I'll take 480p on a CRT over fake laggy 1080p on an LCD. So add Gen ≥6 for me.
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Upscalers, CRTs, PVMs & RGB: Retro gaming done right!
- Thread starter IrishNinja
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I'll take 480p on a CRT over fake laggy 1080p on an LCD. So add Gen ≥6 for me.
I'm a fool. How did I manage to forget the Wii in my post? It's 480p widescreen heaven just like the OG Xbox.
Khaz, funny you should mention lag. I've since tried Game mode on my Sony KDL (thanks Sixfortyfive for helping me find the proper setting) and I don't detect much input lag. It feels just as good as my 1080p games... in other words VERY good.
Obviously, this isn't scientific, but I'd be shocked if 480p isn't well under 30ms of input lag just like 1080p content on my KDL.
Now, is it 100% lag free like my CRT? No. But I honestly think it's worth the tradeoffs to play in 480p on my HDTV rather than 480i on my CRT unless I'm playing SSBM against someone who really knows their shit.
Ivan Amiibo
Banned
my parents have a huge Panasonic CRT with component inputs at their house that is free for me to take, but no room for it 
The last time I tried gaming on an HD display I was dismayed by the input lag. It was a Wii and the TV was put in gaming mode. Maybe the scaling had a huge part in it and having a console outputting 1080p already would help, that I don't know. But I never felt so shit at Mega Man.
I may have a 360 before the end of the year if prices keep falling, I saw refurb consoles for 99€ earlier this week and bins full of unloved games for 3€. I'll try it on my parents display and I may eat my words, but in the end I'll play it on my HD CRT at 720p (because 1080i is a flicker-fest sadly).
I may have a 360 before the end of the year if prices keep falling, I saw refurb consoles for 99€ earlier this week and bins full of unloved games for 3€. I'll try it on my parents display and I may eat my words, but in the end I'll play it on my HD CRT at 720p (because 1080i is a flicker-fest sadly).
theSlacker
Member
Well there are a number of 16:9/widescreen crts that no one ever talks about because they are just not as useful for retro gaming out there if that is your thing. Like the main reason that people stop at the 20" for PVMs and BVMs is because anything bigger is either widescreen or too old to be useful.
I also cannot imagine how heavy they would be.
NormalFish
Banned
Got my Playstation SCART cable. Gives me an obnoxious checkerboard pattern. I'm pretty sure it's because it's giving me Sync via composite video. That isn't what I want for "real" RGB, right? I can't figure this sync stuff out, but I know this cable gives me a picture that results in instant headache.
I've been doing some looking into this. I think a sync strike is often brought up as a solution, but it seems cumbersome as is only has VGA out. That would then requite another god damn converter or adapter before you get to a Framemeister...
If there was something like a syc strike with a scart or mini RGB out port, that would be grand.
NormalFish
Banned
what a bummer. 10$ and 2 weeks waiting for a cable that I can't use.
Ivan Amiibo
Banned
Everything I read seemed like I'd need to buy an expensive sync box for SCART through a framemeister, so I just bought a d-terminal cable.
That video still sends me into laughing fits, it was amazing lol
NormalFish
Banned
lmao. I don't think the glue is atypical, though for whatever reason. And it's a relatively moderate amount when compared to Drakon monstrosities.
So I played a little Twilight Princes on the Wii U and I really feel like it does a fantastic job upscaling Wii games. So much so that I definitely wanna hack the Wii mode on it to play GC games. TP looked cleaner than it did on GameCube.
So now my Wii goes in the closet, never to see the light of day again. And the GameCube is relegated to being a GameBoy player.
So now my Wii goes in the closet, never to see the light of day again. And the GameCube is relegated to being a GameBoy player.
Get dat Nintendon't!
Oh yeh it's definitely too neatly done to be him. If it was really him I'd expect you'd have a hard time cracking open the cable because it would probably be completely filled with hot glue.
Still makes me wonder why you'd do it when it's enclosed anyway, what if you need to change it up a bit someday?
D.Lo
Member
You can get a scart to minidin8 (Framemeister) plug with sync stripper built in. Someone sells completes, and it's easy to build too, some shmups guy designed the board that fits perfectly in the scart plug head.
speedlolita
Member
People mention this often but I'll be honest, I've never found it to be something I have noticed or found to be annoying.
My RGB modded Duo R and SNES Mini are just fine with composite video for sync. In fact the only time I've ever had an issue was with my RGB modded Nintendo 64 - which was fixed by resorting to luma sync as composite sync wasn't available on my hardware revision.
Perhaps it is really a display variable.
