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[Dark Machine]

I get it, bit harsh from Cameron.

Also who are the right wing nutcases Cameron's been siding with?

An extreme right EU coalition with parties from Eastern Euope who are homophobic and deny climate change.

Acheteedo called the poll results, good job man.

 

[avaya]

I think what this debate has shown is that LibDem support has hit a bit of a glass ceiling for the current week. Whether that'll pick up in a week or so, I don't know, but I think their current level of being in and around 30% is solid.

Next week. Cable time.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Turning over to the BBC News At 10 is paradise.

 

[Chinner]

Keep this in mind when looking at the YouGov polls:
http://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2010/04/yougovmurdoch_d.html

 

[avaya]

I'd prefer it to have been one of the lasses from BBC personally.

Can't have everything.

 

[gutter_trash]

I can see the immigration issue costing the Lib Dems, even among moderates.

 

[blazinglord]

I thought Brown did badly tonight, and I'm interested to see how the whole Labour scare-mongering leaflets play out because I saw SNP leader Salmond also call Labour out on this.

Cameron was better than last week but Clegg didn't do too badly either. Although I don't think he articulated his nuclear policy very well, and it's a shame that he didn't rule out future foreign invasions of countries with Al Qaeda links - I think it would have helped him if he had. Also Cameron's dig at the Lib Dem's immigration policy meaning border controls on the m25 was effective.

 

[Wes]

Confirmed ComRes:

Brown: 30
Cameron: 30
Clegg: 33

 

[travisbickle]

the poles

Oh right, I get it. I was sitting there thinking what the fuck is going on, but kind of makes sense.

Also I have a friend from Poland who says it's pretty extreme...it's all becoming clear.

 

[FabCam]

Clegg was a bit silly with his defense argument.

Stop production of Eurofighter
Eurofighter is made by BAE Systems...
...which have a large factory in Bristol.

Excusing his regional ignorance, Clegg seems to have no real plan of what these planes will be replaced with? Or the fact that the country has already invested billions into systems and procedures that involve these aircraft? Or that thousands of jobs in the RAF are directly linked to the Eurofighter?

 

[Chinner]

Confirmed ComRes:

Brown: 30
Cameron: 30
Clegg: 33

As I said, taking into account margin of error they're all on a equal footing.

 

[avaya]

Clegg was a bit silly with his defense argument.

Stop production of Eurofighter
Eurofighter is made by BAE Systems...
...which have a large factory in Bristol.

Excusing his regional ignorance, Clegg seems to have no real plan of what these planes will be replaced with? Or the fact that the country has already invested billions into systems and procedures that involve these aircraft? Or that thousands of jobs in the RAF are directly linked to the Eurofighter?

F35's. Also made by BAE systems. More heavily in fact.

 

[Empty]

Keep this in mind when looking at the YouGov polls:
http://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2010/04/yougovmurdoch_d.html

that was actually from yougov market research for one of the two big parties on how best to fight the lib dems, not for one of the publically released national polls. iirc.

 

[Linkified]

Sorry. He should die in a fucking fire.

Its ok, he was so awesome on european parliament when he said to Van Rompuy that he had 'the charisma of a damp rag and the appearance of a low grade bank clark.' :lol

 

[Chinner]

And here are some more figures from ComRes

Last week ComRes asked people who had seen the debate how they would vote in the election. Those figures showed a huge surge in Lib Dem support (compared with what people were saying before the debate). ComRes asked the same question again tonight. And the figures are almost exactly the same as they were after last night's debate.

Here are the voting intentions of those who saw the debate.

Conservatives: 35% (down 1 from last week's figures for viewers who saw the first debate)
Lib Dems: 36% (up 1)
Labour: 24%

ComRes also asked who gave the most honest answers. Clegg won. Here are the figures.

Clegg: 43%
Cameron: 29%
Brown: 23%

And ComRes also asked who exceeded expectations. Brown won on that count.

Brown: 47%
Cameron: 27%
Clegg: 21%

more detail

 

[blazinglord]

Clegg was a bit silly with his defense argument.

Stop production of Eurofighter
Eurofighter is made by BAE Systems...
...which have a large factory in Bristol.

Excusing his regional ignorance, Clegg seems to have no real plan of what these planes will be replaced with? Or the fact that the country has already invested billions into systems and procedures that involve these aircraft? Or that thousands of jobs in the RAF are directly linked to the Eurofighter?

I also don't quite see the point of decommissioning trident missiles system and then create new land based or cruise missiles from scratch which would still amount to billions. I think nuclear disarmament would be a simpler policy for the Lib Dems to adopt - electorally I don't think the electorate cares if we no longer had nuclear weapons of any kind.

 

[Zenith]

Its ok, he was so awesome on european parliament when he said to Van Rompuy that he had 'the charisma of a damp rag and the appearance of a low grade bank clark.' :lol

he's a pathetic joke of a politician who's built his life on xenophobia.

