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[damidu]

Eh....I don't need to look at any game to figure out that the NPC expressions in Starfield can be really screwed up. I'm not playing the we/they game.

yeah unfortunately thats how usually anything ever improves,
the ultimate we/they game

 

[Windom Earle]

Is this launch build Cyberpunk?

All of this was in CP at launch. People like to pretend it was a broken mess at launch but at least the PC version was mostly fine.

 

[Alan Wake]

Maybe I am in the minority but I don't base my joy of a game on how pretty NPCs are

But then again I am not a 15 year old hormone induced teen anymore either

People hating this game will keep having it no matter what. And find things to complain about.

 

[Topher]

yeah unfortunately thats how usually anything ever improves,
the ultimate we/they game

Video game tribalism isn't about improving anything.

 

[Tams]

That BG3 comparison is absurd. In Alien (1979), Ridley Scott deliberately cast a bunch of fairly unattractive, middle aged actors to be the cast to give the impression that the crew were middle-class expendable schlubs in space. Bethesda probably had a similar idea.

Then they should have put in an option for NPC face types.

I don't want to spend my enjoyment time looking at uggos.

 

[Topher]

All of this was in CP at launch. People like to pretend it was a broken mess at launch but at least the PC version was mostly fine.

Not really. The game had ton of problems on PC as well. You had cops randomly spawning on rooftops coming after you when you committed crimes. You could cut a guy's head off with a sword and he would walk around like normal. And who can forget the t poses....

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

That BG3 comparison is absurd. In Alien (1979), Ridley Scott deliberately cast a bunch of fairly unattractive, middle aged actors to be the cast to give the impression that the crew were middle-class expendable schlubs in space. Bethesda probably had a similar idea.

Well, BG3 simply has better char generator, while SF generates it's NPCs from the dreaded Oblivion editor. At least random BG3 NPCs have eyelashes and skin pores (it's was vey hard for me to catch BG3 chars closer due to more mouse-bound camera).

 

[damidu]

Video game tribalism isn't about improving anything.

wth are you even talking about lol
when you compare games of the same genre, its tribalism. yeah right.
sounds more like some sort of tribal defence

 

[azertydu91]

Maybe I am in the minority but I don't base my joy of a game on how pretty NPCs are

But then again I am not a 15 year old hormone induced teen anymore either

Come on!!! Who here hasn't rubbed one out on Ms Pacman, in a crowded arcade complex, while listening it's a small small world?
It probably happenned to all of us that's just normal behaviour now, the hardest part is to keep an angry face during the the prolonged eye contact with the crowd...
More seriously (in case some pervert thought that was real) having good looking (meaning well made not especialy beautiful) helps a lot even with bad facial anmation (one day well cross that uncanny valley)

 

[Topher]

wth are you even talking about lol
when you compare games of the same genre, its tribalism. yeah right.
sounds more like some sort of tribal defence

I've made plenty of comparisons to Everspace 2 in this very thread to compare the aspects of space travel that could be improved in Starfield. Why? Because you can't just see the difference when looking at an image or a video.

Again, I don't need to see BG3 or any other game to understand that this is fucked up....

 

[Topher]

Well, BG3 simply has better char generator, while SF generates it's NPCs from the dreaded Oblivion editor. At least random BG3 NPCs have eyelashes and skin pores (it's was vey hard for me to catch BG3 chars closer due to more mouse-bound camera).

That's a much better comparison. Of course, if we are talking about character models then it really doesn't matter if the game is in the same genre or not, does it? We can compare character models of Starfield to that of Jedi Survivor just as easily. I guess BG 3 vs Starfield is just the trumped up rivalry of the day.

 

[killatopak]

I think the issue here is that people don’t seem to take comfort that people other than them can enjoy the game despite all the problems or that people can not like the game despite all the positive it brings.

