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Team Fortress 2 Official PC Thread. SO. WORTH. IT.
- Thread starter saelz8
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ThaiGrocer
Member
That's a relatively low ratio of stalemates, don't you think? Valve has cracked the code!
Teknopathetic
Member
"Aw, demoman doesn't really top any of the good lists.. 
"
Gimped classes usually won't!
"Gimped classes usually won't!
Demoman really only has 7 less kills per hour than the soldier. And considering he's a great last resort with his stickies on the CP and by far the best, you know, demoman (Destroying equipment); I'd say that's a pretty good balance job. He's also quit a bit faster than soldier/heavy.
Speaking of non-nerfed demoman, that really was the definition of "win button."
Speaking of non-nerfed demoman, that really was the definition of "win button."
the most telling stat to me is 2.1% of people having "With Friends Like These" as an achievement. Valve should change it!
edit: the huge gap in damage dealt with rocket launcher vs the #2 weapon is probably due to crits, I assume. not that I will complain about rocket crits again, since I'd rather they just rework the whole crit system, but that's the only reason I can think for it having such a big gap in damage dealt. I've been playing soldier more lately and it feels like when you're really rolling with it, the crit rocket is just salt in the wound. though I do think it sucks that a crit rocket can take a noob soldier and make them, well... godly.
edit: the huge gap in damage dealt with rocket launcher vs the #2 weapon is probably due to crits, I assume. not that I will complain about rocket crits again, since I'd rather they just rework the whole crit system, but that's the only reason I can think for it having such a big gap in damage dealt. I've been playing soldier more lately and it feels like when you're really rolling with it, the crit rocket is just salt in the wound. though I do think it sucks that a crit rocket can take a noob soldier and make them, well... godly.
Interesting to see the crit for each weapon. Rocket crits must stick out because you can actually see those.
Surprised most of the deaths at Gravel Pit C occur at the tower. I always thought most deaths occurred trying to get to the tower.
Cp_Well is pretty funny. Despite being a mirror map, Red has a bit of a slaughterhouse in their spawn room, but the Blue team is almost untouched.
Surprised most of the deaths at Gravel Pit C occur at the tower. I always thought most deaths occurred trying to get to the tower.
Cp_Well is pretty funny. Despite being a mirror map, Red has a bit of a slaughterhouse in their spawn room, but the Blue team is almost untouched.
soldier is 3rd in the total of people playing classes, so I just assume the big damage gap comes from rockets having capable range, and/or the big splash damage of rockets since that would boost it up over most of the other weapons.
edit: captures/hour surprises me, too, but then again it probably comes from scout rushes on well and granary.
edit: captures/hour surprises me, too, but then again it probably comes from scout rushes on well and granary.
the grenade launcher also doesn't fluctuate much in damage/hit compared to the rocket launcher, though. I'm just wondering why there is such a huge gap in rocket damage vs everything else for total damage when most servers I play on aren't exactly flooded with soldiers.
so the only explanations I can come up with are:
1) crit rockets do a lot more damage/hit, so it could be jacking up the total (especially after victories when everyone runs around gibbing the losing team)
2) rockets have a pretty big splash, so they can get more total damage when aimed properly even if it's not a direct hit
3) all the soldiers helping build up medic ubers drastically increase the total damage dealt (just thought of this! and it probably makes the most sense)
so the only explanations I can come up with are:
1) crit rockets do a lot more damage/hit, so it could be jacking up the total (especially after victories when everyone runs around gibbing the losing team)
2) rockets have a pretty big splash, so they can get more total damage when aimed properly even if it's not a direct hit
3) all the soldiers helping build up medic ubers drastically increase the total damage dealt (just thought of this! and it probably makes the most sense)
Teknopathetic
Member
"1) crit rockets do a lot more damage/hit, so it could be jacking up the total (especially after victories when everyone runs around gibbing the losing team)
2) rockets have a pretty big splash, so they can get more total damage when aimed properly even if it's not a direct hit"
These 2.
2) rockets have a pretty big splash, so they can get more total damage when aimed properly even if it's not a direct hit"
These 2.
Ah yeah, I wonder if self-injury is included.
Point 1 is contradicted by the chart showing actual per-hit averages, and Point 2 in a "low per-hit but more consistent" way probably wouldn't account for the large disparity on its own... unless engineer builds are included.
EDIT: Yeah, when you include self-injury and sentry damage, the disparity makes a LOT more sense.
Point 1 is contradicted by the chart showing actual per-hit averages, and Point 2 in a "low per-hit but more consistent" way probably wouldn't account for the large disparity on its own... unless engineer builds are included.
EDIT: Yeah, when you include self-injury and sentry damage, the disparity makes a LOT more sense.
wow, I can't believe I forgot sentries. and I was even thinking "if it doesn't count sentry kills, that explains the low kill ratio for engineers" since a lot of maps have at least one decent turtle spot to get some kills with a sentry.
so I'm guessing self damage + sentries is why the rocket launcher has so much more damage listed. the average damage I can see being so low since rockets have a huge disparity in damage based upon all the other stuff we've talked about in this thread (range, direct hit vs splash, etc.).
so I'm guessing self damage + sentries is why the rocket launcher has so much more damage listed. the average damage I can see being so low since rockets have a huge disparity in damage based upon all the other stuff we've talked about in this thread (range, direct hit vs splash, etc.).
Second Edit: I was right the 1st time. You guys aren't talking about hit damage per shot (cause demo is greater than both.)
Soldier and Heavy are identical in REAL damage percentage. Soldier total playtime of 15 percent divided by Heavy total playtime of 8.5 percent = 1.76. The 12.1 percent of total damage of the minigun * 1.76 = 21.3. Which is basically identical to the total damage percent of the rocket.
