UMVC3: Phoenix Wright and Nova Revealed!

He will end up being an assist char. His projectile is more for combo extension TBH. He will be depending on his fullscreen pokes and armor attacks to set up the command grab which will not happen due to his HUGE ass hitbox and slow walking speed.

He will have the problems Sent has but without the flight mode or Hard Drive to help him get out of corner pressure. Yeah Nemesis just seems to be used for assist and nothing else.

Sorry but IMO he will end up the worst. Just due to the huge hitbox.
 
There are only 2 things that make Nemesis interesting to me.

Invincible freakin hyper to punish shit and more than that the highly HIGHLY armored assist.

Assist character is how I see him turning out for me. He's got options, but he's slow and I'm already seeing people block the shit outta him and punish him in vids people put up from these shows. Same can be said for Sentinel in a way...guy is big, guy is armored, guy has range but he is predictable and easy to scout.

I still play a lot of Sentinel though so who knows. Course he can fly, has a great wavedash, and an air hyper so he's got that over Nemesis. Either way I just don't feel hyped for Nemesis though.
 
i already have experience using an assist character in haggar so using nemesis will be a no brainer for me. he looks to be way, way better than haggar as well. his command grabs have good range and he can zone when he needs to and he has that hyper that eats up almost everything. his x factor 3 level 3 causes insane damage so he will be good as an anchor.
 
Off of Deviantart.

I just see problems for Nemesis. Heavy chars need some of the following: Tons of super armor to eat up the light attacks and deal damage, either a projectile that covers a lot of space or is quick and not a charge motion.

And Nemesis's hyper has hyper armor and not invulnearable like Sent/Hulk's hyper. Just the big hitbox screams bad with his moveset.
 
Did anyone ever got 500,000 points in MVC3 arcade mode?

I was testing to see if I can for fun since I want to get Phoenix Wright achievement.
 
God's Beard said:
You just don't know.
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?
Care to elaborate? I haven't seen anything that's particularly impressive. He's got interesting resets, but not unlike She-Hulk, Spencer, and others with command grabs. Damage is a given. If someone would like to feed me some crow stew, I'm ready for a helping but I don't think it will be anytime soon. But if anyone can do it, Combofiend can. And with all due respect, it's not like you haven't be wrong before. The game isn't even out and I haven't got my hands on it so I'll reserve further judgement but for now Nemesis is going into the bin.

The most accurate "tier list" out of the new cast so far has probably been QisTopTier's.
 
smurfx said:
that may actually catch a ton of players by surprise. kinda like haggar on point.
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Agreed... his only place is point or 2nd for assist. You never want him as anchor -- players will run all day and waste your xfactor. I even have strong feelings against having dark Wesker as anchor. Although he is godlike, experienced players will run away successfully from XF3 Wesker. Virgil XF-LVL3 with summoned swords will be best anchor in the game IMHO.
 
koryuken said:
Agreed... his only place is point or 2nd for assist. You never want him as anchor -- players will run all day and waste your xfactor. I even have strong feelings against dark Wesker as anchor. Although he is godlike, experienced players will run away successfully from XF3 Wesker. Virgil XF-LVL3 with summoned swords will be best anchor in the game IMHO.
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Well you are in for a rude shock :D
 
koryuken said:
Agreed... his only place is point or 2nd for assist. You never want him as anchor -- players will run all day and waste your xfactor. I even have strong feelings against dark Wesker as anchor. Although he is godlike, experienced players will run away successfully from XF3 Wesker. Virgil XF-LVL3 with summoned swords will be best anchor in the game IMHO.
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I really hope this isn't the case.

As it stands Virigil looks like he is easily going to stand above the rest of the cast.

I don't know if I would say broken but certainly OP and if he is strong enough to stand above the cast in his Normal state and then suddenly be a better Achor then Dark Pheonix then he has gone from being OP to flat broken.
 
TruePrime said:
I really hope this isn't the case.

As it stands Virigil looks like he is easily going to stand above the rest of the cast.

I don't know if I would say broken but certainly OP and if he is strong enough to stand above the cast in his Normal state and then suddenly be a better Achor then Dark Pheonix then he has gone from being OP to flat broken.
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What makes him great on paper is that you cannot run away and the summoned swords make sure you get hit...

TruePrime said:
I really hope this isn't the case.

As it stands Virigil looks like he is easily going to stand above the rest of the cast.

I don't know if I would say broken but certainly OP and if he is strong enough to stand above the cast in his Normal state and then suddenly be a better Achor then Dark Pheonix then he has gone from being OP to flat broken.
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There is no way he will be a better anchor than Dark Phoenix. He will still be somewhat fair... I have killed an entire team in under 6 seconds as dark phoenix. Virgil will not be that OP, guaranteed.
 
