TheRealTalker
Banned
wait I am hearing a 86% turnout
that means literally a bunch of people switched sides to the AKP
that means literally a bunch of people switched sides to the AKP
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Turkish General Election 2015 Round 2: Eurasian Boogaloo. Sunday November 1st.
- Thread starter Stereogatari
- Start date
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corduroygt
Banned
Only if you're a muslim
Have you ever been to Turkey? The only thing the two counties have in common is the moronic 10% election threshold.
Anyway, I'm surprised that AKP is getting 2011 numbers and winning provinces like Eskisehir and Canakkale.
Stereogatari
Banned
I'm not a Muslim. I was in Turkey over the Summer. I went to a nightclub full of chicks wearing sexy clothes, local beer flowing endlessly. I never went to prayers. Islam a subject that barely if ever came up in conversation with fellow Turks. Beaches were full of bikini wearing Turkish girls (most of them believing MUSLIMS! :O). AKP are a whole load of fuckeries, but they aren't legislating against Western lifestyle choices. They'd lose a lot of their own voter base if they did that haha.
TheRealTalker
Banned
wow corduroygt I am starting to pity you
you lost in the Syria thread and now lost here too.... stop posting, and go to a library
it will help you in the long run
you lost in the Syria thread and now lost here too.... stop posting, and go to a library
it will help you in the long run
corduroygt
Banned
Don't need pity from people who think gays and women are inferior, thank you.
As for Sterogatari, the only think Islamic countries love more than their religion is money, that's why you can go to a resort in Egypt and have bikini girls etc.
If anyone wants to know where I'm coming from, please watch this 4 minute video by Bill Maher:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvvQJ_zsL1U
This is what bothers me. Especially when my fellow liberals treat Islam as a protected group. I mean it's OK to berate Republicans for to their anti-gay, anti-women beliefs, why not isn't it OK to do the same to Islam for the same beliefs?
Back on topic, this result will pull Turkey more towards Islamic rule. However it wouldn't become like Iran probably.
TheRealTalker
Banned
lol at least you gave up on the whole infidel murdering thing
also Bill Maher lol you speak of people wanting and loving money but Bill is the number one click baiter BS host I know
I can also go on and on explaining your other bait tossing but quite honestly we got complaints for derailing the other thread (rightly so) so we shouldn't derail this one
you just need to go and research man... seriously you really do and not from someone like that person in your link lol
it is like me going to learn about the greatness of burgers from a pizza guy who hates burgers
since you were proven wrong
also Bill Maher lol you speak of people wanting and loving money but Bill is the number one click baiter BS host I know
I can also go on and on explaining your other bait tossing but quite honestly we got complaints for derailing the other thread (rightly so) so we shouldn't derail this one
you just need to go and research man... seriously you really do and not from someone like that person in your link lol
it is like me going to learn about the greatness of burgers from a pizza guy who hates burgers
corduroygt
Banned
You don't throw a frog in boiling water, you put it in room temperature water and slowly heat it up.
By the way, this man has a point LOL:
https://twitter.com/geertwilderspvv/status/660922004300779520
You're saying the AKP has a secret long-term plan to slowly but surely turn Turkey from a secular state into a theocracy?
Because I was just gonna go with Erdogan being a corrupt power hungry jackass, something for which there is actual evidence.
corduroygt
Banned
It's not Erdogan per se (which you are 100% correct on and I agree with), the underlying public except for the 25% wants a theocracy due to Erdogan's counter-reforms. And it would make it even easier to control the people if it were a theocracy. So while he's not actively trying that, the wheels are pointing in that direction.
TheRealTalker
Banned
You're saying 75% of people in Turkey want a theocratic state? Wuh? Since when?
Proof? Are you saying that the ~50% of Americans that vote for the GOP also want a Theocratic state? Or the people who vote for the Christian Democratic Party in Germany? Are the AKP just different because they're muslim?
corduroygt
Banned
Much as I may disagree with the sentiments expressed there, nothing in that suggests they want to establish a theocratic state. Link an actual source on your theocracy claim.
corduroygt
Banned
I interpreted the poll as one, since that's what they prefer their women to be dressed like, and wouldn't mind laws dictating such. AKP's support comes directly because of how the public is, sad but truth. People want more conservative islamic leaders. That will only lead to one place, maybe not with Erdogan, not with his successor, but eventually, it will be.
gutter_trash
Banned
Turkey, why are you reverting backwards?
Probably the saving grace of the whole election. The AK Party is not as uniform as it appears, and secularism is more entrenched than I think outsiders realize. That said, Erdogan is actively retarding the progress of the country, and yet again, a war appeal swings an election.
I can't speak to what corduroy is referring to, but if he is referring to Turkish women wearing the niqab, it is uncommon in Turkey (and legally banned).
Baron Doggystyle von Woof
Member
They are not. Turks are not stupid they know what they vote for.
Go to turkey, it's a liberal country. Even more liberal then some European or American states.
Turkey is both deceptively modern and deceptively conservative. I love the country and can't wait to go back.
I basically go every few years but the country has drastically improved over the last fifteen years. Erdogan has played a part in that but his political career needs to have ended already. If he had left 5 years ago he would have been remembered as one of the greats...
But now he's basically living long enough to see himself become a villain.
I basically go every few years but the country has drastically improved over the last fifteen years. Erdogan has played a part in that but his political career needs to have ended already. If he had left 5 years ago he would have been remembered as one of the greats...
But now he's basically living long enough to see himself become a villain.
hooijdonk17
Member
Surprising results; the government's simple policy of intimidating the populace by fostering insecurity paid off and stimulated the conservative voter base to rally into re-voting them into office.
Not what I expected, not what I would have liked, but it will do. They will now have to face the 2016 economic crisis alone.
Not what I expected, not what I would have liked, but it will do. They will now have to face the 2016 economic crisis alone.
Stereogatari
Banned
There will not be an economic crisis with them in charge. Nutjob Erdoğan may be the figurehead, but the cabinet has a several smart university educated people (some Western educated).
hooijdonk17
Member
I'm talking about the huge China shitstorm at the gates that everyone keeps ignoring.
corduroygt
Banned
Nope,
The economic growth in Turkey was due to easy credit that was given to all developed nations in the beginning of the millenium. While countries like Korea used this to invest in technology and education, Turkey used it for infrastructure and wasted some on religion. Now Turkey's caught in the middle-income trap and it's not a competitive location for foreign investment. Seeing this, Erdogan got in bed with the Saudis in exchange for supporting Salafists in Syria (ISIS). But now that money is drying up due to oil prices.
Canis lupus
Member
You know nothing about Turkey. The Anatolian Islam of Turks is their culture, nutjobs like the taliban or isis etc can never gain a foothold in Turkey. Turkish Islam never gave rise to extremism for 1100 years since accepting the religion. The Ottoman Empire was a haven for persecuted jews and sects of christians fleeing Europe. It is the reason why Eastern Europe still retains their language and religion, because the Ottomans could've made everyone forcefully muslim like the Europeans in their colonies.
There is nothing wrong with headscarved women. They were a marginalized group, now they can go to university etc. Seeing them on the streets is only a good thing, since they have business somewhere and not tucked away at home by their husband like it happens elsewhere.
What easy credit are you talking about. Taking credit is never easy. The IMF opened the credit taps to overcome the 2001 crisis but prescribed "the bitterest pill to Turkey ever in its history". It tamed the Treasury with fiscal discipline, eliminated bankrupt banks and tamed the system. It cleared the road for privatizations, etc. Turkey could never have grown from 200 to being a $800bn economy with just the $11bn it loaned from IMF. "they used the money to make roads and religion". You really believe the bullshit you write? Considering the instable shithole Turkey is surrounded by currently, Greek bankruptcy in the west, war in the north, war in the south and east, 2.5 million refugees. I'd say it's impressive Turkey is functioning at all, let alone still be considered an emerging nation. Once peace returns Turkey will come out of this stronger, as the regional leader should be.
This is a good point.
Turkey has seen economic prosperity and stability under the leadership of AKP and lots of people feel like their vote matters now. There is nothing wrong with moderate religious people and that is what most people who vote for AKP are.
That doesn't mean I agree with Erdogan. I think he is a bully and too quick to use the justice system in order to suppress dissent.
Stereogatari
Banned
Too many people are ignorant of the fact that Anatolian Islam of the Turks is a whole different beast and ballgame compared to the modern regressive Islamist movements that have root in places like Pakistan and Bangladesh. I mean our Empire actually fought against the Wahabbis, in fact the Wahabbis were founded as an antithesis to the Turkish Caliphate for being too Westernised. That Saudi shit will never fly in Turkey.
This is an amazing point. When seeing videos of Turkish streets it's normal to see headscarved women travelling themselves or in their friendship groups. To judge that just because they wear headscarf and support AKP that they are in favour of hardcore misogynistic sharia, is very alarmist and generalises Turkey with the rest of the Muslim World. Turkey is its own thing, people (especially Turks themselves) have to accept that and stop tugging us one way or the other.
corduroygt
Banned
I know a lot about Turkey my friend, Do you remember Sivas 1993, how about Maras in the 70's? How about just a few weeks ago when the salafist Erdogan govt allowed ISIS to blow up 100+ people just a few blocks from the governmental palace? This is Turkish national Islam and some of its massacres.
I disagree with the first part but agree about the second, they should be allowed to study so they can see how crap Islam is eventually.
It's not just the IMF lol, there was massive liquidity expansion in the world in the 2000's and that went to many avenues including bad loans in the USA and high interest loans in the developing countries. Turkey made pretty much no investment in science, technology or art. There is a good reason why Turkish Nobel prize winners don't live in Turkey.
Please compare the budgets of the ministry of religion vs, education, art, health and come back to me. Also, peace will not return, not with the current status quo.
Canis lupus
Member
What xenophobic conspiracy website are you visiting to spout such bullshit? Some of these Erdogan haters are so salty they lost all reasoning lol.
So you were talking out of your ass then, since you failed to specify what this easy credit was. In reality foreign investors took money out of Turkey at the beginning of the century, which lead to the crisis.
I asked you a question, don't change the subject. Turkey grew from 200bn to $800bn, people's income quadrupled to 12k. How did this happen. They didn't get there by building roads. What nonsense do you have left to discredit AKP's economic success.
RustyNails
Member
Goddamn that's a massive accusation. You better have clean and clear evidence to back up that claim.
Barajas_201
Member
Was Turkey Election Rigged?
TYT sheds some light on what's going on, very interesting. I see a lot of similarities to Mexico, I hope the APK can't change the constitution.
TYT sheds some light on what's going on, very interesting. I see a lot of similarities to Mexico, I hope the APK can't change the constitution.
Yeah, the only thing we know for sure is that Erdogan provided material support to ISIS, not that he directed their actions.
EDIT: Also what's with Erdogan's obsession with Gülen? Oppressing the media, interfering with the executive and judical branches, etc all get justified with "they're connected to Gülen". Is there any actual legitimacy to that reason or is Erdogan just fucking crazy?
MisterFalcon
Member
Turkey seems so powerless whenever ISIS is involved. Tens of thousands of foreign fighters went through Turkey to Syria unimpeded and hundreds of truckloads of fertilizer with them to make huge car bombs. Compared to the brutal force that's employed whenever Kurds are involved it's hard to argue Turkey is unable to do anything, they just don't want to as ISIS is fighting two of Erdogan's mortal enemies.
corduroygt
Banned
Pro-Erdogan poster eh, welcome to my ignore list. I don't argue with people who support a theiving and murdering dictator, there is no reasonable discussion to be had with such.
Stereogatari
Banned
Tbf Western countries also seem powerless against ISIS, letting their citizens leave for them very easily.
Also stop calling them "Kurds". They are PKK and are in no way representative of the Kurdish population.
Gülen and Erdoğan are both Islamists that want to rule Turkey with an iron fist.
Heavy's Sandvich
Member
corduroygt
Banned
Only a dictator would make the cops raid the offices of the press that criticized him, not a normal ruler.
MisterFalcon
Member
Yes, Western countries should ban on all travel to Turkey.
Stereogatari
Banned
Well no. Otherwise how will me and the millions of other Turks go home every Summer
. But they should be smarter. If some non-Turkish Muslim youth are heading to Turkey, especially when it's not in the Summer (or non-Muslim youth on their own or something) they should be a bit more rigorous and stricter about checks.
Yup. MHP Nationalists who enjoyed AKP's harsher stance on the Kurdish issue and Kurdish HDP voters who were upset that HDP weren't harsher on the PKK.
MisterFalcon
Member
Well no. Otherwise how will me and the millions of other Turks go home every Summer
But they should be smarter. If some non-Turkish Muslim youth are heading to Turkey, especially when it's not in the Summer (or non-Muslim youth on their own or something) they should be a bit more rigorous and stricter about checks.
Absolutely. But you can't just state 'well the West is also not doing enough' and somehow hide the fact behind that how Turkey's non interference has been vital in ISIS being able to exist. As you say there is a legitimate stream of millions of people traveling to Turkey for people to hide in. There is no legitimate stream of oil exports from ISIS held territories to Turkey or tourists to Raqqa for ISIS to hide in, it's 100% run by ISIS and should have been stopped years ago.
Heavy's Sandvich
Member
Is David Cameron a dictator then when he did the same with the Guardian (and more recently with a BBC journalist)?
corduroygt
Banned
Did the police raid the Guardian because of a cartoon of Cameron? If not, the situation is not comparable. I also looked at your post history and decided it's fruitless to argue with you as well.
Heavy's Sandvich
Member
Goalposts are moving.
Just wanted to clarify your definition of dictator
If you clamp down on newspapers because of whistleblowers - not dictator
If you clamp down because of cartoons = dictator
Catatafish
Banned
So much salt in here. congrats to the AKP.
You mean take a vacation in the country they don't actually want to live.Well no. Otherwise how will me and the millions of other Turks go home every Summer
MisterFalcon
Member
Was The Guardian shut down ? Were the editors replaced by a someone picked by the government ?
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