By punishing the users who engage in that behavior? If they ban evade, when Valve sees that they've made multiple alt accounts linked to their original, at that time, VAC ban the primary account that's sharing. Not by punishing legit users who just shared with a friend and their friend was an idiot, downloaded something they shouldn't have or whatever. It shouldn't be possible to be VAC banned on my account from afar when someone is not even logged into my account.
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STEAM Announcements & Updates 2014 - To Next-Gen and Beyond!
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By punishing the users who engage in that behavior? If they ban evade, when Valve sees that they've made multiple alt accounts linked to their original, at that time, VAC ban the primary account that's sharing. Not by punishing legit users who just shared with a friend and their friend was an idiot, downloaded something they shouldn't have or whatever. It shouldn't be possible to be VAC banned on my account from afar when someone is not even logged into my account.
well I guess they want it so that people can't just create an account, lend themselves a game and cheat on the throwaway account
maybe you can contest the vac claims or something
actually it's only like 200 gigs of games
it's all essential, work shit and stuff. I just gotta get another tb and be done with it
yea but i just buy a cd and whatever
games being this big really makes me lose interest in aaa gaming. it's only gonna last like 10 hours anyways
I'd be more fine with losing my sharing rights, rather than getting VAC banned.
If ever there was a title I simply couldn't decide upon, it's Continue?9876543210. On one hand the idea of playing as a fail video game character about to be deleted forever is an interesting thought, on the other it's described as an "experience" game that even those who love it admit many not be something others will be able to get into even if they like Dear Esther and Gone Home and To The Moon.
I just don't know.
That calls for some Spacewar
I just don't know.
That calls for some Spacewar
toddhunter
Member
Just reading that a lot of games do use VAC these days. So yeah, would need to be careful.
jediyoshi
Member
So break it down exactly because you're not being clear, what's the threshold here? Three strikes? VAC ban the primary account that's sharing, except when it's totes an accident?
Well I did play this game about 3-4 times over because it was so damn good. Haven't touched the DLC yet. Also I heard there will be a boss rush mode. Guaranteed more playtime.
shush
waifu moba is essential
yea I'm downloading it anyways
but I fear for my future with shooters lol
What's fair about it? They're using my game, not my account. The only excuse is for someone evading bans as has been mentioned, and that's a lazy one because Valve can just VAC ban primary accounts which engage in that particular behavior.
And I don't think you can choose which games you share. It shares the entire library. So then you'd have a big red VAC ban and the entire stigma that comes with it posted on your Steam profile forever, because you let a friend play a game from your library on their account through the Family Sharing program.
If you don't think Valve can tell the difference between a real, unique, actual Steam user playing a game in your library from their account and being responsible for their actions, and someone making alt accounts to play from their own account, then you're either being dense or Valve needs to give it up.
CheesecakeRecipe
Stormy Grey
I'm probably going to buy it tomorrow after I sleep on it, will be more than glad to report my thoughts on it should I do so.
Just be warned that I eat, shit and breathe "pretentious art nongame" things like Dear Esther, Gone Home, To The Moon and Kentucky Route Zero so if you hated any of those my opinion will not be geared towards you in the slightest.
MarcoZombieCannon
Member
Being totally oblivious to the way VAC bans work... A 3 strike system:
1: Lose sharing rights for the game that was cheated in.
2: Lose sharing rights for VAC-enabled games altogether. (maybe just lose sharing rights completely)
3: VAC ban on the main account.
Seems like a bit much to jump straight to a ban, heck, it seems weird to not VAC ban both parties involved, actually. That's just me. Why let punish the lender but let the offender get away near scot-free?
1: Lose sharing rights for the game that was cheated in.
2: Lose sharing rights for VAC-enabled games altogether. (maybe just lose sharing rights completely)
3: VAC ban on the main account.
Seems like a bit much to jump straight to a ban, heck, it seems weird to not VAC ban both parties involved, actually. That's just me. Why let punish the lender but let the offender get away near scot-free?
Atraveller
Banned
I think Valve is just trying to discourage family sharing with people on the internet.
MarcoZombieCannon
Member
But I can't punch the internet like I can my buddy if he gets my account VAC banned. Maybe that's the point.
Dunno how many VAC-enabled games I have that it would happen anyway.
I'm not educated on this topic, but aren't all Steamworks enabled games also VAC-enabled?
jediyoshi
Member
So these restrictions and consequences in place, that don't tread anywhere near other platforms that have something like say, an entire console ban, is worth forsaking the entire feature of sharing because you lose the ability to specifically play some games' multiplayer's servers? And no, I don't think you're actually aware of what the implications of what you're looking for are if you think there's a simple, technical metric to make a distinction between throwing alt accounts together or not. You're not even answering my threshold question, the actual solution you've come up with is the very thing you're already against with Valve's only out going simply by the word of the users already involved.
Not all of them. VAC, like CEG ("Steam DRM"), is optional.
I dunno why family sharing has to be like this in general tbh
like, lending individual games would've been so much better. just limit the max number of games to like 5 or something
Looking at the Amazon Editor's Choice games, I notice the XCOM collection went from a cheap price to it's standard $59.99 USD price. Great "savings" and deals there.
As long as you give them a chance and are fair and honest about your thoughts, I expect no problem even if I disagree with them. Always good to see another opinion I believe, if nothing else it might help me consider something I wouldn't have otherwise.
So I look forward to your thoughts.
As long as you give them a chance and are fair and honest about your thoughts, I expect no problem even if I disagree with them. Always good to see another opinion I believe, if nothing else it might help me consider something I wouldn't have otherwise.
So I look forward to your thoughts.
I'm waiting on the Ace Patrol Pack to hit $5.99 so I can buy five copies to give away. I've no personal need for the credit.
Wait so the lender takes the hit while the borrowing hacker doesn't get a strike? Surely they'll amend that if it's the case because that is just silly.
Too bad the online is dead
Pretty much. I think it would be fairer if instead of VAC banning the lender that they VAC banned the borrower and merely banned the lender from any future lending.
jediyoshi
Member
Looks like CSGO broke 100k for the first time yesterday.
So many crates.
Sale isn't live yet.
Atraveller
Banned
Probably just steamworks FPS games.
MarcoZombieCannon
Member
I'm not sure what the language is, but currently they will VAC ban you, for example, if a family-sharer does something ban-worthy in one of your games. They did it, but since they were authorized by you, while playing one of your games, you get the hit.
Looks like CSGO broke 100k for the first time yesterday.
So many crates.
Sale isn't live yet.
During the sale my mate got enhanced steam for the first time and we started looking at stats because what is life without stats? I wasn't sure I believed that CSGO hadn't topped 100k before, Dark Souls is another it says peaked at 10k that I wasn't so sure about and the main reason I didn't really trust it was that it said that Skyrim's historical peak was <100k when I know it was the previous record holder before Dota at >200k... Wonder when the stats started getting recorded.
I'm more poking fun at the fact Amazon sent me an email telling me about various sales for digital games, with the XCOM collection being one of them, yet when I go it's at the full price.
Not in the email of savings was XCOM Classics Pack [Online Steam Code] and XCOM: Enemy Unknown , which if bought together are cheaper than The XCOM Collection currently.
Oh those do look fun. Ill have to add them to my wishlist for an eventual buy.
thesaucetastic
Unconfirmed Member
I picked Nightmare for both I&II and I'm intending to do the same for Oath. RIP bumping, you were kinda cool but also somewhat annoying
What's the size?
CheesecakeRecipe
Stormy Grey
24GB
I remember it being like 18GB on ps3, so much more data! Now have to wait for that inevitable 10 pricetag at the next sale.
Pity that the Steam version doesn't have the original PC-88/X68k music, PSP port has all three.
The stats are from Steamcharts.com which only started tracking July 2012. So Skyrim had already had its peak about half a year before that.
Dark Souls is a bit weird one. For some reason the tracking starts from September 2012, when the game was released in August. But it's absolutely fantastic to see that the active player base is now HIGHER than it was few weeks after release.
toddhunter
Member
I think it is fair in the context of family sharing, where you can pick which games are available.
I can see your point of view if you are using this for friends, but I don't believe that is Valve's intent.
I would agree.
probably old news but the holidays groupees bundle is down to 1 game only needed and they added doctor who episode 5 to it
List may not be up to date: Games that support VAC
Only applies when connecting to a VAC secured server, cheats running in single player or non VAC servers are unaffected.
Just noticed Dark Messiah of Might and Magic is on there, on my wishlist but never hit 75% during the sale
Only applies when connecting to a VAC secured server, cheats running in single player or non VAC servers are unaffected.
Just noticed Dark Messiah of Might and Magic is on there, on my wishlist but never hit 75% during the sale
1) Show me a console where you can play someone's games from 1,000 miles away, not using their console or their account, and get their entire console banned. 'Til then whatever comparison you're making is irrelevant. Even if you could this is still a fallacy, or we could just write off anything bad that happened ever as "not treading anywhere near the Holocaust".
2) Yes, Valve can tell the difference between unique Steam users and alt accounts. How do you think they track statistics for unique Steam users/accounts, and don't just count every account ever made? How do you think they punished people who abused coal and TF2 idling on alt accounts?
3) I don't need to give a solution or threshold because the solution is already inherent and apparent in #2; Valve's ability to identify unique users and alt accounts. That's not really something up for discussion. Whether they want to put forth the effort in doing so, or just ban the primary account anyway "just in case", is still fair game.
4) A VAC ban isn't just being banned from playing a game, it's also this posted on your Steam profile forever:
Branding you as a cheater for the rest of your Steam life, because you let someone else play a game remotely through their Family Sharing program. That has consequences; friends who remove you, groups who remove you, and a great many people who don't want to play any game ever with someone who has this on their profile because they think they're a cheater.
So yes, it's pretty important for Valve to make sure they're marking the correct individual before they do it.
CheesecakeRecipe
Stormy Grey
Jørdan;95812015 said:
Also worth reminding that VAC bans are on a per-engine basis. So should your dumbshit friend/cousin/cat-rabbit hybrid earn a VAC ban while playing Black Ops 2, rest assured you are still well within your rights to load up on a VAC Protected server in Revelations 2012.
Not saying it's fair, just sayin'. At the moment it probably only has checks to look for whose license key is about to get revoked and not which account is playing using said license. Could be an easy enough change, but who knows if Valve would want to bother.
I thought it was universal, that's pretty stupid if it's by engine.
Edit: Pay no attention to this post, I'm a silly old bear.
Maybe there'll be something else on the sale I'm interested in? But if these don't stack i guess it's not that great of a deal / sale anyways.
Edit: Pay no attention to this post, I'm a silly old bear.
Crap, I just bought Sly Cooper for PS3. oh well, I only continued because:
- Add all productsdescribed in the promotional offer message to your Shopping Cart one of two ways:
- Via the Add both to Cart button in the promotion description, OR
- Via the Add to Shopping Cart button on each respective product information page.
- The benefit for this promotion will not be reflected on the final order checkout page. The merchant will apply any benefit after your order has been processed.
Maybe there'll be something else on the sale I'm interested in? But if these don't stack i guess it's not that great of a deal / sale anyways.
Edit: Pay no attention to this post, I'm a silly old bear.
Yeah, I haven't even allowed anyone to share games yet. (And I have family that uses steam on their own accounts...)
Wok
Member
By request:
Don't Take This If You Already Own Toki Tori 2 Plus -- The Two Tribes Bundle (28 entrants)
Too Many Puppies / With Guns In Their Hands -- Humble Weekly: Puppy Games (6 entrants)
Co-Op With One of MakeshiftChef's Kids -- Foul Play (7 entrants) CSD would have been a MUCH better choice. I wish I had been clever enough to go with that instead of referencing this post.
The Doctor Wore One -- FEZ (5 entrants) correctly guessed by LuffyZoro
Like 30 Lightning Strikes -- 1000 Amps (5 entrants)
R.I.P. Hamilton Camp -- Ducktales (20 entrants) correctly guessed by Wok, which impressed me. I would not have expected someone who presumably grew up watching the show dubbed in French to get this one since Hamilton Camp was the English voice of Gizmoduck.