 

[painey]

If Brown really did authorise those anti-Tory leaflets, even inadvertently as part of something bigger.. he's fucked because the Tory press is going to take it and run with it all the way till the election.

 

[FabCam]

F35's. Also made by BAE systems. More heavily in fact.

So he wants to scrap fully operational aircraft - which will cost millions - and replace them with new ones that our country has little control over? F35s use American technology that the US has constantly tried to stop us from using until we "tighten up protection". Not to mention mass retraining, redevelopment, refurbishment and weakening of EU relationships - something Clegg obviously wishes to protect.

 

[Walshicus]

Its ok, he was so awesome on european parliament when he said to Van Rompuy that he had 'the charisma of a damp rag and the appearance of a low grade bank clark.' :lol

To be fair though, Farage has the charisma of a pack of cigarettes and the appearance of a pædophile.

 

[Wes]

Hot girl over the shoulder spotted!

BBC News is the new Top Gear!

 

[Varion]

Time for the wiggly worm again.

No funny guy in the background this week.

 

[avaya]

So he wants to scrap fully operational aircraft - which will cost millions - and replace them with new ones that our country has little control over? F35s use American technology that the US has constantly tried to stop us from using until we "tighten up protection". Not to mention mass retraining, redevelopment, refurbishment and weakening of EU relationships - something Clegg obviously wishes to protect.

No he wouldn't replace them at all since the F35's are already paid for and are VTOL. Why we even need fighter aircraft is in fact amusing.

 

[Harry_Tequila]

I'm calling it as pretty even in my opinion. This will definately be Cleggs weakest debate given that the others could hit him with Europe, which is particularly unpopular and also Immigration.

Cameron and Brown were both better than last week with Cameron perhaps edging it over Brown.

I would have liked to have seen Clegg hit Cameron hard for the smear campaign over the last couple of days. I think most people in the country understand what it was and I think he misjudged the mood by moving on from it quickly, rather than taking a couple of lumps out of Cameron for a smear/Murdoch connection.

 

[Varion]

Clegg 'got the highest points of the evening' when talking about cooperation in the event of a hung parliament apparently.

Looks like Cameron's attempt to scare everyone about the idea really isn't working!

 

[Timbuktu]

I would have liked to have seen Clegg hit Cameron hard for the smear campaign over the last couple of days. I think most people in the country understand what it was and I think he misjudged the mood by moving on from it quickly, rather than taking a couple of lumps out of Cameron for a smear/Murdoch connection.

Especially when Cameron started talking about not spreading fear.

 

[Dark Machine]

So he wants to scrap fully operational aircraft - which will cost millions - and replace them with new ones that our country has little control over? F35s use American technology that the US has constantly tried to stop us from using until we "tighten up protection". Not to mention mass retraining, redevelopment, refurbishment and weakening of EU relationships - something Clegg obviously wishes to protect.

No, he said he doesn't want to buy the newer upgraded version of the Eurofighter, or the upgrade for it, whilst we are in the current defecit. Jobs in the UK aren't affected since there are already backorders for the Eurofighter from Saudi Arabia for example. The F35 is a viable alternative. This is all about including it within the strategic defense review anyway. Lab/Con want to ringfence Trident and the Eurofighter, LDs are saying EVERYTHING should be included. Which I agree with.

 

[NekoFever]

All their love is for white indigenous British Christians.

We should kick out the Christians and return Britain to its roots.

 

[Harry_Tequila]

Especially when Cameron started talking about not spreading fear.

Indeed, I thought that was the perfect opportunity to turn it back on him.

 

[Linkified]

he's a pathetic joke of a politician who's built his life on xenophobia.

Remember his party came second in the European Parliament elections though.

If Cleggy actually thinks we are the White House's lap dog - then hes confused we are its minder.

 

[Chinner]

The Times:

Nick Clegg:
48%

Gordon Brown
17%

David Cameron
34%

 

[avaya]

Remember his party came second in the European Parliament elections though.

Yes because everyone voted in those.

 

[Varion]

If Cleggy actually thinks we are the White House's lap dog - then hes confused we are its minder.

I thought Clegg was supposed to be anti-US? :lol

 

[Acheteedo]

This debate was by far the biggest risk for lib dem to falter, what with the content of the debate and the massive potential for a disappointing contrast compared the surge and success of the first debate, but they've clearly come through well. It has to be a hung parliament now.

 

[avaya]

This debate was by far the biggest risk for lib dem to falter, what with the content of the debate and the massive potential for a disappointing contrast compared the surge and success of the first debate, but they've clearly come through well. It has to be a hung parliament now.

Cable Time.

To be fair though, Farage has the charisma of a pack of cigarettes and the appearance of a pædophile.

