I don't think so. I think the reason people aren't shitting on it more is because it has "True Detective" in the title.
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True Detective - Season 2 - We get the Season we deserve - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter Cornballer
- Start date
I don't think so. I think the reason people aren't shitting on it more is because it has "True Detective" in the title.
Anton Sugar
Member
Yeah, I don't think the episode was bad, but it mostly felt like a dour mess of character and storylines. It only felt compelling in the last few minutes, after Kitsch finds the body.
It's also hard to not compare it to S1, because it apes the same kinda beats: long pushes/zooms into a character's face, character stares coldly into the distance, ambient/droning music, the occasional "wtf" moment, etc.
It was hard to not roll my eyes whenRust Ani and Marty Elvis wandered upon an evangelical preacher new-age scientist who was spouting a haunting sermon to his followers.
It's also hard to not compare it to S1, because it apes the same kinda beats: long pushes/zooms into a character's face, character stares coldly into the distance, ambient/droning music, the occasional "wtf" moment, etc.
It was hard to not roll my eyes when
Secret Fawful
Member
I'm not sure what is wrong with Paul finding the body like that. His entire story in the episode was just leading up to him finding it. It's not a contrivance.
Anyway, the final scene of the episode gave off some serious Touch of Evil vibes to me, with Farrell channeling Hank Quinlan upon his entrance to the crime scene.
It's also obvious to me that the episode was trying to mix slight elements of Sergio Leone mixed with extremely in-your-face elements of David Lynch. The closeups at the last bar scene between Farrell and Vaughn and the stareoff at the end were Leone, but the singer in the bar singing about a bad life was specifically channeling Lynch and the singer at the bar in Fire Walk With Me. The episode made it clear it would do this by specifically putting Mulholland Dr. so heavily in the viewer's face earlier on. I expect more in-your-face Lynch influence.
I also felt like the bird statue in the car with the city planner was referencing the Maltese Falcon, but that may be a stretch. However, the shot of it came right before a shot of the Mulholland Dr. sign, another blatant reference, so I dunno. And yes, I know Mulholland Dr. is more than just the Lynch movie, but it was very direct in my opinion.
I feel like with a cast this large there will be room to kill off a lead character or two over the course of the season, but we'll see.
Anyway, the final scene of the episode gave off some serious Touch of Evil vibes to me, with Farrell channeling Hank Quinlan upon his entrance to the crime scene.
It's also obvious to me that the episode was trying to mix slight elements of Sergio Leone mixed with extremely in-your-face elements of David Lynch. The closeups at the last bar scene between Farrell and Vaughn and the stareoff at the end were Leone, but the singer in the bar singing about a bad life was specifically channeling Lynch and the singer at the bar in Fire Walk With Me. The episode made it clear it would do this by specifically putting Mulholland Dr. so heavily in the viewer's face earlier on. I expect more in-your-face Lynch influence.
I also felt like the bird statue in the car with the city planner was referencing the Maltese Falcon, but that may be a stretch. However, the shot of it came right before a shot of the Mulholland Dr. sign, another blatant reference, so I dunno. And yes, I know Mulholland Dr. is more than just the Lynch movie, but it was very direct in my opinion.
I feel like with a cast this large there will be room to kill off a lead character or two over the course of the season, but we'll see.
Extra Sauce
Member
omg that title change...
Moff
Member
was that a nick cave song I never heard before I just heard?
well the whole episode I was kinda split between hating it passionately and being curious about it, so I will definitely stay on, but I don't see this coming close anywhere near season 1, writing and especially acting. but of course I didn't expect that, season 1 was too much of a case where all the constellations were perfect.
well the whole episode I was kinda split between hating it passionately and being curious about it, so I will definitely stay on, but I don't see this coming close anywhere near season 1, writing and especially acting. but of course I didn't expect that, season 1 was too much of a case where all the constellations were perfect.
phazedplasma
Member
A lot of it is the negative hype train that has been running full steam ahead since about forever. Also reviews of the first 3 episodes that are written like they're a review for the whole season just to get ad revenue don't help either.
This is the internet we deserve though...
Hopefully people who stop watching will leave this thread over time and we can start to have some of the great conversations that happened in the S1 thread or the off season thread.
Agreed. I actually though the bigger coincidences belonged to Ani - Porn bust? Boom, her sister is there. Missing person? Boom, she's a worker at her dad's center.
