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Twitter Death Watch |OT| How long until the bird dies?

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Nobody_Important

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
strange headache said:
So much for the "advertisers are leaving Twitter" narrative:
Click to expand...
Try again. The article you posted only cover the immediate reaction to his take over. The advertisers pulling out are a more recent occurence.

endpts.com

Eli Lilly pulls millions in Twitter advertising after fake account debacle — report

Eli Lilly is pulling its millions in ad spending on Twitter after last week’s fake posts debacle, according to a news report. When an imposter Lilly account with a
endpts.com endpts.com

www.theverge.com

Another major ad agency recommends pausing Twitter ad campaigns

Twitter under Elon Musk isn’t safe for brands, agency says.
www.theverge.com www.theverge.com

www.reuters.com

Advertisers react to Twitter's new ownership

Advertisers are grappling with Twitter's new ownership under Tesla boss Elon Musk, who once tweeted "I hate advertising".
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com

www.nytimes.com

Elon Musk’s Twitter Faces Exodus of Advertisers and Executives

At least five Twitter executives have left in recent days, as one of the world’s largest ad companies said clients should pause spending on the social media platform.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com

www.wsj.com

Elon Musk Tries to Convince Wary Advertisers to Stay on Twitter

The social-media site’s new owner laid out potential features such as payment options and long-form video during a question-and-answer event.
www.wsj.com www.wsj.com



Nice try though 👍
 
strange headache

strange headache

Banned
Nobody_Important said:
Try again. The article you posted only cover the immediate reaction to his take over. The advertisers pulling out are a more recent occurence.

endpts.com

Eli Lilly pulls millions in Twitter advertising after fake account debacle — report

Eli Lilly is pulling its millions in ad spending on Twitter after last week’s fake posts debacle, according to a news report. When an imposter Lilly account with a
endpts.com endpts.com

www.theverge.com

Another major ad agency recommends pausing Twitter ad campaigns

Twitter under Elon Musk isn’t safe for brands, agency says.
www.theverge.com www.theverge.com

www.reuters.com

Advertisers react to Twitter's new ownership

Advertisers are grappling with Twitter's new ownership under Tesla boss Elon Musk, who once tweeted "I hate advertising".
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com

www.nytimes.com

Elon Musk’s Twitter Faces Exodus of Advertisers and Executives

At least five Twitter executives have left in recent days, as one of the world’s largest ad companies said clients should pause spending on the social media platform.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com

www.wsj.com

Elon Musk Tries to Convince Wary Advertisers to Stay on Twitter

The social-media site’s new owner laid out potential features such as payment options and long-form video during a question-and-answer event.
www.wsj.com www.wsj.com



Nice try though 👍
Click to expand...

Did you just google "advertisers leaving twitter" or actually read them? None of these articles provide any numbers, or specific reasons as as why these advertisers are pausing their campaigns. Some advertisers leaving doesn't mean that Twitter ad revenue is going down, as other advertisers have increased their expenditures or new advertisers have joined.

Also it's completely normal for brands to pause campaigns during M&A. Doesn't mean that they are boycotting Musk.

Nobody_Important said:
endpts.com

Eli Lilly pulls millions in Twitter advertising after fake account debacle — report

Eli Lilly is pulling its millions in ad spending on Twitter after last week’s fake posts debacle, according to a news report. When an imposter Lilly account with a
endpts.com endpts.com
Click to expand...

The Eli Lilly Twitter drama lead to them admitting that insulin prices are too high and need to be lowered.

Nobody_Important said:
www.theverge.com

Another major ad agency recommends pausing Twitter ad campaigns

Twitter under Elon Musk isn’t safe for brands, agency says.
www.theverge.com www.theverge.com
Click to expand...

This article is about some firm recommending to pull ads, not that ads are being pulled.

Nobody_Important said:
www.reuters.com

Advertisers react to Twitter's new ownership

Advertisers are grappling with Twitter's new ownership under Tesla boss Elon Musk, who once tweeted "I hate advertising".
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com
Click to expand...

These are a handful of medium sized advertisers, many of which paused their ads on Nov. 4, so before the article that I've posted.

Nobody_Important said:
www.wsj.com

Elon Musk Tries to Convince Wary Advertisers to Stay on Twitter

The social-media site’s new owner laid out potential features such as payment options and long-form video during a question-and-answer event.
www.wsj.com www.wsj.com
Click to expand...

