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[industrian]

William Hague's voice always makes me sleepy.

 

[Gary Whitta]

So with Brown and Cameron now both courting Clegg and needing his coalition support, doesn't that kinda make him Kingmaker, the man who will basically decide the next government? A guy whose party won a paltry 50 seats? This all seems very odd to me.

Also, from what I've read constitutionally it's the sitting Prime Minister who is supposed to get first bite at forming a coalition government, yet Clegg has said he'll sit down with the Tories first because they won the most seats. What the fuck is going on?

 

[operon]

That's crazy. It's like saying that all you have to do is get you and 10,000 of your friends to vote one way to gain the privilege of being represented by someone you voted for. All you really should have to do is freaking vote. Most democracies get that.

where have I said anything about organising groups of people to get someone elected??????????????

 

[Walshicus]

So with Brown and Cameron now both courting Clegg and needing his coalition support, doesn't that kinda make him Kingmaker, the man who will basically decide the next government? A guy whose party won a paltry 50 seats? This all seems very odd to me.

Also, from what I've read constitutionally it's the sitting Prime Minister who is supposed to get first bite at forming a coalition government, yet Clegg has said he'll sit down with the Tories first because they won the most seats. What the fuck is going on?

50 seats but 20%+ of the vote...

 

[Empty]

Also, from what I've read constitutionally it's the sitting Prime Minister who is supposed to get first bite at forming a coalition government, yet Clegg has said he'll sit down with the Tories first because they won the most seats. What the fuck is going on?

the sitting prime minister getting first bite is just a convention, so they aren't overriding anything legally

 

[phisheep]

So with Brown and Cameron now both courting Clegg and needing his coalition support, doesn't that kinda make him Kingmaker, the man who will basically decide the next government? A guy whose party won a paltry 50 seats? This all seems very odd to me.

Also, from what I've read constitutionally it's the sitting Prime Minister who is supposed to get first bite at forming a coalition government, yet Clegg has said he'll sit down with the Tories first because they won the most seats. What the fuck is going on?

Constitutionally, you're right.

In practice this works only where the sitting PM has a chance of forming a government - and Brown can't form any sort of sensible majority without doing under-the-table protection deals with nationalists even if he had the Libdems in tow.

So what Clegg has done is just to shortcut the process by saying he won't negotiate first with Labour, which gives Cameron first bite since Brown has no option but to resign if Cameron can do a deal or form a minority government.

 

[RedShift]

With PR, it does seem great but there is the danger that it gives small parties like the BNP a bigger voice than they'd get with FPTP. A lot of people I know talk about some countries (Germany?) Having a 5% minimum cap needed for representation which prevents the rise of small radical parties. I guess the cap would have to be smaller or have to be adjusted for region here though because otherwise that would reject everyone but the big 3.

I really know very little about electoral systems apart from FPTP is terrible.

 

[industrian]

Well, it's 00:15 here. I've been watching the election results unfold for 15 hours or so now and after making 200+ posts I'm generally tired as fuck. I leave the more GMT centric brigade of UKGAF to debate the election, fried chicken and Dominos' pizzas in peace.

I'm overjoyed that Michael Moore my MP has retained his seat and the legacy of the Liberal Democrats in the south of Scotland. All I hope for now is that when I wake up on Saturday morning/afternoon there's some semblance of a government in the making - even if it is the Conservatives soldiering on alone. That and hopefully I won't miss any meltdowns, like a Labour/LD Coalition with Clegg as PM or maybe Mandleson and Campbell being caught on camera garrotting Nick Robinson, or Tony Blair descending from the heavens, activating the Queen and laying waste to London.

Later.

 

[Gary Whitta]

The PR issue seems to be the biggest roadblock to a Con/Lib coalition, right? Libs will insist on some form of it, Tories will never stand for it?

 

[phisheep]

Called this at 6:14 this morning

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=21153014&postcount=8102

I expect a Con/Lib coalition, or at least some sort of arrangement. Can't see Libs entering coalition with Labour and retaining any honour - or credible plans for deficit reduction.

Just sayin'

 

[Frank the Great]

Does anyone feel like helping an American with his British Politics exam?

One of the questions on the study guide is this:

"When you're queuing for a London bus with a perfect stranger and you're bored, and you want to be polite and/or strike up a conversation, what topic should you start with?"

