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//: StarCraft II: Wings of Liberty |OT2| GL HF GG
- Thread starter Corran Horn
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pieatorium
Member
was surprised i didnt die in the first 5 minutes playing T, might actually try to random it up in the future.
mescalineeyes
Banned
LovingSteam said:
- day9tv.blip.tv :>
- what?
- It's just as good, just newer.
It's very hard to just kill a Terran in TvT.pieatorium said:
I decided not to use tanks and see if I could 3 rax mard pressure you into a victory, but that didn't work.
High ground mad annoying, stupid expo just dies to tanks. If you had a bit more tanks you would have held it off a lot better. Also attack move vs moving. I was able to snipe 3 tanks with my small forces before the contain (you should have stayed there and targetted my repairing scv's as well).
That gave me enough time to get my 2 port banshees out and I was confident you didn't have enough to repel it. Some bunkers would have certainly helped your front as well. imo Engy bay after you get your 3 rax is super important (or after fact) since banshees can just ruin your entire day.
Pretty good for someone who usually doesn't play T!
pieatorium
Member
your backdoor sneak attack killed all my scv's mining gas and i didnt realise for ages which is why i didnt have more tanks :lolHazaro said:
Hazaro said:
Thanks, but when I read your post I thought : ''it wasn't T, it was P'' :lol
He had 1 airship (no idea which) killing my workes and overlords at my base within minutes, while I was still trying to get a roaches/ling army up.
I guess it's just my own lack of skills though, I probably just take too long building up in the first few minutes.
Oh well, I'm going to watch some more day9 beginner vids, and some high lvl Z replays, just to see how others cope with some of the stuff I encountered in my first steps in MP.
mescalineeyes
Banned
Nyx said:
your problem starts here. Learn the units/terminology.
mescalineeyes
Banned
Nyx said:I know, bought the guide already to help with that.
But I was just wondering what a Z can do vs someone who has Air within minutes, or can Z do the same with Mutas ? (it takes me way too long to get to Mutas)
if you are expecting air harass, spawn 2 queens in your main.
also, you should be getting hydras against air, not mutas.
<- these guys
Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
And before he tries it out and goes "Wow, hydras sucks, wtf!", he should note that Hydras pretty much requires creep and +1 range upgrade (from the Hyd Den) to become super effective).
mescalineeyes
Banned
Yoshichan said:
you get what you pay for
still, Hydras might not be as mobile as mutas but have insane DPS and as long as you have something to tank (ironically, I usually mass Lings for this purpuse), you can deal with most ground armies as well.
However he might go colossi if he sees you building lots of Hydras which opens up a whole other can of worms.
Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
If he goes colossi, the remaining gas you've gathered should be going to mutas. Pincer those damn units and GG.mescalineeyes said:you get what you pay for
still, Hydras might not be as mobile as mutas but have insane DPS and as long as you have something to tank (ironically, I usually mass Lings for this purpuse), you can deal with most ground armies as well.
However he might go colossi if he sees you building lots of Hydras which opens up a whole other can of worms.
mescalineeyes
Banned
Yoshichan said:
don't spoil the game for him, Yoshichan, let him use his own imagination
mescalineeyes
Banned
Nyx said:Thanks guys.
And I'll never say Hydras suck, they are the coolest unit ingame !
you are good people. feel free to come back here anytime.
TheRagnCajun
Member
I lost TvZ due to mass mutas last night. I saw the early spire, I just couldn't get enough vikings out. I had 2 starports with techlabs cause I was banshee rushing, which worked, but he just had way too many mutas. Teching to Thors didn't make sense as I didn't have a techlab on my factory and had no armory. Besides, Thors are just so damn slow. If I had to to do it again I probably should have abondoned the banshee rush strat and just mass vikings.
Lets try this again.
I need volunteers (admins) for the next EU tournament.
Task will be:
* Managing results
* Uploading replays (if there is)
* Solving disputes
* Be able to idle @ mirc (since next tournament will have req. for this for players also).
Might be some other tasks.
PM me.
I need volunteers (admins) for the next EU tournament.
Task will be:
* Managing results
* Uploading replays (if there is)
* Solving disputes
* Be able to idle @ mirc (since next tournament will have req. for this for players also).
Might be some other tasks.
PM me.
mescalineeyes
Banned
fanboi said:
pm sent.
fanboi said:
stim is definitely what scares me most.
mescalineeyes
Banned
That should win you a guaranteed 3 out of 7 games!Cheeto said:Try the foxer strat
TheRagnCajun
Member
fanboi said:
I could have massed more marines...But switching from a banshee rush start to teching to thors, and getting them out would have taken way too damn long. Even if i got them out to my expansions they probably would have gotten zerging owned. Vikings do more damage than mutas and cost less don't they? And they can shut down muta map control without worrying about zergings or roaches, which my oppenent had plenty of, and I could have handily eliminated with banshees once I had air dominance.
So basically my opponent had roaches, zerglings, and a lot of mutas, with which he was doing a lot of map control, shutting down my attempts to expand. My strat was to gain air superiority with vikings and then clean out the zerglings and roaches with banshees.
From what I can see my main fault was trying to stick to early banshees, which prevented me from massing enough vikings to counter the mutas.
For me, my counter lately for mass mutas has been...mass ravens!TheRagnCajun said:
It's actually worked out incredibly well for me every time. Hunter seeker missile is fantastic at bringing down the large packs that form up. Plus it only takes dropping a couple of auto turrets to scout and deny zerg from expanding past their natural, which is quite important that late in the game. You can also easily harass existing bases by dropping an auto turret or two on the mineral lines.