This article isn't even about advertisers boycotting twitter.
 
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phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
strange headache said:
So much for the "advertisers are leaving Twitter" narrative:

Or c) they were fired legally with due respect to procedure. Why would he not be aware of employment laws in Europe? Dude just opened a Giga factory in Berlin. You really think he's dumber than us? Also that twitter account posted no sources whatsoever.
Click to expand...

It's a bit early to tell with the advertising figures. That report only covers the seven days before v the seven days after Oct 27th. Ad spend is usually committed at considerably more than a weeks notice, so it is hardly surprising there's no immediate impact. We'd need to see, I guess, monthly figures at least before really seeing what is going on.

"Fired legally with due respect to procedure" does not square with reports that staff have been told that they had 'resigned' by not clicking yes on an email, nor with the notification and consultation requirements for mass layoffs that apply in many, maybe most European countries (and also California I think). So while it is, I guess, possible that some staff have been fired in accordance with law and procedure, there are significant and credible suggestions that many were not. It'll probably take a few weeks to get definitive information out on that.
 
Trazyn the Infinite

Trazyn the Infinite

Member
Nobody_Important said:
Try again. The article you posted only cover the immediate reaction to his take over. The advertisers pulling out are a more recent occurence.

[/URL]

[/URL]

[/URL]

[/URL]

[/URL]



Nice try though 👍
Click to expand...
Do you know how to read?
 
D

Deleted member 1159

Unconfirmed Member
strange headache said:
Or c) they were fired legally with due respect to procedure.
Click to expand...
Given how manic and all over the place he’s seemed throughout this whole thing, that seems unlikely. I doubt the “click yes to work slave hours or quit” email followed any due respect to procedure. But maybe it did.

strange headache said:
Why would he not be aware of employment laws in Europe? Dude just opened a Giga factory in Berlin. You really think he's dumber than us? Also that twitter account posted no sources whatsoever.
Click to expand...
It’s more that I doubt he bothers educating himself about something he sees as minutia. If I had a dollar for every time an exec got over their skis without realizing what regs would need to be adhered to, I’d be retired by now instead of constantly correcting their assumptions about how easily something is done (and that’s times a hundred in EU)
 
strange headache

strange headache

Banned
phisheep said:
We'd need to see, I guess, monthly figures at least before really seeing what is going on.
Click to expand...

True, it is a developing situation. I was merely taking issue with people already proclaiming that advertisers are leaving Twitter in droves, when in fact their ad revenue went up almost 20% following Elon's takeover.

Thaedolus said:
It’s more that I doubt he bothers educating himself about something he sees as minutia.
Click to expand...

That's pure speculation and your shared twee still has no source whatsoever for that claim.
Do you actually think that Musk his manually firing each employee himself? He makes the decision, his army of lawyers execute.
 
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Bitmap Frogs

Bitmap Frogs

Mr. Community
strange headache said:
If that's working as intended, the platform is already doomed to fail as it will regress into infinitely fragmented tribalistic communities and information bubbles.
Click to expand...

You see, that's the beauty of it.... if server A and server B are federated and both are federated to server C and server A blocks federation with server C, Server B is still federated with both Server A and Server C... it does not fragment!

phisheep said:
I'm settling in quite nicely at Mastadon on a small, relatively quiet server (though it is rapidly getting bigger with emigres like me).

The way I think of it is if Twitter is the town square, Mastadon is all the different pubs that surround it. Sure I want to hear all the news or pick a fight I'll be out in the square with the rest of 'em. But if I fancy a chat or it gets too rough out there for me, I'll duck into a pub. Doesn't really matter that I can't talk to all the people in all the other pubs at the same time - that's not what pubs are for.

As for what's going on at Twitter, I'm rather horrified. I've been through a few takeovers myself, and run many more of them, and this seems a textbook example of how not to do it.
Click to expand...

I'm glad you found a solution that works for you!
 
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strange headache

strange headache

Banned
Bitmap Frogs said:
You see, that's the beauty of it.... if server A and server B are federated and both are federated to server C and server A blocks federation with server C, Server B is still federated with both Server A and Server C... it does not fragment!
Click to expand...

Calculate Figure It Out GIF
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
A big part of the problem, it seems to me, is that Musk totally waived the due diligence phase of entering into the purchase. You do due diligence for two things (a) to get the terms of the purchase and the price right, and (b) to formulate your plan of how to handle the takeover. All the information you gather there goes into making not just the contract a good one, but also the transition a successful one - so that you know how big your transition team needs to be, how you are going to resource it, where it has to operate, which things you are going to do really fast on day 1 and which things you need to work at over a longer period, where your cost and revenue exposures are, what are their dependencies. And you work all that out before deciding who to fire and how fast.

Doing without that was probably a mistake.
 
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Nobody_Important

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
strange headache said:
Did you just google "advertisers leaving twitter" or actually read them? None of these articles provide any numbers, or specific reasons as as why these advertisers are pausing their campaigns. Some advertisers leaving doesn't mean that Twitter ad revenue is going down, as other advertisers have increased their expenditures or new advertisers have joined.

Also it's completely normal for brands to pause campaigns during M&A. Doesn't mean that they are boycotting Musk.
Click to expand...
I did read them. You apparently did not.

In the NYT article for example IPG (one of the largest advertising agencies there is) is pulling out due to moderation concerns. That is directly tied to Musks decisions.

Also from the NYT article

The Global Alliance for Responsible Media, a coalition of platforms, advertisers and industry groups that is fighting harmful content on social media, also said this week that it was monitoring how Twitter planned to deal with content moderation.
Click to expand...

And another from the NYT article

Katie Klumper, the chief executive of Black Glass, a consulting firm owned by IPG, said the company had surveyed many of its clients, which include Walmart, Pepsi and Cadillac. Most of them said they were planning to pause their spending on Twitter until they had more confidence and clarity on the platform’s direction, she said.
Click to expand...


In the Reuters article GM is pausing it's adverts until it can "understand the direction of the platform under their new ownership." Which is fairly easy to interpret as being moderation related be due to Musk being very clear about it's direction and it's moderation policies (or lack thereof)

Also from the Reuters article

Gilead Sciences (GILD.O)

The HIV drugmaker and its unit Kite are in the "process of pausing advertising" on Twitter, monitoring its ad spending and waiting to better understand how community standards and content moderation will be handled.


Havas Media Group

Havas Media Group, Vivendi's (VIV.PA) advertising unit, is recommending that its clients "temporarily pause their Twitter ads in the U.S. because of concerns about the company's ability to monitor its content", the Wall Street Journal reported.


Mondelez International (MDLZ.O)

The maker of Oreos has paused advertising on Twitter, CEO Dirk Van de Put told Reuters in an interview, saying the "amount of hate speech increased significantly" since Musk's takeover.

Omnicon (OMC.N)

The advertising conglomerate that serves over 5,000 clients in 70 countries, including McDonald's Corp (MCD.N) and Apple (AAPL.O), recommended that clients pause their spending on Twitter in the short term. "Twitter's ability to maintain their previous level of brand safety measures and effectiveness seem impeded in the immediate term," it said.


In the Eli Lilly article it's covered that they are pulling their adverts due to what happened when a troll account using the $8 blue check impersonated them and cost them billions of dollars in stock value.



It is abundantly clear why advertisers are leaving. Should I keep going or do you just want to go ahead and admit you're wrong? 🤷‍♂️
 
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D

Deleted member 1159

Unconfirmed Member
strange headache said:
That's pure speculation and your shared twee still has no source whatsoever for that claim.
Do you actually think that Musk his manually firing each employee himself? He makes the decision, his army of lawyers execute.
Click to expand...
It’s more of an informed opinion based on his clownish behavior since…well even before the acquisition, and based on my experience with EU regs. And as another poster already pointed out, the regs will differ by country even within the EU (which is true of my experience as well).

So, I think it’s reasonable to assume his ridiculous ultimatum e-mail violated employment laws in EU countries. I could be wrong, and ultimately the legality of it is irrelevant to how ridiculous it was, but whatevs. I’m just here for the lulz, I’m not dedicated to seeing daddy Elon succeed or fail as some seem to be.

In my experience when people are trying to suss out how actions that are prima facie irrational are actually 4D chess it’s actually just a good indication they’re just irrational actions.
 
