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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 5 - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter Steelyuhas
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Saw this on reddit...fairly relevant I think regarding D&D's lack of subtlety and such.
No, there he is just abbreviating what GRRM said in less than half the words.
ChaosZeroX
Banned
I'll be honest. I was pretty devastated by that when I read it in the book the first time lol. Jon Snow is my favorite character. Once I got pasted the initial shocker; I just thought about R + L = J and Mel being at the wall. I knew he would be resurrected.
ChaosZeroX
Banned
I personally think it just has to do with them running out of Book material for alot of characters. Everyone is pretty much caught up at this point besides Jon/Arya/Tyrion/Dany who are basically the main characters of the show.
All the other characters are feeding off other story lines and what not.
Sorry mods - Forgot to edit this into my previous post.
Saw this on reddit...fairly relevant I think regarding D&D's lack of subtlety and such.
Season 6 Spoilers: I AM ARYA STARK, FOR THE NED. I FIGHT FOR THE NORTH, WHO DO YOU FIGHT FOR
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
Diverging from the books isn't inherently a bad thing. It's just that the writers of the show are average at best so the stuff they come up with tends to not be very good.
They're very good at adapting GRRM's words so that they sound like things an actual person would say, I'll give them that.
Moff
Member
Saw this on reddit...fairly relevant I think regarding D&D's lack of subtlety and such.
thats super odd, because the scene where she hid needle definitely did not look like it was a tool for revenge but a thing to remember the good old times.
but still, we all know she will stab bad people with it, does she still have needle in the books?
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
Uh...
Chuckie
Member
I totally agree with you.
I'm saying that in the events that they use dialogue straight from the books, it's adapted to be true to the show and doesn't sound like it's being read directly from the books.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
It doesn't?
Not to me. Your take may be different.
Moff
Member
fixed that for you
Given Martins tv background, do you guys think he would have been able to make the similar and necessary, MASSIVE cuts to his books, say if they started the show after the last book released and Martin got to do a lot more of the writing for the show. It would be really interesting to see what he personally feels is expendable.
Well, I think anyone who has read these books and has been given control over their adaptation is going to be bold and confident, especially if they're successful.
I always say of creators that if you're willing to disown the bad stuff you must also disown the good, because you wouldn't get one without the other, or any other's depiction.
I always say of creators that if you're willing to disown the bad stuff you must also disown the good, because you wouldn't get one without the other, or any other's depiction.
Moff
Member
that's a very good question. I think he said he wanted three seasons for AFFC/ADWD, so I don't think he woudl have cut away a lot, but then again he said that in a context where he discussed that D&D could wait for him to finish the books. but as the original writer he certainly would not have made the same decisions D&D did, season 1 would probably have been more or less the same.
Would he have been -able- to? Sure. Would he want to put himself in that position? Probably not. If he finished the writing the series, he would probably have other things things to write. I don't think dedicating another decade of his life exclusively to showrunning a series based on the exact same story he had just spent three decades of his life on is something he would do.
Interceptor
Banned
Yep. Season 5 is full of hybris.
Shuggananas
Banned
So Sandor is actually dead right ? That means no cleganebowl ? Is it gonna be Loras vs Zombie Clegane then ?
cartoon_soldier
Member
I think Stannis dying and Melissandre trying to rez him but misclicking and rezzing Jon is most likely for last episode. D&D loves that kind of stuff.
As with most things, it depends on how important it is (or I guess even if it happens at all lol).
They know people really like the Hound though, so there's that.
Atraveller
Banned
That Nolan direction.
Killed by Varys of course, he can have a jetpack too.
cartoon_soldier
Member
Hound's death was never shown, just implied. But it doesn't look like they plan to bring him back. Let's see.
Shuggananas
Banned
Brienne is way too busy imo
Unless he comes back to KL by himself to deal with his brother. Somehow. Not knowing that he was "killed".
Unless he comes back to KL by himself to deal with his brother. Somehow. Not knowing that he was "killed".
I have the impression success got the better of them and now they ride an unstoppable train.
cartoon_soldier
Member
Lett's keep in mind that last two seasons were great. They do have to adapt the weakest book this season while not having the luxury of just ignoring certain characters for a book like GRRM did.
