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[Mailbox]

Is your issue the fact he's anti-social, unpopular and embraces it? I mean there's character development but his character for the longest time is how he acknowledges that often the simplest solution is one that isn't popular. It's a nice change of pace from most of these shows having people who go WAY the fuck out of their way to help others, this guy likes the simple straightforward solution no one wants to think about. The Batman jokes are there for a reason. Keep watching as the interesting aspect of his character involves his world view and personality greatly

Spoiler

hurting those that grow to like him.

That's actually what I kinda don't like in the series. Not his world view or how he interacts with problems, nor even that people don't like his seemingly self-destructive attitude towards problem solving, but rather just how quick everyone is to literally and viciously hate him just because he handles a situation his way. They do this, oddly enough, at time while still knowing and enabling that kind of behavior.

Its why I hated the intra-club dynamic in season 2, immediately he says he'll fix a problem in the last second, everyone acknowledges him to do it knowing full well he will get hurt in the process, and yet everyone gets pissed and gives him the silent treatment for it. Its bullshit.

Hachiman's attitude and use of problem solving aren't good, sure, and he does eventually learn (somewhat) that he shouldn't take his relationships lightly, but I'll be damned if everyone he is friends with (or at least inside the club) isn't a horrible asshole.

 

[CielTynave]

That's actually what I kinda don't like in the series. Not his world view or how he interacts with problems, nor even that people don't like his seemingly self-destructive attitude towards problem solving, but rather just how quick everyone is to literally and viciously hate him just because he handles a situation his way. They do this, oddly enough, at time while still knowing and enabling that kind of behavior.

Its why I hated the intra-club dynamic in season 2, immediately he says he'll fix a problem in the last second, everyone acknowledges him to do it knowing full well he will get hurt in the process, and yet everyone gets pissed and gives him the silent treatment for it. Its bullshit.

Hachiman's attitude and use of problem solving aren't good, sure, and he does eventually learn (somewhat) that he shouldn't take his relationships lightly, but I'll be damned if everyone he is friends with (or at least inside the club) isn't a horrible asshole.

This is exactly my problem with it too, I ended up dropping it a few episodes into the 2nd season because it was pissing me off too much. I enjoyed the first season quite a bit, enough to watch it all in one sitting, then it went completely overboard with this stuff in the 2nd part.

 

[Quasar]

Hachiman's attitude and use of problem solving aren't good, sure, and he does eventually learn (somewhat) that he shouldn't take his relationships lightly, but I'll be damned if everyone he is friends with (or at least inside the club) isn't a horrible asshole.

Well I'd disagree. Sure they are flawed, 'horrible asshole' is way overstepping the mark.

 

[Line_HTX]

Nobody talks shit about my Bathachiman and gets away with it.

Too bad he never got to say "Tell me... D'you bleed?"

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

Not that I'm familiar with the bible, but wasn't that whole cross thing a result of him pissing off the wrong people? Oh, and he bears the sins of people who hate him anyway because that's just the kind of dude he is.

The motivation behind the arrest of Jesus was that he was such a charismatic figure, attracting many followers and gathering large crowds wherever he went, that the religious authorities were worried he would undermine their power and so created trumped-up charges to bring him before the Roman political leaders.

Is your issue the fact he's anti-social, unpopular and embraces it? I mean there's character development but his character for the longest time is how he acknowledges that often the simplest solution is one that isn't popular. It's a nice change of pace from most of these shows having people who go WAY the fuck out of their way to help others, this guy likes the simple straightforward solution no one wants to think about. The Batman jokes are there for a reason. Keep watching as the interesting aspect of his character involves his world view and personality greatly

Spoiler

hurting those that grow to like him.

I don't have a problem with his character type so much as the writing of the dialogues, as in principally the quality of the prose. Brains Base's production is fairly average, though the film-reel flashbacks were one creative directorial touch, so there isn't much to keep me engaged that way.

 

[Mailbox]

This is exactly my problem with it too, I ended up dropping it a few episodes into the 2nd season because it was pissing me off too much. I enjoyed the first season quite a bit, enough to watch it all in one sitting, then it went completely overboard with this stuff in the 2nd part.

You should keep going tbh, while I don't like the intra-group stuff, there is a LOT of content that isn't that and is very very good.

Well I'd disagree. Sure they are flawed, 'horrible asshole' is way overstepping the mark.

