poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
They kind of mention that they travel to where the food is, berries in the summer, snails in the winter I guess.
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AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
But screw you if you walk slow. How I feel about my kids on vacation.
Hardensoul
Member
Uh! That’s a no for me! Cate Blanchett still looks good! IMO
Come On Tars
Member
Never thought much of her until Don't look up.Love her as an actress and think she’s very pretty even though not really my type. For some reason I find her super sexy as godess of death though.
Something about her with dark hair…
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
What is the purpose of the caravan they are dragging behind them? It’s not like they are bringing food with them based on what we saw is in the caravan. Also, how long have they walked for so far? It seems weeks but only a few days seem to have passed in Numenor and in the Southlands.
Thats the gist of what I gathered, since they were bemoaning the lack of forage in the forest when they were gathering fungus. I'm assuming they are based off someones poorly researched idea of what and why a tribe stays nomadic.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
Btw, remember how people were going on about how they got a writer who wrote 5 episodes of Breaking Bad? I told you mofos that it wouldn’t matter. It’s the show runners who dictate the quality of the show.
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
Her husband is one lucky sonuvabitch.
Dang he's ugly! He better NEVER forget how lucky he is!
ManaByte
Gold Member
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
Him too! Gal is daggone gorgeous!
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
That bloke ain’t ugly at all.
sol_bad
Member
Spoiler tag it if you want but what have they thrown out so far?
Alex11
Member
Ok, so one of the reasons I was hyped when I first saw the teaser for this show was the whole Sauron in his fair form, when he was trying to manipulate the elves and then succeeding in manipulating the Numenoreans. That was so interesting to me, it really puts another layer to Sauron, besides the one of Evil Lord doing bad stuff whilst looking like a demon cliche. I don't know, maybe we'll still get some version of Numenorean thing, but if the leaks are true as to who Sauron is, I doubt it.
This is my main gripe, there are a few more things that bother me, but for the small stuff, I don't really care, I know there are some things that need changing when you're going from book to movie, I understand that.
Agreed. Might put of svope of this thread but thete is a great philosophical discussion about working with evil in an attempt to do good versus sticking to your morals no matter what and how that plays out in practice. Could have made for fascinating high brow fantasy.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
They’ve thrown out:
1. Sauron in his Annatar form.
2. The Numenoreans, the strongest army the world has seen.
3. The forging of the rings of power and how they were given out.
4. Ar Pharazon’s corruption.
sol_bad
Member
Yep, wife and I just finished the extended editions of Two Towers and Return of the King on 4k. In return of the King Gandalf even mentions that Sauron is covering the sun so his army can travel to Gondor. Yet in Two Towers we have orcs on wargs and orcs travelling with Urekai in the sun.
That's kind of weird really. The haters have freely admitted they are hate watching the show. It's fine to let them shit all over the show but if anyone should require to create a new thread it should be the haters as this is the official thread for the show. Let the haters fester in their own thread of hate and vitriol and continue their own little community of negativity. Let the people who enjoy the show enjoy it in peace.
Don't worry, these haters love to say what massive Tolkien fans they are but I'm betting if you check their post history you'll barely find any mentions of Tolkien on these forums and they wouldn't be able to prove their involvement in positive Tolkien communities anywhere on the internet. Basically they became overnight Tolkien experts due to Google.
None of the haters have provided any proper proof as to how this show destroys Tolkiens lore, it's just accusations with no meat. Whereas rhe YouTube channels that agree that Tolkiens lore has not been destroyed come up with extremely detailed explanations as to why.
The show sucks though, so that's why.
Alex11
Member
Well you shouldn't generalize, I for one don't hate the show or don't hate watch, whatever that is. As well as you shouldn't comment on a person's critique of the show just for the sake of it. So if someone finds a fault in a scene or doesn't like the show don't take it personally. I really don't care if someone finds no fault in a scene that to me makes no sense.
Yeah, some are highly aggressive towards the show and kind of exaggerate with the negativity, but so are those that elevate it to something that's never before seen, flawless and every second is pure gold, and that's just wrong, let's be fair, the show has problems. There are some that even try to justify the prison escape sequence of Galadriel, I mean come on, that scene is utter trash, it's comical.