Soldier and Heavy are identical in REAL damage percentage. Soldier total playtime of 15 percent divided by Heavy total playtime of 8.5 percent = 1.76. The 12.1 percent of total damage of the minigun * 1.76 = 21.3. Which is basically identical to the total damage percent of the rocket.
The difference between a short and long range rocket hit is not that large, and splash damage is a falloff effect. At any rate, direct hits normally aren't lethal on their own, which is why shot and prefire accuracy on successive hits are so important given the 4 rocket clip.
EDIT: 1-D, firex is looking at the total damage graph; I brought up the per-hit graph.
EDIT: 1-D, firex is looking at the total damage graph; I brought up the per-hit graph.
The damage/hit chart makes a lot of sense to me, just going by all the time I've logged into tf2. the knife is obviously high because it can do up to 450 damage and frequently does 100+ damage multiple times when a spy is really successful with backstabs. the sniper is a no-brainer too, with all the crit headshots/fully charged shots that kill virtually anything. the flamethrower does low damage/hit (plus not enough pyros close in even closer when they're burning someone) but racks up a ton of hits really fast. The minigun hovering between 10-15 damage/hit makes sense, too, because that's almost literally the amount of damage I've taken from it when I was able to test just a single bullet (not really test, I was just playing scout against a really crappy heavy who couldn't aim that well).
I was just trying to think of why rockets have such a huge gap over all the other weapons in the total damage chart. and what I think it is now is all the self-damage from soldiers helping medics building up uber. blowing up sentries helps too, but then stickies would probably be higher as well on the total damage chart. Especially since lately I swear I see 3-4 demomen on each team on nearly every server I play except the GAF one.
I was just trying to think of why rockets have such a huge gap over all the other weapons in the total damage chart. and what I think it is now is all the self-damage from soldiers helping medics building up uber. blowing up sentries helps too, but then stickies would probably be higher as well on the total damage chart. Especially since lately I swear I see 3-4 demomen on each team on nearly every server I play except the GAF one.
Firex: am I on your ignore list? The soldier rocket and heavy minigun have identical percentages on a 1:1 basis. For every hour 1 soldier and 1 heavy play, their damage percentage is equal.
Soldier and heavy should be the top two since they're the most offensive classes. And the only difference between the two is that soldier is a more popular class (Probably since you can play effectively without a medic.)
The soldier rocket and heavy minigun have identical percentages on a 1:1 basis. For every hour 1 soldier and 1 heavy play, their damage percentage is equal.Soldier and heavy should be the top two since they're the most offensive classes. And the only difference between the two is that soldier is a more popular class (Probably since you can play effectively without a medic.)
nah, I know you averaged it out so they do the same real damage. I was just shocked at the huge gap between the rocket launcher and the next biggest gun on the total damage list. it makes it look like either the rocket launcher is really overpowered (when it isn't) or way more people play soldier than anything else (and they don't according to that list of most played classes). I'd really say neither soldier/heavy are a pure offensive class, which is why they average out so much on damage dealt. since they both can play offense/defense equally well they should make up the bulk of the damage dealt.
It still kinda blows my mind, because it's not like I see that many rocket kills when I play tf2 anymore. At least not so many that there would be that big of a gap between the rocket launcher and the minigun if we were looking at damage dealt. that's why I think the self-damage to build up uber has to influence some of the total damage dealt. Although it could also be that the most effective way to play a heavy is to close in on people and then fire away with the minigun, so your shots don't miss, while if you can predict where someone is moving with the rocket launcher you can get them from further away. It's probably just a case of the visual of the chart not really correlating to the reality of the numbers, though.
It still kinda blows my mind, because it's not like I see that many rocket kills when I play tf2 anymore. At least not so many that there would be that big of a gap between the rocket launcher and the minigun if we were looking at damage dealt. that's why I think the self-damage to build up uber has to influence some of the total damage dealt. Although it could also be that the most effective way to play a heavy is to close in on people and then fire away with the minigun, so your shots don't miss, while if you can predict where someone is moving with the rocket launcher you can get them from further away. It's probably just a case of the visual of the chart not really correlating to the reality of the numbers, though.
No_Style said:Sorry about the AFK there on Central, Icy. Work called the BlackBerry.
Nobody plays on Central. Dare I say you could effectively get rid of it?
well its full now. I have Central paid for until Dec. 25th. It gets most of its play on the weekends. I just renew east for another month.. and just got a nice generious $50.00 christmas donation from an unnamed source ;-)
Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
Doytch said:
Ah, TF2 for the DS. A great choice!
Nice games tonight, especially that REALLY brutal dustbowl section 2 defense. There was a lot more vocal team coordination tonight, which is always good to see.
Some schmuck came along and was belting out some "My teams are full of f*gs" BS. He got kicked and came back silent. :lol
Some schmuck came along and was belting out some "My teams are full of f*gs" BS. He got kicked and came back silent. :lol
Zaraki_Kenpachi
Member
"Nobody plays on Central. Dare I say you could effectively get rid of it?"
I don't know about that. It seems no one wants to try and get something started but once it does it builds pretty quickly. Everytime it's just me and icy goofing around in central in a reasonable amount of time we start getting a full server and some pretty nice matches going.
I don't know about that. It seems no one wants to try and get something started but once it does it builds pretty quickly. Everytime it's just me and icy goofing around in central in a reasonable amount of time we start getting a full server and some pretty nice matches going.
He left not long after along with half of the other team, and I can't really blame them. It was incredibly stacked and the next map was even worse. I took this immediately after I finally decided to switch teams...Davidion said:
DISCLAIMER: Blue was scout rushing a lot previously.
Felt I had enough when my connection dropped again not long after. :/
EDIT: Oh yeah, thanks for the help, Archie and Storyteller.
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