U

Unknown Soldier

Member


I'm starting to believe Elon might actually pull this off. His people need to figure out the spaghetti codebase before something bad happens but if they can do it, the user base is locked in there with Elon and he knows it.
 
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
Clear said:
Is it "hate speech" or just speech they hate though?
Click to expand...
Advertisers tend to be rather hard-headed about these things, so that's not quite the right framing.

They'll be considering
(a) whether it might damage their corporate brand
(b) whether it might drive potential customers away from the platform and so decrease the price they are willing to pay

In the long run, both are geared to and assessed by sales figures. In the short run it is rather more like guesswork and risk-assessment.
 
U

Unknown Soldier

Member
DragoonKain said:
To recap the week:

"Elon is a disaster, so many people are gonna leave Twitter!" (no one did)

"Twitter is dying it won't last the weekend!" (it did)

Sounds like business as usual to me.
Click to expand...
It's funny to realize that actually moving to Canada is not easy and so the threats in 2016 were kind of hilarious in retrospect.

Actually leaving Twitter is just...logging out and not looking at it ever again.

And that's too hard for these people.

It really is exactly like this:
 
DragoonKain

DragoonKain

Neighbours from Hell
Kacho said:
Still waiting for the mass migration to Mastodon.
Click to expand...
Hasn't happened, won't happen. It's the social media equivalent of "I hate this game, I'm never playing it again!" as they proceed to click continue to give the boss another attempt.

Butt hurt people throwing tantrums that their favorite social media platform no longer leans heavily to them ideologically, and they're going through it right now.
 
Nobody_Important

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
Trazyn the Infinite said:
Do you know how to read?
Click to expand...
Do you? See below. It's clear why advertisers are stepping away from the circus to see what happens. The admitted lack of moderation concerning hate speech and other offensive content has them worried. Especially since such a policy breaks the law in many places.

Nobody_Important said:
I did read them. You apparently did not.

In the NYT article for example IPG (one of the largest advertising agencies there is) is pulling out due to moderation concerns. That is directly tied to Musks decisions.

Also from the NYT article



And another from the NYT article




In the Reuters article GM is pausing it's adverts until it can "understand the direction of the platform under their new ownership." Which is fairly easy to interpret as being moderation related be due to Musk being very clear about it's direction and it's moderation policies (or lack thereof)

Also from the Reuters article

Gilead Sciences (GILD.O)

The HIV drugmaker and its unit Kite are in the "process of pausing advertising" on Twitter, monitoring its ad spending and waiting to better understand how community standards and content moderation will be handled.


Havas Media Group

Havas Media Group, Vivendi's (VIV.PA) advertising unit, is recommending that its clients "temporarily pause their Twitter ads in the U.S. because of concerns about the company's ability to monitor its content", the Wall Street Journal reported.


Mondelez International (MDLZ.O)

The maker of Oreos has paused advertising on Twitter, CEO Dirk Van de Put told Reuters in an interview, saying the "amount of hate speech increased significantly" since Musk's takeover.

Omnicon (OMC.N)

The advertising conglomerate that serves over 5,000 clients in 70 countries, including McDonald's Corp (MCD.N) and Apple (AAPL.O), recommended that clients pause their spending on Twitter in the short term. "Twitter's ability to maintain their previous level of brand safety measures and effectiveness seem impeded in the immediate term," it said.


In the Eli Lilly article it's covered that they are pulling their adverts due to what happened when a troll account using the $8 blue check impersonated them and cost them billions of dollars in stock value.



It is abundantly clear why advertisers are leaving. Should I keep going or do you just want to go ahead and admit you're wrong? 🤷‍♂️
Click to expand...
 
The Book Reader

The Book Reader

Banned
Nobody_Important said:
Doesn't mean it doesn't exist though.
Click to expand...
You’re right, I should probably have not said it doesn’t. I guess I just don’t understand why people should just up and leave. It’s almost like a certain political agenda squeezed as much juice out of a lemon as it could , and as soon as something came along that reset the status quo, it was time to burn it down. It’s just really telling of an echo chamber mentality.
 