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Say whaaaaaa? We give numerous examples where RoP fails to met or straight up contradicts Tolkien's words. Folks that jump through a myriad of hoops to make a tenuous connection between some in screen event and actual written Lore are the ones reaching. They are mostly operating in the "well, he didn't NOT say this" realm.
But we have 5 seasons, so by season 3 I'm optimistic the entire writing team will he flushed out and we will have a better one.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Almost all of the casting choices for the characters literally look like a generic blank human in a character creator sitting inside a campus coffee shop.
Not a Tolkien fan here. Couldn't finish Fellowship book. Loved the movies tho.
I don't care about the lore, or the new characters, or all that. I just think the show is badly written as characters are very one dimensional so far except maybe Durin ("give me the meat and give it to me raw"). We're 5 episodes in and there's too much mystery going on that doesn't feel needed. And as a creative, I'm also not a fan of the costume designs. Many discussed the armors, I don't get why a dwarf woman needs to have dresses that she needs to pick up from the floor in order to be able to move, why Galedriel is in the same exact dress for her week+ stay in Numenor.
The vistas are nice.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
Did you miss Celeborn’s line in Fellowship where he says to Aragorn “Seldom do orcs venture out in broad daylight yet these do so freely”?
It’s quite clear that the orcs do not burn in the sun.
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TaylorSwiftFan
Member
I’d argue there’s plenty - starting with the writing.
sol_bad
Member
I really enjoyed episode 5 and can't wait for the battle this week. It's good to see that Galadriel has cooled down and great that they are leaving Numenor. I hope it is a well done battle and doesn't look cheap.
Not sure why people are criticising the meat line, I think it was intentionally funny and I laughed my arse off at it hard.
BTW, Corey's breakdown for episode 5 is available.
On a side note, as mentioned above, my wife and I watched the extended trilogy and it's still an incredible bunch of films. Tell you what though, the 4K transfer doesn't do the films any justice. So much bad CGI everywhere, horrible compositing, sets look fake (rocks/stone look like painted foam) and the Gondor soldiers armour looks like plastic. The miniature sets do a disservice for Two Towers as well, the flooding of Isengard loses all scale and looks like a toy. Golum looks terrible in Two Towers, overly shiny and he never matches the supposed lighting so he really stands out.
Not sure why people are criticising the meat line, I think it was intentionally funny and I laughed my arse off at it hard.
BTW, Corey's breakdown for episode 5 is available.
On a side note, as mentioned above, my wife and I watched the extended trilogy and it's still an incredible bunch of films. Tell you what though, the 4K transfer doesn't do the films any justice. So much bad CGI everywhere, horrible compositing, sets look fake (rocks/stone look like painted foam) and the Gondor soldiers armour looks like plastic. The miniature sets do a disservice for Two Towers as well, the flooding of Isengard loses all scale and looks like a toy. Golum looks terrible in Two Towers, overly shiny and he never matches the supposed lighting so he really stands out.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
I’ve read The Hobbit in 2000, I think. LotR after than then The Silmarillion. I also read The Unfinished Tales and all of the History of Middle-Earth. I owned all those books back plus I owned and read a Tolkien biography. I was browsing Lord of the Rings websites back in the 2000s looking at the art of Nasmith, Howe and Lee. Do I pass your test?
Alex11
Member
Well of course it's gonna look bad now, it's a 20 years old movie. Hard disagree on the armors, but I agree with you on the compositing stuff, it looks weird in places. Again, disagree on the miniature sets, for me it's more immersive than full CGI.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
Maybe you shouldn’t have put the people who don’t like the show on ignore then.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
If he thinks the armour in LotR looks bad, I wonder what he thinks of the armour in RoP.
BadBurger
Many “Whelps”! Handle It!
Not that you asked for it, but just my advice: I used to get frustrated in other threads where I enjoy(ed) the show / movie in question but many others clearly do/did not. Just remember it's only an opinion, sometimes people will hate what you love or vice versa. Unless they keep trying to antagonize you just ignore their comments. And if they do keep bugging you, put them on ignore until the discussion of the show has died down and then take them off your ignore list.
TaylorSwiftFan
Member
I guess it’ll just be a conversation between sol_bad and deaftourrett.