I'm inclined to say "the weather" but I don't know for sure. The professor assigned a book to us on British mannerisms but I forgot it at home.

 

[Deadman]

Browns offers pr refferendum, cameron offers nothing close. Lib/Con coalition wont happen.

 

[LukeT]

Not sure if this was posted in the 20+ pages since i went to bed but our man also fancies himself as a singer/songwriter

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8cUDbpZbZM

 

[Shanadeus]

Does anyone feel like helping an American with his British Politics exam?

One of the questions on the study guide is this:

"When you're queuing for a London bus with a perfect stranger and you're bored, and you want to be polite and/or strike up a conversation, what topic should you start with?"

I'm inclined to say "the weather" but I don't know for sure. The professor assigned a book to us on British mannerisms but I forgot it at home.

It is the weather, or football.

 

[kitch9]

I would, quite frankly, be disgusted.

You would be disgusted to know your vote now has more power than it ever has in the past?

I'm not sure of your thinking..... Voting Lib Dem in the past has meant that basically your voice would never be heard, but now some of those ideals you want may actually come to fruition.

 

[BGBW]

Does anyone feel like helping an American with his British Politics exam?

One of the questions on the study guide is this:

"When you're queuing for a London bus with a perfect stranger and you're bored, and you want to be polite and/or strike up a conversation, what topic should you start with?"

I'm inclined to say "the weather" but I don't know for sure. The professor assigned a book to us on British mannerisms but I forgot it at home.

It's a trick question. No one in London likes to strikes up a conversation with a stranger. Read a newspaper and keep to yourself.

 

[SmokyDave]

Does anyone feel like helping an American with his British Politics exam?

One of the questions on the study guide is this:

"When you're queuing for a London bus with a perfect stranger and you're bored, and you want to be polite and/or strike up a conversation, what topic should you start with?"

I'm inclined to say "the weather" but I don't know for sure. The professor assigned a book to us on British mannerisms but I forgot it at home.

Islamic immigration and welfare abuse. That's standard etiquette for bus stops in London.

 

[Nicktendo86]

Islamic immigration and welfare abuse. That's standard etiquette for bus stops in London.

Or don't say aything as they will think you are a nutter and ignore you.

 

[Gary Whitta]

It's a trick question. No one in London likes to strikes up a conversation with a stranger. Read a newspaper and keep to yourself.

This is the correct answer.

 

[phisheep]

I'm inclined to say "the weather" but I don't know for sure. The professor assigned a book to us on British mannerisms but I forgot it at home.

"Looks like rain" is a good all-purpose opener.

Unless it actually is raining, when you should start with "Looks like it'll last a while".

Beware, though, that this applies only to London. There are huge regional variations. In Liverpool you should describe the trouble you had getting a birthday present for your sister. In Cardiff it is always raining, so you will get no response. In Southend the bus will never come so you had better start walking.

 

[RedShift]

Does anyone feel like helping an American with his British Politics exam?

One of the questions on the study guide is this:

"When you're queuing for a London bus with a perfect stranger and you're bored, and you want to be polite and/or strike up a conversation, what topic should you start with?"

I'm inclined to say "the weather" but I don't know for sure. The professor assigned a book to us on British mannerisms but I forgot it at home.

Yeah its a trick question, just stay silent and avoid eye contact.

 

[D4Danger]

It's a trick question. No one in London likes to strikes up a conversation with a stranger. Read a newspaper and keep to yourself.

correct.

The most you can hope for is some awkward eye contact a which point one of you has to roll your eyes and make a tutting sound to show you displeasure at the bus being late.

 

[Spirit of Jazz]

Or don't say aything as they will think you are a nutter and ignore you.

Or potentially stab you. If it's an attractive lass you should continue veering your glance towards her even after the line ends (assuming she'd to your right) alternatively you can catch a proper eye-full by turning your head 'to see if the bus is coming'.

 

[Mr. Sam]

The PR issue seems to be the biggest roadblock to a Con/Lib coalition, right? Libs will insist on some form of it, Tories will never stand for it?

Speculation they may accept a referendum on it, but reserve the right to campaign against it.