Chillax guys, xfactor 3 virgil will be strong yes, same could be said for most of the cast. But wont be remotely near phoenix levels. He'll be on par with xfactor dante. Strider is more dangerous in xfactor. Firebrand is more dangerous in xfactor.

Virgil will be the type that you will want to use the level 2 xfactor for while still having an assist.
 
QisTopTier said:
Chillax guys, xfactor 3 virgil will be strong yes, same could be said for most of the cast. But wont be remotely near phoenix levels. He'll be on par with xfactor dante. Strider is more dangerous in xfactor. Firebrand is more dangerous in xfactor.

Virgil will be the type that you will want to use the level 2 xfactor for while still having an assist.
Click to expand...

XFLVL + summonsed spinning swords + teleport behind. If they block, you are safe,and can go for super fast High/lows, crossovers with swords, throws into full combos, etc. Agreed though, he will not be a Dark Phoenix.
 
koryuken said:
Why? XFLVL + summonsed spinning swords + teleport behind. If they block you are safe, and can go for super fast High/lows, crossovers with swords, throws into full combos, etc. Regardless, he will not be a Dark Phoenix.
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Yay let's ignore all the things in the game engine and just pretend people are forced blocking with no means of escape!
 
Vergil is going to retire Dark Wesker.

LVL3XF + Devil Trigger + Storm Sword formation = THE FUCK YOU GONNA DO?

Although I personally will not be playing him anchor. I will be playing him on point because I am of the believe that like Viper he can sustain himself meter wise. Just need two assists to help him extend combos further and be able to mix up well at close and long distances. I have so much theory fighter packed in with Vergil, I swear it feels like I am playing him every day.

I am pretty sure that the same teleport + "blender" assist fuzzy guard mix up is still going to be extremely powerful in UMVC3.


i wonder will you be able to use taskmasters counter hyper when virgil has those summoned swords around him? i hope so.
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You can just use arrows to snipe him and remove his swords. If he gets hit his swords are removed. I don't think the swords themselves count as physical hits though... if so that would be LOL.

Capcom REALLY tried their hardest to nerf the SS to hell. 2nd formation an extra meter, entire formation removed if hit, doesn't build any meter, scales combo to shit and no block damage from swords. Seth said that Vergil's swords used to be 1 meter throughout, didn't remove on hit and did block damage/built meter.
 
smurfx said:
i wonder will you be able to use taskmasters counter hyper when virgil has those summoned swords around him? i hope so.
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I'm sure they count as projectiles. Unless they do the whole weird wolverine's projectile super is actually a physical hit thing.
 
Not going to be easy as that. Hawkeye/Strange/Nova say fuck that. All three will waste a meter to punish it from Nova Force, to SoV, to the golden arrow.

Vergil will have to have an assist to protect him or the insta punishers and area hypers go forget your swords.

Strange/Firebrand/Strider will probably be the most dangerous anchors out of the cast. Nova, unsure on. Vergil needs to follow Dorm and go second for an assist and meter.
 
crimsonspider89 said:
Not going to be easy as that. Hawkeye/Strange/Nova say fuck that. All three will waste a meter to punish it from Nova Force, to SoV, to the golden arrow.

Vergil will have to have an assist to protect him or the insta punishers and area hypers go forget your swords.

Strange/Firebrand/Strider will probably be the most dangerous anchors out of the cast. Nova, unsure on. Vergil needs to follow Dorm and go second for an assist and meter.
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Strange is just going to be annoying period, specially with meter stocked up. He might be one of the worst out of the new characters, but he is still strong and can punish you damn near instantly when ever you press a button. Hawkeye can as well.
 
Dahbomb said:
I am pretty sure that the same teleport + "blender" assist fuzzy guard mix up is still going to be extremely powerful in UMVC3.
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Can you elaborate on the blender assist? Not familiar with this tech...
 
smurfx said:
i might use hawkeye just so i can instant punish all the annoying teleport behind you characters with his hyper.
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I wonder if XF LVL3 will make some of the TP's damn near safe. All the moves get super safe/sped up...
 
koryuken said:
I wonder if XF LVL3 will make some of the TP's damn near safe. All the moves get super safe/sped up...
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well if i can make them blow their x factor early then that is my victory.
 
I JUST GOT PERMISSION TO DO MY STATISTICS FINAL ON EVERYONE'S OPINION OF THE NEW MARVEL CAST!!!!

