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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 4 - Sundays on HBO

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L

Lonestar

I joined for Erin Brockovich discussion
-Pyromaniac- said:
I feel like the stuff on the wall bores a lot of people because it's so far removed from everything else happening in the story. It's like it's operating in its own bubble. Yet at the same time the info learned from the wall can have such massive implications which only makes it seem kind of more ridiculous that it isn't being acknowledged for the most part and is still in that bubble.

I'm trying to make a point here but I'm too tired to articulate it properly. I'll just assume people see what I'm driving at.
Click to expand...

it's a hell of alot closer to the action than Essos and the land of forever WHEREAREMYDRAGONS
 
B

Basileus777

Member
-Pyromaniac- said:
I feel like the stuff on the wall bores a lot of people because it's so far removed from everything else happening in the story. It's like it's operating in its own bubble. Yet at the same time the info learned from the wall can have such massive implications which only makes it seem kind of more ridiculous that it isn't being acknowledged for the most part and is still in that bubble.

I'm trying to make a point here but I'm too tired to articulate it properly. I'll just assume people see what I'm driving at.
Click to expand...

Well that should be ending soon with Stannis arriving and the Bolton plotline getting connected with the Wall.
 
K

Kittenwithbeer

Banned
-Pyromaniac- said:
I feel like the stuff on the wall bores a lot of people because it's so far removed from everything else happening in the story. It's like it's operating in its own bubble. Yet at the same time the info learned from the wall can have such massive implications which only makes it seem kind of more ridiculous that it isn't being acknowledged for the most part and is still in that bubble.

I'm trying to make a point here but I'm too tired to articulate it properly. I'll just assume people see what I'm driving at.
Click to expand...

Well then that's pretty funny then, right? Majority of viewers aren't interested in The Wall and Jon's story as much as King's Landing and others. Everyone's invested in the game of thrones, despite The Wall being the most important part of the whole continent of Westeros. Winter is coming, The Others have returned, and The Wildlings are attacking. That poses a much greater threat than anyone can imagine but everyone is too invested in sitting upon the iron throne. No one gives a damn about The Night's Watch and won't until it's too late.
 
S

Speevy

Banned
The biggest problem with the wall is the whitewalker story.

They can't afford as much CG as they need to make that relevant.

First episode: Oh shit it's whitewalkers.

Later that season: Oh shit, men can come back to life.

Second season: Oh shit, it's an army of whitewalkers. They're gonna kill Sam!

Third season: Wait, no. Sam's okay, it's just a few of them.

Later in the third season: Sam's brave. He stabbed one!

Fourth season: Oh shit, they have a king and they're turning babies blue!

Meanwhile in King's Landing: Let's have a trial by combat to decide the fate of Tyrion.


Nobody besides Stannis cares about this, and we haven't been made to care about Stannis.
 
F

Fancy Clown

Member
Kittenwithbeer said:
Well then that's pretty funny then, right? Majority of viewers aren't interested in The Wall and Jon's story as much as King's Landing and others. Everyone's invested in the game of thrones, despite The Wall being the most important part of the whole continent of Westeros. Winter is coming, The Others have returned, and The Wildlings are attacking. That poses a much greater threat than anyone can imagine but everyone is too invested in sitting upon the iron throne. No one gives a damn about The Night's Watch and won't until it's too late.
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It's true the stakes are higher, but the problem is that dramatically I think political intrigue with a bunch of interesting characters is 100000x more interesting than the (frequently offscreen/page) magical and mysterious world ending threat that must be death with by a mopey band of misfits.
 
F

Fey

Banned
ugh, with only one week left, i'm beginning to get paranoid and scared stoneheart will be cut/pushed into next season

don't do it
2kiLqFo.gif
 
L

Laconic

Banned
Lonestar said:
oh yeah, the "arrow" (morelikeaspear) showed off a nice viewing angle of the wall and the elevator.



Grenn at the bottom when he lands :lol

poor Grenn.

Only Dolores Edd left :lol
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This is such bullshit. Characters dying who are alive at the end of book five.
 