This is why people resort to posting the worst of what the game is and people who are having fun ignore it because it doesn’t affect them. While people who post all these amazing stuff you can do is ignored as well because some people can’t get past the issues the game have and prevents them from enjoying the game.

It’s the nature of personal preference. Well how do we come to an agreement then? Well usually that means we bring up other games and look to see if an issue with those games result in the same reaction with this game. An example is the Cyberpunk comparison. Are the bugs suddenly okay now just because Bethesda is known for it? How about the fact that Bethesda has always been able to integrate the 3rd person perspective which Cyberpunk got a pass for?

 

[analog_future]

I think the issue here is that people don’t seem to take comfort that people other than them can enjoy the game despite all the problems or that people can not like the game despite all the positive it brings.

This is why people resort to posting the worst of what the game is and people who are having fun ignore it because it doesn’t affect them. While people who post all these amazing stuff you can do is ignored as well because some people can’t get past the issues the game have and prevents them from enjoying the game.

It’s the nature of personal preference. Well how do we come to an agreement then? Well usually that means we bring up other games and look to see if an issue with those games result in the same reaction with this game. An example is the Cyberpunk comparison. Are the bugs suddenly okay now just because Bethesda is known for it? How about the fact that Bethesda has always been able to integrate the 3rd person perspective which Cyberpunk got a pass for?

The issue is that the vast majority of those posting "the worst of the game" are people who've never played the game and/or have no intention to ever play it.


Look at the Early Access OT, where, you know, people have actually purchased and are playing the game. It's near universal praise.

 

[damidu]

I've made plenty of comparisons to Everspace 2 in this very thread to compare the aspects of space travel that could be improved in Starfield. Why? Because you can't just see the difference when looking at an image or a video.

Again, I don't need to see BG3 or any other game to understand that this is fucked up....

So if I'm the tribal one then why am I arguing with others in this thread about how Starfield did space flight wrong? Nope. I'm not the one engaging in we/they rhetoric. That's all you.

you make less sense longer this goes, so i leave it.
there is nothing tribal about people comparing npc quality of two biggest rpgs releasing in same month.

just do some soul searching why seeing them side by side triggers you.

 

[GymWolf]

I've made plenty of comparisons to Everspace 2 in this very thread to compare the aspects of space travel that could be improved in Starfield. Why? Because you can't just see the difference when looking at an image or a video.

Again, I don't need to see BG3 or any other game to understand that this is fucked up....

What is wrong with african bud spencer?

 

[Topher]

you make less sense longer this goes, so i leave it.
there is nothing tribal about people comparing npc quality of two biggest rpgs releasing in same month.

Comparing NPCs was not what I was pointing out as tribal and you know it. It was your insistence in framing this in terms of "we" and "they".

I repeatedly pounded the point home that Starfield's NPC look horrible and that fact stands on its own. Why you keep pretending the RPG genre matters, I have no idea. Character models can be compared across multiple genres. Factually, Starfield being in the science fiction genre means it is going to have a decidedly different aesthetic than one of a fantasy nature like BG3. The fictional genre, setting, theme, etc. of these games have more much impact on design language than simply being a RPG. All to say this BG3 vs Starfield nonsense is completely contrived as these games are much more different than they are alike.

 

[Windom Earle]

Not really. The game had ton of problems on PC as well. You had cops randomly spawning on rooftops coming after you when you committed crimes. You could cut a guy's head off with a sword and he would walk around like normal. And who can forget the t poses....

Sure it was buggy and pretty comparable to a bad Bethesda game I guess. Just way more ambitious and technically advanced.

 

[killatopak]

The issue is that the vast majority of those posting "the worst of the game" are people who've never played the game and/or have no intention to ever play it.


Look at the Early Access OT, where, you know, people have actually purchased and are playing the game. It's near universal praise.

I find it hard to fault that when the game isn’t officially out yet. As you say it’s an early access. I myself certainly won’t pay more for something I’ll get in a few days. It’s not like this is an online mmo game where every day you play earlier is an advantage towards those that are late. About those with no intention to play it, if they’re wrong then what they’ve brought up shouldn’t be an issue for those that are already playing. The problem is, there is some kernel of truth to it that’s why it’s harder to ignore.

People who have issues with the game at the jump generally won’t go to an OT. Generally because I’ve seen otherwise. It’s also because criticism can be drowned out or ganged upon. A neutral field is much better place to settle stuff. It’s also a better place to temper expectations for someone like myself. I know I’ll buy the game and I’ll know I’ll enjoy it however I wanna see and discuss the issues before I jump into it so I won’t come into the game blind just to be disappointed due to the amount of hype I’ve put into the game.

 

[BouncyFrag]

Gotta admit I’m looking forward to the standard release of this.

 

[FlyyGOD]

This sums up the 88-87 score. So basically without those paid actors we are looking at a score around 70-75. Make more sense now.

I see he cherry picked ratings. Where are the ign Spain, Brazil and Japan ratings amongst others?

 

[analog_future]

I find it hard to fault that when the game isn’t officially out yet. As you say it’s an early access. I myself certainly won’t pay more for something I’ll get in a few days. It’s not like this is an online mmo game where every day you play earlier is an advantage towards those that are late. About those with no intention to play it, if they’re wrong then what they’ve brought up shouldn’t be an issue for those that are already playing. The problem is, there is some kernel of truth to it that’s why it’s harder to ignore.

People who have issues with the game at the jump generally won’t go to an OT. Generally because I’ve seen otherwise. It’s also because criticism can be drowned out or ganged upon. A neutral field is much better place to settle stuff. It’s also a better place to temper expectations for someone like myself. I know I’ll buy the game and I’ll know I’ll enjoy it however I wanna see and discuss the issues before I jump into it so I won’t come into the game blind just to be disappointed due to the amount of hype I’ve put into the game.

I'm not faulting anyone for not paying for early access. But this forced attempt at trying to frame this game as a broken mess of unfulfilled promises being largely proliferated by people who haven't even played the game is just silly.

And it's quite obviously largely driven by console warring and tribalism.

 

[ChinMitten]

Started playing yesterday and it runs shockingly well on an old 1080 mini. No issues on that front, have been really happy with the game so far. I haven’t been this stoked for a game since probably the Division or Overwatch.

 

[GymWolf]

Comparing NPCs was not what I was pointing out as tribal and you know it. It was your insistence in framing this in terms of "we" and "they".

I repeatedly pounded the point home that Starfield's NPC look horrible and that fact stands on its own. Why you keep pretending the RPG genre matters, I have no idea. Character models can be compared across multiple genres. Factually, Starfield being in the science fiction genre means it is going to have a decidedly different aesthetic than one of a fantasy nature like BG3. The fictional genre, setting, theme, etc. of these games have more much impact on design language than simply being a RPG. All to say this BG3 vs Starfield nonsense is completely contrived as these games are much more different than they are alike.

You can't compare run of the mill npcs to bethesda npcs tho.

 

[The Cockatrice]

Well, BG3 simply has better char generator, while SF generates it's NPCs from the dreaded Oblivion editor. At least random BG3 NPCs have eyelashes and skin pores (it's was vey hard for me to catch BG3 chars closer due to more mouse-bound camera).

I dont think BG3 has randomly generated characters as npc's aka you will see the same townsfolk no matter what. I think they're all handcrafted.

 

[Tomeru]

I dont think BG3 has randomly generated characters as npc's aka you will see the same townsfolk no matter what. I think they're all handcrafted.

Not really. There are a bunch of models that are shared all over. There are enough that it feels somewhat oragnic, but you'll ocassionally see a familiar face. They do not look like lifeless dolls however.

 

[twilo99]

honestly BG3 has some of the most eye pleasing characters

Yes, it’s not even close. Can that be fixed with mods ?