I do think that cutting LSH was a mistake. Because it represented a hope for revenge that book readers had to look forward to but show watchers don't. In that way, also the Northern plot/Faegon cut is affecting this season. Keeping Vary's plan with faegon would have added a more sense of urgency. But yea, budget issues I am sure factored into some of these decisions.
Pyramid head
Banned
LSH also represented an arc for Jaime which is orders of magnitude better than the festering turd which has been Dorne this season.
Well, obviously it's his story. For better or worse, the other writers are chained to the events he created. Also, GURM got the benefit of writing the episodes for the best plot points in the story , i.e. Black water.
Cersei names ZombieGregor her champion, the Faith summons The Nameless Inquisitor. Book it. PPV. Two Dead Men. One Lives. One Dies Again. One Night Only.
cartoon_soldier
Member
Would be better than Mayweather-Paq
Jon should have been killed and warged into Barristan. Sam will take care of Ghost until Barrisjon comes back from Mareen with Dany and their dragons.
That would have been insane. Would have pissed off a lot of people, but hey D&D are already climbing the ladder of chaos, what's one more rung?
That would have been insane. Would have pissed off a lot of people, but hey D&D are already climbing the ladder of chaos, what's one more rung?
MisterR
Member
Except that's nothing close to what GRRM was saying.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Interesting hypothetical. Would he care though? I thought one of the driving forces for writing the books was that it couldn't be properly depicted on TV.
Honestly, when I heard him say he wanted AFFC and ADWD to be at least a season each, I figured it was just so that he'd have more time to finish the books.
The Elite
BOSS
Saw this on reddit...fairly relevant I think regarding D&D's lack of subtlety and such.
I don't see any issue with this.
It's a quick and dirty summation of GRRM's words.
?? It's completely different. She can't bring herself to leave Needle because it represents everything that she loves, not because it's a killing machine.
Moff
Member
needle is the last relic of arya stark and her old life in winterfell, it symbolizes a time where everything was all right. that was clear in the books and clear in the show, so his statement doesn't make sense, maybe it was taken out of context. because it certainly is a tool of revenge and will be used as such.
bengraven
Member
I think the best moments from the writers of this show happen as they are transformed from characters giving speeches to flesh-and-blood human beings.
The first problem with adapting the books is depicted in its best art. It looks and sounds like a series of (very dark) fantasy books. We sit and talk about how this or that didn't live up to how George described it, but the events of the show do fit the adult flesh-and-blood men and women who are inhabited by these actors.
It's how you get from this
to
I agree that they gave characters much more depth. What I've been talking about are the big "moment" scenes that happen in each chapter, created by GRRM to maximize the cliffhangers he consciously puts at the end of each chapter. Major and minor: Bran falling, Ygritte dying, the Red Wedding, Tyrion killing Sansa and Shae - all those moments were translated into the show because they were incredible. Now they have a very loose (from what I've gathered and this is conjecture) idea of how it ends without knowing all the great twists he's going to play. I think there's going to be a lot of these "moments" that he writes that will be far superior to what they have to come up with because they don't have the two books to go by. Their "moments" have lacked impact at least so far and I think when they read the books they're going to think "shit, that would have played great on screen..."
Outside of the big scenes he wrote, yes, they have "fixed" his characters quite a bit.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Martin's comments about expecting AFFC/ADWD to receive multiple seasons really displayed delusion and his inability to be a showrunner IMO. Obviously if he was showrunner he'd have a firmer grasp on the realities of the budget but he should already know enough about it as a producer to realize the show couldn't afford more locations for side stories (Oldtown, more Pyke, etc). Not to mention the onslaught of characters that would require.
The show's decision to essentially focus on the existing cast outside of Dorne makes sense. This season has been weak but can you imagine how ridiculous it would be if they added the Iron Isles plus Sam's travelogue to Oldtown?
The show's decision to essentially focus on the existing cast outside of Dorne makes sense. This season has been weak but can you imagine how ridiculous it would be if they added the Iron Isles plus Sam's travelogue to Oldtown?
Revenge in and of itself is related to her family. It's revenge for her family, against those who have killed and mistreated them. I'm sure if the two minute video his quote came from was longer he could have expanded on things more. And we all know the real reason that specific quote was used is because she's soon going to take revenge by killing Meryn Trant.
If nothing else, the show has allowed me to believe that we don't need to see Sansa screwing around in the Vale for 200 pages. As long as that arc ends with her or LF nominally in control of the Vale knights, what is the difference?
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