Anoregon
The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
That is pretty much how I see it. Absolutely awful, 100% rape, but 100% inevitable.
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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 5 - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter Steelyuhas
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That is pretty much how I see it. Absolutely awful, 100% rape, but 100% inevitable.
schlongdog
Banned
Exactly how I feel
Corpsepyre
Banned
It wouldn't have been rape before R v R. However, ever since that case came up, in UK atleast, such an act would be considered rape, arguably.
Anyway, this is season 5, and I still see people weeping over characters getting raped, killed, and more. We're watching Game of Thrones, right?
Enjoyed the episode a lot. Arya's arc + Tyrion/Jorah and the last scene were the highlights. It's quite certain they're setting up Reek to snap and do something drastic sooner or later. Can't wait to see how it plays out. Dorne could use some work, however.
Anyway, this is season 5, and I still see people weeping over characters getting raped, killed, and more. We're watching Game of Thrones, right?
Enjoyed the episode a lot. Arya's arc + Tyrion/Jorah and the last scene were the highlights. It's quite certain they're setting up Reek to snap and do something drastic sooner or later. Can't wait to see how it plays out. Dorne could use some work, however.
Incandenza
Banned
D&D have to be aware that the Sand Snakes stuff turned out really bad. In my head it went like this:
- People love Oberyn. People love that Dornish swagger. Let's go a bit over-the-top with these characters. Three sexy Spanish vipers getting into fights in sunny Seville, what could go wrong?
- Oh no, these actors are nowhere near as good as Pedro Pascal, now all this stuff just sounds cheesy.
- Oh no, these actors can't fight.
- Oh no, these breastplates have nipples on them.
- Oh no, we had to darken up the lighting in post so the breastplate nipples don't stick out as much.
Even before the fan reaction, there's no way they looked at those final cuts and went "Oh yeah, we nailed it."
- People love Oberyn. People love that Dornish swagger. Let's go a bit over-the-top with these characters. Three sexy Spanish vipers getting into fights in sunny Seville, what could go wrong?
- Oh no, these actors are nowhere near as good as Pedro Pascal, now all this stuff just sounds cheesy.
- Oh no, these actors can't fight.
- Oh no, these breastplates have nipples on them.
- Oh no, we had to darken up the lighting in post so the breastplate nipples don't stick out as much.
Even before the fan reaction, there's no way they looked at those final cuts and went "Oh yeah, we nailed it."
Latvian Hitman
Member
I'm in the minority of people who don't really have a problem with the scene in the context of the show. But, come on- Sansa was raped. No way around that.
The legality/criminality of such an act is dependent upon culture/region.
The moral implication, not so much. Forcing or coercing someone to have sexual relations against their will is rape. Whether they have any legal recourse afterward is incidental.
The legality/criminality of such an act is dependent upon culture/region.
The moral implication, not so much. Forcing or coercing someone to have sexual relations against their will is rape. Whether they have any legal recourse afterward is incidental.
Dorne is almost certainly being minimized relative to pre-season expectations.
Sort of want to ask you to unpack this comment, so we can figure out your reasoning, but not really.
Atraveller
Banned
omg, oh my god, so useless! what the hell?
Pyramid head
Banned
You're one of those guys who think rape isn't possible between husband and wife? Jesus fucking christ.
Askherserenity
Member
lol "It was a mistake". They didn't get to sand off all the niples? What.
Electric_ Cthulhu
Member
To me it was consensual in the sense that she knew it was unavoidable. She silently agreed to it. Sure, she didn't enjoy it, but it's not like Ramsay had to force himself on top of her and she tries to fend him off.
Well.. I guess there is no point in further debating that issue. We seem to have too different views about that matter.
Yes it was.
- It involved penile penetration
- It was done without the consent of Sansa
- Ramsay couldn't have reasonably believed that she consented, at all.
It was definitely rape. Defend the show all you like, but don't go around throwing such falsehoods so carelessly.
crazyrabbits
Banned
Hahaha so true. We've seen them twice in 6 episodes. If they're barely in the last 4 I could totally buy that they minimized their roles.
I say that because she gave no consent, he threw her across the bed and ripped her clothes off before violently taking her, while forcing someone she despises to watch against his will.
What he did was entirely within his rights as husband under the GoT medieval rules, but that doesn't mean it wasn't non-consensual sex (i.e., rape).
Atraveller
Banned
Remember that line George was obsessed with? Remember? And they still kept the nipples?
Askherserenity
Member
Yeah, I think you're just digging yourself a hole with the words you're using. Like these words to be exact...
Enosh
Member
it's not like stuff like this wasn't used, although it's mostly an antique thing
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscle_cuirass
apparently mostly for parades or other ritual use but there are accounts of it being used in battle and then mostly by generals or other higher ranking officers
Corpsepyre
Banned
Tyene has to get naked before they're cut out. It must happen!
Intheflorsh
Banned
Now I'm wondering if the horrible quick cut editing during the fight scene was in fact another attempt to hide this.
