Thornton Reed
Member
potentially but i think this shows they are going to hammer this narrative between now and Thursday
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UK General Election - 8th June 2017 |OT| - The Red Wedding
- Thread starter Jezbollah
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potentially but i think this shows they are going to hammer this narrative between now and Thursday
Huw_Dawson
Member
I'll admit that Farron's not been the best at getting the message out. We could have done much better nationally this campaign.
Hopefully with UKIP wiped out and the LDs getting a solid result in terms of vote share in the past locals (and hopefully gaining seats in the General) the LDs will be a bit more visible politically over the next few years - especially as they'll be the main pro-EU voice.
But frankly this election has all been about Corbyn vs May, and I think everyone knows that.
Hopefully with UKIP wiped out and the LDs getting a solid result in terms of vote share in the past locals (and hopefully gaining seats in the General) the LDs will be a bit more visible politically over the next few years - especially as they'll be the main pro-EU voice.
But frankly this election has all been about Corbyn vs May, and I think everyone knows that.
Hot Coldman
Banned
Worth a punt really, eh? Not like they're predicted to win right now.
killer_clank
Member
I'd think Clegg is pretty safe in Hallam tbh, last time Labour ran a decapitation strategy based on Lib Dem anger and it almost worked but at heart it's a fairly wealthy constituency (despite the inner city sounding name it's fairly well to do and doesn't have all that many students).
WhateverItTakes
Banned
I reckon they know the conservatives are on the back foot, and feel their best chance of success is to go up a gear and keep pushing. I can't disagree really, it's all about going hard as the challenger, especially in This election.
Huw_Dawson
Member
Yeah, I'd say Leeds North West is a more likely loss, as it has a really big youth population.
War Peaceman
You're a big guy.
It would be a shame for Clegg to go. For all the flaws of the LDs in coalition, I do believe him to be a talented and well meaning MP. If we had many more like him the country would be much better served.
The BBC are running an interview with man who says he called the anti-terror hotline about one of the london attackers a year ago and nothing was done. They've asked the MET for comment, I think that's why there's all these ex-security people out blaming May today, the MET is doing what it does and circling the waggons, they'll do everything they can to make sure the public blames funding levels and not whatever decision making led to this guy not being arrested before he did something.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-40159360/they-didn-t-get-back-to-me
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-40159360/they-didn-t-get-back-to-me
Anyone with an admin job can tell you that mistakes happen when there is more work than can be done in the available time you have. The only ways to fix it are to improve efficiency (which isn't necessarily possible) or to employ more staff.
Jezbollah
Member
Agreed on both points. Labour really have nothing left to lose here.
Whoa. That soundcloud snippet with Pierce Morgan that was linked earlier in this thread is cathartic. Can't you guys have more people like him on TV/radio/newspapers? May and her empty vapid slogans would have gone under ages ago, if you had.
On the other hand, more like him would probably sink Corbyn with his nuclear nine trauma as well. And the LibDem guy with his faith problem. But maybe that'd be for the better?
//News: insidious German spy arrested by UK Cyber Police, sentenced to 15 years of 128kbit/s PG-13 internet for "inciting a revolution" and "trying to influence UK elections" on a video game board.
On the other hand, more like him would probably sink Corbyn with his nuclear nine trauma as well. And the LibDem guy with his faith problem. But maybe that'd be for the better?
//News: insidious German spy arrested by UK Cyber Police, sentenced to 15 years of 128kbit/s PG-13 internet for "inciting a revolution" and "trying to influence UK elections" on a video game board.
I fear with Morgan, it's a case of a broken clock occasionally looking like it's correct.
Jezbollah
Member
Thread's jumped the shark, gents.
EDIT: OT2 title: "Call Pierce Morgan, Bake Off's on BBC2"?
Huw_Dawson
Member
Shocking news: Corbyn calls on May to resign.
Man this election keeps on being so weird!
Man this election keeps on being so weird!
You really, REALLY, want *****more***** Morgan?
Hot Coldman
Banned
We need more Piers Morgans and less Piers Morgans!
Be careful what you wish for
Theonik
Member
Should have resigned 3 years ago and saved everyone the trouble really. At this point, people have the option to fire her instead.
E: And hey. Even her own party is asking for her resignation.
The Tories somewhat made it fair game by trying to score political points by bringing up their idiotic internet regulation when responding to it. It's less opportunistic when you're responding to the other party being opportunistic.
Hot Coldman
Banned
Eh, I mean, we're all in here weighing up the odds of her getting ousted even thought she'll likely win and mostly thinking it's likely, right? Corbyn's probably just trying to push the odds of that in his favour. He knows anyone who could immediately take over would probably be even more ham-fisted.
I don't like the idea of people getting "more police everywhere = no more terror" in their heads. That's an easy solution to a problem that does not allow for easy solutions.
He did say that the people have a chance to make it happen with the GE.