Larian seems to be less affected by the current cultural environment compared to Bethesda…

 

[geary]

Well, BG3 simply has better char generator, while SF generates it's NPCs from the dreaded Oblivion editor. At least random BG3 NPCs have eyelashes and skin pores (it's was vey hard for me to catch BG3 chars closer due to more mouse-bound camera).

BG3 had 200+ actors who mocap and VA. Every NPC in that game was bespoked.

https://www.vg247.com/baldurs-gate-3-performances-motion-capture

 

[The Cockatrice]

Not really. There are a bunch of models that are shared all over. There are enough that it feels somewhat oragnic, but you'll ocassionally see a familiar face. They do not look like lifeless dolls however.

I mean yes there are copy pasted models, but I was talking about the game generating npc population. BG3 doesnt not have that, you'll see the same exact npc's on the road and in the city, same scripted paths, same dialogues. Starfield, generates and regenerates new npc's every time you reload or come back. It's different.

 

[Madflavor]

Space Exploration RPGs just feel cursed at this point. It's incredible that modern games can't seem to replicate what Mass Effect 1 managed to achieve 15 years ago. And no, I'm not saying Mass Effect 1 was perfect with it's exploration. There were copy and pasted interiors, some of the planets were completely barren, and the combat left a lot to be desired. But all of that was elevated by the game's wonderful art direction, ambient music, tone, and writing. Also the Mako was a janky piece of shit that somehow managed to be fun as fuck to drive once you figured it out.

 

[Jimmy_liv]

I'm enjoying it but...are there not friendly alien races in SF like in every other Bethesda game?

I know you can only be human which is fine but I'd still expect to see aliens working on ships and I'm bars etc.
In the infinite vastness of space they've got creatures but no intelligence characters besides humans at all?

 

[DJ12]

I've seen lots of people complain about that, and I get it, but I'm not sure what the alternative is. If you want to manually fly to a planet, would it be a case of aiming at the coordinates of a planet that's too far in the distance to see, setting engines to full and waiting for it to appear? I think that expecting to fill the void of space with enough dog fights, asteroid fields and comets to make it interesting would surely get repetitive pretty quickly. People would be saying "I just want to advance the story, not fly through another asteroid field."

The game's an RPG, not a space flight simulator. People make entire games (Everspace 2 just came out) of that, but this would represent a small part of what Starfield sets out to achieve, which is to offer stories for players to immerse themselves in, it's a different game to Elite Dangerous, which is what these criticisms would seem to satisfied by, to me.

I think there's obviously an impact going on where reality is meeting expectation, it's a shame it's gone this way, but I would say that Bethesda would be able to argue their case that players are given freedom to explore, even if they're not able to fly a spaceship in the way some players want to and even if the generated surfaces can be disappointing for various reasons.

Have you seen or played elite dangerous?

That plus the RPG elements and story wouldn't be a bad start. I'd say NMS but I've not really played that.

They can dumb it down from elite ie you can warp to any system without worrying about fuel etc, but I think that would be the game they tried to sell.

 

[Salmon Snake]

Space Exploration RPGs just feel cursed at this point. It's incredible that modern games can't seem to replicate what Mass Effect 1 managed to achieve 15 years ago. And no, I'm not saying Mass Effect 1 was perfect with it's exploration. There were copy and pasted interiors, some of the planets were completely barren, and the combat left a lot to be desired. But all of that was elevated by the game's wonderful art direction, ambient music, tone, and writing. Also the Mako was a janky piece of shit that somehow managed to be fun as fuck to drive once you figured it out.

I just started my first ME1 run and the feeling is just awesome.
And that theme has been putting me to sleep many nights. Just perfect.

 

[Loope]

I'm assuming you also didn't like Red Dead Redemption 2?

I did, but that first hour oh boy.

 

[DJ12]

I really loathe the creation engine.

Upside, at least the mods will already be experts at adding content and applying fixes and optimisations to it.

It's crazy to me that people are not happy with a 87/88 score. That's very good.