V

Vespene

Member
A few predictions for episode 10:

  • Mannis' victorious stampede won't be as epic as in the book. I pictured an aerial shot from atop the wall where we see the cavalry run over the wildlings between the wall and the forest. I think the show will just show a bunch of horses scattered through the trees.
  • Probably no Stoneheart. Maybe a season 5 opener where she would be a more prominent character than in the book. Her duties on 24 ended this year.
  • Dany's will order her dragons chained and Drogon will escape within the span of 2 short scenes.
  • Death of Tywin and Shae is garanteed. There will be a lot of Lannister scenes. Maybe too many considering what else needs to be covered.
  • Always thought Brienne was going to serve as the introduction to Stoneheart. This probably won't happen this season.
  • Arya boarding the ship to Braavos NEEDS to happen this season so her opener on season 4 is her going under the Titan of Braavos. Given that it needs to happen and where she is now, the conclusion of the Hound storyline will feel rushed.
  • Is it me or, excluding the first season, have all finales felt rushed and unsatisfying? I get this finale will feel the same.
 
F

Fuzzy

I would bang a hot farmer!
Fancy Clown said:
They were like the only familiar faces in the crowd of Night's Watchmen though, and they offered a bit of charm/humor now and again. Now there's only Edd left :(

Meanwhile Janos Slynt got to live...
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I bet his execution won't be for not following orders but for cowardice/abandoning his post during the fight.
 
D

Dysun

Member
Janos can be both a coward and an asshole at the same time. I fail to see how it changes anything.

Alliser could replace Bowen Marsh as well, or they could still add him in if they don't want to go that route since he's always been antagonistic towards Jon
 
A

A Human Becoming

More than a Member
FusionCode said:
Well Stannis HAS to show up next episode right? I know D&D don't like him but they can't seriously rob him of his greatest moment. It would be as bad as making Jaime a rapist.
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Have they said anything to suggest that?
Fancy Clown said:
Ah, thanks. Even though a lot of the dialogue is the same, I feel it works a lot better on the page. I think it's more just the performances and the 'holding a dying friend on the battlefield in the middle of the battle' cliche that's more prevalent on the screen.

I stand by that it would be better if:
1) She died immediately after the arrow hit her
2) He finds her dead/dying after the battle

It would be less 'sastisfying', but I think it would be more emotionally effective by emphasizing that despite their feelings for each other they were both ultimately serving causes that would keep them apart, including denying them one last reunion.
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That's what happened in the books after all. Worked better I think.
Hasphat'sAnts said:
Man the critics are going ham on this episode.

Fair game in my opinion. The show runners never invested much in the Wall story line to make us care.
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This excerpt from the A.V. Club review illustrates that well:
...even the biggest Jon and Ygritte ‘shippers, say, would be hard-pressed to find the moment when the latter dies of an arrow through the heart to be as powerful as it might have been. It’s a momentary pause in the action that the episode attempts to give weight, but because we’ve been away from the characters so long, it doesn’t get to be anything other than said pause. “Watchers” strains to give it the weight of tragedy, but it doesn’t really deserve it, because how long has it been since we’ve seen Jon and Ygritte together? In show time, it’s been nine episodes, but in actual calendar time, it’s been over a year.

This mostly means that my main problem with “The Watchers On The Wall” has basically nothing to do with the episode itself—which might have worked fine as an action climax to a differently executed storyline—and everything to do with the fact that this season has had such a heavy King’s Landing focus that giving an entire episode over to the conclusion to this story didn’t make a lot of sense from a structural standpoint. The entirety of the Night’s Watch story this season has been a lot of throat-clearing and warnings about Wildlings, with a brief pause for a voyage north to stop some raping and pillaging, just because the characters all needed something to do. Intellectually, I knew that the Wildlings were closing in on the Wall, but when they raided Monk’s Town last week, all I could think was: Oh yeah. These guys. That’s not a good sign for the major opponents in your penultimate battle episode. It’s different in a book, where we can keep turning pages and turning pages, where Ygritte was always more of a footnote, where it’s easier to have fun with the notion of Jon being kind of a dolt. On screen, everything tends to flatten and become literalized.
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I enjoyed the episode but this is what happens when Nammek is going to explain in five minutes takes multiple episodes.
 
V

Vyer

Member
Oh man that was great. Amazing how epic that was. And Jon for the first time completely felt like Lord Commander Snow.

I also feel like Stoneheart may be next season, but I guess we'll see.
 
V

Vespene

Member
From a production standpoint, this was a way bigger triumph than Blackwater. The episode was littered with money shots.

