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The Order 1886 Review Thread
- Thread starter The Sarcastic Dude
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They don't.
And examples of 'man' fantasies would include Sopranos, Game of Thrones, Hangover, Django Unchained, etc.
Yeah I mean a good portion of the people defending it have Sony avatars.
Their fanboy is showing.
Another I'm only a few chapters in and the reviewers are wrong.
Honestly it's all a matter of opinions ... Even a 4 or 5 in the end, while a bit low by today's (awful) scoring standards that can often range from 6 (awful) to 10 (GOTY) is still only that.
But tbh it's the 2/10 that kinda boggles my mind.
I mean ... it's obviously a matter of opinion just the same, and I guess the reviewer really hated it ... but 1 or 2? ... We're in Steam Greenlight broken shit territory here...
Shadow_FFVI
Member
Look guys, the Defense Force in full effect!
I'm excited to play it tonight as well 
Neuromancer
Member
I thought it was an interesting idea. Call of Duty AW actually does something cooler (and more plausible) where you can reload faster if you double tap square, but you lose any remaining rounds you had in that magazine. (If you hit square once the reload is slower but you save those extra rounds for later.)
I apologize for picking on the poster. I was a jerk for that.
However, these reviews do serve a purpose here. Again, movies and games are different here. Movies are cheaper and take up less of your time than a typical game. However, if you're a family of four, a movie can become more expensive than a game, so those reviews are there to help a family determine what is worth their money to see.
Games offer few refunds and way more money up front. They serve a big purpose and are used by a great segment of the gaming population. $60 is a big chunk of money. Like it or not, people look at these reviews as the consumer guides they are (because they are NOT critical breakdowns of the game or in depth critiques) to help them determine whether to spend their money or not. When you pile on the fact that places to rent games are few and far between now, that we live in a microwave society, and refunds for games are a joke, these things become quite important.
So the people blinding rushing in saying REVIEWERS ARE A JOKE, MAKE UP YOUR OWN MIND, are kind of missing the forest for the trees. How are people supposed to make up their own mind? Blindly throwing money around? It doesn't work that way.
On the flipside, Reviewers and increasingly... Youtube Reviewers need to take their work very serious because people really look to them. They need to respect the work, be honest, be informed, know your shit, fact check and get it right. Be able to back up your opinions and provide the best reviews they can.
LookAtMeGo
Member
Same here man. 3 more hours.
After hearing some impressions from some gaffers with similar taste in games, I have tempered my expectations but I still think I will enjoy it enough. One thing I wish I did was not buy digital so if I feel done with it after I could trade it in. Oh well. Damn Canada and $69.99 games.
TheCanisDirus
Member
Ready @ Dawn vs. the Internet
Whelp, you know something is wrong when you'd rather watch this Gif than play The Order.
and this is when gamers start to ignore reviews, because in no way such low scores are justified for this game. if thats what they want...
I mean to be fair, someone seeking out games who's a fan of Sony platforms would have had the Order on their radar for quite some time, so they would be most likely to play it to have a first-hand reaction. That being said, it's not like formal reviewers didn't play the game either, and they have less personal investment in a platform meta-game.
Hobbies are weird, lol
Xaero Gravity
NEXT LEVEL lame™
Personally I think animal abuse is even lower, but I too don't want to derail the thread.
Melchiah
Member
Not as much so far as there was X pushing in the old Resident Evils and Silent Hills.
I think the interesting thing about this whole drama is that it goes to show how much programmers and designers can ruin the hard work of everyone else when it comes to a developer. A game like The Order can be technically amazing with fantastic graphics, sound direction, and art direction, but that means jack shit if the game sucks (not that this is a bad thing).
Messofanego
Banned
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
Well, I don't go solely on what GAF says. I go a bit overboard by watching reviews, reading player input on GAF, and watching people play on Twitch.
Even in the case where it's a no brainer "should buy" game, I'm still questioning myself on the inside as to whether I would have problems with certain aspects I might not be crazy about.
freenudemacusers
Member
per this game guide (obviously spoilers inside hello), it appears you push circle and square too
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B-Txh1ACYAAtmwq.jpg
Cave Johnson
Member
Judging from the general response here, it doesn't. What ONLY matters to them has and always will be.. the fucking "score". The review can go "blah... blah.. blah, fuck The Order 1886, it's garbage" in their review and close it with 9/10 and most won't even bother to notice which is what I've consistently garnered in every review thread I see.
Staunch defenders have already started the initiative with their 2 1/2 hours of impressions to downplay or undermine established reviews with their anecdotal statements for validation. It's pathetic, toxic and irresponsible for the sake of evangelizing a product that they have already committed to even before they purchase it. I left N4G because of that kind of soapbox platforms and yet somehow now it seeps its way here in GAF.
And tap X.
R1 a few times too.
