Support NeoGAF

[Kintaro]

I like how negative comments are somehow trolling... criticism is valid sometimes guys >_>

Problem is, I don't see much criticism here. Just random comments. Not to mention, there can be no real discussion here because not everyone has played the game, beta tested it, or even touched it.

Either way, its just pissing in the wind until launch when everyone can actually provide good discussion made on the actual retail build and not old builds that don't have everything included.

 

[CzarTim]

There is a difference between posting concerns/negative opinions and constantly derailing the thread with the same shit over and over again until the people who are excited about the game (flaws and all) don't want talk about this game anymore.

 

[Jarmel]

Problem is, I don't see much criticism here. Just random comments. Not to mention, there can be no real discussion here because not everyone has played the game, beta tested it, or even touched it.

I've explained my criticisms in a logical manner and given examples to back it up. However I'm sure you guys would be fine with someone just saying that TOR is great without examples though.

 

[Last Hearth]

I've never played WOW, and I have no interest in ever playing WOW, in fact before I heard about SWTOR I had no interest in MMO as a genre, and I love this game.

Stuff like supposed linearity doesn't bother me, ME and KOTOR were structured that way and I loved those games. I enjoy the cutscenes which give me motivation for doing the quests so I never skip them, and I appreciate that most of the quests aren't "kill x number of y", they usually involve other objectives and things that get in your way you have to kill.

 

[DodgerSan]

Lets be honest here, if your talking about regular single player RPGs, yes people expect and want a good story for various reasons. However I don't know if that desire to have that much story is there for an MMO (it could obviously) but it's not a clear answer at this point, because so few MMOs have barely attempted to tell any kind of genuine narrative.

Most MMOers want that next quest, next level, next piece of epic gear/loot, whatever. The majority skip right over the text involved with the quest and just go straight to the objective and complete it. It's just the way MMOs have been made, so it's what people except. I don't know if StarWars will change that but will see soon enough.

I know that's true for the majority, but it's interesting to read the LOTRO thread with the amount of people praising the writing and that they actually enjoy reading the quest text. It can make a difference.

I'm also wondering how much the cosmetic bugs (textures wtc) are down to individual setups. Pretty much EVERY pc game released, not just mmos, will have a percentage of people that have problems other people don't have simply down to their system. I suspect this due to some people saying they've not seen them, where others have.

(Fwiw I'm the sucker that hates COD games due to spawn deaths, non functioning triggers, non functioning dialogue etc. these are issues my friends don't seem to get) :/

 

[Dresden]

Nothing Jarmel posted is offensive, some of you fuckers just sound massively butthurt.

 

[fierrotlepou]

So what is this about the zones being instanced ala Guild Wars? Because that sucks imo.

 

[Moaradin]

So what is this about the zones being instanced ala Guild Wars? Because that sucks imo.

The zones are open world, but there are multiple versions of a zone as of right now.

 

[gatti-man]

Any posts explaining why someone dislikes a thing -> "He must be trolling, Bioware owns my soul and I can say no wrong, also Star Wars!!11one!"

It's a wow clone with voice acting, lightsabers, no auto attack, bland, with some good aspects that could go farther but don't.

It just feels half-realized, and if it wasn't for the voice acting it'd pretty much be any old mmo but with starwars, which can only take you so far imo.

The least it could do is be better than wow in some respects and it can't even do that.

The least it could do is be better than wow? Come on. It is better than wow in some areas like voice (ha) and storytelling. Gameplay is better to me but that's to each his own.

The least it could do is be better than ffxiv which it is lol.

 

[Felix Lighter]

As someone who hasn't played the game but has a Amazon preorder, I'm desperate to read all impressions. My only real problem with in this thread right now is how the stupid fucking NDA is effecting discussion. In some cases, people who really aren't enjoying the game have no problems with going into detail about why they don't like it. At the same time, those that are enjoying it are too worried about getting banned to go into any real detail.

Anyways, after reading this thread, I think I have a pretty good idea where I should set my expectations. I appreciate all the feedback in the thread, I just wish the discussion wasn't stifled by the NDA.

 

[BattleMonkey]

I've explained my criticisms in a logical manner and given examples to back it up. However I'm sure you guys would be fine with someone just saying that TOR is great without examples though.

Difference is the people posting negative impressions, just repeat themselves over and over and over for pages just stating the same thing. You have been doing just that yourself. No one is posting pages and pages of "it's great".

It has nothing to do with negative opinions, but we got a handful of the same exact members who just keep saying the same thing post after post.

We get it, unless you find new issues or something new to contribute, it does get annoying. Some members at least have been pointing out issues or giving out new info with their critique, while some just will keep saying the same thing and it becomes trolling at that point.

