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[jas0nuk]

conservative manifesto today. bet jas0nuk is fukking giddy as shit about it.

Didn't make me giddy but I liked his speech and some of the policies he mentioned. Apart from anything else, you have to admit it is completely different to Labour's manifesto. He's going really big on the "big society" decentralisation thing and putting trust in the public rather than Labour and it's state control agenda. He wants to change the way politics works.

 

[sohois]

It's because they know they can't commit to many tax cuts, except the reversal of the 1p NI increase.

They were recently committed to cutting the inheritance tax of the richest 3,000 estates in the country. That's now an aspiration, and will be their priority on tax cuts, or cutting the £150,000+ income tax rate.

Do you have a link for that inheritance pladge? All I've seen is the pledge to raise the threshold to £1m, which i will say is one policy that will benefit upper-class people (or at least upper-middle class). As for the higher tax band, it was introduced for purely political reasons and raises hardly any tax; what is more, it may have negative effects in the long run, so i think repealing it would be a fairly good thing (though i am quite biased on this issue as i am indirectly affected by it).

 

[Dabookerman]

This is why I aint never voting Green:
http://timesonline.typepad.com/science/2009/06/political-science-be-careful-what-you-vote-for.html

stupid one issue parties, never worth da effort.

There are some things I REALLY agree with, and some things I don't. They're too mixed.

Shame we can't pick and choose policies and create our own custom party and get them elected. It's a stupid idea that would be awesome!

 

[Chinner]

Conservative Manifesto at a glance:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/apr/13/conservative-manifesto-at-a-glance

• Emergency budget within 50 days of election to include immediate £6bn cut in wasteful spending and one-year freeze on public sector pay in 2011

wasteful spending? 6 billion? allotta people gonna be losing there jobs

• Pledge to match Labour's spending plans for 2010-11 in health and overseas aid•

oh

• Develop schools under the Swedish "free schools" and the US "charter school" models: small, autonomous

schools run and set up by parents, teachers, universities, faith groups and voluntary groups

need more information on this. also yuck.

• Scrap waiting-list targets

*banana slip sound effect*

Give individual patients their own health and social care budge

what does this mean and how is it supposed to work?

• Elected police commissioners to replace police authorities; instant grounding orders for antisocial youngsters; prison sentences for carrying a knife; ban on below-cost alcohol sales; new border police force

more young people put in jail? that'll put them back on the right path!

• ID cards and register and Contactpoint children's database to be scrapped; Human Rights Act to be replaced by British Bill of Rights

good in regards to the ID cards, but they've dilly dallied on it before so.

Neighbourhood groups, the "little platoons" of civil society will be able to take over failing public services

people seem to like this according to polls or something

Tax breaks to promote marriage and civil partnerships.

already been talked about

 

[blazinglord]

conservative manifesto looks like a textbook right out of Eton.. these toffs don't change..

What's wrong with Eton? I'm sure plenty of parents, if they could afford it, would send their children to Eton instead of a comp. After all, beloved socialist George Orwell went to Eton.

wasteful spending? 6 billion? allotta people gonna be losing there jobs

Good. There's far too many people employed by the public sector at the moment.

 

[Dabookerman]

Yeah that's what we need. More Faith schools. Brilliant..

 

[Chinner]

looks like that pay restriction on the public sector has also disappeared. alas, poor yoderick.

 

[LukeT]

Wasn't sure who to vote for and I don't think it'll make a difference anyway but seeing as David Anderson voted in favour of the Digital Economy bill he's out. Think i'll vote Lib Dem.

 

[blazinglord]

Yeah that's what we need. More Faith schools. Brilliant..

I'm not especially keen on faith schools, but one cannot deny that Faith schools tend to do a lot better than comps in exam results. They must be doing something right.

 

[Chinner]

There are some things I REALLY agree with, and some things I don't. They're too mixed.

Shame we can't pick and choose policies and create our own custom party and get them elected. It's a stupid idea that would be awesome!

i also dislike their approach to nuclear power.

 

[Dabookerman]

i also dislike their approach to nuclear power.

See, regarding power. I would be more for Fusion Power plants and shit, but that's due to too much Sim City.

 

[jas0nuk]

What's wrong with Eton? I'm sure plenty of parents, if they could afford it, would send their children to Eton instead of a comp. After all, beloved socialist George Orwell went to Eton.

Good. There's far too many people employed by the public sector at the moment.

Too right.

Labour seems to think the state exists to employ people in huge numbers and likes flaunting how many public sector non-jobs it has produced. We need to get rid of the excessive bureaucracy and unelected, unaccountable quangos in this country which are wasting huge proportions of our taxes.

13 years in power and Labour are talking about "reforming" public services? LOL. Can't blame Thatcher any more.

 

[Empty]

I'm not especially keen on faith schools, but one cannot deny that Faith schools tend to do a lot better than comps in exam results. They must be doing something right.

isn't that because they are selective, though. much easier to succeed that way, and of course by selecting they bring down the standards of the schools around them.

 

[Chinner]

love these descriptions of the 'little platoons'

"Yeah we cant actually run public services so er.... why don't you guys do it for us? Can't find a decent school to put your kids in? Well under the Conservatives you don't have to worry! You can just er... quit your job and be head teacher of your very own school! Cos we, the Conservatives, are enabling *hard working families*!"

So the Tory policy here is, in effect: Shitty local school full of disaffected kids who can't read and whose parents don't care? That's OK, we'll help you take your kids out of there ... as long as you've got an education. Badly educated yourself but want your kids to do better? Fuck off, you're not qualified to teach them. Don't give a fuck if your children don't learn to read? Nor do we, so we're going to encourage anyone in your area who does care to get their kids as far away from yours as possible.

another person pointed this out:

Hang on a minute, how can you do this:

• Replace Trident nuclear missile system.

• Double operational allowance for troops in Afghanistan.

And still realistically do this?

• Cut MoD running costs by 25%

 

[Wes]

Get rid of the secret space army we have.

 

[freethought]

Yeah that's what we need. More Faith schools. Brilliant..

Hey, if this is about the CoE bailing out state schools then I don't really have a problem. We all said morning prayers at assembly and had to take R.E. anyway. But if this is opening the door for more Emmanuel Colleges that is a major problem. Where does Labour stand on the issue? They had no problem with Emmanuel (at least Blair didn't) and the CoE took over my old comp. a few years ago so it hardly seems like an exclusively Tory platform.

Either way I'd never vote Tory and it'll be a cold day in hell before I cast a ballot for David Milliband. Maybe I'll vote for Siamak Kaikavoosi. Can't be any more of a waste of a vote than the Lib Dems. Not that I know a damned thing about the Lib Dem candidate.

 

[Chinner]

UKIP's manifesto is out:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8617187.stm
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/apr/13/ukip-sod-the-lot-united-kingdom-independence-party

interesting bits:

The main thrust of UKIP's manifesto remains withdrawal from the European Union, membership of which they say costs the UK £120bn per year.

Pearson also revealed that his party would put up billboards urging voters to back Labour and Conservative candidates who were "committed" Eurosceptics as part of its strategy to mobilise support for a referendum on Britain's role in Europe.

Reduce public sector to 1997 size, diverting two million jobs to manufacturing and industry

(jas0nuk approves)

Immediate five-year freeze on immigration for permanent settlement, future limit on gross immigration of 50,000

Double number of prison places and end early release, ensure life sentences are served totally in prison and set up "boot camps" for young offenders

Freeze public sector pensions, bringing them "back into line with typical private sector pension provision".

It reaffirms a plan to ban Muslim face coverings such as the burqa and pledges to "scrap political correctness in public affairs".

And it also promises to set up a royal commission to "allow scientists to reach a conclusion about the facts and economic implications of global warming", adding that Ukip is "sceptical" about man-made global warming claims.

Daily Mail influential than scientists confirmed.

The "misconceived" Human Rights Act would be abolished, which would remove the obstacles that prevent deportation of "dangerous imams, terror suspects and criminals to countries where they are wanted for trials".

don't want human rights for those terrorists.

 

[iapetus]

I love UKIP. Ask them any question and it's about leaving the EU.

"What's your position on Europe?"
"We should have an immediate referendum on leaving the European Union."

"Are you in favour of investment in schools?"
"Of course we're in favour of investing in schools, but as long as European bureaucrats dictate what we can teach our children any investment is wasted, so we should have an immediate referendum on leaving the European Union."

"Would you like a nice cup of tea?"
"I would, but it'll leave a bitter taste in my mouth unless we've had an immediate referendum on leaving the European Union."

Incidentally, has anyone else seen the leaked copy of the proposed UKIP referendum?

Should we leave the corrupt, evil, and probably paedophilic European Union?

[ ] Yes
[ ] Hell yes!
[ ] Immediately

 

[scotcheggz]

"Would you like a nice cup of tea?"
"I would, but it'll leave a bitter taste in my mouth unless we've had an immediate referendum on leaving the European Union."

:lol :lol

 

[curls]

See, regarding power. I would be more for Fusion Power plants and shit, but that's due to too much Sim City.

:lol I imagine the green party mentality is: Nuclear = Evil

Fucking UKIP :lol

 

[Chinner]

I wonder if we'll get any comedy shit about the election and so on. Just dug these up (not in particular relation to the election, but still):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sg-4ATrE8n0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWSr1Aw0EBA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnxPuidq1qQ

 

[blazinglord]

isn't that because they are selective, though. much easier to succeed that way, and of course by selecting they bring down the standards of the schools around them.

Well I was under the impression that the only requirement for most faith schools (CofE schools anyway) was that prospective pupils and their parents must adhere to the school's credo. Which is not necessarily to say that the said pupil must be a Protestant, only that he or she must agree to be taught in accordance to CofE values.

So I don't really object to Faith schools so long as they meet the basics of the curriculum in science and continue score highly in the league tables. Faith schools seem to be popular with a lot of middle income families who can't afford to send their kids to independent schools therefore it seems unfair to start withdrawing tax breaks from these schools on grounds of distaste for religion.

 

[scotcheggz]

I wonder if we'll get any comedy shit about the election and so on. Just dug these up (not in particular relation to the election, but still):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sg-4ATrE8n0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWSr1Aw0EBA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnxPuidq1qQ

The Now Show on radio 4 are going to do "The Vote Now Show" every day leading up to the election. It depends wether or not you consider that comedy though, I haven't listened to it for a while, i think it stumbled a bit. I hope this will be return to form.

 

[Empty]

Well I was under the impression that the only requirement for most faith schools (CofE schools anyway) was that prospective pupils and their parents must adhere to the school's credo. Which is not necessarily to say that the said pupil must be a Protestant, only that he or she must agree to be taught in accordance to CofE values.

So I don't really object to Faith schools so long as they meet the basics of the curriculum in science and continue score highly in the league tables. Faith schools seem to be popular with a lot of middle income families who can't afford to send their kids to independent schools therefore it seems unfair to start withdrawing tax breaks from these schools on grounds of distaste for religion.

Well, it is a little more that that.

Damning new evidence that faith schools are siphoning off middle-class pupils can be revealed today, as research shows they are failing to take children from the poorest backgrounds nationwide.

Even when they are situated in deprived inner-city areas, religious schools have fewer poor children than local authority secondary schools.

New figures show that religious schools, in England, admit 10 per cent fewer poor pupils than is representative of the local area. Local authority schools, meanwhile, take in 30 per cent more and have a disproportionately deprived intake. The result is a school system deeply divided by social class.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2008/mar/02/schools.faithschools

To give an example of how this takes place, my younger sister's COE and state funded faith school Lady Margaret's in west london determines intake based on this:

"Over half the girls are offered places on the basis of parental religious affiliation and just under half on the basis of tests in English, mathematics and reasoning skills, designed to enable the school to recruit a comprehensive intake; these places are open to pupils of other faiths or no faith."

By choosing so many based on religious affiliation they can skew the intake towards those from stable, affluent backgrounds, and that allows them to perform better in results, hence the perception that faith schools should be expanded, when it fact doing that is rather dangerous and unfair.

 

[jas0nuk]

(jas0nuk approves)

You know me too well boi :lol

edit: Fusion power would be the nice, "perfect" solution but it's still about 20 or 30 years away. So I'm happy to support the development of the latest technology nuclear fission power stations. France gets 80% of it's electricity from nuclear, and has never had anything more than minor incidents.

 

[Walshicus]

Get rid of the secret space army we have.

Shut uuuuup.[/Carl]

 

[Songbird]

This is why I aint never voting Green:
http://timesonline.typepad.com/science/2009/06/political-science-be-careful-what-you-vote-for.html

stupid one issue parties, never worth da effort.

What the frig? An abolition of all zoos? Good grief.

 

[Mr. Sam]

:lol I imagine the green party mentality is: Nuclear = Evil

Only if they're morons that don't understand what nuclear power actually entails. So... Yeah, maybe.

 

[Chinner]

How To Win The TV Debate is quite interesting and should be given a watch.

Talks about the history of debates in both the US and UK.

