• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

The Legend of Korra: Book 4 |OT2| ALL HAIL THE GREAT UNITER

Status
Not open for further replies.
T

That Dude John

Member
FeenixRising said:
I can unite my taste in good Kuvira shipping fan art.

#ThankYouBasedOwler
Click to expand...

A lot of uniting goin' on in that art

ez6DGzF.png
 
D

Daemul

Member
B

BKatastrophe

Member
Icyflamez96 said:
Man people keep saying this and I say this every single time

Teamwork would take him down. No one is too OP for some creative coordination. That's what I wanted to see in the finale. Team Avatar coming up with a plan.

I don't know if people always think i'm joking when I say that, but whenever I say that it seems to be glossed over.
Click to expand...

I 100% agree with you, but they had the Krew working in places all around the city. Mako and Korra were all there was to specifically go at Amon. Even if we increase the group, though, we see Amon is strong enough to take down groups, and based on his psychic bloodbending, he wouldn't exactly be easily restrained. But assuming everything played out in a similar way to the ending, I still think it'd be a rather underwhelming fight. Pretty much every season takes the same concept and just does it better.

-Book 2 has Mako, Bolin, and Korra all working together to keep Unalaq and Vaatu separated and when that fails, they protect Korra's body along with Tenzin, Eska, Desna, Kya, and Bumi.
-Book 3 has a team fight vs. the Red Lotus.
-Book 4 has everyone cooperating to take out the Colossus.

Each of those takes the cooperation angle and just does it better. Air is so underwhelming by comparison. Also, while it is true that a good villain doesn't need to be physically powerful, in this type of series that genuinely needs to be the case. The villain needs to present a real threat and there has to be some sort of "final boss" so to speak. Even if it was the villain's henchman as opposed to the villain himself (a trope referred to as "The Dragon"), there still needs to be something there. While Amon does present a huge threat, his Lieutenant is garbage and gets bodied frequently, so it doesn't fix the issue there either.

It's the entire foundation of an action series: fights. If you can't end with that promise in mind, then you've failed. I'm sorry if that seems douchey or pompous, but that's the way I see it.

I genuinely believe (and I'm probably one of the few) that Air's critical flaw is also one of its greatest strengths, and that is Amon. It's all subjective of course, but that's the way I see it.
 
I

Icyflamez96

Member
BKatastrophe said:
I 100% agree with you, but they had the Krew working in places all around the city. Mako and Korra were all there was to specifically go at Amon. Even if we increase the group, though, we see Amon is strong enough to take down groups, and based on his psychic bloodbending, he wouldn't exactly be easily restrained. But assuming everything played out in a similar way to the ending, I still think it'd be a rather underwhelming fight. Pretty much every season takes the same concept and just does it better.

I genuinely believe (and I'm probably one of the few) that Air's critical flaw is also one of its greatest strengths, and that is Amon. It's all subjective of course, but that's the way I see it.
Click to expand...

You don't 100% agree with me if you're still saying these things though.

First off, Grouping up and trying to crowd a bloodbender isn't much of a plan. (Of course things would have to be done differently so that they already know he can bloodbend prior to coming up with a plan)

A general philosophy could be to have a person(s) try to fight him in his bloodbending range, and have others outside of that range so that if the closer people get caught in the trap, the others can break them out of it. Of course this may not be a viable strategy in a building without much space, but things definitely could have been set up different in general to make a good fight against him.

I genuinely believe (and I'm probably one of the few) that Air's critical flaw is also one of its greatest strengths, and that is Amon. It's all subjective of course, but that's the way I see it

If you're saying that to mean that Amon is too OP for a 1v1 battle, then sure. With a bit of creativity and imagination, there definitely could have been a awesome team avatar vs Amon battle...
 
J

JadedWriter

Member
Icyflamez96 said:
You don't 100% agree with me if you're still saying these things though.

First off, Grouping up and trying to crowd a bloodbender isn't much of a plan. (Of course things would have to be done differently so that they already know he can bloodbend prior to coming up with a plan)

A general philosophy could be to have a person(s) try to fight him in his bloodbending range, and have others outside of that range so that if the closer people get caught in the trap, the others can break them out of it. Of course this may not be a viable strategy in a building without much space, but things definitely could have been set up different in general to make a good fight against him.

I genuinely believe (and I'm probably one of the few) that Air's critical flaw is also one of its greatest strengths, and that is Amon. It's all subjective of course, but that's the way I see it

If you're saying that to mean that Amon is too OP for a 1v1 battle, then sure. With a bit of creativity and imagination, there definitely could have been a awesome team avatar vs Amon battle...
Click to expand...
It's evidenced in that flashback that a bloodbender can immobilize an entire courtroom full of people if he wanted to. So how big of a group do you actually need to gang up on Amon. Two platoons? That's a lot of bodies to bring down the guy. You pretty much need to artillery strike the guy from a safe distance.
 