If someone let me handle something, knowing full well how I handle things, and then gave me the cold shoulder to the point of almost permanently breaking apart a group I have been a part of for a while because of how I handled it, I'd call someone like that a manipulative asshole

 

[The Illiterati]

Re.Zero Ep 2:

My theory was that his ghosts exist concurrently (so there would be like 5 of him walking around right now), but he says it too soon for that to be true (before the MC gets attacked by the 3 dudes), so it must be that people have some small memory of his previous actions. The MC says something to that effect as well. Either it'll get explained later, or it doesn't really matter.

Just a small note regarding the helping of the child: Satella is wearing the flower the girl gives her in ep one at the end of ep three, indicating that she helped the girl herself.

 

[Crash Station]

Hundred 2

This is worse than Infinite Stratos.

 

[Puruzi]

All of 8man's friends are shit.


Teacher ending please.

 

[darkblade77]

I'm not sure he would get recognition for that.

The vendor was remarking that another person that was broke recently found his daughter. So he decided to give information to a broke person as a karmic act, I guess.

Even wording it out sounds kinda weak, but I'm pretty sure that's what happened.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

That's actually what I kinda don't like in the series. Not his world view or how he interacts with problems, nor even that people don't like his seemingly self-destructive attitude towards problem solving, but rather just how quick everyone is to literally and viciously hate him just because he handles a situation his way. They do this, oddly enough, at time while still knowing and enabling that kind of behavior.

Its why I hated the intra-club dynamic in season 2, immediately he says he'll fix a problem in the last second, everyone acknowledges him to do it knowing full well he will get hurt in the process, and yet everyone gets pissed and gives him the silent treatment for it. Its bullshit.

Hachiman's attitude and use of problem solving aren't good, sure, and he does eventually learn (somewhat) that he shouldn't take his relationships lightly, but I'll be damned if everyone he is friends with (or at least inside the club) isn't a horrible asshole.

Well in S2 the people who get to know him and see his self-destructive behavior might get pissed off at him and not want to speak with him for a bit but they still care for him. This would be similar to frustration over a family member or friend with an issue like gambling or alcoholism.

Everybody else only knows him via the shit he does to secretly help others, so of course they grow to hate him as he just seems like an asshole. Which he is, but an asshole with a heart of gold.

I enjoyed the show and would watch more because we rarely get this type of utilitarian protagonist.

 

[SliceSabre]

I've always had an issues with his 'friends' getting mad at his methods of problem solving as well.

Its like hiring an exterminator to get rid of some mice in your house then getting mad they killed the mice.

 

[zulux21]

Re.Zero Ep 2:



Just a small note regarding the helping of the child: Satella is wearing the flower the girl gives her in ep one at the end of ep three, indicating that she helped the girl herself.

yup there are two broke kids in the series that saved the girl the first time.
not sure why satella ended up going to the vendor anyways, my guess is that the cat is gonna have some sort of memories about the time loop.

 

[Crash Station]

Did anything worth seeing end up happening in Active Raid? Fell behind at episode 6 and just sort of stopped watching. I liked it somwhat, but not sure I have the motivation to finish it.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

I've always had an issues with his 'friends' getting mad at his methods of problem solving as well.

Its like hiring an exterminator to get rid of some mice in your house then getting mad they killed the mice.

His friends got mad at him because even though the methods worked they either:

A. Caused him to hurt himself or his public opinion even more, sinking him further into his self-hatred.

B. Were straightforward options that solved the issue in a backhanded manner.

Which for the other two characters wasn't cool. They wanted him to change as an individual an the fact he kept returning to the same methodology pissed them off.

 

[Cornbread78]

Kimikiss Pure Rouge ep.10-12
Oh man, it's gonna be juicy and annoying as hell as soon as all these drama plot points start clashing soon. Real love vs. fake love, unrequited love, the love that cannot be, forbidden love and just straight misunderstandings and sorries. The stage has been carefully set and now it's time to see it all play out in dramatic fashion.

 

[Puruzi]

His friends got mad at him because even though the methods worked they either:

A. Caused him to hurt himself or his public opinion even more, sinking him further into his self-hatred.

B. Were straightforward options that solved the issue in a backhanded manner.

Which for the other two characters wasn't cool. They wanted him to change as an individual an the fact he kept returning to the same methodology pissed them off.

Yeah, but it's fucking stupid because even though they know his methods they let him do it and then got mad after the fact

Like if you know what he does how you gonna smile and be like "okay we'll leave it to you" and then get angry at him afterwards.