Everyone get ready because I'm about to post the survey. PM me your responses and I will release the data after I run all the numbers and comparison charts. There will be a LOT of stuff in this. Final voted rank, rank on average, box and whisker charts that should actually plot the proper range of how people see the characters to plot the tiers based on voting data...a ton of shit.

This class lasts beyond release too so I can incorporate any changes you make after launch.

Vote now and when RR and FW reveal soon you are free to change your votes if you so choose. (i'll keep records of before rankings to compare to the after rankings of things once they reveal. Ill also run another comparison after launch as well.)
 
I honestly think Strange, Nova and Firebrand are the three to be worried about out of the new chars the most. Followed by Hawkeye, Vergil, Strider. The second group of three just seem like they are going to be scary as hell with the meter to run in second slot.

Nova just screams rushdown beast who can go anywhere, Strange is going to be the new Viper. Face a good one and smash your face in. Firebrand, is going to be an annoying bastard with him flying around.
 
People are already assuming that Vergil is going to do naked SS into teleport.

Yeah people WILL do that day 1 until others figure it out. It's not hard to block SS + teleport, Vergil's teleport isn't that fast. Once you block SS and Vergil has no meter, you are A OK.

The utility on SS is that it's like 2 frame start up (instant basically) and it can initiate a reversal. Plus it keeps opponents in block stun so you can't just use hyper to de-activate it unless you use XF guard cancel into invincible hyper. It's primary use is lock down enough to call an assist and create a 50/50 or convert it into 2nd formation which is more terrifying. Vergil can just chill in the corner while the swords hover you and once they start hitting he comes in.

The real scary part which isn't 100% confirmed yet but people have been murmuring about is that Storm Swords isn't a true block string (the 2nd formation, first formation is a block string of course) but if it hits it causes such a massive stagger that every sword is confirmed. While the swords are raining down you could keep teleporting and create an impossible to block 50/50 if you do it right. I saw LPN take out Phoenix this way, FChamp had no idea how to block that.


Can you elaborate on the blender assist? Not familiar with this tech...
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When you are close to your opponent either if they are grounded or not (within normal jump range), you call assist preferably with a high priority and one that juggles opponent long enough for a hit confirm (the #1 blender assist is Akuma Tatsu as it also causes a soft knockdown). As soon as you call assist, you tap the opponent with st.L which they block but they quickly come out of block stun. As soon as you do st.L you do teleport. What's going to happen is a fuzzy guard situation where they blocked the st.L but as soon as the teleport is initiated they come out of block stun and they are crossed up instantly with an assist also coming in. What's going to happen is that the assist will pick them up while they are mix in between the 2 characters like a blender.

It's the standard mix up used nowadays with Akuma + Wolverine/Dante/Wesker/Zero. Dante and Wesker especially are the kings of this and because of this anti-Phoenix technology has gone up. Wesker can do teleports from the air but Dante on in-coming character can lock them in place with Jam Session -> Devil Trigger and initiate the blender. It's a guaranteed 50/50 that you can do nothing about but guess.
 
crimsonspider89 said:
I honestly think Strange, Nova and Firebrand are the three to be worried about out of the new chars the most. Followed by Hawkeye, Vergil, Strider. The second group of three just seem like they are going to be scary as hell with the meter to run in second slot.

Nova just screams rushdown beast who can go anywhere, Strange is going to be the new Viper. Face a good one and smash your face in. Firebrand, is going to be an annoying bastard with him flying around.
Click to expand...

Why is everyone hyping firebrand as anchor? Because of the helper assist + XF3?? His damage is not that good and he has quite a few weaknesses.

Dahbomb said:
The real scary part which isn't 100% confirmed yet but people have been murmuring about is that Storm Swords isn't a true block string (the 2nd formation, first formation is a block string of course) but if it hits it causes such a massive stagger that every sword is confirmed. While the swords are raining down you could keep teleporting and create an impossible to block 50/50 if you do it right. I saw LPN take out Phoenix this way, FChamp had no idea how to block that.
Click to expand...

VIDEO LINK PLEASE!!!
I was thinking DT Vergil with 1st formation and teleport above their head. Since he has airdash in DT, he can go to either side. A true safe 50/50 with XF3 that can kill a char instantly.
 
crimsonspider89 said:
I honestly think Strange, Nova and Firebrand are the three to be worried about out of the new chars the most. Followed by Hawkeye, Vergil, Strider. The second group of three just seem like they are going to be scary as hell with the meter to run in second slot.