 

[Shanadeus]

With PR, it does seem great but there is the danger that it gives small parties like the BNP a bigger voice than they'd get with FPTP. A lot of people I know talk about some countries (Germany?) Having a 5% minimum cap needed for representation which prevents the rise of small radical parties. I guess the cap would have to be smaller or have to be adjusted for region here though because otherwise that would reject everyone but the big 3.

I really know very little about electoral systems apart from FPTP is terrible.

I believe plenty of countries have some form of minimum cap, and I think it'd be a sound idea if they do manage to implement PR in the UK. German has a 5% minimum cap as you said, and in Scandinavia you can have anything from 2% (Denmark) to 4% (Sweden).

 

[Gary Whitta]

I remember when I first moved to the US many years I was really put off when total strangers would start talking to me in bars about whatever sports game was on TV, etc. WTF? I don't know who the fuck you are, John, why are you talking to me? But after a while I decided it was a superior and more friendly, social system than the British convention and over the years it just became normal to me. Then I went home to London on a visit and without thinking started talking to the bloke next to me at the bar about the match on TV and he looked at me like I was a nutter. :lol

 

[frankie_baby]

wow all you southerners are nutters, go up north and talk to anyone about anything

annoyingly i've been stuck living in the south for the last 7 years

 

[Kowak]

Just re-awoke, didnt think I would see Cam push for the lib dems so hard. I just cant see the Cons accepting liberals in a cabinet.

If I was labour I would be loving a con-lib coalition. They could replace brown and then let the coalition get on with it and then might stand a better chance at the next election. If the coalition does well then Labour could hopefully counter it with their fresh new labour. I think this is more a damming verdict on Brown then on the Labour party.

 

[Kowak]

wow all you southerners are nutters, go up north and talk to anyone about anything

annoyingly i've been stuck living in the south for the last 7 years

I hate going outside the m25

 

[Azih]

where have I said anything about organising groups of people to get someone elected??????????????

For a single individual voter in a safe seat of a party that he/she does not support what other way is there to cast a vote that matters?

 

[Nicktendo86]

Just re-awoke, didnt think I would see Cam push for the lib dems so hard. I just cant see the Cons accepting liberals in a cabinet.

If I was labour I would be loving a con-lib coalition. They could replace brown and then let the coalition get on with it and then might stand a better chance at the next election. If the coalition does well then Labour could hopefully counter it with their fresh new labour. I think this is more a damming verdict on Brown then on the Labour party.

IF the coalition goes well though could that theoretically push both Conservative and Lib Dem votes up at the next election, squeezing out Labour? Who knows, had the opposite effect the last time we had a hung Parliament...

 

[Kowak]

IF the coalition goes well though could that theoretically push both Conservative and Lib Dem votes up at the next election, squeezing out Labour? Who knows, had the opposite effect the last time we had a hung Parliament...

could do, but I dont think Labour stand any chance of winning another election within the next 18 months if they still have Brown in charge of the party or they try to keep hold of power through their own coalition. They need to refocus and become an effective opposition during that period.

editlus any con-lib coalition would likely collapse over ideological reasons so would be better for labour.

 

[ghst]

Does anyone feel like helping an American with his British Politics exam?

One of the questions on the study guide is this:

"When you're queuing for a London bus with a perfect stranger and you're bored, and you want to be polite and/or strike up a conversation, what topic should you start with?"

I'm inclined to say "the weather" but I don't know for sure. The professor assigned a book to us on British mannerisms but I forgot it at home.

i imagine after the initial salutations and pleasantries the primary topic of conversation will swiftly progress onto your personal transportable finances and their immediate availability.

 

[Kowak]

Does anyone feel like helping an American with his British Politics exam?

One of the questions on the study guide is this:

"When you're queuing for a London bus with a perfect stranger and you're bored, and you want to be polite and/or strike up a conversation, what topic should you start with?"

I'm inclined to say "the weather" but I don't know for sure. The professor assigned a book to us on British mannerisms but I forgot it at home.

You are looking for a smacking if you start talking to someone in London. The rule is dont talk to anyone unless its to complain about the buses.

 

[FabCam]

wow all you southerners are nutters, go up north and talk to anyone about anything

annoyingly i've been stuck living in the south for the last 7 years

all you northeners are nutters, come down south and talk to anyone about anything

 

[lo escondido]

Ugh....

but then again this guy is running again Grayson, so the people he's running to represent obviously aren't the most conservative in the world

 

[CrunchinJelly]

Not sure why I stayed up last night... all the interesting stuff has happened today.