Last edited:
Nobody_Important

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
The Book Reader said:
You’re right, I should probably have not said it doesn’t. I guess I just don’t understand why people should just up and leave. It’s almost like a certain political agenda squeezed as much juice out of a lemon as it could , and as soon as something came along that reset the status quo, it was time to burn it down. It’s just really telling of an echo chamber mentality.
Click to expand...
Because terrible decisions are being made? The site is unbanning horrible people? The site is no longer really moderating hate speech and other bigoted content and is instead just not "super boosting" it?


There are plenty of reasons why some people or some companies don't want to be a part of Twitter right now.
 
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The Book Reader

The Book Reader

Banned
Nobody_Important said:
Because terrible decisions are being made? The site is unbanning horrible people? The site is no longer really moderating hate speech and other bigoted content and is instead just not "super boosting" it?


There are plenty of reasons why someone or some company doesnt want to be a part of Twitter right now.
Click to expand...
As if any of that never existed before on Twitter.. As if it doesn’t exist on mastodon, or any other corner of the world, right?
 
Last edited:
phisheep

phisheep

NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
The Book Reader said:
You’re right, I should probably have not said it doesn’t. I guess I just don’t understand why people should just up and leave. It’s almost like a certain political agenda squeezed as much juice out of a lemon as it could , and as soon as something came along that reset the status quo, it was time to burn it down. It’s just really telling of an echo chamber mentality.
Click to expand...

Not so much a political agenda, as a matter of where the people are that you want to interact with. Many of the people I follow on Twitter have already found new platforms - mostly on Mastadon. I'm hanging around there partly to see what happens and partly to see where the rest of them end up so I can follow them there.

I suspect a bunch of journalists and news outlets will hang on the longest, as they really need the mass market to be viable at all, and they'll take clicks wherever they can find them.

But this is the thing that Musk seems not to get. Twitter isn't a tech company, it is a people company. And Elon's really not that much of a people person no matter how much he claims to love humanity and want us to emigrate to Mars for the greater good.
 
U

Unknown Soldier

Member
SJRB said:
Mastodon is just fucking weird. Even the sign-up process is super obtuse. You need to select a specific server or whatever, but some servers are locked meaning you can't join that server but you can make an account on another server and then join the first server. Mastodon.social apparently is the place to be but that place closed registrations. So you make a social media platform but restrict people from joining.

Everything is decentralized, fragmenting the userbase. Some servers can be accessed, some not. How and why? No idea. Not to mention a lot of servers are run by mods or admins with a god complex.

How anyone thinks Mastodon is a solid replacement for Twitter is beyond me. Surely anyone doing 5 minutes of research sees these glaring issues.
Click to expand...
Mastodon is like Reddit except somehow worse.

Still, the only way to find out is by fucking around, so let people fuck around I guess.
 
Nobody_Important

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
The Book Reader said:
As if any of that never existed before on Twitter.. As if it doesn’t exist on mastodon, or any other corner of the world, right?
Click to expand...
Not at all. It's just on a MUCH larger and more publicly blatant scale. Twitter never actually allowed any of this garbage, but was too poorly moderated to actually keep up with it all. It could only get the big fish that stood out and the posts that got reported into oblivion.

But now Musk is publicly saying it's allowed, but just won't be "super boosted". Not only that he has upended the verification system that was previously pretty handy with his insane $8 Twitter Blue nonsense and allowed trolls to rule the roost with it. Not only that but despite it's admitted failure he is bringing it back.


Basically Twitter was pretty bad before, but it's just plain worse now. Which has caused a lot of people to search elsewhere for a replacement outright or just in case Musk can't get things under control. It's why we have seen various personalities and brands start advertising their TikToks and their Instagrams this past week. They want to establish another foothold in case the house of cards finally falls or if they decide to commit to leaving.
 
Last edited:
Guilty_AI

Guilty_AI

Member
Dee Dah Dave said:
Just checked in with the reeeetards for a giggle.

Apparently it is free speech that is THE gateway to authoritarianism. These kids are completely lost.
Click to expand...
These people love their "paradox of tolerance" to justify forceful action, which is ironic since Karl Popper's himself said we shouldn't supress different opinions regardless of how "intolerant" they were.

Even bigger irony is that he says such "intolerant" people should only be supressed when they start denying conversation altogether. Y'know, if they were to, for example, start denouncing all argument against their preachings or started forcefully blocking the voice of people arguing against them.
 
Last edited:
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