Jex
Member
If anything, most of the criticism I've read hasn't been harsh enough:
- Devoting this initial episode to all four characters at once left the story feeling overt-stuffed and yet wholly unsatisfying. Even though the entire episode was essentially devoted to set up I remained wholly unconnected to these characters and their plights. When they all got together at the end I assumed I was supposed to care, as if the Avengers had been assembled. Instead its just a bunch of empty caricatures gathered round to glare at each other.
- The interlinking and weaving of the various characters together was...non existent? The editing conveyed nothing. It just cut between a number of seemingly unconnected stories for the entire episode. Someone earlier described it as a bad Game of Thrones episode and I feel that's an apt comparison.
- Speaking of the production, the cinematography was largely...bland? The visuals utterly failed to covey a place, or a mood, or a tone or even any kind of geography. The only semi-decent scene was at the bar in the end. Lets not talk about that terrible final shot. It's not only far worse than say, the first season, but it looks absolutely pathetic compared to something like Hannibal.
- Really not a fan of that opening or the music. I don't think it was a wise idea to emulate the style of the first season, but do it far worse. It felt like a weird, alternate universe True Detective porn parody where everyone had moustaches.
- The dialogue was bad. Daddy issues galore mixed with over-the-top nonsense (specifically the astronaut line, yuck).
- Devoting this initial episode to all four characters at once left the story feeling overt-stuffed and yet wholly unsatisfying. Even though the entire episode was essentially devoted to set up I remained wholly unconnected to these characters and their plights. When they all got together at the end I assumed I was supposed to care, as if the Avengers had been assembled. Instead its just a bunch of empty caricatures gathered round to glare at each other.
- The interlinking and weaving of the various characters together was...non existent? The editing conveyed nothing. It just cut between a number of seemingly unconnected stories for the entire episode. Someone earlier described it as a bad Game of Thrones episode and I feel that's an apt comparison.
- Speaking of the production, the cinematography was largely...bland? The visuals utterly failed to covey a place, or a mood, or a tone or even any kind of geography. The only semi-decent scene was at the bar in the end. Lets not talk about that terrible final shot. It's not only far worse than say, the first season, but it looks absolutely pathetic compared to something like Hannibal.
- Really not a fan of that opening or the music. I don't think it was a wise idea to emulate the style of the first season, but do it far worse. It felt like a weird, alternate universe True Detective porn parody where everyone had moustaches.
- The dialogue was bad. Daddy issues galore mixed with over-the-top nonsense (specifically the astronaut line, yuck).
phazedplasma
Member
Pretty sure it was implied she picked the cam house because she knew, or thought her sister would be there.
I just watched it and I liked what I saw.
Sure there is a bit much going on making it feel unfocused, but you can't really compare it to S1 where they only had to introduce two characters. It's just the pilot and I'm sure the season will put all these story-bits and characters together later on.
Didn't really know what to expect of this before, but now I'm excited for what comes next.
Sure there is a bit much going on making it feel unfocused, but you can't really compare it to S1 where they only had to introduce two characters. It's just the pilot and I'm sure the season will put all these story-bits and characters together later on.
Didn't really know what to expect of this before, but now I'm excited for what comes next.
Freedom = $1.05
Banned
Seems a lot of the same people who I've seen whining about the drop in quality regarding the writing are also missing some of the subtext and implied story telling used in the first episode. Which is weird to me since it's not really being that deep or philosophical at the moment.
I just get the sense that folks aren't giving the show a fair shake. While this first episode didn't start with a bang it at least set up all of the characters and their motivations moving forward. If there's any issues that I can agree on is that there are too many balls up in the air right now and I'm not sure that it will pay off in the end. Sometimes less is more.
I just get the sense that folks aren't giving the show a fair shake. While this first episode didn't start with a bang it at least set up all of the characters and their motivations moving forward. If there's any issues that I can agree on is that there are too many balls up in the air right now and I'm not sure that it will pay off in the end. Sometimes less is more.
Secret Fawful
Member
Yeah. She abused her authority to raid a place that had everything legal and in order so she could try to scare her sister away from the porn "business".
Anton Sugar
Member
Ani specifically picks that bust because she knows her sister is involved, though, right?
EDIT: Beaten.
I was most surprised by this. Can't really think of any standout shots from this episode, but I plan on watching it again. At some points, the show looked borderline ugly, and I have to wonder if that is a specific choice. It's not a pretty kind of "ugly digital", either.
Word, makes sense. The father/missing person coincidence still a huge stretch though.
Either way, you can pick it apart, but I loved every pulpy second.