You Can't Be A Wizard, Only A Magic-User -- Dungeons & Dragons: Chronicles of Mystara (13 entrants)
Be! Aggressive! B-E Aggressive! -- Humble Weekly: Cipher Prime (6 entrants)
Easy...But Not Necessarily Easy (ba-BUMP BUMP) -- Ys I & II Chronicles (5 entrants)
This Year You Overlooked An Excellent Puzzler; Remedy That Mistake -- Tetrobot & Co. (14 entrants) correctly guessed by Wok, who up until this sale was the only person on my friends list that owned it.
Eat Something, You Skinny Little Weirdo -- Don't Starve (20 entrants) correctly guessed by Mr. Poolman
A Rougelike -- Papers, Please (42 entrants) correctly guessed by toddhunter
Search Query: "Tellaerin". Did You Mean: Tel'Arin | Tel'Elerin -- Dungeons & Dragons: Chronicles of Mystara (6 entrants) I MISTYPED TEL'ELERON and couldn't do anything about it! AUGH
Chocoholics, Beware -- Long Live the Queen (5 entrants) Unfortunately, Caerith won this one...and obviously he already owns the game, so he ended up thanking me, turning down the gift and now I gotta give it away again. The funny thing about this is that I considered using the hint "Caerith Would Approve", but since so many others bought it and were singing its praises during the sale I thought more people would guess this.
The following weren't hints at all, but there's no other way to pass any kind of message through ModBot anonymously.
You Can Re-Gift Any Of These Games, I Don't Mind (8 entrants) -- Humble Weekly: Daedalic Bundle
None Of These Games Are Bad Rats (5 entrants) -- Humble Weekly: Team 17
Please Don't Clog Up The Thread With Thank You Posts (19 entrants) -- Rogue Legacy
Since it was difficult to tell which games are which, I wanted to make sure people knew it was okay to pass the gift along if they got something they knew they didn't want or already hadand that no, none of the games were Bad Rats.
Thanks for playing and thanks for being good sports, everyone.
Thanks for doing this! I like guessing.
Wok
Member
I have talked with one of the two devs during a conference, and this is exactly what they have done.
Edit: Oops, double post, sorry.
jediyoshi
Member
1) Show me a console where you can play someone's games from 1,000 miles away, not using their console or their account, and get their entire console banned. 'Til then whatever comparison you're making is irrelevant. Even if you could this is still a fallacy, or we could just write off anything bad that happened ever as "not treading anywhere near the Holocaust".
2) Yes, Valve can tell the difference between unique Steam users and alt accounts. How do you think they track statistics for unique Steam users/accounts, and don't just count every account ever made? How do you think they punished people who abused coal and TF2 idling on alt accounts?
3) I don't need to give a solution or threshold because the solution is already inherent and apparent in #2; Valve's ability to identify unique users and alt accounts. That's not really something up for discussion. Whether they want to put forth the effort in doing so, or just ban the primary account anyway "just in case", is still fair game.
4) A VAC ban isn't just being banned from playing a game, it's also this posted on your Steam profile forever:
Branding you as a cheater for the rest of your Steam life, because you let someone else play a game remotely through their Family Sharing program. That has consequences; friends who remove you, groups who remove you, and a great many people who don't want to play any game ever with someone who has their on their profile because they think they're a cheater.
So yes, it's pretty important for Valve to make sure they're marking the correct individual before they do it.
1) Not using their account? Are we still talking about Steam? Assuming it was shared remotely, does not implicating another account involve explicitly handing out those account details so they could complete the share process?
2) Again, you're not being specific here. Obviously Valve is able to monitor their own system, but to what extent is something a "Steam user" and when is it an "alt account"? They tracked those people by looking at very specific, tangible patterns. What are those patterns in terms of making throw away accounts? Accounts that own a few games in their account versus none?
3) You don't think it's reasonable to give a sensible rationale behind your logic when the things you're proposing make the system worse across the entire board as a result? Your solution instead of the current is either dropping sharing altogether or further forsaking the integrity of online matches by letting people who are already hacking assuredly get away just a few more times before they're cut off. You don't see there being a net negative in terms of how people are served when larger amounts of people are affected in the actual game itself?
4) Is it more or less important than users who should be aware of consequences when opening their accounts to sharing?
What's LLTQ?
Long Live The Queen.
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