Nova just screams rushdown beast who can go anywhere, Strange is going to be the new Viper. Face a good one and smash your face in. Firebrand, is going to be an annoying bastard with him flying around.
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I kinda wish max showed off Firebrands level 1 power up super and his level 3 a bit more. So I could have something better to use for what im saying but meh xD it's all good. Just think of felicia and wolverine fused and that's all you need to know.
 
Which is why in second slot those three are going to be scary. Assist plus meter with those three I named will be scary. Hawkeye punishing everything and then combo poison OTG and continue and repeat. Strider, we all know how. Vergil, will have two options DT or swords. So that itself is a mixup potential.
 
Firebrand has great aerial movements, great ways to set up mixups, and he can perform Arthur's gold armor fire bottle without the meter. Firebrand with XF3, and meter is going to be annoying. He will be opening people up like nothing. Wolverine's ability to perform pretty much two XFs is one of the dominating factors which Firebrand can do as well.

So Kitty Helper+ Bersearker Charge +XF3 is no laughing matter at all.
 
Why is everyone hyping firebrand as anchor? Because of the helper assist + XF3?? His damage is not that good and he has quite a few weaknesses.
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Luminous Body + LVL3 hyper + XF = Impossible to block speedy stone gargoyles all over the place that covert into high damage.

High priority dive kick, meter building during his utility hyper, space covering projectiles and some of the most unorthodox but confusing mobility in the game. And like said Luminous Body is basically a B Charge you can build meter during and his LVL3 is like Kitty Helper on steroids although it will take a while before people get used to controlling his LVL3 and his air options.

will taskmaster and hawkeye be firebrands worst match ups? up arrows might stop some of his rushdown.
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No because Firebrand has various trajectories to by pass those arrows like low to the ground straight forward air dash or Bon Voyage.


VIDEO LINK PLEASE!!!
I was thinking DT Vergil with 1st formation and teleport above their head. Since he has airdash in DT, he can go to either side. A true safe 50/50 with XF3 that can kill a char instantly.
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Oh trust me if he has DT + SS it's going to be like DMC3 Vergil boss fight all over again. The issue with Vergil is basically HOW someone intends to use his meter. Some may save it for the LVL4, some may use SS lockdowns and others will burn it for damage with JC hyper or mobility/utility with DT. He has a lot of options for meter usage but all of them are good.
 
Survey will follow this post.

*NOTE*

  • PM me your survey answers.
    This way the board DOES NOT GET CLUTTERED.

  • DO NOT POST YOUR HOW YOU RANKED THINGS ON THE SURVEY!!
    This would flood the board and probably start the dreaded "tier war" arguments, but worst of all it could pressure other people's votes. By keeping things private it keeps opinions safe from pressure and bias. This way we can get an accurate ranking of things. If you wanna vote Vergil, or Iron Fist or ANYONE as garbage then do so, but don't bring it up afterwards.

    The results will be worth it.
 
Like I said it's legit but it's a lot of meter for a "safe 50/50". Trust me when I say this... Vergil is going to have a ton of safe 50/50s when combined with an assist.

Oh and you know what I was talking about "blender" assist... guess who has a blender assist too... Vergil's Rapid Slash. Covers a great portion of screen and causes soft knockdown on hit, excellent for teleporters. In corner it's going to set up the most ambiguous mix ups since vanilla Tatsu.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WSOYHp_Mw4 <-- This isn't the best example because now that I remember it Phoenix was already getting hit but it gives you an idea.
 
*Survey ended*

Thanks to those who participated
Dahbomb
Karsticles
Bizazedo
Crimsonspider89
Mr.Puppy
Twisted-Gamer
Reigun
Viewtiful_Dru
Azure Jericho
Banana Kid
Touch
Tiger Uppercut
Nate 405
Nils
Kamisamaa
ThoughtsofSpeaking
DevastatorPrime
Becquerel
Shadowninja64
Godsbeard
Sephi22
Solar Powered
Solune
Qistoptier


This will go a long way. Expect stat thread soon.
 
shaowebb said:
stuff
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I'll get cracking on this for ya tomorrow. Right now my body is saying fuck you and my mind is like DONT DO ANYTHING AND GO TO BED.

Oh and firebrands worst match ups will be.

Ghostrider/Shuma/Strider/Dante/Hulk/Nemisis/.......... arthur/Zero/X-23

Well by worst I mean fight him on even ground for the most part.

Keep in mind he can zone the shit out of hulk but it's really not in his favor.

When he pops his level 3 though the whole cast is his bitch.
 
Dahbomb said:
Like I said it's legit but it's a lot of meter for a "safe 50/50". Trust me when I say this... Vergil is going to have a ton of safe 50/50s when combined with an assist.

