking at the age of the characters. for me it seems very likely that Rey was dumped on Jakku some years before the whole academy thing happened.
Also Luke being gone for a 15 years depression post Ben/search of Jedi temple seems quite exaggerated.
So I don't think that she was really present there, at Luke's academy. Plus looking at the age of the characters. for me it seems very likely that Rey was dumped on Jakku some years before the whole academy thing happened.
Also Luke being gone for a 15 years depression post Ben/search of Jedi temple seems quite exaggerated.
prag16
Banned
Not to split hairs, but it could be as little as 12-13 years. And this kind of lines up with when Kylo left based on Han allegedly seeing his son's face as an adult/grown man for the first time out on that catwalk.
Leia also says that she "lost" Luke, Han, and Kylo all at around the same time iirc. Say in TFA Kylo is 30 and Rey is 19. 12-13 years prior, Kylo is 17-18 and Rey is 6-7. He wrecks Luke's shit, and Rey gets ditched. It call could have happened close together around that timeframe.
Though there's the implication by Pablo that those two events may be farther apart. Don't know.
I thought Rey is around 5 in the vision.
The Librarian
Banned
Why?
This is the way I feel, that it would be a bit out of the character.
We talk about the same guy who didn't mourn his adoptive family one bit and found Yoda immediately when needed.
prag16
Banned
First viewing I though that, then in the second viewing I thought she looked a bit older. I haven't seen any official age source. You may be right.
The "first time as an adult" thing with Han/Kylo also was only a novel thing so we may not be able to entirely take that to the bank. Hell, the pseudoscience behind Starkiller is totally different (and moderately less stupid) in the novel so who knows.
The Librarian
Banned
That's bad writing for the first one, and that's movie coincidence for the second.
prag16
Banned
Yeah, there aren't really safe assumptions to be had with regard to all this. (Aside from ruling out the most outlandish nonsense.)
There ought to be an awesome female bounty hunter who becomes allied with the main characters introduced in 8
I hope this character who will definitely for sure exist isn't too shafted in favor of the existing characters a la that rumor.
edit:
She should have one of those HK droids from KOTOR that travels with her as a Chewbacca-like muscle slash copilot type friendship. The ones that basically just hate humans and call them "meatbags" and so on
I hope this character who will definitely for sure exist isn't too shafted in favor of the existing characters a la that rumor.
edit:
She should have one of those HK droids from KOTOR that travels with her as a Chewbacca-like muscle slash copilot type friendship. The ones that basically just hate humans and call them "meatbags" and so on
Blue Ninja
Member
That'd be pretty cool. I'd be down for meatbags.
I liked the Rathar sequence. It was a fun way to introduce Han to an audience that may not be familiar with him (Han, the smart ass smuggler who may be unreliable to dirtbag clients, and his furry companion Chewie, who knows Han is usually getting into shit), and it was a light hearted Star Warsy monster moment, when Rey messes up and accidentally released the Rathars.
It was a fun way to resolve the conflict between Han and the two gangs. I guess it could have ended in a shootout, but that'd have required more time to set up the motivations behind the shootout, and believable have Han, Chewie, Finn, and Rey escape with their lives. That whole sequence is just really short. Too short to really have a problem with it, especially since the next two scenes are very, very exposition heavy and slow paced (Han explaining what happened to Luke, then meeting Maz leading up to the vision sequence and the First Order arriving to kick off the next big action set piece).
It didn't even feel out of place to me. It made me think of stuff like the trash compactor, the Wampa stuff, the Rancor, etc. Very lighthearted and pulpy: the heroes encounter a giant monster on their spaceship! Monsters! Pirates! Daring do! It was fun.
It was a fun way to resolve the conflict between Han and the two gangs. I guess it could have ended in a shootout, but that'd have required more time to set up the motivations behind the shootout, and believable have Han, Chewie, Finn, and Rey escape with their lives. That whole sequence is just really short. Too short to really have a problem with it, especially since the next two scenes are very, very exposition heavy and slow paced (Han explaining what happened to Luke, then meeting Maz leading up to the vision sequence and the First Order arriving to kick off the next big action set piece).
It didn't even feel out of place to me. It made me think of stuff like the trash compactor, the Wampa stuff, the Rancor, etc. Very lighthearted and pulpy: the heroes encounter a giant monster on their spaceship! Monsters! Pirates! Daring do! It was fun.