NullPointer
Member
Just watched the IGN video review, which ends with this:
I know it comes up a lot in conversations about cinematic games, but for this game right here, now that it's out I'd be curious to know who else agrees with this after finishing it.
I had no idea you could do that in AW. Thats a nice touch.
Are the QTE button presses arbitrary or do they make sense with the actions the game is asking you to perform? Are they the same buttons you'd use to do the actions yourself if you could?
Well after playing now for 3 hours (i´m at chapter 4) on hard I can understand the scores it got. Speaking of missed opportunity that RaD had here. Setting is interesting and graphics are spectacular (still with some minor bugs like shadow flickering and objects floating around but very rare) and maybe a nice soundtrack but that´s it. Gameplay especially the shooting part is not that satisfying how I would like to. The guns sounding weak, I can barley feel the punch behind them, most of the enemies are still mindless cannon fodder (only the shotgun guys try to rush and flank you so far) and at the more calm parts I think: Why can´t I interact with my surrounding more ? No speaking to random peoples on the street, no puzzles to break up the whole atmosphere, no detective work with alternative routes to explore the world a little more. Heck, I can´t even use the damn binoculars for the most of the time by myself. I respect RaDs vision to deliver a stream less story but we still speaking about a video game and you expect some things in this medium imo.
Even if RaD just wants to tell a story without using typical game mechanics like random collectives, XP bars that filling up or inventory bag pack to equip your character, they could still use other things to pep this up. So far it´s just go straight to A, kill B, watch C and repeat.
And why the hell do you place audio logs in the world but don´t let the player listen to them when walking around ??? I have to stay in the damn menu with text that I can read much faster than listing to the speaker. Makes that any sense ?
Even if RaD just wants to tell a story without using typical game mechanics like random collectives, XP bars that filling up or inventory bag pack to equip your character, they could still use other things to pep this up. So far it´s just go straight to A, kill B, watch C and repeat.
And why the hell do you place audio logs in the world but don´t let the player listen to them when walking around ??? I have to stay in the damn menu with text that I can read much faster than listing to the speaker. Makes that any sense ?
NEOPARADIGM
Banned
I dunno. Part of me sees this whole thing as a push toward using the whole review scale. Seems to me you're arguing for the ol' 7-10 thing where so long as a game is remotely competent it should get a 7 or better. I have no problem understanding where a game like this could garner 4s and 5s if people are starting to use the whole scale.
From what i can tell Triangle used the most, looking at stuff, opening doors, triggering cutscenes, stealth kills. Square/Circle is used for like fight fight QTEs, X is used for spamming QTEs and R1 used for shooty QTEs?
GatticusFinch
Member
Ready @ Dawn vs. the Internet
Looks like a mattress is the new playground for bullies. This cat is just drinking the haterade.
StarBlazers1
Member
the game is what it is. It's telling a story. Is it a great game? No. Is it a bad game? Definitely not. It's definitely somewhere in the middle. I wish there was a lot more interactivity, and a lot less QTE's. either way, I respect the developers development choices. As I get older, the longer gamse appeal less to me.
CosmicQueso
Member
Ready @ Dawn vs. the Internet
What a punk ass kid. Good job, cat.
Kacho
Gold Member
THIS IS AMAZING
freenudemacusers
Member
66 metacritic pretty much aligns with 'not good not bad' and 'wishes for more gameplay'.
well maybe some players can't read the button prompts very well *shrug*
A few of them are really good and link well with your actions. But then some are poor and shouldn't really be needed.
Resident_UA
Member
$ per hour of entertainment movies are very similar to games. I don't have kids, but just going to a movie with my wife is already almost $40 all things considered. And that's for 2 hours. No matter how you twist it opinions are just opinions and nothing more.
If you think it is so black and white (buy or not buy) based on reviews why even bother with all the text in reviews? Just to defend the score? Sure you can say that they are just reviewing functionality of the product, but is anyone really that surprised about content of Order? These reviews are more about attitudes towards the game and that's fine, but they should be more elaborate than "I can't upgrade any weapons"
Mad Season
Banned
But those games hard more playable contentNot as much so far as there was X pushing in the old Resident Evils and Silent Hills.
I'll just say this and then take my impressions to the OT.
For the most part I took 2014 "off" in terms of playing releases. I've used the last two months to catch up on Infamous, SSB, Zombie U, FarCry 4, ACU, etc.
That said, I just completed chapter 4 and I can honestly say its my favorite playable sequence of anything I've come across in a long, long time. It's moody, well placed, and just enough of a moment of brilliance to make me satisfy my purchase.
The one thing I would have definitely changed would have been the scene we saw at E3 2014.
less automatic running and more of you running at the screen.
I look at these reviews and as I continue to progress through The Order and I cant but help feel that they would be in the 7's or 8's if RAD had been more interactive in their design.