Oh and you know what I was talking about "blender" assist... guess who has a blender assist too... Vergil's Rapid Slash. Covers a great portion of screen and causes soft knockdown on hit, excellent for teleporters. In corner it's going to set up the most ambiguous mix ups since vanilla Tatsu.
Click to expand...

Awesome... I do hope it is a great assist :) That will validate my choice as Wesker #1, Vergil #3.
Here is another scrubby setup with 1 Meter. It can be blocked, but I imagine it will be hard to do so. The best way would be to air-throw on reaction.

I am thinking you summon formation #1. Call an assist to surprise your opponent. TP above their head, and as you are falling jam on A. (fastest attack). First attack will need to be blocked high, but as you are falling the swords are keeping them locked. You spam A during the descent. As your are falling, keep holding down(for crouch) and jamming on A. Basically they have to react to your TP with swords and then block high low in a split second. If your jab gets through at any point, your swords will give you enough time to react for a full combo. I know this is not fool proof, but since swords are keeping you safe, the risk/reward is in your favor for 1 meter.
 
QisTopTier said:
I'll get cracking on this for ya tomorrow. Right now my body is saying fuck you and my mind is like DONT DO ANYTHING AND GO TO BED.
Click to expand...


Its cool. I'll be tallying data daily and making corrections as votes change after reveals and launch. For those already voting (if any) I forgot a question and added it in. Its under the "edit" notice at the bottom.

Thanks for doing this guys. It'll be fun showing the results of what the data shows as the overall opinions. I'll post comparative voting charts, average rank, final voted rank, and the range of where characters placed in votes along with everything else so you know how things went down overall. This aint a simple vote job...its statistics and you'll know the rundown of how things are viewed as a whole by the time I'm done.

Best college math class ever.
 
Jintor said:
I hope you're accounting for scrubs who don't do anything great but watch (like me) Shao

/edit why 'scrubs', anyway?
Click to expand...

I'm accounting for this. Even though the population I am surveying will be heavily stacked in favor of players who have done their own research I'll be showing box and whisker charts that show the extremes of how everyone is voted, the average ranges they stayed at within those extremes (a good indicator of tier within the 12) and the most average line of divergence they stayed within within that range to show the (more or less) mathematical rank someone stayed on anything they were voted on.

Each of the 12 will have a list of numbers shown for them after the overall results are shown. The numbers will list averages, ranges, and a lot of other stuff.

So yeah...you can be as scrubby as you want and still vote.

Could anyone help me make a list (or know of a link to a list) of character assists?
 
Dahbomb said:
X-23 has favorable match ups against Firebrand?

I want to hear the explanation on that. The rest is more or less accurate.
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Mostly for priority and range reasons. Of course one lucky fireball during her barrage of shit and moving around and she's as good as gone. X-23 is severely underrated even in current marvel. Her main flaw is that she's just flat out harder to use than a lot of the top characters and that's the main flaw of mvc3 in general. A great x-23 is pure bullshit though and her fucking crazy ass hitboxes will fuck over his approaches from any direction.

Let me just say there are only a few of the cast that can do a full combo to you behind them on the ground or air, and she is one of them. A true tribute to her hitboxes T.T

In all honesty if the game got to go on longer x-23 would of replaced wolverine on teams.
 
Dahbomb said:
Vergil is going to retire Dark Wesker.

LVL3XF + Devil Trigger + Storm Sword formation = THE FUCK YOU GONNA DO?
Click to expand...

Vergil is going to be like Wolverine, he can teleport and troll you easily when you are on the ground but his air game is lackluster and if you use the usual Wesker air teleport runaway/fly around the screen tactics he's going to have a hard time catching you. Making running out XF against him easy. Which makes me seriously doubt his viability as an anchor.

QisTopTier said:
Oh and firebrands worst match ups will be.

Ghostrider/Shuma/Strider/Dante/Hulk/Nemisis/.......... arthur/Zero/X-23

Well by worst I mean fight him on even ground for the most part.
Click to expand...

His worst matchup will be Storm/Hawkeye/Strange/Magneto/Dorm/Nova. Pretty much anyone that's going to able to take advantage of that stupid auto flight aspect of Firebrand to punish him easily while he's flying. In fact I can predict that those Gravity Squeezes are going to make a lot of people drop Firebrand quickly.
 
scytheavatar said:
His worst matchup will be Storm/Hawkeye/Strange/Magneto/Dorm. Pretty much anyone that's going to able to take advantage of that stupid auto flight aspect of Firebrand to punish him easily while he's flying.
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He's not gonna be autoflying unless he is in your face already landing hits, by that point it's to late, inputting the unfly command is fast and easy as well.
 
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