We were told it was going to be the best game ever. 87 is bad. As the 10 out of 10s that this game definitely dint deserve are keeping that score higher than it should really be (Happens to all over hyped games with reviewers not daring to score it appropriately for whatever reason)

It's probs a mid 70s to low 80s game, which is good. Just not great or the system seller folks were hoping for.

 

[lefty1117]

Just not great or the system seller folks were hoping for.

Starfield hype boosted Xbox Series X sales by 1000% on Amazon

Starfield has definitely had a positive effect on Xbox Series X sales, as the console saw its sales jump up by more than 1000% on Amazon.

www.vg247.com

 

[Pelta88]

Starfield hype boosted Xbox Series X sales by 1000% on Amazon

Starfield has definitely had a positive effect on Xbox Series X sales, as the console saw its sales jump up by more than 1000% on Amazon.

www.vg247.com

This is not replicated on the other Amazon charts outside the US.

 

[Shadowstar39]

Fallout 4 shows even a bad Bethesda game can score high. But this looks better than fallout 4. It actually looks like a good game.

Why do you and others hate fallout 4? What was wrong with it? I loved it. It had all the elements of f3 but awesome modding and basebuilding. I did think the power armor suit was offered too early and easily but other than that it was fun.

Was it the optional base building? I loved that and thought it was a great addition to the game.

As for starfield, I love space games like everspace 2, freelancer, wing commander, and no man's sky. You better believe I will be getting this. I even thought about getting an Xbox s just for this but after playing elden ring and bg3 on my pc to steam link for TV play, Ill just get it on pc.

To the people itching about some barren planets.
It's space. 95% will be barren or some minible mineral. Bunch of morons.

 

[DJ12]

This is not replicated on the other Amazon charts outside the US.

Its not even replicated there.

Amazon.com Movers & Shakers: The biggest gainers in Video Games sales rank over the past 24 hours

Amazon.com Movers & Shakers: The biggest gainers in Video Games sales rank over the past 24 hours

www.amazon.com

I would put this more down to them not having any previously, and getting some for the launch.

More relevant would be if the monthly sales have increased, more than the change in 24 hours, but hey ho, as it stands, xbox series x (15th) is a couple of places above the pre-order spiderman 2 edition of PS5 (18thj. For comparison, the special edition of the starfield series x is 54th.

lefty1117 if you are happy that when someone took a screenshot it was selling way better than it previously was in that 24 hour period, then more power to you brother.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

Maybe I am in the minority but I don't base my joy of a game on how pretty NPCs are

But then again I am not a 15 year old hormone induced teen anymore either

I have a medical condition where I imagine myself fucking every NPC I lay my eyes on so this game is really screwing me over

 

[analog_future]

Space Exploration RPGs just feel cursed at this point. It's incredible that modern games can't seem to replicate what Mass Effect 1 managed to achieve 15 years ago. And no, I'm not saying Mass Effect 1 was perfect with it's exploration. There were copy and pasted interiors, some of the planets were completely barren, and the combat left a lot to be desired. But all of that was elevated by the game's wonderful art direction, ambient music, tone, and writing. Also the Mako was a janky piece of shit that somehow managed to be fun as fuck to drive once you figured it out.

Starfield is one of the best reviewed games of the year and almost everyone who's actually playing it is loving it, soooo

 

[Elder Legend]

Why do you and others hate fallout 4? What was wrong with it? I loved it. It had all the elements of f3 but awesome modding and basebuilding. I did think the power armor suit was offered too early and easily but other than that it was fun.

Was it the optional base building? I loved that and thought it was a great addition to the game.

As for starfield, I love space games like everspace 2, freelancer, wing commander, and no man's sky. You better believe I will be getting this. I even thought about getting an Xbox s just for this but after playing elden ring and bg3 on my pc to steam link for TV play, Ill just get it on pc.