It's not a matter of player agency/authorship, its just simply a matter of player involvement. There are soooo many moments that should have just let you walk the character forward as opposed to a cut-scene
. It might seem trivial, but for a game that features cutscenes where the characters are simply walking and talking you would think we would be able to just remove the middle man and have that playable.
It's just...frustrating. I can see the merits of the reviews concerning how much is played versus how much is watched. I maintain the writing is good, as is the familiar but effective gunplay.
For the most part I took 2014 "off" in terms of playing releases. I've used the last two months to catch up on Infamous, SSB, Zombie U, FarCry 4, ACU, etc.
That said, I just completed chapter 4 and I can honestly say its my favorite playable sequence of anything I've come across in a long, long time. It's moody, well placed, and just enough of a moment of brilliance to make me satisfy my purchase.
The one thing I would have definitely changed would have been the scene we saw at E3 2014.
The Lycan chase should have been more like the Uncharted 2 alley chase/truck sequence,
I look at these reviews and as I continue to progress through The Order and I cant but help feel that they would be in the 7's or 8's if RAD had been more interactive in their design.
It's not a matter of player agency/authorship, its just simply a matter of player involvement. There are soooo many moments that should have just let you walk the character forward as opposed to a cut-scene
(carrying Isabeau should have been a playable sequence)
It's just...frustrating. I can see the merits of the reviews concerning how much is played versus how much is watched. I maintain the writing is good, as is the familiar but effective gunplay.
walltowall
Member
Look guys, the Defense Force in full effect!
I'm excited to play it tonight as well
Just got my copy and I'm still hyped....a different kind of hype, a more measured hype, but hyped none the less.
It's as simple as this.
That's not aggressive enough.
Critics vs The Order 1886
Might not want to use that particular gif.
As someone who wasn't particularly interested in this game in the first place, the larger observation that the story of this game reinforces is a depressing one: AAA game development has become unattainable unless you are a very large studio.
Ready at Dawn is a team of ~80 that took ~3 years to make this game. If we assume an average salary of 80,000 (RaD is based in Irvine, so this is a safe estimate), this ~19 million dollars just on salaries for 80 people over 3 years, without considering anything else.
And even then, RaD clearly had to cut some corners. The game is short; the game is corridorish; the game is tightly controlled. I think to make a bigger AAA game of this type without cutting corners, you're going to need a team of ~250 people for 2 years, or 500-750 people for 1 year, to plausibly get the game out without cutting the sorts of corners RaD clearly did with this game. For those who don't want to do the math, that's more than 2x the burn rate that RaD would have faced for this game. I remember that we mocked (for instance) the size of Assassin's Creed teams just a few years ago. 500 people? 700 people?!?!??
It seems absurd, but it's becoming increasingly apparent that it's necessary if you want to make a game with "AAA" technical scope.
Ready at Dawn is a team of ~80 that took ~3 years to make this game. If we assume an average salary of 80,000 (RaD is based in Irvine, so this is a safe estimate), this ~19 million dollars just on salaries for 80 people over 3 years, without considering anything else.
And even then, RaD clearly had to cut some corners. The game is short; the game is corridorish; the game is tightly controlled. I think to make a bigger AAA game of this type without cutting corners, you're going to need a team of ~250 people for 2 years, or 500-750 people for 1 year, to plausibly get the game out without cutting the sorts of corners RaD clearly did with this game. For those who don't want to do the math, that's more than 2x the burn rate that RaD would have faced for this game. I remember that we mocked (for instance) the size of Assassin's Creed teams just a few years ago. 500 people? 700 people?!?!??
It seems absurd, but it's becoming increasingly apparent that it's necessary if you want to make a game with "AAA" technical scope.
What about those who haven't played it nor plan on doing so yet are using the review as some kind of validation.
Isn't that also a sense of justification to one's self?
Maybe games have become a bit too big for their breeches. =x
Maybe Sony buy them or send a team to help them next time?
It's basically followed the movie industry's mistakes step by step.
NullPointer
Member
I still dislike QTEs but its good to see they are becoming a little less random over time.
One would hope that a lot of the heavy lifting has now been done and that RAD is in a much better place for a followup game. Just like all the other devs putting out current gen games.
Well, here is hoping HellBlade with its team of 13 is good.
timetokill
Banned
Then add in the fact that with so huge teams, it requires a huge investment in salaries alone -- and when more money is involved, less risk usually is as well. Meaning we get the same third-person cover-based shooters and open world games ad nauseum because hey, that's what sells.
I imagine quite a bit of the time it took to make the game was spent making the engine they used for this. If the game gets a sequel(which was implied by the game itself, from what I understand), then I doubt it would take nearly as much time or money. Even if the game doesn't get a sequel, I'd think other 1st party sony games would make use of it.
One in the game is the best QTE I have seen in a game. I won't spoil it for people tho.
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