So what is this about the zones being instanced ala Guild Wars? Because that sucks imo.

The instancing is not like Guild Wars, but like how Cryptic MMOs have been where you have an instance of a world segment that holds a specific number of players, when it fills up, the players are basically put into another instanced version of that same world. So instead of having everyone on the server in the same place, the game will do something like allow only 50 (or whatever number the server is set for the particular game) in the area then create another instance for the other players, and so on.

 

[Moaradin]

I think the multiple versions of a world is a great idea, but they do need to improve on switching between the different versions.

 

[BattleMonkey]

I think the multiple versions of a world is a great idea, but they do need to improve on switching between the different versions.

The whole shield thing you see randomly in the world is basically them seperating these "phased" areas correct? Seems pretty meh job of them attempting to do world phasing if so.

 

[gatti-man]

I think the multiple versions of a world is a great idea, but they do need to improve on switching between the different versions.

Yup it must be painless to switch.

 

[Moaradin]

The whole shield thing you see randomly in the world is basically them seperating these "phased" areas correct? Seems pretty meh job of them attempting to do world phasing if so.

No that's not world phasing. The "shield thing" means its a phase for a specific quest, mostly class quest so you don't see random players running around on a key part of the story. Plus it allows more impact since its separated from the rest of the world.

Those phases make a small part of a world really. So they are only for key parts of class quest and a world quest every once in a while if its a bigger one.

 

[Sigfodr]

No that's not world phasing. The "shield thing" means its a phase for a specific quest, mostly class quest so you don't see random players running around on a key part of the story. Plus it allows more impact since its separated from the rest of the world.

Those phases make a small part of a world really. So they are only for key parts of class quest and a world quest every once in a while if its a bigger one.

I like seeing people run around in my quest. Guy is telling me that the world is in a time of great darkness and only I can bring it from the brink, so I must find nine great wolf pelts. And right behind him is an angry looking gnome getting blasted and /dancing.

fuckyeah.jpg

 

[Morn]

The whole shield thing you see randomly in the world is basically them seperating these "phased" areas correct? Seems pretty meh job of them attempting to do world phasing if so.

There's no phasing at all in TOR, the tech doesn't exist in the game (Jarmel points out multiple quests that should use it). The shields mean it's an instanced quest area.

 

[Moaradin]

There's no phasing at all in TOR, the tech doesn't exist in the game (Jarmel points out multiple quests that should use it). The shields mean it's an instanced quest area.

The shields ARE use of phasing. There are no loading times, it is all seamless.

 

[Morn]

The shields ARE use of phasing. There are no loading times, it is all seamless.

It's an instance. One of Hero Engine's big features is that seamless instancing tech.

Unfortunately Hero Engine was being developed back during vanilla WoW and BC...before Blizzard started using phasing to show your effect on the game world; so it doesn't use the tech.

 

[Gvaz]

Yeah imo the linearity of the planets is my biggest complaint. It opens up after the first planet (in the sense of levels are much larger) but never really seems to do more than what Guild Wars 1 did. I hated GW and Aion if only for the fact that the levels were too cramped and you couldn't swim or go exploring much. In GW and Aion iirc if you entered the water you got health taken away like fatigue in wow if you venture too far, though in TOR all the water you see is only as deep as your waist. I mean you can explore in TOR but not like with wow's levels. Manuvering platforms to find datacrons is the only real incentive to explore and fuck that shit half the time because it's too much of a bother to reach them and find out that one was just +4 aim which is useless as a jedi.

 

[BattleMonkey]

It's an instance. One of Hero Engine's big features is that seamless instancing tech.

Unfortunately Hero Engine was being developed back during vanilla WoW and BC...before Blizzard started using phasing to show your effect on the game world; so it doesn't use the tech.

Phasing in WoW was basically a use of seamless instancing originally and in parts of the game, but the tech Blizzard created has gone beyond that with what we see in Cat that became more complex.

 

[Mr. Luchador]

Every time I check this thread my hope dies. Morn is basically the Emperor.

 

[Kintaro]

PC Gamer posted a ten minute Eternity Vault video from Bioware. http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/09/05/star-wars-the-old-republic-video-shows-part-one-of-the-eternity-vault-raid/

 

[Tendo]

Really considering cancelling my Origin Pre order...I'm not liking what I'm hearing. I loved DCUO for... 3 weeks. Then I was out of stuff to do. What was great about WoW and other MMO'is there is a ton of stuff to do besides just the main story missions. It seems this is lacking anything beyond main quest lines...May just save my 80 bucks for now and wait and see.