I use the excess minerals I have, which is a ton, to mass marines that I generally keep in my base to help fend off the mutas and any ground attacks that come. At that size army, stimmed marines are very effective against the zergling groups that tend to accompany mutas.
Given your setup at the time, it sounds like it would have been something you could have easily transitioned to.
mescalineeyes
Banned
BigAT said:
all zerg players you play against are shit.
magic box negates seeker missile.
You talk as though everyone executes theory 100% effectively in games. Players make mistakes, frequent mistakes. "Magic box" is all well and good, but I still find clumps of mutas in various situations in which HSM becomes extremely effective. Certainly better than uselessly throwing some Vikings at them.mescalineeyes said:
mescalineeyes
Banned
BigAT said:
we should always measure ourselves up against perfection
TheRagnCajun
Member
I stll don't see why vikings are useless. They are cheaper than mutas, and will win toe-to-toe against mutas. Granted they are better against armoured units.
Thors are too slow to shut down muta map control.
Mass marines will work, but are vulnerable to ground support units.
The appeal of using vikings in my situation is that it allowed me to isolate the fight to vikings vs mutas instead of marines vs mutas & roaches & zerglings. If I had just rolled a strict Mball from the get-go it could have probably worked but I had already invested in 2 starports at that point.
Thors are too slow to shut down muta map control.
Mass marines will work, but are vulnerable to ground support units.
The appeal of using vikings in my situation is that it allowed me to isolate the fight to vikings vs mutas instead of marines vs mutas & roaches & zerglings. If I had just rolled a strict Mball from the get-go it could have probably worked but I had already invested in 2 starports at that point.
TheRagnCajun said:
Due to bounce damage, I am pretty sure Zerg can not only pump out more mutas than you can with 2 starport with 2 reactors ( assuming he is on 2 base at least, if he successfully estabilished a 3rd with 2 gas, you are DOOMED with Vikings), but they can perform quite well against Vikings due to that additional hits. The first shot is the Viking's advantage, and that is about it.
TheRagnCajun
Member
V_Arnold said:
Well by the time I was banshee harrassing he had to 2 bases. I killed all of his workers. But at that point he already had a ton of mutas. It was probably the 10 minute mark.
You're probably right when you say he could produce faster than me though.
Next time it will be mass marines then.
Yeah, muta vs Vikings is a bad deal... since you can't produce enough of them I guess.
But 2 air armor Vikings are pretty nasty vs muta since they cripple the splash even against the +1 air weapons all Zerg get (and if they don't mutas are sooo dead, dps wise).
Oh, and Mutas are much faster than Vikings so while you can defend all you want with Vikings, a mass Viking attack will get you counterattacked hard, especially since you have to land to attack a base.
Though there have been instances of mass Vikings doing really well.
But 2 air armor Vikings are pretty nasty vs muta since they cripple the splash even against the +1 air weapons all Zerg get (and if they don't mutas are sooo dead, dps wise).
Oh, and Mutas are much faster than Vikings so while you can defend all you want with Vikings, a mass Viking attack will get you counterattacked hard, especially since you have to land to attack a base.
Though there have been instances of mass Vikings doing really well.
close to the edge
Member
I can't believe how angry I get when I lose. I'm usually pretty relaxed and shit but this game..man. I just ragequit after being cannonrushed in a random vs random matchup on scrap station. I sent my overlord to his base, saw only a forge, scouted my base, saw his pylon, it was already done and tried to surround his probe with my drones for like 5 minutes, he built 3 cannons (that didnt actually do anything), I got pissed and alt-f4 without gg. I really gotta stay more calm.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
Build a hatchery and spawning pool at their natural. Tower up their ramp and move in. I've done it, it's funny.close to the edge said:
TheRagnCajun
Member
FoxSpirit said:
Well mutas are faster than anything Terran can throw at them.
I usually land the vikings just long enough to take out spore crawlers/cannons/missle turrets and then its back to banshee.
Haven't paid too much attention to the thread in a few days so not sure if this has been posted, but it's a very helpful PvZ guide
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=167992
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=167992
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=169252
Takes big interview with TLO on his return to Germany, 50+ minutes german with subtitles (Y)
Takes big interview with TLO on his return to Germany, 50+ minutes german with subtitles (Y)
Corran Horn
May the Schwartz be with you
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=166114
Cool program for SC/SC2 events/streams/chat.
Cool program for SC/SC2 events/streams/chat.
close to the edge
Member
Nice.. that looks pretty sweet. Might try it out later.Corran Horn said:
Revengeance
Member
I have a total mancrush on TLOHolyCheck said:
<3!!
Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Ahhh! This shows how much league placement really means. I just fought a terran who's 1v1 Platinum, 2v2 Gold, 3v3 Diamond, 4v4 Diamond...
I send a scout, he's walled off with three supply depots.
I go for quick speedlings + banelings. At around 6 minute mark, I attack. I bust through his supply depots. Inside, I find one barrack, two marines, an engineering bay, a factory and three missile turrets.
wat
edit: feel sorry for him now though :/ He pms me telling me "wow, u must be diamond! gg!" and then continues on saying that he always loses to zerg ._. ...
I send a scout, he's walled off with three supply depots.
I go for quick speedlings + banelings. At around 6 minute mark, I attack. I bust through his supply depots. Inside, I find one barrack, two marines, an engineering bay, a factory and three missile turrets.
wat
edit: feel sorry for him now though :/ He pms me telling me "wow, u must be diamond! gg!" and then continues on saying that he always loses to zerg ._. ...
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