 

[Gary Whitta]

Nicholas Witchell!

 

[phisheep]

Nicholas Witchell!

For some reason re-named as "Nick" Witchell. When did that happen? Is it the same guy?

 

[Empty]

Speculation they may accept a referendum on it, but reserve the right to campaign against it.

That would be one hell of a fight. The right wing press along with the huge amounts of money that the tories can pump into campaigning against it would make it a difficult one to win, even if right now polling suggests that more people support PR than FPTP, though with many don't knows.

 

[Gary Whitta]

For some reason re-named as "Nick" Witchell. When did that happen? Is it the same guy?

It said Nicholas on his chyron just now.

 

[scotcheggz]

Ufff I just woke up. Can someone give me a quick rundown of whats happened since 9:30 this morning please? It all looks well messy. From what I gather, Clegg is the kingmaker and both lab and torys are both begging him for his support? Is that about the sum of it?

I don't really understand how Clegg can be considering Cameron, but there you go.

 

[phisheep]

It said Nicholas on his chyron just now.

Just that all through today when they went to him (outside Buck House I think) he was always introduced as "Nick" Witchell.

Wasn't until I saw your post that it clicked why the name sounded vaguely familiar!

 

[fizzelopeguss]

Christ, the map of england is blue yet it looks like we're being held to ransom by the scots, thought those fuckers had their own parliament.

I had no idea my home town of bolton had 3 seats, what the fuck is that all about.

 

[Azih]

Ufff I just woke up. Can someone give me a quick rundown of whats happened since 9:30 this morning please? It all looks well messy. From what I gather, Clegg is the kingmaker and both lab and torys are both begging him for his support? Is that about the sum of it?

I don't really understand how Clegg can be considering Cameron, but there you go.

The problem is that Lib+Lab doesn't go over 50% seats.

 

[jas0nuk]

Hi all, watched the election ALL night and then rushed to uni... xD

Hope everyone enjoyed it.

Interesting result - slightly disappointing for the Conservatives. They needed 117 gains to form a majority, they achieved 97. Labour lost a massive 91 seats. Brown has been decisively rejected by the country.

Also disappointing for the Lib Dems, what happened to Cleggmania?

Clegg has basically ruled out supporting Labour now, and why wouldn't he? If he were to support an unelected PM who has failed to win an election in his own right, his reputation as a person of "new politics" would be destroyed forever. Looks like PM Cameron, Deputy PM Clegg or some similar arrangement will appear.

 

[Gary Whitta]

If I was Brown I would just dig in like Nixon. Fuck 'em all, let them come and get me.

Remember, he still commands the military.

 

[Varion]

Ufff I just woke up. Can someone give me a quick rundown of whats happened since 9:30 this morning please? It all looks well messy. From what I gather, Clegg is the kingmaker and both lab and torys are both begging him for his support? Is that about the sum of it?

I don't really understand how Clegg can be considering Cameron, but there you go.

Pretty much.

- Clegg makes speech saying Conservatives have the most votes and seats, should be the first to 'prove they can govern in the national interest'.
- Brown makes speech saying he'll keep doing his duty, is open to talks from any party leader, and would give a referendum on PR.
- Cameron makes speech saying he would work with the lib dems and make (very minor) concessions - no change on europe, immigration or trident, but would work with them on pupil premiums, a 'cross-party electoral reform committee', abolishing the ID cards and a few other small issues.

Lib Dem sources say they see the proposal is a step forward and they'll be meeting on it over the weekend, with Cameron and Clegg to discuss it by phone later tonight.

 

[APZonerunner]

The problem for Clegg is whatever way he goes he loses. If he helps Labour the Conservative press (which right now is almost all of them) will ravage him for supporting an unelected party, they'll call him an enemy of democracy etc. On the flip side, if he tries to join with the Conservatives a large segment of his own party will go ape shit over it, as their policies are so wildly different.

 

[scotcheggz]

Christ, the map of england is blue yet it looks like we're being held to ransom by the scots, thought those fuckers had their own parliament.

I had no idea my home town of bolton had 3 seats, what the fuck is that all about.

You need to see a proportional view: