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[TestOfTide]

Yeah, but in the current political climate, wouldn't Trump have far more support to do this than Nixon did?

Nixon had stubborn republican support too.

The Republicans themselves control the majority of government and no longer seem to care about getting re-elected,

Oh they care about reelected. It's just that for many of them they feel far more vulnerable to a primary than a general election.

since they're basically leaving many Trump supporters to die with changes to healthcare,

That's only because the GOP has forgotten how the electorate reacts when thousands of citizens die on their watch.

and many Trump supporters themselves are willing to burn democracy down as long as immigrants and democrats get hurt in the process.

First off there are numerous states where GOP politicians could be vulnerable to a moderate primary challenge if independents can vote in the primary.

Second, Nixon had near universal support among the Republicans as well, but that didn't stop the big leaks from happening.

When you add onto that that Fox controls the majority of mindshare in news distribution and is essentially state controlled media at this point, you have a recipe for actually getting away with it.

You mean the same Fox that has been hit with scandal after scandal? The same Fox where some of the biggest far-right influences have been kicked out due to said scandals?

I'm just wondering if he actually has the legal power to do so. At this point, I have no questions about how he would succeed if he could actually do it. It seems like a depressingly large amount of American people and American government want to get rid of democracy anyway and switch back over to a monarchy.

Ask yourself the following questions:

- How many IC employees would be okay with Trump undermining their capabilities?
- How many FBI employees would be okay with Trump undermining their capabilities?
- If Trump has such loyalty, then why was it easy as fuck for the press to find leakers all over the Whitehouse?
- What can Trump possibly do when he thinks he can trust his closest staff, then finds out that his close staff are leaking big shit to the press?

If trump was capable of just replacing all the IC and FBI employees with his own fanbase he would have done it already.

 

[RPGCrazied]

I hope for all our sakes its Rogers then the other on the list. Gowdy? Rudy? Cornyn?

Yikes.

At least if its Cornyn Texas could get rid of this senator and replace it with a Democrat.

 

[sc0la]

The only acceptable option on any of these "shortlists" is the current acting director. imo

 

[TestOfTide]

I hope for all our sakes its Rogers then the other on the list. Gowdy? Rudy? Cornyn?

Yikes.

At least if its Cornyn Texas could get rid of this senator and replace it with a Democrat.

If it's Cornyn than Democrats could kill two birds with one stone by going for BOTH Texas Senate seats.

 

[RPGCrazied]

If it's Cornyn than Democrats could kill two birds with one stone by going for BOTH Texas Senate seats.

Yep. Cruz's seat is up next year. Licking my lips in anticipation to vote him out.

 

[gazele]

An Interesting byproduct would be that it would make it harder for health care to pass the senate

Not sure it's worth the risk of him as the head of the FBI however

 

[Slime]

Because we haven't seen that shit happening with the IC in spite of Trump's best efforts to try and make that happen.

Nixon didn't just go down due to his paranoia, a democratic congress, and a persistent press. Nixon went down because there were a shitload of people in the White House who were not loyal to Nixon and Nixon wouldn't have been able to fire them all.

I hope there are enough disloyal people to tear Trump down from within, but with a compromised FBI and Justice Department and a Republican supermajority desperate to hang on to power by any means necessary, I'm not confident this will end like it did with Nixon. Republicans now have such a nihilistic and apocalyptic worldview that I seriously get sick to my stomach thinking of the depths they're likely to go to before allowing their party leaders to face justice. They have shown such a blatant disregard for truth and democracy, what reason do we have to believe that even the most damning leaks won't just be swept under the rug?

The March for Science was like two weeks ago i think

Oh yeah. Still, I'm disappointed at the lack of visible outrage over some of these issues. You see it in town halls, but months ago I would have thought for certain that Comey's firing would result in public outrage at least sort of akin to the Muslim ban. Part of that probably has something to do with the fact that everyone hates Comey, but I also fear that most people either don't care or aren't educated enough about Trump-Russia to do anything about it.

 

[ShadowSwordmaster]

If I recall correctly, there were protests going on in New York City, Washington DC and other parts of the country.

 

[TestOfTide]

I hope there are enough disloyal people to tear Trump down from within, but with a compromised FBI and Justice Department and a Republican supermajority desperate to hang on to power by any means necessary, I'm not confident this will end like it did with Nixon. Republicans now have such a nihilistic and apocalyptic worldview that I seriously get sick to my stomach thinking of the depths they're likely to go to before allowing their party leaders to face justice. They have shown such a blatant disregard for truth and democracy, what reason do we have to believe that even the most damning leaks won't just be swept under the rug?

Think about the fact that almost immediately after Comey got fired, the Washington Post was easily able to get THIRTY effing sources telling them that Comey was fired for not being a Trump loyalist. Think about the logistics involved in getting 30 different sources from the FBI to speak about something and realize that to get all those sources within 24 hours they had to practically be waiting in line to talk to the Washington Post.

And the stories HAVE had effects. Numerous times the stories have caused the GOP politicians to have to give at least the appearance of giving a shit. Trump's approval HAS been hit by each revelation.

Like, the way you are phrasing it you make it sound like the GOP would be able to sweep it under the rug if the Pee Tape got leaked to the press.

 

[AlphaDump]

So FBI Agents Assoc. recommends Mike Rogers eh?

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/11/03/meet-donald-trump-s-top-fbi-fanboy?



More like Rudy recommends Mike Rogers.



Also set up 2 PACs for John Bolton, the top donor in both was Cambridge Analytica.

Interesting pull. This would definitely undermine the optics of the decision and come off like Trumps decision was listening to/working with the FBI. Scary.

Intel needs to act fast before we find ourselves in too much shit.

 

[Electric Eye]

This motherfucker. I had missed this little nugget before.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/13/us/politics/election-is-over-but-trump-still-cant-seem-to-get-past-it.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

He seemed to almost invite comparisons to the Watergate scandal by firing Mr. Comey late in the day, then hosting Henry Kissinger in the Oval Office the next day.

 

[sc0la]

An Interesting byproduct would be that it would make it harder for health care to pass the senate

Not sure it's worth the risk of him as the head of the FBI however

Wouldn't he Texas governor just get to name a replacement till it could be filled via election?

 

[gazele]

Wouldn't he Texas governor just get to name a replacement till it could be filled via election?

Yeah, you're right

 

[Suikoguy]

Wouldn't he Texas governor just get to name a replacement till it could be filled via election?

I found this on ncsl.org

If vacancy occurs in an even year on or before the 62nd day before the primary, remainder of term is filled at next regular general election. If vacancy occurs after 62nd day before the primary in an even year, or in an odd year, special election is held on the first uniform election date occurring on or after the 36th day the election is ordered

... the 14 states listed below require that a special election be held to fill a vacancy in the office of U.S. Senator. Nine of these states allow the governor to make an interim appointment (with specific restrictions in three), but these are short-term appointments as in most cases, a special election is held within a few months. In the remaining four states (Oklahoma, Oregon, Rhode Island, and Wisconsin), the seat remains vacant until filled by the voters at a special election.

http://www.ncsl.org/research/elections-and-campaigns/vacancies-in-the-united-states-senate.aspx

 

[TopDreg]

* They nominated him last time as well
* He was accused of being a partisan liar last go around doubt that has changed
* The agents association are probably a politically active group who do not actually poll all their members on what they think, but instead claim to speak for them.

Oh. I retract my earlier statement. Damn.

 

[Suikoguy]

Oh. I retract my earlier statement. Damn.

Also famous for this ultra-bullshit exchange:

Rogers: I would argue the fact that we haven’t had any complaints come forward with any specificity arguing that their privacy has been violated, clearly indicates, in 10 years, clearly indicates that something must be doing right. Somebody must be doing something exactly right.

Vladeck: But who would be complaining?

Rogers: Somebody who’s privacy was violated. You can’t have your privacy violated if you don’t know your privacy is violated.