That's horseshit

 

[veloxStrix]

If someone let me handle something, knowing full well how I handle things, and then gave me the cold shoulder to the point of almost permanently breaking apart a group I have been a part of for a while because of how I handled it, I'd call someone like that a manipulative asshole

I don't really think anyone ever got to the point of breaking the group apart. They are still teenagers, despite everything. I used to get into all kinds of dumb arguments that had me and my friends in a silent battle for days at a time. Not to mention the times they were fairly vocal arguments. Growing up is hard and Hachiman doesn't help himself much with his snide remarks, sneers. and even body language. Most of the friction in the group is a direct result of Hachiman's issues with his own self-image that cause him to push back against others. Where Oregairu really shines is that it doesn't set itself up to validate his actions for the Hachimans of the audience, but rather it shows how he is only hurting himself. The show captures his flaws and limitations, and the "cold shoulder" comes more from his friends' concern than any malice.

Teacher ending please.

I can agree with this sentiment.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

I hope he never changes and just grows up to be a martyr republican.

 

[Mailbox]

His friends got mad at him because even though the methods worked they either:

A. Caused him to hurt himself or his public opinion even more, sinking him further into his self-hatred.

B. Were straightforward options that solved the issue in a backhanded manner.

Which for the other two characters wasn't cool. They wanted him to change as an individual an the fact he kept returning to the same methodology pissed them off.

I would normally agree here, but neither of those things happen in the beginning of season 2.
Hachiman acts as a bridge for conversation. A way to turn someone down in a round about way. He never actually gets hurt, and everyone involved knows what he is doing.

Yet his friends still treat him like he's dirt because of this.

If he "hurts" himself with something like this, then they hurt him 100x more with their resulting actions. How they act causes hachiman a lot of anguish throughout most of that season.

 

[SliceSabre]

His friends got mad at him because even though the methods worked they either:

A. Caused him to hurt himself or his public opinion even more, sinking him further into his self-hatred.

B. Were straightforward options that solved the issue in a backhanded manner.

Which for the other two characters wasn't cool. They wanted him to change as an individual an the fact he kept returning to the same methodology pissed them off.

Yet at the same time I felt that they never did anything to take to load off him to solve the problem. Every single problem they ran into the solution was always. "Alright 8man you fix EVERYTHING."

I never felt like the rest of them ever tried all that hard to fix the problems they faced which then leads to the circle of him having to fix it his way and them getting mad at him more. If you put all the pressure on him of course he's going to resort to the most 'effective' way to solve the issue. Then at the end of they day they are the one choosing to treat him like crap for his methods despite it all.

 

[Jintor]

i don't understand love lab at all, i coasted through 5 episodes and just hit this wall at episode 6. I just can't watch this, I don't know why. It's well made and I like the characters and stuff but there's something that just completely fails to capture my interest that just occurs here

 

[Cornbread78]

I would normally agree here, but neither of those things happen in the beginning of season 2.
Hachiman acts as a bridge for conversation. A way to turn someone down in a round about way. He never actually gets hurt, and everyone involved knows what he is doing.

Yet his friends still treat him like he's dirt because of this.

If he "hurts" himself with something like this, then they hurt him 100x more with their resulting actions. How they act causes hachiman a lot of anguish throughout most of that season.

Well, let's be honest here. Iroha used him the must and really didn't give two shits. In fact, she asked him to "take responsibility" in an almost seductive manor to make herself feel better. She was such a self centered hussy.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

Yet at the same time I felt that they never did anything to take to load off him to solve the problem. Every single problem they ran into the solution was always. "Alright 8man you fix EVERYTHING."

I never felt like the rest of them ever tried all that hard to fix the problems they faced which then leads to the circle of him having to fix it his way and them getting mad at him more. If you put all the pressure on him of course he's going to resort to the most 'effective' way to solve the issue.

Well that's probably more an issue with them sucking at finding solutions that make everybody happy because the both of them aren't exactly well rounded either. So it's two people who under pressure can't find good long term solutions to tough problems, and a self-destructive asshole who knows exactly what to do for the short-term solution, even if not popular.

 

[JulianImp]

I love this SNAFU discussion and wish I could chip in as well, but I guess I'll try posting tomorrow since it's pretty late around here.

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

Gunslinger Girl 7

This episode was devoted to an appreciation of fine Italian art and architecture.

And killing. That too.

I got really sad when the man she was protecting, not knowing she was an assassin, told Rico that she had a life full of possibilities. Little did he know all possibilities but one were closed for her.