To the people itching about some barren planets.
It's space. 95% will be barren or some minible mineral. Bunch of morons.

I don't know why people are hating on Fallout 4. But what I do know is that this is awesome.

 

[Lokaum D+]

Bethesda keep delivering 12/10

 

[AntiCap]

Why do you and others hate fallout 4? What was wrong with it? I loved it. It had all the elements of f3 but awesome modding and basebuilding. I did think the power armor suit was offered too early and easily but other than that it was fun.

Was it the optional base building? I loved that and thought it was a great addition to the game.

As for starfield, I love space games like everspace 2, freelancer, wing commander, and no man's sky. You better believe I will be getting this. I even thought about getting an Xbox s just for this but after playing elden ring and bg3 on my pc to steam link for TV play, Ill just get it on pc.

To the people itching about some barren planets.
It's space. 95% will be barren or some minible mineral. Bunch of morons.

Rot in Bethesda’s design philosophy.

Fallout 4 was the first Bethesda game I didn’t enjoy since Morrowind, though the writing was on the wall as early as Oblivion.

The introduction of Fast Travel and Compass Markers changes how you engage with the world as a player. Environments and points-of-interest are increasingly defined by the game’s mechanics rather than the player’s inclinations.

The longer these features were present in Bethesda games, the more their design team took them for granted in their quest design.

Criticisms of the introduction of fast-travel in Oblivion were met with responses of ‘just don’t use it then.’ It wasn’t just about the fast-travel though; it was about all the design connotations of introducing something like fast-travel.

Now we have a Bethesda game where you literally cannot play it without fast travel. It wasn’t hard to see coming. Fallout 4 for me, was simply the saturation point for this rot in design philosophy.

 

[RickMasters]

Is it really time wasted when it is time you enjoyed playing? I replay games all the time and those games that I do replay, I am certain that I'll have more fun doing it rather than some other mediocre game I have no idea of what I'm getting. Besides in the specific case you pointed out, difficulty does change things up a bit especially in the early game on NG+ Elden Ring. The latter portion being a bit more of a marginal upgrade. The game doesn't stop being enjoyable just because you finished it especially in games where gameplay is at the forefront. I would agree with you if a game is more story heavy and only if the gameplay itself isn't much of a draw.

yes I believe it is time wasted. its no small chunk of time. and there are far too many good games out there right now, coming soon or already released for anybody to go from playing a great game to a mediocre one.

I would agree with you if a game is more story heavy and only if the gameplay itself isn't much of a draw.

Yeah, i mean in the case of DS, elden ring etc, a different build will yield a slightly different gameplay experience and challenge at the mechanical level, so they get a pass to a degree. but on the otherhand...who wants to go through the nightmare and agony of trundling through the black gulch or blight town all over gain...i relished it the first time with my pyro, but I have no desire to do it all again with another class, that might prove even harder/more frustrating. I got through it once and that was enough for me. Ill just move on to something else but thats me.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

I don't know why people are hating on Fallout 4. But what I do know is that this is awesome.

It's an action game. Not proper RPG. Still a enjoyable game.

 

[Freeman76]

why would they change, they just got themselves a braindead army of fanatics after becoming first party,
who would defend anything and everything for them, do free damage control and harass reviewers, who dare to point any issues.

we are pretty much stuck with this archaic shit of an engine i'd say.
all you can hope for is bandaids on top of bandaids.

Oh the irony of this post is *chefs kiss*

 

[bender]

I just started my first ME1 run and the feeling is just awesome.

I've tried to get into the game 3 or 4 times over the years but the combat is so bad.

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

Gotta admit I’m looking forward to the standard release of this.

Me too. I have no problems with this game being a Bethesda game: ugly npc characters, crazy bugs and their weird sense of humor. Shoot it directly into my veins already.

 

[zeldaring]

Metracritic 86 now on xbox.

 

[jm89]

Metracritic 86 now on xbox.

Yeah IGN added there score to the xsx version.