I

Icyflamez96

Member
JadedWriter said:
It's evidenced in that flashback that a bloodbender can immobilize an entire courtroom full of people if he wanted to. So how big of a group do you actually need to gang up on Amon. Two platoons? That's a lot of bodies to bring down the guy. You pretty much need to artillery strike the guy from a safe distance.
Click to expand...

I thought I made it clear that, regardless of the size of the group, crowding a blood bender isn't a good idea? Team Avatar plus maybe like 1 person should be enough. 2 people in his bloodbending range, and 2 people out of his bloodbending range.
 
B

BKatastrophe

Member
Icyflamez96 said:
You don't 100% agree with me if you're still saying these things though.

First off, Grouping up and trying to crowd a bloodbender isn't much of a plan. (Of course things would have to be done differently so that they already know he can bloodbend prior to coming up with a plan)

A general philosophy could be to have a person(s) try to fight him in his bloodbending range, and have others outside of that range so that if the closer people get caught in the trap, the others can break them out of it. Of course this may not be a viable strategy in a building without much space, but things definitely could have been set up different in general to make a good fight against him.

I genuinely believe (and I'm probably one of the few) that Air's critical flaw is also one of its greatest strengths, and that is Amon. It's all subjective of course, but that's the way I see it

If you're saying that to mean that Amon is too OP for a 1v1 battle, then sure. With a bit of creativity and imagination, there definitely could have been a awesome team avatar vs Amon battle...
Click to expand...
I agree in the sense that a creative group battle is an ideal that I can definitely adhere to. Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood's final fight is a perfect example of that. Same with Soul Eater and various other shonen battle anime.

I don't think, however, that it works as well in the Avatarverse because the power sets aren't as diverse, especially amongst the main cast. Plus his bloodbending range is still huge (which you pointed out). We see Yakone solo an entire courthouse. Let's assume Amon's range is, at it's bare minimum, the same (since it's implied that Amon is in fact stronger than Yakone). They would have to be fighting in a massive room. Hit and run tactics in the pro-bending arena would be cool for awhile, but it'd be repetitive real quick. You could have Amon run and hide, but then we end up with the scenario we already got.

Plus, what would you have them do to finish this fight? Kill Amon? They'd have to, because restraining him would be impossible unless Korra also removed his bending, which means she'd have to achieve Avatar State during her final battle. Let's assume killing is out of the question, and Korra achieving her AS would seem unlikely if she fought a group battle (since the fight would lack that overwhelming danger that it has now). So you basically have the group confronting Amon and pushing him out of a window to deface him. Just like what we have now.

The way I see it, it's still a boring fight, even if it is more entertaining. In fact, it's barely a fight. I think Amon is fundamentally broken in that way. There's just no way to give him an interesting fight within the bounds of the Avatarverse.
 
I

Icyflamez96

Member
BKatastrophe said:
I agree in the sense that a creative group battle is an ideal that I can definitely adhere to. Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood's final fight is a perfect example of that. Same with Soul Eater and various other shonen battle anime.

I don't think, however, that it works as well in the Avatarverse because the power sets aren't as diverse, especially amongst the main cast. Plus his bloodbending range is still huge (which you pointed out). We see Yakone solo an entire courthouse. Let's assume Amon's range is, at it's bare minimum, the same (since it's implied that Amon is in fact stronger than Yakone). They would have to be fighting in a massive room. Hit and run tactics in the pro-bending arena would be cool for awhile, but it'd be repetitive real quick. You could have Amon run and hide, but then we end up with the scenario we already got.

Plus, what would you have them do to finish this fight? Kill Amon? They'd have to, because restraining him would be impossible unless Korra also removed his bending, which means she'd have to achieve Avatar State during her final battle. Let's assume killing is out of the question, and Korra achieving her AS would seem unlikely if she fought a group battle (since the fight would lack that overwhelming danger that it has now). So you basically have the group confronting Amon and pushing him out of a window to deface him. Just like what we have now.

The way I see it, it's still a boring fight, even if it is more entertaining. In fact, it's barely a fight. I think Amon is fundamentally broken in that way. There's just no way to give him an interesting fight within the bounds of the Avatarverse.
Click to expand...


I don't think, however, that it works as well in the Avatarverse because the power sets aren't as diverse, especially amongst the main cast.


They don't need to be diverse. All they need to do is shoot him with some stuff from a distance if he starts bloodbending.