NormalFish
Banned
judging by my very brief research I think it varies by console and what they're designed to output. Playstation 2s apparently don't play well with sync on composite.
Also: I'm pretty sure composite sync and sync on composite are different.
Ooooooh, gonna look that up. Thanks! I wonder if there's an eBay seller that has them premade.
NormalFish
Banned
would "the display" translate to the XRGB FM in this case?
What do you mean by that?
Sync on Composite video (video sync) is normal with Scart, it's part of the standard. Some professional displays may not like it and expect pure sync (csync) but it's because they are not made for the Scart standard and get their RGB from BNC cables. You can usually solve this by using a sync stripper.
One thing I found when I got my European psone (the redesigned model) is that for some reason my TV settles on Composite at boot. And it does it with all my four different displays, Only after I unplug/plug the Scart can I have proper RGB. I'm assuming the console sends the first frame in Composite only, and only after it sends the correct switch signal to get RGB. I'm pretty sure it's a problem on the console as I tested several displays and cables, but I don't know if it's inherent to the design or if I have a faulty console.
NormalFish
Banned
I'm running it through my Framemeister, so I don't think the issue is my display. I'll take a capture in a bit and post it so you guys can get a feel for what I'm talking about. Will edit this post unless the thread starts moving quite a bit in which case I'll post an independent post with them.
Edit: Okay, took captures. sorry for the slightly different settings, I assure you that is not impacting the video quality (as I've done testing with it, using the cable on both my consoles).
speedlolita
Member
I would assume that sync on composite is composite video sync. That is indeed different to composite sync.
This doesn't help your situation but have a read here:
http://retrorgb.com/playstation.html
It does mention that component is your best bet for PS2
NormalFish
Banned
This is only true if you're playing 480p games. RGB has a better image quality for 240p and 480i images. Since I have 2 PS2s, I am looking to hook 1 up by RGB and 1 by YPbPr.
Also some people report and as I've seen in this YouTube vid PS2 has a lot of noise compared to RGB even at 480i.
It's not scientific (as it could vary by cable brand and/or PS2 model) but it's worth exploring.
It's not scientific (as it could vary by cable brand and/or PS2 model) but it's worth exploring.
It was captured using a video capture card I assume?
I can't trust anything that isn't a real CRT filmed. So many problems can arise with the computer processing the picture.
I saw something very blurry, without scanline definition. I saw a picture slightly brighter on Component, and slightly blurrier on Scart (but it may be because of the brightness). Nothing remotely like on my cheap old 90s 4:3 TV.
I can't compare decently between RGB and YUV on my setting (my only Component-ready display deentrelace and upscale anything that is below 480p) but I didn't notice any differences when I switched cables. If there was one, it was tiny.
For what it's worth, my PS2 RGB cable from retro_console_accessories is sync-on-luma. This was her preferred sync type for PS2, you may get better results with it.
My PS1 and PS2 games look outstanding with it.
NormalFish
Banned
Apparently her supply ran dry. I would love to get my hands on one of those cables.
If I'm not mistaken, you can rewire your current cable to supply sync-on-luma? Not sure what that pinout looks like but I bet there's someone here that can give some good advice on it.
NormalFish
Banned
yeah, I thought about this. Guess I'll have to figure such things out at some point.
Yeah, I found the retro gaming cables one yesterday. I had only know what to look for recently and behold... Exactly what I wanted was there. Lol
Thanks for the other links though. Now I'm wondering if I can solder my own cable together, but the UK one seems inexpensive enough to not go through the hassle.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
This probably isn't the appropriate topic, but I'm not sure there is one and I don't really want to make a new one.
I currently have access to a 20" LCD EDTV. Specifically a Sylvania LC200SL8. I'm guessing it's junk and not worth keeping, I already have a 32" Sharp CRT (model number escapes me) and apart from 480p support, I'm guessing it's probably a better all-around TV for anything pre-HD?
I currently have access to a 20" LCD EDTV. Specifically a Sylvania LC200SL8. I'm guessing it's junk and not worth keeping, I already have a 32" Sharp CRT (model number escapes me) and apart from 480p support, I'm guessing it's probably a better all-around TV for anything pre-HD?
I have a similar tv that I keep around. The picture is ok , and if I every get around to building my game room, ill probably keep my ps2, xbox, gamecube, and wii connected to it. I prefer many games from that gen scanline free, so it works well for me.
retro_console_accessories may be able to hook you up if you send her your old cable. I'd send her an email with a picture of your cable and tell her what you'd like her to do.