 

[Wes]

Aye watched it yesterday. Quite informative but was more to do with the history of debates in the US and UK rather than a "How To" guide as the title may suggest (if you didn't read the tv guide like me!

Shut uuuuup.[/Carl]

I'm not getting the reference

 

[Walshicus]

I'm not getting the reference

http://www.bing.com/search?q=Carl+shut+uuuup&form=IE8SRC&src=IE-SearchBox

 

[Panda1]

What the frig? An abolition of all zoos? Good grief.

think of the penguins

 

[Chinner]

need to figure out if we can watch this itv debate on the internet.

 

[Subliminal]

need to figure out if we can watch this itv debate on the internet.

Maybe not officially like Channel 4 Did. but http://www.tvcatchup.com/watch.html?c=3 will work.

 

[Dabookerman]

What the frig? An abolition of all zoos? Good grief.

It's moronic because the animals in UK zoos (as far as I'm aware) are in pretty damn good hands. They're well looked after. So it's a stupid policy to make.

I can understand animal testing, hell I'm against it as well, but banning Zoos is just :lol

Maybe they meant

 

[Songbird]

It's moronic because the animals in UK zoos (as far as I'm aware) are in pretty damn good hands. They're well looked after. So it's a stupid policy to make.

I can understand animal testing, hell I'm against it as well, but banning Zoos is just :lol

Totally agree. It's why I'll never vote for them nationally. Back home in olde Holderness they've had a decent part in running a campaign against the council dumping a waste burner near the secondary school I went to.

 

[J Tourettes]

I love UKIP's poster. :lol

 

[Dabookerman]

I love UKIP's poster. :lol

Post em yo

 

[Wes]

Whoever is supplying Clegg with the soundbites have been doing a good job recently.

need to figure out if we can watch this itv debate on the internet.

ITV would be fools not to have it online.

 

[jas0nuk]

Do you mean this one?

 

[J Tourettes]

Post em yo

I'm on my mobile so I can't without a lot of fucking about. Check it on their website.

 

[J Tourettes]

Do you mean this one?

Yeah, that's the one :lol

 

[Dabookerman]

Cameron looks so sleazy.

 

[Walshicus]

God I fucking hate UKIP and everything they stand for.

 

[defel]

Detail aside, the central Tory message should be pretty appealing to the majority of the population imo. Most people only read the headline after all.

 

[Chinner]

Do you mean this one?

loads of people will be thinking "YES!!!" and then you see....

nah, i think i'll stick with the sods.

 

[NekoFever]

I wouldn't trust UKIP to run the economy when they can't even afford Photoshop to properly cut out those heads.

On the zoo thing, if I speak to a Green candidate I'll be sure to ask what happens to animals in UK zoos that are extinct or critically endangered in the wild but are involved in international breeding programmes with the aim of repopulating them.

Oh, and LOL faith schools. The funniest thing is when politicians insist that they foster integration, because dividing people and educating them along religious lines has worked so well in Northern Ireland.

 

[freethought]

Cameron looks so sleazy.

He doesn't look too trustworthy in that poster either. baduum-tsh

 

[blazinglord]

By choosing so many based on religious affiliation they can skew the intake towards those from stable, affluent backgrounds, and that allows them to perform better in results, hence the perception that faith schools should be expanded, when it fact doing that is rather dangerous and unfair.

Okay I concede your point that Faith schools are selective. Nevertheless, I think that abolishing Faith schools altogether would be using a sledgehammer to crack a nut. The government could reform the selection process by making it illegal to ask the religious affiliation of the parents and prospective students but still allow the school to act as a Faith school. I recall not that long ago about a Jewish student who was rejected from a Jewish school on grounds that only one of his parents was Jewish and the other was merely a convert. I thought that school's selection process was vastly unfair and believe the supreme court was right to declare it as illegal discrimination.

 

[Walshicus]

Okay I concede your point that Faith schools are selective. Nevertheless, I think that abolishing Faith schools altogether would be using a sledgehammer to crack a nut. The government could reform the selection process by making it illegal to ask the religious affiliation of the parents and prospective students but still allow the school to act as a Faith school. I recall not that long ago about a Jewish student who was rejected from a Jewish school on grounds that only one of his parents was Jewish and the other was merely a convert. I thought that school's selection process was vastly unfair and believe the supreme court was right to declare it as illegal discrimination.

I dunno, I'm personally against anything that exposes children to religion.