The entire freighter sequence, from Han and Chewy boarding the Falcon to the rathtars getting out to them jumping to hyperspace, essentially serves as our exposition for what Han has been up to the last 30 years (and it doubles as introduction to exactly the type of scoundrel he is for new viewers). It's doled out in pieces throughout the whole sequence.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Yeah. The exchange between Han and the 2 merc groups was hilarious. That's pretty much Han Solo in a nutshell.
Tell that to Kanjiklub!
I think the sequence gets a bit of flack (not a lot) because:
A. The Raid folks are in it (and they don't really do anything)
and B. The explanation for Han and Chewie just kinda showing up is shitty.
But hey, a lot of things about the script of this movie are shitty! It was dumb good fun that felt like it was lifted straight out of an unmade Star Wars movie from the 80s.
Trigonometrize.
Member
One thing that I think will push TFA away from being considered as good as classic Star Wars is the lack of iconic lines that weren't jokes. Yeah, "That's not how the force works!" and "Traitor!" are memorable in their own ways, but ANH has an absolute deluge of good stuff. I'm sure I don't have to lay them out for everyone here, but I'm just not seeing much in TFA that'll live up to "I find your lack of faith disturbing" and "the force will be with you... always" and "that's no moon... it's a space station!" I'm sure time has served a lot of these well but all things considered there's not much there in TFA's case IMO.
So, can't remember if it was the teaser, or third trailer: But we have Luke saying "The Force runs strong in my family. My father had it. I have it. My sister has it. You do too".
I guess he could just be referencing his strong connection, but since Star Wars IS the Skywalker Saga, I think the trailer pretty much gave it away.
I guess he could just be referencing his strong connection, but since Star Wars IS the Skywalker Saga, I think the trailer pretty much gave it away.
aHebrewMenagerie
Member
It's pretty much implied that he was saying that to Ben during his training.
This dialog is directly lifted from Return of the Jedi for the trailer.
Oh are people still on about the Luke's daughter theory. I'm just going to accept that won't go away until the episode 9 comes out and lays it all to rest.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Rey is Jar Jar Binks daughter. She'll be able to use the force to extend her ears for super hearing, Kappa.
prag16
Banned
Don't act all high and mighty like you "know". Be dismissive all you want, but there's very little we can actually take off the table at this point (aside from obvious nonsense involving cloning, raising the dead, time travel, etc). There's good reason why such theories will not go away, and obnoxious or condescending remarks from you and others won't be a deterrent.
excelsiorlef
Member
BreezyLimbo
Banned
He supposedly knows the Skywalkers and who Kylo Ren is, but I can't pinpoint whether he was in the OT.
ryutaro's mama
Member
He wasn't.
He's a new character. He has a history dating back to the Clone Wars, according to the wiki, but he's only appeared in TFA stuff. He's just an "old ally" who developed a history with some of the characters in the 30 years between ROTJ and TFA.
Thanks. I thought he had some role I wasn't aware of in previous films. It would be interesting to see a flashback of exactly how he got a hold of that portion of that map.
That's the only scene in the movie that seemed to just be there just because it was fun and not because it moved the plot along. We got some classic Han Solo being Han Solo moments from it and some other really funny bits so I don't mind it at all.
Did people think Captain Phasma was going to show her badass against Chewie?
Fandom was expecting her to be this trilogy's Boba Fett, which for the moment has been put on TR-8R as this movie's place-holder.
But if she did some fighting like TR-8R vs Finn, except fighting Chewie or even all 3 of them but gets subdued that would have matched her trailer hype and then some.
Fandom was expecting her to be this trilogy's Boba Fett, which for the moment has been put on TR-8R as this movie's place-holder.
But if she did some fighting like TR-8R vs Finn, except fighting Chewie or even all 3 of them but gets subdued that would have matched her trailer hype and then some.
As much as it was a mostly pointless detour of a scene, in the grand scheme of the story it didn't seem out of place to me.
travisbickle
Member
I had to google TR-8R ... the stormtrooper?
That guy's a nobody, he's in it to show the similarities between a brainwashed soldier and Kylo Ren.
it felt very Guardians of the Galaxy.
i didn't like it. Especially the moment where Old Han sprints through a corridor, punches a dude in the face and then throws(!) him flying(!) into a Rathtar's maw.
I mean his popularity in the fandom's view, not his story importance.
Though he maybe one of the members from Finn's squad (as he was the leader) during his training days. Which would match his familiarity and hatred seeing Finn out of uniform and killing another trooper.
Well his official name/number is FN-2199 or "Nines" then.
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