Friend of Sonic
Member
Nintendont is really fun to mess around with.
drhankmccoyphd
Member
I'm getting a weird discoloration with my PVM 14M2u. After about an hour of gaming the color saturation kind of flickers a bit and and the image gets kind of yellow and not as sharp. If I leave it alone for a while the image will go back to normal but it seems like flickering whites in the game can trigger the issue. Not sure what it is, but I'm wondering if there's anything simple I can do to correct the issue.
I expect I'll get a better answer here than starting a new thread .....
Which is probably the better method of connecting a Wii to HDTV, the Neoya Wii2HDMI dongle, or just component cables? I've got a softmodded Wii that's only ever been on a CRT, but the CRT is dying. I'm switching to an HDTV. I know 'get a WiiU' is probably the best answer and we already have one, but I'm not interested in hacking Wii mode on my daughter's WiiU. I'm not doing it.
Also, I'm planning to get the XRGB mini soon and use it for NES, SNES, N64, Megadrive, and Saturn. Maybe Dreamcast and PCEngine eventually. But I've read mostly consistent comments here and there that the Wii is better off directly connected to the TV because the XRGB mini isn't at it's best with 480i signals and especially not through the D-link input. Yes? Is that true even with the Wii2HDMI dongle? (i.e. and use an HDMI input on the mini instead of the D-link/component input)
Which is probably the better method of connecting a Wii to HDTV, the Neoya Wii2HDMI dongle, or just component cables? I've got a softmodded Wii that's only ever been on a CRT, but the CRT is dying. I'm switching to an HDTV. I know 'get a WiiU' is probably the best answer and we already have one, but I'm not interested in hacking Wii mode on my daughter's WiiU. I'm not doing it.
Also, I'm planning to get the XRGB mini soon and use it for NES, SNES, N64, Megadrive, and Saturn. Maybe Dreamcast and PCEngine eventually. But I've read mostly consistent comments here and there that the Wii is better off directly connected to the TV because the XRGB mini isn't at it's best with 480i signals and especially not through the D-link input. Yes? Is that true even with the Wii2HDMI dongle? (i.e. and use an HDMI input on the mini instead of the D-link/component input)
Use whichever has a better upscaler in it. The likely answer is your TV rather than a dongle.
My understanding is the Neoya dongle is just a transcoder, not an upscaler. So just a question of whether it's better to deliver the signal to the TV through an HDMI input, or component. Probably doesn't make a difference, but like I said my Wii's never even been connected to an HDTV so thought it was worth asking. Not going to spend the $30 on the Neoya Wii2HDMI if there's literally no difference. Also still curious about my question re: using Wii w/ the XRGB mini vs. directly inputting to the TV.
in my experience, it looked the same. my TV's processing of 480p material looked the same when using the dongle and the cables.
the only reason i use the dongle is because the FM only has 1 component input and i have the GC there and use the HDMI in for Wii.
also, audio can be iffy sometimes if you use HDMI audio. using analog audio is more reliable but that defeats the purpose of using the adapter since you want HDMI to reduce cable clutter.
the only reason i use the dongle is because the FM only has 1 component input and i have the GC there and use the HDMI in for Wii.
also, audio can be iffy sometimes if you use HDMI audio. using analog audio is more reliable but that defeats the purpose of using the adapter since you want HDMI to reduce cable clutter.
this is something that gets me in my pic comparisons. some shots look quite good on capture but on TV it's a complete different story.
it's too bad all i have to take pics is a Samsung S3 camera.
So you're running the Wii through the FM? Did that turn out better for you than directly to the TV?
I'd love to have the component cable for GC but $$ so prolly just gonna be happy with the Wii and Nintendont. I hadn't touched my Wii since forever and just learned tonight that Nintendont isn't just for the WiiU. Doh. Pretty excited about adding my GC collection to the Wii without depending on the disk drive. Sucks that my spice (orange) GC is gonna be a paperweight though. It's pretty.
NormalFish
Banned
So apparently retrogamingcables has started offering Sync-on-Luma PS2 RGB cables. Since my current cable seems to be not what I'm looking for and rewiring it for my needs will cost just as much (since a sync stripper is 20$), I guess I'll try it out.
Before I do I figure I should ask you folks if you've had any grief with these guys' cables? I know I've heard some lukewarm responses relative to retro_console_accessories, but really she's the standard for perfection.
**Oh, and how long does shipping usually take to the east coast USA? They're in the UK, right?
Before I do I figure I should ask you folks if you've had any grief with these guys' cables? I know I've heard some lukewarm responses relative to retro_console_accessories, but really she's the standard for perfection.
**Oh, and how long does shipping usually take to the east coast USA? They're in the UK, right?
Huggers
Member
I've had a few cables from them. No complaints at all. I'm in England so can't help with their delivery times
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