Vladeck: I disagree with that. If a tree falls in the forest, it makes a noise whether you’re there to see it or not.

Rogers (astounded): Well that’s a new interesting standard in the law. We’re going to have this conversation… but we’re going to have wine, because that’s going to get a lot more interesting…

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/top-house-republican-says

 

[NihonTiger90]

That's just the story from the company's president, not the FBI. The firm has ties to Roger Stone and Paul Manafort, which is quite a coincidence.

Ah, I might have heard wrong then. Guess we'll find out soon enough, lol.

 

[Slime]

Think about the fact that almost immediately after Comey got fired, the Washington Post was easily able to get THIRTY effing sources telling them that Comey was fired for not being a Trump loyalist. Think about the logistics involved in getting 30 different sources from the FBI to speak about something and realize that to get all those sources within 24 hours they had to practically be waiting in line to talk to the Washington Post.

And the stories HAVE had effects. Numerous times the stories have caused the GOP politicians to have to give at least the appearance of giving a shit. Trump's approval HAS been hit by each revelation.

Like, the way you are phrasing it you make it sound like the GOP would be able to sweep it under the rug if the Pee Tape got leaked to the press.

What has honestly changed, though? The extent of all these months of leaks has been, like you said, GOP politicians saying something half-criticial (and then proceeding to further Trump's agenda without question in Congress) and his approval hovering around where it's been since inaugurated but fluctuating a couple points when things get slightly shittier.

The problem is, no matter what seems to leak, everything is either met with lies or ignored. Things don't stick to this administration the way they typically would. The mere act of justified outrage becomes a partisan issue and less informed people are numbed and confused out of engagement. As much as shit has escalated in just a few months, we are basically at status quo from where we started.

Trump and the GOP have mastered the art of constructing an alternate reality. You confront them with a truth and they talk past you in return. It's not so much even that they sweep things under the rug, but they go on living as if there's nothing wrong with what happened to begin with, because no one is going to stop them.

Trump is not going to resign, Republicans are not going to impeach him, and the Justice Department is not going to press charges against him or any of his associates. Why should we have any hope that leaks will change anything?

 

[yanipheonu]

Trump is not going to resign, Republicans are not going to impeach him, and the Justice Department is not going to press charges against him or any of his associates. Why should we have any hope that leaks will change anything?

Because the public is fickle, and the future is uncertain. Pessimism is just as uncertain as optimism. The real answer is we have no idea what's going to happen next.

But I doubt Trump is very sustainable.

 

[KHarvey16]

What has honestly changed, though? The extent of all these months of leaks has been, like you said, GOP politicians saying something half-criticial (and then proceeding to further Trump's agenda without question in Congress) and his approval hovering around where it's been since inaugurated but fluctuating a couple points when things get slightly shittier.

The problem is, no matter what seems to leak, everything is either met with lies or ignored. Things don't stick to this administration the way they typically would. The mere act of justified outrage becomes a partisan issue and less informed people are numbed and confused out of engagement. As much as shit has escalated in just a few months, we are basically at status quo from where we started.

Trump and the GOP have mastered the art of constructing an alternate reality. You confront them with a truth and they talk past you in return. It's not so much even that they sweep things under the rug, but they go on living as if there's nothing wrong with what happened to begin with, because no one is going to stop them.

Trump is not going to resign, Republicans are not going to impeach him, and the Justice Department is not going to press charges against him or any of his associates. Why should we have any hope that leaks will change anything?

That's a lot of declarations you can't possibly support.

Politicians need to get elected. With polling showing enourmous disapproval and D+16(!) republicans will distance themselves when it comes time for people to vote. We've already seen Trump start to lose votes.

If no republican will lift a finger to do any damage here, why did the senate committee just request records about Trump, his businesses, his associates, his family and all of their businesses? Why do that? Why ask Comey to come testify, or Yates, or Clapper?

 

[shawnbuddy]

I've met people who went to Liberty. It's an intellectual toilet that fills graduates' minds with shit. The only half cool one I met was a guy who washed out because he couldn't follow oppressive campus rules.