Freedom = $1.05
Banned
There are very few huge coincidences in a show like true detective. For example, as early as the second episode of season 1 you could tell that the task force that the governor guy wanted to set up was clearly there to simply cover up the story and to make sure any investigations go nowhere. If you paid enough attention you could already see what forces were at play even that early.
The dad thing will go places, it's just too soon to call it a coincidence
PlayALLtheGames
Banned
It was fine but am I supposed to believe that this town is so corrupt that Colin Ferrell can just beat the shit out of some kid's dad and then continue about his business as a cop like nothing happened?
And Rachel McAdams being introduced by her preference for anal? Haha wtf.
Also, the cop character is weird, and not in an interesting way.
And Rachel McAdams being introduced by her preference for anal? Haha wtf.
Also, the cop character is weird, and not in an interesting way.
Oh, I thought she looked genuinely surprised to see her sister there
I suppose it would make sense, though
Moff
Member
is it usual behavior for police to hand out papers and then just take a new case from the person they handed those papers to, which are not connected to that case, and follow up on it right away although that case was already filed with someone else? seemed a bit odd to me but what do I know.
Corpsepyre
Banned
I thought it was interesting. Definitely not as strong as the first season's pilot, but this is where I stop comparing the two. It's obvious the two are worlds apart, and from now on, I'll be judging this based on the quality of the season itself.
Lets see if it picks up in the coming episodes. The characters got established in the first episode, now lets see how they interact and evolve through the 7 episodes.
I legit LOL'ed at Colin's line to that little kid. Was epic!
Lets see if it picks up in the coming episodes. The characters got established in the first episode, now lets see how they interact and evolve through the 7 episodes.
I legit LOL'ed at Colin's line to that little kid. Was epic!
Probably not but I guess you could say she asked for the case or maybe she just went straight to the complex as she was wondering if her dad was involved.
Future PhaZe
Member
very real criticisms have been placed, many of which aren't "lol worse than s1"
What made you come to this conclusion?
e: I mean, it sounds just like any stupid "you just don't like it cause you don't GET it" post. The thread is pretty negative right now which I understand puts some people on the defense, but maybe most people simply think the first episode just wasn't particularly good. If there are people who're hating on it for hating's sake, I'm sure they'll drop out of the thread soon enough
dead souls
Member
Yep. That and the prestige that HBO still has even though they don't deserve it after years of fairly weak drama development.
If this had aired on Showtime, Starz, AMC or FX people would be demolishing it.
dave is ok
aztek is ok
Oh come on. It would be the best pilot on any of those channels by a considerable margin.
I think it makes for an interesting dichotomy. Kitsch character being clean(presumably), doing things by the book and is punished for doing so. Then you have Ray, who's on the take and dirty as they come, beating up suburbanites with seeming impunity.
It just illustrates how fucked up things are. Pizzaman likes tales of decadence/Noir.
Darth Pinche
Member
Corpsepyre
Banned
'You ever bully or hurt someone again, I'll come back and buttfuck your father with your mom's headless corpse on his goddamn lawn. 12 year old my ass. Fuck......you'
Colin takes the cake.
Colin takes the cake.
I mentioned this earlier but I think it's worth reiterating. There is no Marty in this season right now and despite Rust being the overwhelming fan favorite, you also need someone like Marty for multiple reasons.
Marty served as a balance to keep Rust from sounding too preachy and also served as a way of grounding the show in that Rust might say something philosophical or pondering and Marty would be like "What the fuck are you talking about? Nobody wants to hear your shit". Here however we have Frank, Vaughn's character, have ridiculous lines such as "Never do anything when you're hungry" and nobody bats an eyelash at how absurdly stupid that is. As stated earlier, everybody is saying Rust dialogue but there isn't any counterweight. Pizzolatto's dialogue is now coming off as cheesy and over the top partly because nobody is calling it out but also Rust's character traits are being distributed among all the leads.
The other thing was that Marty was mostly normal. Yes yes he had his vices but he was still a fairly normal human being. Look at the four leads presented in this episode: one is a corrupt cop who had a wife who was raped and he's raising the rapist's kid and will probably lose custody, another has a prostitute sister and a cultist father while her mother committed suicide when she was a child (she was probably raped too hence the knife fetish), the third was badly burned when he was a kid/teenager before going into the army and is now suicidal, and the fourth is a crimeboss going straight. It says something when the person with the closest thing to a normal background is a crimeboss.
It's over the top and none of the characters are serving as a bridge to the audience.
Marty served as a balance to keep Rust from sounding too preachy and also served as a way of grounding the show in that Rust might say something philosophical or pondering and Marty would be like "What the fuck are you talking about? Nobody wants to hear your shit". Here however we have Frank, Vaughn's character, have ridiculous lines such as "Never do anything when you're hungry" and nobody bats an eyelash at how absurdly stupid that is. As stated earlier, everybody is saying Rust dialogue but there isn't any counterweight. Pizzolatto's dialogue is now coming off as cheesy and over the top partly because nobody is calling it out but also Rust's character traits are being distributed among all the leads.
The other thing was that Marty was mostly normal. Yes yes he had his vices but he was still a fairly normal human being. Look at the four leads presented in this episode: one is a corrupt cop who had a wife who was raped and he's raising the rapist's kid and will probably lose custody, another has a prostitute sister and a cultist father while her mother committed suicide when she was a child (she was probably raped too hence the knife fetish), the third was badly burned when he was a kid/teenager before going into the army and is now suicidal, and the fourth is a crimeboss going straight. It says something when the person with the closest thing to a normal background is a crimeboss.
It's over the top and none of the characters are serving as a bridge to the audience.
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
Highlight of the episode.
BizzyBum
Member
I enjoyed it. The S1 Pilot was better, yes, but it's just the first episode. I've read the first three episodes are not as strong as S1 either but the payoff could be huge with 4-8.
The one thing I will say is they were a little over the top at times with the melancholy nature of the show. One example was when that girl started singing that song in the bar when Farrell and Vaughn had that little meeting. It was like "LOOK HOW DEPRESSING THIS SHOW IS. YOU SHOULD BE DEPRESSED WATCHING THIS."
We get it. It's not a feel good show.
The one thing I will say is they were a little over the top at times with the melancholy nature of the show. One example was when that girl started singing that song in the bar when Farrell and Vaughn had that little meeting. It was like "LOOK HOW DEPRESSING THIS SHOW IS. YOU SHOULD BE DEPRESSED WATCHING THIS."
We get it. It's not a feel good show.
just found out the studio the makes the intro also makes a bunch of intros and spots for video games and other shows. Love their work
http://www.antibody.tv/projects.html
http://www.antibody.tv/projects.html
At first I though she was the missing girl and was thinking this is really contrived.
dead souls
Member
lol, the True Detective Season 2 premiere? That script wouldn't even cut it on NBC.
No, no, it wouldn't.
lol it's even funnier typed out like this.
The writing wasn't exactly amazing or subtle last season, but this season is definitely even more overwrought. Some of the dialogue was just laughably bad.
Almost everything said in dialogue was exposition. Pizzolatto isn't going to suddenly become a great scriptwriter, so I'm really worried for the season.
Oh man, I didn't even realize that Rachel McAdams's character's full name was "Antigone." Jesus.
Echoed my thoughts exactly.
What? No.
Echoed my thoughts exactly.
What? No.
Bit of a stretch. Justified is significantly better than many shows HBO has put out, and I say that as a fan of most HBO shows.
Anton Sugar
Member
Also important to remember that some of Rust's monologues/philosophizing were taken almost verbatim from Thomas Ligotti...something to think about this season re: how well any "weird" dialogue goes down. Ligotti + McConaughey=bliss.
I don't know if there was anything last season as bad as "don't do anything out of hunger, even eat" or some of Morse's dialogue. Maybe the Lawnmower Man muttering "mah family's been here a reeeal long time heh heh heh" is close, but there were a lotta clunkers scattered throughout the S2 premiere.
DO YOU GET IT
I don't know if there was anything last season as bad as "don't do anything out of hunger, even eat" or some of Morse's dialogue. Maybe the Lawnmower Man muttering "mah family's been here a reeeal long time heh heh heh" is close, but there were a lotta clunkers scattered throughout the S2 premiere.
DO YOU GET IT
"Sure it is. We're cops."
"We were working for America, sir."
"I used to wanna be an astronaut, but astronauts don't even go to the moon anymore," Ray Velcoro says into a fucking tape recorder he intends to give to his "son" because this show needed more sloppy exposition.
"I'll come back and butt-fuck your father..." Not only was this scene so ridiculously unrealistic and edgy, the writing was just bad.
MidnightCowboy
Member
Don't get the hate for the astronaut line. It was the only line with any punch behind it. The hate for the episode is clouding judgment on a good line of dialogue. And it's not overly expositional.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
I feel like another thing that will be missing compared to season 1, that also ended up
, was the mystery surrounding the cults and mentions of The King in Yellow and Carcosa. Most of the speculation and talk of the show was about this stuff.
being a redherring to the dissapointment of a lot of people