- Aerial shot of the wildlings breaking camp to rush Castle Black, flying over the wall while seeing the lookouts rushing to position, then panning to the forest on fire with the dots appearing through the trees.

- Great work with pretty much all the giant stuff. As epic as in the book.

- The giant's arrow hitting that poor crow, projectiled into the air and landing in Castle Black.

- The scythe "surprise" was this episode's wildfire blast.

- Amazing mise-en-scène showing the entire battle inside Castle Black.

This is probably the most amazing high-budget production I've seen for a TV show.
 
G

"God's Beard!"

Member
Definitely the worst episode of the season for me. Sure, there were cool shots and all, but it was just all so boring outside of admiring cinematography. Just Sam for ten minutes, a half hour block of nothing but action shots then it ends.

The script might as well have been *they fight*.

The blackwater episode was so awesome because there was real character development, you got to see the action from different perspectives and there were major plot developments. There was no resolution to the episode, and it was really disappointing because I was looking forward to it.

By far the worst 9th episode as well.
 
D

Dany

Banned
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";115381132]Definitely the worst episode of the season for me. Sure, there were cool shots and all, but it was just all so boring outside of admiring cinematography. Just Sam for ten minutes, a half hour block of nothing but action shots then it ends.

The script might as well have been *they fight*.

The blackwater episode was so awesome because there was real character development, you got to see the action from different perspectives and there were major plot developments. There was no resolution to the episode, and it was really disappointing because I was looking forward to it.

By far the worst 9th episode as well.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I like Sam and Jon, but they could have done more with them.
 
G

"God's Beard!"

Member
Dany M said:
Yeah, I like Sam and Jon, but they could have done more with them.
Click to expand...

I was really expecting at least one scene with Ciaran Hinds to show the wildling side, some sort of relevant dialogue from anywhere outside of the Night's Watch. Instead it was just half an hour of a tower defense flash game.

Even Jon Snow's "development" into becoming more of a leader was him yelling at people to fire arrows once and giving orders to someone that listened because he's his friend, not his boss. And then he abandons his post to be seen cuddling with the enemy by the people he's supposed to lead.
 
R

rataven

Member
Just rewatched it. That long shot was something special for television. They've come a long way since Blackwater. And man, Jon's face hit that anvil HARD. Would have knocked a lesser brother out.

Preview talk/speculation:
Seems clear that they've set up a Brienne/Hound confrontation, but what's the point? The show's already given his character a way out with the infected bite and we got the earlier foreshadowing on delivering a mercy kill along with Arya's jab at his slower pace on the way to the Eyrie. The Hound's 'death' in SoS would work logically with what they've already shown us and top off his journey with Arya perfectly. Why throw Brienne in? What will that mean for Arya? And the QI?
 
D

Demon Ice

Banned
Holy shit at that giant mace / scythe thing on the wall, was that in the books??


Also goodnight sweet Ygritte :'( Knew it was coming, still hurt to watch

Also Pyp and Grenn :( :( I guess that's one way to keep surprising book readers
 
S

suzu

Member
- I liked the giants, mammoth, Tormund, Ghost, huge scythe, and most of Sam's scenes.
- Poor Pyp and Grenn. :( The reciting of the Night's Watch vows was a really good scene.
- Ygritte. :( :( I laughed at that kid nodding though.
- The music was good.

I actually liked Jon Snow in this episode. Which is nice because he's my favorite in the books, but not on the show. haha..

Episode 10 is going to be crazy.
 
D

Demon Ice

Banned
Jon Snow showed off some fantastic swordplay against the Magnar. Thought that was awesome.


Also the run time for the Finale is 66 minutes so hopefully they managed to squeeze Stoneheart in there.
 
C

Count of Monte Sawed-Off

un33dab@dpu$$y
Szeth said:
Hey, remember when they killed those guys at Craster's so Mance wouldn't know how outnumbered they were? Looks like Jon's plan worked, and it all ended up making perfect sense. It's all there, just use your brains instead of jumping to complaining, folks.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but shouldn't that warg with the owl be able to tell how many people were there anyway?
 
T

The Silver

Member
In terms of action and scale and all that stuff this episode easily beats Blackwater.

The only thing that brings it down is the lack of characters you really care about and of course any real badass battle needs Stannis the Mannis Baratheon.(but that will be fixed next episode)
 
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