 

[Guy.brush]

That Broadsword Six guy that had the "follow the money" thread a couple of days ago
https://twitter.com/Broadsword_Six/status/863072720551985153

now did one for the aftermath. Pretty scary. Telling folks to be ready if civil unrest follows in the coming days due to Trump's followers not standing down.
https://twitter.com/Broadsword_Six/status/863467384203485184

Loved that one:
"If I were Trump at this point. Id start walking around in a bathrobe & shitting in the rose garden. Insanity defense is the only way to go.."
https://twitter.com/Broadsword_Six/status/863198614763393024

 

[smokeymicpot]

So Trump does tape conversations.

Former Employees of Donald Trump Say They Saw Him Tape Conversations

As a businessman, Mr. Trump sometimes taped phone conversations with associates and others from his Trump Tower office in New York, according to three people who say they have direct knowledge of the recordings.

Mr. Trump had one or more recording devices that he used to tape his phone calls from his office, the three people said. All are former high-level employees who worked for Mr. Trump over a span of three decades. They said they saw devices in use recording phone calls.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/former...ay-they-saw-him-tape-conversations-1494715712

 

[ShadowSwordmaster]

Because the public is fickle, and the future is uncertain. Pessimism is just as uncertain as optimism. The real answer is we have no idea what's going to happen next.

But I doubt Trump is very sustainable.

The clock is ticking for that man.

 

[TestOfTide]

What has honestly changed, though? The extent of all these months of leaks has been, like you said, GOP politicians saying something half-criticial (and then proceeding to further Trump's agenda without question in Congress) and his approval hovering around where it's been since inaugurated but fluctuating a couple points when things get slightly shittier.

No changes since inauguration? You do realize that When he entered office Trump was at neutral approval, right? Nowadays he considers it a good day if his approval hits above 40% approval.

The problem is, no matter what seems to leak, everything is either met with lies or ignored. Things don't stick to this administration the way they typically would. The mere act of justified outrage becomes a partisan issue and less informed people are numbed and confused out of engagement. As much as shit has escalated in just a few months, we are basically at status quo from where we started.

It's not about the single story, it's about the constant narrative the barrage of negative stories does to Trump. Constant barrages of negative stories is what defeated Hillary Clinton. Now imagine what happens to Trump's image after 2-3 more years of this constant barrage.

Trump and the GOP have mastered the art of constructing an alternate reality. You confront them with a truth and they talk past you in return. It's not so much even that they sweep things under the rug, but they go on living as if there's nothing wrong with what happened to begin with, because no one is going to stop them.

If the GOP were the masters of constructing an alternate reality, then they wouldn't be so goddamn scared of town halls.

Trump is not going to resign, Republicans are not going to impeach him, and the Justice Department is not going to press charges against him or any of his associates. Why should we have any hope that leaks will change anything?

trump would definitely resign if he thought that staying in office put an IC and FBI target on his back. Right now he thinks he can kill the investigation by firing Comey, but Comey wasn't the only guy involved in investigating this shit. What is Trump gonna fire EVERYONE involved in the investigation? That would be ASKING for the IC and FBI to target Trump.

 

[Zolo]

What is Trump gonna fire EVERYONE involved in the investigation?

Game of Thrones:

Spoiler

Olenna once asked the same thing of Cersei.

 

[Isaac Otherworld]

No changes since inauguration? You do realize that When he entered office Trump was at neutral approval, right? Nowadays he considers it a good day if his approval hits above 40% approval.



It's not about the single story, it's about the constant narrative the barrage of negative stories does to Trump. Constant barrages of negative stories is what defeated Hillary Clinton. Now imagine what happens to Trump's image after 2-3 more years of this constant barrage.



If the GOP were the masters of constructing an alternate reality, then they wouldn't be so goddamn scared of town halls.



trump would definitely resign if he thought that staying in office put an IC and FBI target on his back. Right now he thinks he can kill the investigation by firing Comey, but Comey wasn't the only guy involved in investigating this shit. What is Trump gonna fire EVERYONE involved in the investigation? That would be ASKING for the IC and FBI to target Trump.

I personally don't see Trump standing down. He has too much pride. But I also don't think he will last the whole term. This instability isn't sustainable.

 

[KernelPanic]

That Broadsword Six guy that had the "follow the money" thread a couple of days ago
https://twitter.com/Broadsword_Six/status/863072720551985153

Dude I'd be extremely careful about getting any legit info from anonymous Twitter accounts. There's a lot of trolls and misinformation(intentional or not) out there. Even I've gotten wrapped up in a few myself(it's so easy to fall into that trap).

 

[Zolo]

I personally don't see Trump standing down. He has too much pride. But I also don't think he will last the whole term. This instability isn't sustainable.

Depends on his mental state. He may reach a point where he can't take being president anymore and just wants to lounge every day without worrying about everything surrounding him.

 

[Tovarisc]

So Trump does tape conversations.

Former Employees of Donald Trump Say They Saw Him Tape Conversations

As a businessman, Mr. Trump sometimes taped phone conversations with associates and others from his Trump Tower office in New York, according to three people who say they have direct knowledge of the recordings.

Mr. Trump had one or more recording devices that he used to tape his phone calls from his office, the three people said. All are former high-level employees who worked for Mr. Trump over a span of three decades. They said they saw devices in use recording phone calls.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/former...ay-they-saw-him-tape-conversations-1494715712

There is also allegation that he listened in on his guests telephone calls at Mar-A-Lago before he became President.

 

[Suikoguy]

There is also allegation that he listened in on his quests telephone calls at Mar-A-Lago before he became President.

Florida is a 2-party consent state for recording calls.

 

[KingV]

It was unrelated to Trump. Has to do with a lawsuit against that firm by the Ken Cuccinelli campaign.

Does the FBI serve subpoenas and warrants in civil trials? When they do so, do they typically do so in such a shock and awe way?

I honestly have no idea, but my gut says... probably not to at least on or those questions.

 

[BlastProcessing]

I think Trump thought firing Comey would stop the investigation because he assumes the FBI is organized like the Trump Org.

 

[Tovarisc]

Florida is a 2-party consent state for recording calls.

http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/06/donald-trump-eavesdropping-mar-a-lago

Trump likes to listen in anyways.

 

[Patriots7]

It's insane that this is still ongoing. Nothing was ever going to come from the investigation. Even if there is evidence, Trump is for sure shielded from it.

But people and the media continue to make this headline news.

 

[VaultBoy101]

I bet at this point Trump misses his old comfortable life as a run-of-the-mill wealthy con man. Now before this is over he's gonna end up in some seriously deep shit

Spoiler

if any Republicans grow some balls.

 

[TheOfficeMut]

It's insane that this is still ongoing. Nothing was ever going to come from the investigation. Even if there is evidence, Trump is for sure shielded from it.

But people and the media continue to make this headline news.

Are we supposed to fucking ignore if?

 

[BarringGaffner]

It's insane that this is still ongoing. Nothing was ever going to come from the investigation. Even if there is evidence, Trump is for sure shielded from it.

But people and the media continue to make this headline news.

Trump shielded from evidence = stop investigation.

Pretty stupid comment.

It's interesting that people can't believe a president and his administration will be held accountable.

 

[Shoeless]

I bet at this point Trump misses his old comfortable life as a run-of-the-mill wealthy con man. Now before this is over he's gonna end up in some seriously deep shit

Spoiler

if any Republicans grow some balls.

I think you're probably right. His past experience has been as a CEO of a company, and in the 21st century, that's about as close as you can get to a legal autocracy or dictatorship. You call all the shots, everyone answers to you, anything you don't like, you can do something about it. You have absolute authority. He assumed the Presidency was a national-level version of that and is now finding out how horribly wrong he is.

I think in the modern age, anyone that wants that kind of absolute control should concentrate on having a successful company, not attempt to run a country. Supreme executive authority these days is corporate, not government.