 

[kayos90]

To be honest I find the dialogue in the -monogatari series way more pretentious than anything in Oregairu. Everything feels like it's just screaming to sound super philosophical and meaningful but it has no contribution to anything meaningful in the story's plot. it's just "oh let me say something random and meaningful but it really isn't." Screams super pretentious.

 

[veloxStrix]

To be honest I find the dialogue in the -monogatari series way more pretentious than anything in Oregairu. Everything feels like it's just screaming to sound super philosophical and meaningful but it has no contribution to anything meaningful in the story's plot. it's just "oh let me say something random and meaningful but it really isn't." Screams super pretentious.

The courage to speak nonsense lines.

 

[kayos90]

The courage to speak nonsense lines.

Welcome to my life. At least I do it to spice things up in conversations. In a creative work it just sounds like an author trying to add sophistication to his shitty work because he couldn't artistically weave it in.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

Speaking of pretentious dialogue,

How about the Vince Vaughn in True Detective S2?

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

To be honest I find the dialogue in the -monogatari series way more pretentious than anything in Oregairu. Everything feels like it's just screaming to sound super philosophical and meaningful but it has no contribution to anything meaningful in the story's plot. it's just "oh let me say something random and meaningful but it really isn't." Screams super pretentious.

It's not consistent, but at the best of times Nisio's prose in Bakemonogatari is poetic and pleasant to listen to. It flows nicely, abetted by the delivery of the voice actors. Whether the wordplay or interchange going on is directly related to the plot, whatever that is, isn't so important. The prose and its delivery in SNAFU episode 1 is clunkier and not so pleasant to listen to.

 

[Cornbread78]

Sensei's "pep talk" alone with Hiki is probably still one of my favorite interactions in the entire show and it was philosopgical, but it was also heartfelt and sage advice.

#team sensei.

 

[Mailbox]

Well, let's be honest here. Iroha used him the must and really didn't give two shits. In fact, she asked him to "take responsibility" in an almost seductive manor to make herself feel better. She was such a self centered hussy.

There's a slight difference though. Iroha is openly manipulative in her character and behaviour to the audience. How she interacts with everyone and hachiman to get what she wants is one of the reasons why she is so fun to see on screen.

Yukino on the other hand is super high and mighty, pours everything onto hachiman at the last minute and then treats him like trash. Where as Iroha is playful and doesn't try to ruin people's perceptions of others or themselves, Yukino is literally destroying hachimans accomplishments and friendships. She's wayyyyy worse.

I don't really mind Yui all that much since it really feels like she's just following Yukino's lead in this shit, which actually makes sense with her character.

Seriously, Yukino is a piece of shit.

 

[kayos90]

There's a slight difference though. Iroha is openly manipulative in her character and behaviour to the audience. How she interacts with everyone and hachiman to get what she wants is one of the reasons why she is so fun to see on screen.

Yukino on the other hand is super high and mighty, pours everything onto hachiman at the last minute and then treats him like trash. Where as Iroha is playful and doesn't try to ruin people's perceptions of others or themselves, Yukino is literally destroying hachimans accomplishments and friendships. She's wayyyyy worse.

I don't really mind Yui all that much since it really feels like she's just following Yukino's lead in this shit, which actually makes sense with her character.

Seriously, Yukino is a piece of shit.

I don't think you understand Yukino's characteristics judging from what you're writing...

Sensei's "pep talk" alone with Hiki is probably still one of my favorite interactions in the entire show and it was philosopgical, but it was also heartfelt and sage advice.

#team sensei.

To be fair, that conversation is extremely enlightening to Hachiman on numerous levels and I think it speaks to the gap between someone who has matured and someone who hasn't. I also think it does speak to both the troubles that Hachiman faces but at the same time addresses Haruka's issues. It's hard to feel like anything else but masterful.

 

[Puruzi]

Seriously, Yukino is a piece of shit.

thank you

 

[Cornbread78]

There's a slight difference though. Iroha is openly manipulative in her character and behaviour to the audience. How she interacts with everyone and hachiman to get what she wants is one of the reasons why she is so fun to see on screen.

Yukino on the other hand is super high and mighty, pours everything onto hachiman at the last minute and then treats him like trash. Where as Iroha is playful and doesn't try to ruin people's perceptions of others or themselves, Yukino is literally destroying hachimans accomplishments and friendships. She's wayyyyy worse.