Oh shit how did I miss this. :lol

 

[Maleficence]

The Times:

Nick Clegg:
48%

Gordon Brown
17%

David Cameron
34%

Seriously, the yougov/sun poll is the only one that doesn't put Clegg first. Such obvious bullshit. Though I'm surprised to see Brown so much lower than Cameron here.

 

[FabCam]

No he wouldn't replace them at all since the F35's are already paid for and are VTOL. Why we even need fighter aircraft is in fact amusing.

This is just not true. The UK bought a handful of TEST aircraft. No substantial order has been placed. They are penciled in to replace Harriers, but not for at least 5 years. And we need to sustain our RAF to preserve both defense and economy.

 

[Varion]

Seriously, the yougov/sun poll is the only one that doesn't put Clegg first. Such obvious bullshit. Though I'm surprised to see Brown so much lower than Cameron here.

There always has to be one that has Cameron in the lead so the conservative representative can choose to ignore all the others during Question Time. Just like last week.

BU-BU-BUT SKY'S POLL SAID WE WON!

 

[Chinner]

Seriously, the yougov/sun poll is the only one that doesn't put Clegg first. Such obvious bullshit. Though I'm surprised to see Brown so much lower than Cameron here.

Admittedly it's a on site poll, so take it how you want.

 

[Dark Machine]

Remember his party came second in the European Parliament elections though.

If Cleggy actually thinks we are the White House's lap dog - then hes confused we are its minder.

I think it's pretty presumptuous to believe we can or are the minder of the most powerful state on the planet. We wern't the minder on Iraq, or Afghanistan, and we were roundly ignored at Copenhagen. As was demonstrated by posters in this thread, the US doesn't give a fuck about us unless we do as we're told. This is why I in fact welcome the eventual birth of the Euro-superstate and the EU as a true superpower.

 

[avaya]

This is just not true. The UK bought a handful of TEST aircraft. No substantial order has been placed. They are penciled in to replace Harriers, but not for at least 5 years.

Yes because we need them now. We need fighter aircraft to patrol the skies. Maybe we need them to bomb the immigrants.

 

[Joel Was Right]

The Times:

Nick Clegg:
48%

Gordon Brown
17%

David Cameron
34%

That's a fucking joke. After seeing one of their writers try to explain how she thought Brown was the worst (he talked too much policy and details, instead of trying to relate to people), I have no interest in reading their opinion of this debate.

 

[Garjon]

Actually, I forgot about Cameron's hypocrisy over the 'frightening' leaflets. For that, I'd have Brown>Clegg>>Cameron. I agree with Nick Robinson when he said Brown was far more assertive this week, plus he was the one who seemed to stick to discussing his policies rather than squabbling - a stark change from last week:lol

 

[Omikaru]

Remember his party came second in the European Parliament elections though.

Yes, at the height of the expenses scandal where the Tories were far and away the leaders. It was obvious that most angry right wing voters would be siphoned off by UKIP, alongside their current voterbase.

 

[Acheteedo]

After seeing one of their writers try to explain how she thought Brown was the worst (he talked too much policy and details, instead of trying to relate to people), I have no interest in reading their opinion of this debate.

:lol that is bad.

 

[Dark Machine]

This is just not true. The UK bought a handful of TEST aircraft. No substantial order has been placed. They are penciled in to replace Harriers, but not for at least 5 years. And we need to sustain our RAF to preserve both defense and economy.

Do you honestly believe that a fighter we've invested so much in will not be ordered in some capacity? And regardless it matters little in terms of jobs because other countries will buy it, and BAE will have to build it.

Yes because we need them now. We need fighter aircraft to patrol the skies. Maybe we need them to bomb the immigrants.

We need them to shoot down the Chinese nukes full of cancer with immigrants tied to them!

 

[FabCam]

Yes because we need them now. We need fighter aircraft to patrol the skies. Maybe we need them to bomb the immigrants.

What? You stated that we had already paid for them - a complete fabrication. Clegg's replacement strategy would cost more than sustaining our already paid for and fully operational aircraft.

@Dark Machine: I'm not disputing the fact that they will not be ordered. Instead, Clegg's replacement policy is totally ridiculous. He plans to save money by scrapping a fully paid for and fully operational aircraft by... buying more aircraft.

 

[ceramic]

Apparently:

Angus Reid:
Nick Clegg - 35%
David Cameron - 32%
Gordon Brown - 23%

In case it hasn't been posted yet

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

As was demonstrated by posters in this thread, the US doesn't give a fuck about us unless we do as we're told.

Well depending on the day of the week Obama may give half a crap.

 

[Dark Machine]

Well depending on the day of the week Obama may give half a crap.



Yeah, because that family is going to work out perfectly.

Well HEY! Yours did! Remember when the United States wasn't so UNITED?