 

[FTF]

It's insane that this is still ongoing. Nothing was ever going to come from the investigation. Even if there is evidence, Trump is for sure shielded from it.

But people and the media continue to make this headline news.

lol ok

 

[OrangeGrayBlue]

I bet at this point Trump misses his old comfortable life as a run-of-the-mill wealthy con man. Now before this is over he's gonna end up in some seriously deep shit

Spoiler

if any Republicans grow some balls.

Ya know, despite the constant stream of bad news that has been his presidency, I've never gotten the impression in interviews that he actually regrets winning or doesn't want to be president or whatever. He seems to revel in the attention and drama of it all.

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

It's insane that this is still ongoing. Nothing was ever going to come from the investigation. Even if there is evidence, Trump is for sure shielded from it.

But people and the media continue to make this headline news.

Do you think this makes you look smart?

 

[BatDan]

Ya know, despite the constant stream of bad news that has been his presidency, I've never gotten the impression in interviews that he actually regrets winning or doesn't want to be president or whatever. He seems to revel in the attention and drama of it all.

Actually he had an interview recently where he stated that he misses his old life.

 

[Stinkles]

It's insane that this is still ongoing. Nothing was ever going to come from the investigation. Even if there is evidence, Trump is for sure shielded from it.

But people and the media continue to make this headline news.

Cool account bro

 

[RPGCrazied]

Marco Rubio‏Verified account @marcorubio 4h4 hours ago

Very encouraged that @POTUS is considering @TGowdySC & @JohnCornyn to lead @FBI either would be an excellent choice

Really? Why am I surprised though after that presidential campaign he ran. Still though pretty sad.

 

[SomewhatGroovy]

Ya know, despite the constant stream of bad news that has been his presidency, I've never gotten the impression in interviews that he actually regrets winning or doesn't want to be president or whatever. He seems to revel in the attention and drama of it all.

The idea by many out there who know him that he has done this for attention...for love...was confounding at first but it seems to be true the more we go in.

I don't entire discount the idea that what we are witnessing is Trump stirring shit up knowing it'll get people talking about him. What if there is no Russian collusion , what if he isn't so stupid politically that he wouldn't think of the consequences of his actions? What if his tax returns have nothing controversial on them but he knows withholding then prompts speculation and people talking? What if he does all this knowing how it makes people react?

I sometimes don't know what to think anymore.

 

[Lonewulfeus]

The idea by many out there who know him that he has done this for attention...for love...was confounding at first but it seems to be true the more we go in.

I don't entire discount the idea that what we are witnessing is Trump stirring shit up knowing it'll get people talking about him. What if there is no Russian collusion , what if he isn't so stupid politically that he wouldn't think of the consequences of his actions? What if his tax returns have nothing controversial on them but he knows withholding then prompts speculation and people talking? What if he does all this knowing how it makes people react?

I sometimes don't know what to think anymore.

I honestly think he's hiding his tax returns because he's not really as rich as he leads people to believe. That's his main motivation. Ultimately I think they can connect him to Russian influence as well but that doesn't concern him. Being less wealthy than he projects is the biggest issue.

 

[Host Samurai]

I honestly think he's hiding his tax returns because he's not really as rich as he leads people to believe. That's his main motivation. Ultimately I think they can connect him to Russian influence as well but that doesn't concern him. Being less wealthy than he projects is the biggest issue.

I think he's doing illegal shit and violating ethics laws on top of being financially involved with lifting sanctions.

 

[Lonewulfeus]

I think he's doing illegal shit and violating ethics laws on top of being financially involved with lifting sanctions.

I believe that as well but I don't think he's worried about that being proven it's his perceived wealth that motivates the hiding of his taxes

 

[SomewhatGroovy]

I honestly think he's hiding his tax returns because he's not really as rich as he leads people to believe. That's his main motivation. Ultimately I think they can connect him to Russian influence as well but that doesn't concern him. Being less wealthy than he projects is the biggest issue.

It's an interesting thought. Thanks.