I don't really mind Yui all that much since it really feels like she's just following Yukino's lead in this shit, which actually makes sense with her character.

Seriously, Yukino is a piece of shit.

No, Yukino is in love with Hiki and doesn't want him to hurt himself and is super aware of his feelings and her own. Yui is the one that turned super aggressive and manipilative towards to end because she was also aware of the feelings of protection Yuki had for Hiki.

I don't think you understand Yukino's characteristics judging from what you're writing...

To be fair, that conversation is extremely enlightening to Hachiman on numerous levels and I think it speaks to the gap between someone who has matured and someone who hasn't. I also think it does speak to both the troubles that Hachiman faces but at the same time addresses Haruka's issues. It's hard to feel like anything else but masterful.

Exactly right.. We'Re on the same page here. Only if Hiki was 10 years younger. ...

 

[Man God]

No, Yukino is in love with Hiki and doesn't want him to hurt himself and is super aware of his feelings and her own. Yui is the one that turned super aggressive and manipilative towards to end because she was also aware of the feelings of protection Yuki had for Hiki.

 

[Russ T]

Goign from Flying Witch to finishing off Haikyuu!! is quite a shift in tone.

Flying Witch is basically perfect for me. It's somewhere in between Natsume's Book of Friends and Barakamon. That's a good thing, as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Joe Molotov]

Hundred 2

This is worse than Infinite Stratos.

We've entered an infinite Infinite Stratos.

 

[MetroidPrimeRib]

Nonsense. Monogatari has the best and most thought provoking dialogue possible.

 

[Mailbox]

No, Yukino is in love with Hiki and doesn't want him to hurt himself and is super aware of his feelings and her own. Yui is the one that turned super aggressive and manipilative towards to end because she was also aware of the feelings of protection Yuki had for Hiki.

I'd probably be agreeing with you guys more if the beginning of season 2 never happened.

Yukino and Yui giving Hichiman the cold shoulder until he basically has to beg to keep everything the way it was isn't exactly what I'd call being caring.

 

[veloxStrix]

Goign from Flying Witch to finishing off Haikyuu!! is quite a shift in tone.

Flying Witch is basically perfect for me. It's somewhere in between Natsume's Book of Friends and Barakamon. That's a good thing, as far as I'm concerned.

Flying Witch was my most anticipated this season and my favorite so far. I'm glad they didn't try to spice up the character designs too much. I really like the... basic? style of the manga.

 

[firehawk12]

Hundred 2

This is worse than Infinite Stratos.

YES.

All of 8man's friends are shit.


Teacher ending please.

YEEEES.

I've always had an issues with his 'friends' getting mad at his methods of problem solving as well.

Its like hiring an exterminator to get rid of some mice in your house then getting mad they killed the mice.

Even in s1 the teacher calls him out on his methods. It's just that they're the most effective at helping everyone save face, which is something he gives zero shits about.

The interesting dynamic is that he is like the Watamote protagonist, who justifies her shitty life by saying she is better than everyone else. But he has people who are theoretically at least trying to look out for him.

 

[Cornbread78]

I'd probably be agreeing with you guys more if the beginning of season 2 never happened.

Yukino and Yui giving Hichiman the cold shoulder until he basically has to beg to keep everything the way it was isn't exactly what I'd call being caring.

I'm not saying there wasn't some brutal "tough love" in there, but Yukino is on the right side of good and really makes up for it in the end. However, we are still missing a bunch of information on her family situation to fully explain her disposition.

 

[firehawk12]

I'd probably be agreeing with you guys more if the beginning of season 2 never happened.

Yukino and Yui giving Hichiman the cold shoulder until he basically has to beg to keep everything the way it was isn't exactly what I'd call being caring.

Well, that's like the anime version of an intervention since he won't stop doing what he does.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

Today I learned Spielberg is doing ready player one.

Sword art online to win the oscars lmao

 

[Puruzi]

yukino is worst girl

please remove.

 

[kewlmyc]

My Hero Academa 01-02

Reminds me of the first episodes of Naruto. Looking forward to more. I'm actually glad it's only 1 cour right now. It won't be plagued by filler anytime soon.

 

[Jintor]

Today I learned Spielberg is doing ready player one.

Sword art online to win the oscars lmao

If such a world ever came to exist I would destroy it

 

[mrpallyguy]

I find that yui is the worst one out of all of them. Komachi is probably the best in that Hachiman and her relationship is a very nice change of pace in other anime that I've seen.