Bragr
Banned
Wow, imagine putting people on ignore because you can't handle that people have normal views on things. That's just too damn petty.
Nay, thou must firstly posteth an image of thine Tolkien shrine with evidence of daily obeisance! Anything less is the mark of heresy!
nightmare-slain
Banned
"Unless they keep trying to antagonize you just ignore their comments. And if they do keep bugging you"
i think what
BadBurger
was saying was you can respect other peoples opinions but if they keep trying to get a rise out of you then put them on ignore. It's not a matter of ignoring people because they have a different opinion from you. It's if they try fucking shove it down your throat or are trying to piss you off.
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Bragr
Banned
People who troll on that level where it gets abusive usually get banned on this forum. If you can't handle some negative views about a mediocre/bad TV show then it's better to stay out of the thread."Unless they keep trying to antagonize you just ignore their comments. And if they do keep bugging you"
i think what
There is no doubt that this show gets more hate than it deserves, and that the Youtube hate brigade has mobilized against it, but in an age where every major fantasy/sci-fi franchise gets Disneyfied and "interpreted in our way", it's not surprising that the reaction is so extreme regarding Tolkien, considering the high esteem it's held in.
Agreed. This threat can serve as a course correction for the writing team that their intent, such as it may be, does not seem to be resonating or working as planned. Some things are done, but they COULD choose to redirect in S2 and beyond, focus on what is working, retool the stuff that isn't. This forum is a GREAT place to look for that feedback because our level of "nerdery" is EXACTLY what they should be focusing on, as that core level of fandom is what beats the drum and elevates ratings for shows like this in the first place.
Satisfy the core enough while appealing to the unlearned masses and you get a GoT level phenomenon. Focus on the core too much and you get something like The Expanse, a great show but a bit inaccessible to casuals. So I never expected a slavish adherence to canon (though I would have liked it) but nor will I tolerate wholesale changes, ESPECIALLY if they are bad. The Durin family dynamic thing is straight invented for the show but it WORKS, so keep that. The attempt to cast Galadriel as an impetuous field commander lacking social graces DOES NOT, so get on that. The Harfoot abandoning that family DOES NOT WORK, so if there is more stuff like that upcoming it needs to be seriously rethought.
GymWolf
Gold Member
What do you have to do so urgent other than hiding seeds in your mouth, running inside a wheel and licking your balls all day?
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Do you have any idea how much time is required to do those things well???
Plus I run a brothel of course.
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
I have no horse in this race, either way, as a disclaimer, so if I'm a toxic hating istaphobe or whatever, it's completely immaterial to what the bald British guy with the comic book display behind his computer says on the YouTube, but...
I'd say people are frame by frame hate watching and picking this shit apart like a sky burial because of a few reasons:
1. It's a fanbase of literary fantasy nerds.
Seriously. Half of the people even interested in Tolkien are the type that got picked last in gym class and played flute for school band.
2. Star Wars syndrome
We got an incredible universe given to us by Tolkien. Way later, we get a very respectable adaptation from Jackson. Then we get a rather shit Trilogy from Jackson, and then silence. People are angry about it because it isn't what they wanted in the show, and for all anyone knows, this could be the last LotR related visual media for .... so, I mean, I get it.
Algorithm based hate engagement? I mean, that's everywhere online. It's not the cause of this, because it didn't start six weeks ago, it's been that way since the power grab from big tech/social media, it's the status quo. This is a spike in negativity already accounting for the status quo.
Also, autistic has fallen out of vogue (at least in America, don't know where you are) as slang. It's kinda considered low brow. But it also doesn't really bother me, I'm all about free speech. The ToS probably doesn't care, slurs are B&, but I get it, in a very kiwifarms way.
OsirisBlack
Banned
I don't think any reasonable person that dislikes the show, actually hates the show and is going through it frame by frame looking for its flaws. Its imperfections are glaring and jump off the screen so they are almost impossible to miss. Starting with the most basic and unavoidable issue, the writing. Not sure how you have a billion-dollar budget and fuck up character development, pacing, and story so badly.
The things that look amazing look absolutely amazing and the things that look bad...... well, warg for the win.