Exterminieren
Banned
Incandenza
Banned
Weirdly enough, it's actually only in the series like three times. Everyone remembers it as being way more egregious.
Higgins113
Banned
I can't believe they cut Darkstar for this sand snake shite
bengraven
Member
I do have to argue that she did not consent. When she agreed to marry the guy she knew what happened on the wedding night. She agreed to that part even though it horrified her. She knew she would have to consummate it and she already got lucky one... These people killed her brother and she wasn't going to get that lucky again. When she aged to marry him she aged to have seed with him eventually. I think the character would have gone through with it whether it were more romantic or if the entire missing Greyjoy family were watching. I'm not saying she consented just by being there but I think, character wise, in her head she was like "this sucks but let's do it, I agreed to it and let's get it over with". Not defending it and I have another rant against D&d for another time but she consented I think, personally.
Please don't turn this into me defending rape.
Exterminieren
Banned
Christ, Darkstar's even worse than they are. The thought of Darkstar being in these scenes is absolutely hilarious.
I ask again; did she want to have sex?
If not, then it's rape, I'm afraid.
schlongdog
Banned
They should have just cut the SS, kept Doran, added Arianne and Oakheart
The reaction in this thread to the Sansa rape scene is honestly baffling to me. What did people expect, that she would take the reigns and seduce him, without Ramsay seeing right through it? Come on now, while she did progress a bit from the meek girl she was before, that would still be entirely unbelievable. Or did people expect Ramsay to show some kindness? Hah.
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
Yeah, would anyone actually buy this working with a character like Ramsay?
I think people expected her to do something.
The only out was that I thought *maybe* she would reveal she already knew what kind of person he was when he mentioned honesty and ask about the girls that got thrown to the dogs, then he would go to kill toothy-girl instead of throwing her on the bed, but she didn't and he did.
No one is saying that this came out of nowhere or didn't make sense from where the plot of the show has gone. We're saying that the entire story arc is a shitty thing to do to the character and this was just the final gross confirmation of that.
Electric_ Cthulhu
Member
I'm not defending rape either. I'm just saying that in a kind of medieval society like the one in Game of Thrones it wasn't rape. She consented like you said.
In the real world that would be a totally different issue. But I'm not here to talk about the real world. Calm your tits everybody.
bengraven
Member
I said it was rape. I edited to clarify but because I'm saying something minamally against type I'm going to pay for this I know.
Atraveller
Banned
"I'm of the night" will only make the current Dorne story line worse.
bodyofanamerican
Member
To be fair, speaking as someone who thinks Ramsay was one of the most fascinating/horrific characters in the books, I could honestly buy him being enamored by being married to a high born woman, agonizing over being handcuffed by Roose and not being able to torture Sansa, and the whole season being tension around when and if Ramsay snaps and gives into his basest desires.
Like, we've SEEN him as a psycho already, and it'd have been way more interesting to see him put in a situation where he can't do what we all know he wants to.
Consensual Rape*
Anton Sugar
Member
The problem isn't just "well, what did you expect?"
It's that the showrunners put her in this position. It makes no sense, from a character arc standpoint, where she's already gone through tons of abuse and humiliation. As others have pointed out, the entire Littlefinger/Sansa in the north subplot really doesn't seem too compelling or even necessary.
Higgins113
Banned
Why do I love Darkstar so much? It's pretty simple when I think about it. Darkstar isn't just the best character in the series, he might just be the greatest character of all time.
Just imagining him riding through the sands of Dorne, the wind in his hair, his mighty steed below him. As he rides through the red mountains, the ladies swoon at his very scent. They know how he smells, the essence of his smell is sold in Planky Town under the the name of "Greenblood Orgasm." The very nature of Darkstar is mystery. could he be playing a deeper game than even his creator realizes? The answer is yes, he has transcended such boundaries as the written world, and has free will to do whatever he sees fit.
However, Darkstar is filled with such guile, such arcane craft that he does not even use these powers. Why, you might ask? You will never know, for the mind of the Darkstar is not one that is easily penetrated. Darkstar is such a force of nature in his realm that nothing can truly touch him, the only thing keeping him bound to the page at all is his will to exist within the preordained boundaries of his world. Darkstar is not only beyond the comprehension of us, he exists within a plane of true focus and beauty.
Observe his playful smile, his gourgeous and rippling biceps, his gallant nose, and most importantly, his eyes. His eyes, like pools of saffron, provide the only glimpse into the true machinations of Darkstar. Do not stare into them. Many good men have gone mad in the attempt. Darkstar is not just a character, a formless collection of words and images, he is himself is the binding that holds the saga together. Without Darkstar, the entire series, the entire world of Westeros as we know it crumbles. The Trident would stop flowing without Darkstar, the Reach would become a desolate crater, and the Wall would melt without his frosty gaze. These are just of a few of the reasons why I like Darkstar so much.
I feel like it's the last thing she has to endure before setting her up as Queen in the North. At least that's what I'm telling myself. Hopefully LF shows up thinking he'll be King and she gives him to the dogs, her arc complete.
That's 496 words that could have gone into the next book, George.
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