 

[Gvaz]

The main quest stuff seems limited but there's not all that many sidequests per hub. Maybe 10-15 tops before you have to move onto a new hub. That being said, that's okay for me because around that time I get sick of the sidequests and want to move on. Sometimes I find myself skipping the sidequest voices thinking

and going "where do I complete it and what's the fastest way to do so so I can level up and move on" The story ones are interesting but...

 

[BattleMonkey]

Really considering cancelling my Origin Pre order...I'm not liking what I'm hearing. I loved DCUO for... 3 weeks. Then I was out of stuff to do. What was great about WoW and other MMO'is there is a ton of stuff to do besides just the main story missions. It seems this is lacking anything beyond main quest lines...May just save my 80 bucks for now and wait and see.

Well DCUO one can max out in a couple days easily and get top tier gear, TOR is still going to be a much longer game but you do have stuff like pvp and crafting to do. Pretty much offers what other MMOs have offered, the one concern that everyone seems to agree on is in the current beta state it's lacking in instanced group content, though supposedly much more is coming..... DCUO didn't have any crafting nor even an economy at launch and really still has no player economy even after putting in an auction house.

DCUO is the most content starved MMO to come out in a long time with the biggest lack of things to do. The only interesting thing they did to keep people playing was their achievement system. Fun game but they really made such a tiny game sadly.

 

[Tendo]

Well DCUO one can max out in a couple days easily and get top tier gear, TOR is still going to be a much longer game but you do have stuff like pvp and crafting to do. Pretty much offers what other MMOs have offered, the one concern that everyone seems to agree on is in the current beta state it's lacking in instanced group content, though supposedly much more is coming..... DCUO didn't have any crafting nor even an economy at launch and really still has no player economy even after putting in an auction house.

DCUO is the most content starved MMO to come out in a long time with the biggest lack of things to do. The only interesting thing they did to keep people playing was their achievement system. Fun game but they really made such a tiny game sadly.

True. I forgot about crafting. I'm sure it isn't at WoW levels of involvement but I always liked farming mats in all the zones. Would I be going to old/new planets I didn't go to just to get mats? I always dug that. Say I never quested on a planet but I need some resource from it, I land and have to explore the planet to find my material?

 

[ElectricBlue187]

The main quest stuff seems limited but there's not all that many sidequests per hub. Maybe 10-15 tops before you have to move onto a new hub. That being said, that's okay for me because around that time I get sick of the sidequests and want to move on. Sometimes I find myself skipping the sidequest voices thinking

and going "where do I complete it and what's the fastest way to do so so I can level up and move on" The story ones are interesting but...

Especially when group members are waiting for you it's like "blah blah blah tell me how many to kill and I come back and get shiny I know the drill"

 

[BattleMonkey]

True. I forgot about crafting. I'm sure it isn't at WoW levels of involvement but I always liked farming mats in all the zones. Would I be going to old/new planets I didn't go to just to get mats? I always dug that. Say I never quested on a planet but I need some resource from it, I land and have to explore the planet to find my material?

Your supposed to be able to basically automate the gathering by sending out a companion character to do it for you, you can queue up your tasks which get done while you are offline kind of like EVE online does. From videos you can apparently do your own gathering and crafting but with companions it seems like it's just easier to have them do it all for you while you go do the questing or log off.

 

[Gvaz]

I fucking hate farming mats so the crafting system is greatly welcome to me.

 

[gatti-man]

I fucking hate farming mats so the crafting system is greatly welcome to me.

My favorite is the vend trash items feature.

 

[Morn]

My favorite is the vend trash items feature.

Yea that was an awesome feature in Torchlight.

 

[gatti-man]

Yea that was an awesome feature in Torchlight.

Yup torchlight 2 is an insta buy for me.

 

[Mupod]

Your supposed to be able to basically automate the gathering by sending out a companion character to do it for you, you can queue up your tasks which get done while you are offline kind of like EVE online does. From videos you can apparently do your own gathering and crafting but with companions it seems like it's just easier to have them do it all for you while you go do the questing or log off.

The gathering is semi automated. You just walk up and click it, but instead of your own character doing the gathering your companion picks it up - you can just keep walking without stopping. If there's two things next to each other you can gather the other node personally while they do it.

Crafting is all done by crew members. You queue up a bunch of stuff, they vanish for X amount of time, and it shows up in your inventory while you skill up. I think you can have more than one party member crafting at the same time too. The downside is you lose them for combat purposes until they come back, kinda sucks coming across a boss enemy right when you sent them out. Also gathering skills have little 'missions' you can send your partner away on that cost credits and take 5-10 minutes. When they finish them, you get some materials and skill ups. They can fail though.

It seems like party members get bonuses to certain kinds of crafting/gathering - mako has a bonus to slicing, for example.

 

[Mr. Luchador]

Think I'm going to cancel my pre-order for now. Let the first wave people do what they want, and give an honest opinion of the game after a month or so playing. Probably pick it up a few months down the line when things have been ironed out fully, and (hopefully) more content and features have been added.

 

[LowParry]

Think I'm going to cancel my pre-order for now. Let the first wave people do what they want, and give an honest opinion of the game after a month or so playing. Probably pick it up a few months down the line when things have been ironed out fully, and (hopefully) more content and features have been added.

Going back to WoW ehhh? (This is a trend for most failed MMOs from the get go, lol)

 

[Morn]

PC Gamer posted a ten minute Eternity Vault video from Bioware. http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/09/05/star-wars-the-old-republic-video-shows-part-one-of-the-eternity-vault-raid/

That was the Friday update. It's old.

 

[Tendo]

What types of crafting professions have they discussed?

 

[Morn]

Going back to WoW ehhh? (This is a trend for most failed MMOs from the get go, lol)

I've already been playing more WoW. My guild has been clearing all the old instances to gather old armor for 4.3

 

[Mr. Luchador]

Going back to WoW ehhh? (This is a trend for most failed MMOs from the get go, lol)

Nah, think I'm done with MMOs in general (at least pay to play ones). WoW has killed them for me, I'm done with them. 7 years, on and off, of the same repetitive shit has left me dead inside. Keep stringing you along with all these promises that take half a decade to appear so they can keep taking your money. Its not for me anymore.
Plus communities can be terrible, and I don't want the fear of getting into this game just for the community to turn terrible 2 years down the line (WOW!).

I hope this is a good game, and I might pick it down the road when they're not asking for £40 ($60), and just use the free game time to treat this like a KOTOR game, rather than MMO.

 

[BattleMonkey]

Nah, think I'm done with MMOs in general (at least pay to play ones). WoW has killed them for me, I'm done with them. 7 years, on and off, of the same repetitive shit has left me dead inside. Keep stringing you along with all these promises that take half a decade to appear so they can keep taking your money. Its not for me anymore.
Plus communities can be terrible, and I don't want the fear of getting into this game just for the community to turn terrible 2 years down the line (WOW!).

I hope this is a good game, and I might pick it down the road when they're not asking for £40 ($60), and just use the free game time to treat this like a KOTOR game, rather than MMO.

I don't know, while it's kinda true I like to approach MMO's like any other game. I will play them and when I'm done enjoying it, I quit and stop paying. I've greatly enjoyed my time with many MMO's, but know when it's time for me to quit. I dunno, some people seem to feel like if they get into a MMO that they have to commit to it long term.

 

[Mr. Luchador]

Yeah, I see what you're saying, BM. But for me £40 is too much for a PC title, so I'll pick it up when its cheaper and just whore the 30 days of game time to enjoy it as a 'singe player' game.

 

[Gvaz]

My favorite is the vend trash items feature.

Same, I saw that and my eyes teared up and... well not really. But I did go "FINALLY WHAT THE FUCK"

 

[gatti-man]

Nice I finally get a chance to play and crippling lag is everywhere.

 

[Akim]

Nice I finally get a chance to play and crippling lag is everywhere.

hahaha, this.

 

[Last Hearth]

Yeah, it's taking me about 10 minutes to even log in.

 

[antonz]

Low Settings:

High Settings:

 

[LowParry]

Most impressive.

 

[Hawk269]

Lets be honest here, if your talking about regular single player RPGs, yes people expect and want a good story for various reasons. However I don't know if that desire to have that much story is there for an MMO (it could obviously) but it's not a clear answer at this point, because so few MMOs have barely attempted to tell any kind of genuine narrative.

Most MMOers want that next quest, next level, next piece of epic gear/loot, whatever. The majority skip right over the text involved with the quest and just go straight to the objective and complete it. It's just the way MMOs have been made, so it's what people except. I don't know if StarWars will change that but will see soon enough.

I don't see why Bioware, (again this is without me playing it) does not have both Dialog (Voiced) and Text Based quests. Yes, the main story go for it, voice the shit out of it because that is what your main drive is, but for side-quests and just simple quests that some NPC's want you to do, there is nothing wrong with them being text based like many other games.

My only fear right now is that all the Story based quests are linked so tat when the story is done, you should be at the level cap. If they add a bunch of side quests, then the level cap could potentially be achieved way before the end of the story quest. So, some balancing will need to be done.

Again, this is just an assumption on my part, since I am not playing the game. But to me, some text based quests that are not part of the main story is no big deal. Give me some rare quests on tatooine where I have to hunt down certain animals or some shit like that.

 

[Xamdou]

So everyone here got in the beta except me?