I swear the EP needs to be fired. Anyone that had a lead position on this project knew that a lot of this was meme-worthy.
strange headache
Banned
See, this is the reason why nobody likes you superfans and media shills. You're now actively trying to shut down discussion simply because you can't cope with others not liking what you like. Instead you reduce any valid criticism to pure hate. At the same time you keep crapping on Peter Jackson's movies in order to defend this stupid show. Is that not "hateful" according to your own frikkin' definition?
Nice no true Scotsman fallacy there.
Only people who know nothing about Tolkien are able to dislike this show, right? Nah the only true fan is that silly Tolkien professor you keep parading around as if he's not in Amazon's pocket. Nevermind the fact that most people here are old enough to have read Tolkien in their early teens, long before the movies even came out. Closest thing we had back then was Ralph Bakshi's Lord of the Rings and even that is better than Amazon's series.
F*ck off with this annoying crap, this is the reason why nobody can't stand you guys.
Well, #1 certainly explains Galadriel. I'm sure the Harfoot girl will manifest #3. #5 we've covered exhaustively. #4 is where this show gets squishy, I think THEY think the Halbrand/Galadriel/Numenor stuff is a "moral choice" but I disagree, #2 I guess we can wait and see, #8, 9, 10, and 11 are subjective, #12 yup we got that.
I think the knowledge that they have 5 seasons is hurting them a bit, they are a bit too slow (IMHO) in rolling out "the plot" as it were, or at least laying out the lines between groups and setting the stakes in a clear fashion. They are relying heavily on the audience knowledge that a big showdown with Sauron is coming to carry the load.
FunkMiller
Member
All those things are potentially valid components of a successful piece of narrative entertainment.
But the second you stick them in a list and require them, you fuck the creative process completely.
The man is clueless. He renders everything down to factors that can sell his product. Zero creative ability.
Bezos is clearly a great businessman, but when it comes to anything creative he’s like a six month old with a shitty diaper.
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Kamina
Golden Boy
so basically the main plotpoints
Fucking Fanfiction
sol_bad
Member
Read my post again, I said it's fine to keep the haters in this thread, I don't have a problem with it. Did you misread that sentence?
And also, read my older posts again, there are many people in this thread and other parts of the internet who keep saying this show is destroying Tolkien lore. They provide absolutely zero evidence of this at all or it's surface level shit like skin colour. In all the years on NeoGAF and the internet in general I have never seen this much hate based around a LOTR project, not in the original PJ trilogy, not in the Hobbit trilogy, not with the recent LOTR games, it's insane. All of a sudden, out of no where, there are thousands of Tolkien experts. And these thousands of Tolkien experts popped up as soon as the first bit of black skin was shown.
I haven't had any issue with anyone disliking this show due to the show itself. If they don't like it due to the script, the acting, the choreography, the lighting, they find it boring, whatever, fine. I have asked for examples as to why the script is bad in comparison to the PJ trilogy but that's to gain an understanding. When it comes to lore, I've asked what the show has destroyed and I get zero answers. Maybe someone says Galadriel shouldn't be a warrior and that's about it, my understanding is that very little is written about Galadriel in the Second Age, I meant the wiki states the following:
"Celeborn and Galadriel traveled first to Lindon, where they ruled over a group of Elves as a fiefdom under Gil-galad, the High King of the Ñoldor. Sometime later, they had a daughter, Celebrían."
If that is all that is written about Galadrial of the start of the Second Age, there is so much wriggle room to create new stories. As long as Celeborn shows up at Lindon at some point, says they haven't seen each other in thousands of years and Galadriel stops being a warrior, the lore isn't broken. If I'm wrong, please correct me. If there are other examples of lore breaking, please show me.
Trazyn the Infinite
Member
You have been trying to dismiss criticism ever since the first information of the show started to come out and you have gone on record saying you have never read the books. You have no damn clue what you are talking about 99.9% of the time in this thread and everyone can see it. You defend media shills, pretend like you know what you are talking about, dismiss anyone who is critical with no basis of understanding *why* people are critical, and then try to talk down to people from your high horse like you are better than others.
Fuck out of here with that. It is perfectly OK to like this show, but you don’t have to try and lie and weasel your way in defending why you like it to dismiss anyone you disagree with.