He literally said "There's an election in three days and that's probably the best opportunity to deal with it".
He also said the 6.7p for a child's breakfast amounted to "an egg cup full of rice crispies", which was excellent.
OverBlood 3
Banned
To be fair to him he said he'd back other people calling for her resignation...sort of.
It's just posturing I suppose. Makes her look bad though.
It's just posturing I suppose. Makes her look bad though.
Jezbollah
Member
The thing is - I just wonder how more effective 10, 20, maybe 50,000 beat policemen would have been in the scenario like we saw on Saturday. I don't think it would have been stopped before anyone was hurt, but it would most certainly have disrupted the attackers should any of the police had been in the vicinity.
What does help May here (and hinders Labour a little) is that there was a cut in Security Services budget back in 10/11 - by Cameron and Osborne... I think this would be a good attack point to be honest, even if those two are no longer around.
Huw_Dawson
Member
We've entered the silly season of the campaign.
Audioboxer
Member
Gotta agree
Good statement until calls of "step down". A bold move at this point.
Corbyn, a handful of days to go, do not "nuke" the momentum by behaving like May would this close.
I thought the idea was that more police would allow for preventative measures. It would make it easier to stop attacks happening in the first place.
Jezbollah
Member
If Corbyn's team were sharp, they would push on the Public to "resign her" on their own on Thursday.
I do wonder if May + co respond to this by talking about the legislation in the matter that Corbyn voted against during his time on the backbenches?
Think you're right Huw re Silly Season.
I'm not too sure what effectiveness police on the beat has to that vs Security Services to be honest. Would love to find out more.
I do wonder if May + co respond to this by talking about the legislation in the matter that Corbyn voted against during his time on the backbenches?
Think you're right Huw re Silly Season.
I'm not too sure what effectiveness police on the beat has to that vs Security Services to be honest. Would love to find out more.
There is some truth to this.
OverBlood 3
Banned
It's not so much about having police at the scene of an incident it's more that community policing and intelligence services are stretched thin. Although the police that have been responding to attacks are police officers who are overworked. When Theresa May talks about putting more officers on the street it's the same officers just working longer not additional police officers.
For flavour watch this video https://youtu.be/irm2VZMDEvo
I just hope people don't clinge on that, believing this could stop terror altogether.
The Police sees their opportunity to make their point and as we can see it's super effective. It has taken over the discourse.
Well, any possibility of the police cuts going under the radar by the media has been destroyed by Corbyn. The whole call for resignation is silly a few days away from a general election, should have made it sound as though the public should make her resign by voting against her on polling day,
Ah, fair enough
Ah, fair enough
Huw_Dawson
Member
BTW if anyone wants to have their hopes raised, fruitlessly, Yougov's current prediction is that Lab+SNP+LD would equal exactly 323.
Find it hard to believe that anything JC says is well thought out politically but I do think calling for May's resignation works for two reasons 1. It focuses the blame on her. 2. It escalates the argument and rises above the noise of the rest of the campaign.
My work here is done.
I jest, I jest, put down the pitchforks. Yes, even the tiny one. No, you may not poke me just because you brought it all this way. Also, no duck weighing and no setting me on fire. I'm allergic to that.
Lemme be clear. More like him, in terms of going on the attack against unrelated content-free non-answers, would be a good thing for UK politics. More like him, in terms of everything else, would probably sink the British Islands.
I should not have removed that part of my post during my 20-minute reediting spree, but after slimming down my initial four page essay to a few sentences it eluded my attention that I had left that crucial part out. I really want a "post preview" button on mobile GAF.
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
Hate to break it to you, but the UK is not like the rest of Europe. I see some comparing to Germany, yet the top UK institutions easily trump Germany's and the turnout rate in the UK for university is almost twice as large percentage wise.
I say this because if tuition fees were scrapped, the UK which has one of the worlds most attractive higher education environments, would change dramatically, as prestigious places would become private and we've all seen how thats a slippery road to go down with the American education system.
I don't think some realise how beneficial tuition fees are to universities. It helps the government with some cash flow, helps the universities by significant funding, which can be reinvested into further student funding schemes and grants, which ultimately benefit the students with said investments. All it needs in return is a monthly sum by the student after they have some decent earnings.
Funny thing is, the introduction of tuition fees has actually led to more disadvantaged students applying to university (as I said before, Uni funding has increased notably).
Thats why I laugh at Labour's shallow statement, alongside the idea that they will afford this by increasing corporation tax lol
We don't pretend to do it: the government is still getting notable money from these loans as are universities.
Wrong. The current system allows cash to flow between the government and universities in a time efficient manner.
I find it hilarious you speak of xenophobia when UK is probably the number 1 sought after country for university education after the US. Don't get your facts twisted.