Eventually he'd figure out the bloodbending is useless and he'd try to take them out with traditional waterbending, then there'd be some cool choreography, he might try to run to closed off places, bolin shoots up some walls to make sure he can't, then bam. They beat him up enough to tire him for a a few seconds and korra busts in with that rope action to tie up his hands/arms in a way he cant bloodbend. DONEEEEEEE

Not saying that's the best way to handle it, but eh. I personally think some creativity and clever writing can always overcome these types of problems.

In my opinion, something like that could make one of the most interesting fights in the whole series since it would actually use strategy and creativity.
 
B

BKatastrophe

Member
Icyflamez96 said:
I don't think, however, that it works as well in the Avatarverse because the power sets aren't as diverse, especially amongst the main cast.


They don't need to be diverse. All they need to do is shoot him with some stuff from a distance if he starts bloodbending.

Eventually he'd figure out the bloodbending is useless and he'd try to take them out with traditional waterbending, then there'd be some cool choreography, he might try to run to closed off places, bolin shoots up some walls to make sure he can't, then bam. They beat him up enough to tire him for a a few seconds and korra busts in with that rope action to tie up his hands/arms in a way he cant bloodbend. DONEEEEEEE

Not saying that's the best way to handle it, but eh. I personally think some creativity and clever writing can always overcome these types of problems.

In my opinion, something like that could make one of the most interesting fights in the whole series since it would actually use strategy and creativity.
Click to expand...

He has psychic bloodbending. He doesn't need to move his body as a traditional bending form. That's an important point within the story and exactly why this whole idea does not work. Tying him up does not work. Restraining him does not work.

He has no reason to traditionally waterbend when he can solo groups of people without lifting a finger. The only reason Tarrlok fought Korra that way was because he was trying to hide his bloodbending, and he didn't master the psychic bloodbending technique, so he had to use his actual body.

Amon is broken at a fundamental level. Amon himself would have to be changed in order for this issue to not exist.
 
B

BKatastrophe

Member
There is only one other way I can think of that can change Amon, but still keep him the same.

Making him a normal human that can use energybending. That's legitimately the only way that I can think of.
 
I

Icyflamez96

Member
BKatastrophe said:
He has no reason to traditionally waterbend when he can solo groups of people without lifting a finger. The only reason Tarrlok fought Korra that way was because he was trying to hide his bloodbending, and he didn't master the psychic bloodbending technique, so he had to use his actual body..
Click to expand...

My point was he'd figure out that trying to bolodbend the two people closer to him would be pointless if the 2 further people will always interrupt it. That's when he'd resort to waterbending for some cool choreography.
 
I

Icyflamez96

Member
BKatastrophe said:
There is only one other way I can think of that can change Amon, but still keep him the same.

Making him a normal human that can use energybending. That's legitimately the only way that I can think of.
Click to expand...

Honestly him being a bloodbender without ridiculous Yakone range and the "psychicness" would be fine tbh, at least for what i'm proposing.

Even then though, I always feel like there's a way to use creative/clever writing to overcome these scenarios. There are so many things I've watched where I think "Oh there's literally no way they could pull this off" and then they end up pulling it off in a creative way. That is kinda what I expect from good writing. Even if I can't personally come up with a solution, good writing makes it possible.
 
I

Infinite Justice

Member
BKatastrophe said:
There is only one other way I can think of that can change Amon, but still keep him the same.

Making him a normal human that can use energybending. That's legitimately the only way that I can think of.
Click to expand...

or not give him fucking bloodbending at all (he could still a water bender or whatever)?

or just chi blocking plus technology and water bending principles (make the bending removal procedure also a mixture of those).
 
I

Icyflamez96

Member
Infinite Justice said:
or not give him fucking bloodbending at all (he could still a water bender or whatever)?).
Click to expand...

Oh I thought you had a problem with him being a bender in general (since you said when that was revealed, his character arc started to fall)

Because if you're fine with him being a bender, I'd think you wouldn't have a problem with him being a bloodbender considering that would make the most sense IMO for why he can take away bending
 
H

Hamlet

Member
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Witcher 4 Dev talks about Ciri fan reaction: "Ciri is called a witcher in books", "we're not suddenly making up stuff just because we want to", etc
News Game Dev 2 3 4
177
9K
Gonzito replied
Intergalactic: The Heretic Prophet – Jordan’s Looks are expected, and we’re happy about it
Social Opinion Drama 2 3 4 5 6
250
15K
ChorizoPicozo replied
Ridley Scott interview - sharks in the colosseum, Maximus returning from the afterlife to kill Jesus Christ, asleep at the wheel for Prometheus
45
3K
dem replied
GAF Museum - The Greatest OTs of All Time (or at least, some of the great ones)
|OT|
4
2K
Komatsu replied
Horizon Forbidden West: Evolving Aloy (new character model and visual updates)
5 6 7 8 9
419
64K
Gameplaylover replied
Top Bottom