Spuck-uk
Banned
And they said Corbyn would never use nukes 😏
Huw_Dawson
Member
If Yougov's prediction was right, btw, it'd be possible for Corbyn to be PM, but only if Farron backed him.
If Farron refused to back either side, as we're committed to doing, it's Con+DUP vs Lab+SNP. That's 313 vs 310.
EXCEPT the DUP are looking like they could lose a seat to little Alliance. Now, if Wood and Lucas threw their hat in behind Corbyn, that'd be 313. So that's 313 vs 312.
BUT the UUP vs SDLP seat numbers could easily leave us with 3 Tories vs 2 Labour, leaving us with... 315 vs 315.
BUT there's the independent in NI, who I have no idea of the allegiance of. And Bercow, who I think has to remain neutral unless there's a tie.
What that ultimately leaves you with is Tim Farron (and Naomi Long) basically sitting there going "WHAT THE FUCK". As they are now the tie-breakers of every single vote in the HoC.
If Farron refused to back either side, as we're committed to doing, it's Con+DUP vs Lab+SNP. That's 313 vs 310.
EXCEPT the DUP are looking like they could lose a seat to little Alliance. Now, if Wood and Lucas threw their hat in behind Corbyn, that'd be 313. So that's 313 vs 312.
BUT the UUP vs SDLP seat numbers could easily leave us with 3 Tories vs 2 Labour, leaving us with... 315 vs 315.
BUT there's the independent in NI, who I have no idea of the allegiance of. And Bercow, who I think has to remain neutral unless there's a tie.
What that ultimately leaves you with is Tim Farron (and Naomi Long) basically sitting there going "WHAT THE FUCK". As they are now the tie-breakers of every single vote in the HoC.
BossDarkseid
Member
My work here is done.
I jest, I jest, put down the pitchforks. Yes, even the tiny one. No, you may not poke me just because you brought it all this way. Also, no duck weighing and no setting me on fire. I'm allergic to that.
Lemme be clear. More like him, in terms of going on the attack against unrelated content-free non-answers, would be a good thing for UK politics. More like him, in terms of everything else, would probably sink the British Islands.
I should not have removed that part of my post during my 20-minute reediting spree, but after slimming down my initial four page essay to a few sentences it eluded my attention that I had left that crucial part out. I really want a "post preview" button on mobile GAF.
GET THE PITCHFO---oh.
Yeah, I think its fine if he goes on the attack, but he is incredibly selective about what he gets worked up about. Its usually either Arsene Wenger (Arsenal FC Manager since the dawn of time) or Islam in some fashion. Everyone wants journalists to be more hard hitting, to ask the hard questions etc.
BBC have their tail between their legs because renegotiation on their funding is coming up, Sky is controlled by Murdoch etc...
Monty Mole
Member
I'd be very pleased with such a coalition going in to Brexit. Mainly because it would soften it to my personal tastes.
JonathanEx
Member
My work here is done.
I jest, I jest, put down the pitchforks. Yes, even the tiny one. No, you may not poke me just because you brought it all this way. Also, no duck weighing and no setting me on fire. I'm allergic to that.
Lemme be clear. More like him, in terms of going on the attack against unrelated content-free non-answers, would be a good thing for UK politics. More like him, in terms of everything else, would probably sink the British Islands.
I should not have removed that part of my post during my 20-minute reediting spree, but after slimming down my initial four page essay to a few sentences it eluded my attention that I had left that crucial part out. I really want a "post preview" button on mobile GAF.
So ignoring Piers - I think it's a bit about the media landscape. So on broadcast people play it safe because they don't want to be accused of bias, particularly with our impartiality rules.
Then we have an issue right now with how many politicians will actually do interviews - they're not making themselves accessible. So you need them there - and we don't do the US-cable news style 'essay' of hey I matter here's my take, I think in most contexts we'd find that smug. And if you're on the 'wrong' side of things, people tend to be that stubborn on something when it's the opinion on a divisive issue (identity based ones, gender, race, religion etc) - less so 'tell us the truth'.
Then you've got the exceptions - Channel 4 News are doing incredible work, but aren't mass audience. Newsnight a bit, and Paxman was historically the king of no bullshit. But then as we saw the other night, as spin has moved on, aggressively pushing in the way he used to... feels like something of a bygone age, it doesn't always work. Politicians have got so good at the non-answer they make the media look rude for pushing them.
Then I guess radio, the Today Programme is combative but to the point of 'oh of course', and Ferarri occasional on LBC can pull it off too. But recently we've only tended to push people to remember numbers which is a bit of a rubbish thing.
Or it's in comedy, and without the late night talk show, our chat shows don't tend to get political. Then things like Have I Got News For You will make points, but it's usually snide stuff or a very short bit from Ian Hislop. Maybe The Last Leg is the closest - and they do the rants/monologues and are now more of a weekly fixture. Not that comedy shows are the answer, but worth considering what our tone is in the wider sphere of discussing politics.
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