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[BONKERS]

The PSP's TV-out is so mindblowingly bad that there's literally not a single good solution.

Vita TV's not a huge help, considering that a lot of games aren't available digitally.

It's hardly bad for offering 1:1 pixel scaling within a 480p window. A lot of TVs have zoom features these days, people have made custom PSP zoom profiles for the XRGB, and there are custom scalers for it.

Hmmmm... how does it look on a CRT? Better?

I never owned a PSP. My first Sony handheld was an OG Vita.

Unless you can do 480p, it will flicker and have typical interlacing issues. It has a deflicker filter, but I didn't care for it.

Playing PS1 games on the other hand will output at 240p and look great.

It looks bad on everything.

XRGB-3 boasted a feature to make it look better, too, but I think it was just referring to an ability to stretch the picture to fill the screen.


As much as I prefer to play games on a TV vs. a portable (ie: always), the PSP is a system that I just play on the system itself. It really is that bad.

The PSVita TV isn't really different that much. It just line doubles it first and then does non-integer scaling to 720p. Which isn't exactly all that great, which is then being scaled 2.25x more in each direction to 1080p.

Recent Sony TVs have a special setting in them for scaling PSP output IIRC too. 2014 models onward I think.

Though I don't know how good it is.

Also,16x scaling for the PSP is 1920x1088, something is always going to go wrong with that. And PSP games upscaled are going to look only marginally better than PS1 games.

PPSSPP for 3D games is your best bet really if you have a decent PC and don't mind some minor issues or need precise button timing.(Project Diva.)

 

[Ban Puncher]

Updated my Framemeister firmware from 1.10 to 2.00A.

Nothing exploded and everything seems cool.

 

[NormalFish]

Updated my Framemeister firmware from 1.10 to 2.00A.

Nothing exploded and everything seems cool.

yeah, it's gucci

should try out profiles, they're pretty handy

 

[Ban Puncher]

yeah, it's gucci

should try out profiles, they're pretty handy

I should check those out because I used to have to fiddle with the options with the Neo Geo AES compared to everything else and updating the firmware reset everything too and I forget my custom set ups for everything. Everything looks okay without any tweaking so far though.

 

[televator]

Updated my Framemeister firmware from 1.10 to 2.00A.

Nothing exploded and everything seems cool.

Its implosions you gotta watch out for in the FM. Explosions were an XRGB3 problem.

FM uses large hardon colider tech that has a 50/50 chance to implode and create a black hole when you update firmware. For that picture quality in the end... Worth the risk.

 

[Nostalgic Nightmare]

Can anyone who uses the XRGB Mini at 720P post what they have their scanline settings at for 240p sources?

I keep mine around 40 but it seems like you can only adjust the one setting (the rest are greyed out) so I'm not sure if that's normal or what. Essentially the scanlines look good but are a tad "doubled" up for my liking.

This is on the latest firmware.

 

[catabarez]

Got a csync SCART cable so that I can test out my SNES mini mod and everything works great! I decided to mod my N64 to see if I can get csync out of it and to my surprise it actually worked! Now I just need a good SCART switcher so I can plug everything in.

 

[Khaz]

Now I just need a good SCART switcher so I can plug everything in.

Soon. (Dat price though.)

 

[BocoDragon]

Soon. (Dat price though.)

Can't wait. For awhile I was like "nah.. I don't need all my consoles hooked up at once"....

But actually YES I DO *froths at the mouth*

And Arikas Cave ports.
And M2's Sega compilations.
And Ico.

There are a few 240p PS2 games.

Ico is 240p?? Mind blowing. I never would have thought.

 

[Khaz]

Even an Atari VCS 2600 benefits from RGB. From atariage.com:

(No idea why it's dimmer though.)

 

[BocoDragon]

Of course i would. Pixels, even at a low res, can be nice and sharp... and RF/composite/s-video are all various degrees of blurry and artifact-filled.

 

[D.Lo]

Ico is 240p?? Mind blowing. I never would have thought.

Pretty sure if isn't. It's a very low interlaced resolution like 250i or something like that.

 

[sixteen-bit]

Ico is 240p?? Mind blowing. I never would have thought.

Yeah. It actually started out development as a PS1 game so I wonder if that has anything to do with it.

 

[drhankmccoyphd]

Is it possible to get a PS3 to output 240p over s-video?

 

[Coda]

Is it possible to get a PS3 to output 240p over s-video?

Pretty sure there's no way to get 240p with a PS3 unless you use an external device that downscales the image? Not super sure about it though.

 

[catabarez]

Soon. (Dat price though.)

Wow, I'm hoping these become available soon.

 

[televator]

Is it possible to get a PS3 to output 240p over s-video?

Possible? Yes. Not currently though. Hacked PS3 with CFW might be able to be programmed to have the option... I just now realized this too... 60GB PS3 has the potential to be the ultimate PS1-PS3 player machine.

Edit: Just noticed you are talking about S-video. Yeah... Not sure about that. I wouldn't count on the PS3 multi out port to even be wired to support that.

 

[Mega]

Wow, I'm hoping these become available soon.

You can't even get on a wait list. I just got a Hama scart switch and ordered a second one to have a couple more inputs. Who knows how many months until he starts taking new orders and then to wait until you get it. It does look awesome however.

 

[Cyrix]

Soon. (Dat price though.)

That looks like a really nice piece of kit, but it baffels me why the whole console rgb community has decided to adopt SCART as the one true connector when it so huge!

There are tons of other connectors that could be used that would shrink all this stuff down immensely, if you live in a place where SCART was a thing sure, but why has the american scene latched on to it...

Not trying to hate or anything, it's just always seemed weird.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

That looks like a really nice piece of kit, but it baffels me why the whole console rgb community has decided to adopt SCART as the one true connector when it so huge!

There are tons of other connectors that could be used that would shrink all this stuff down immensely, if you live in a place where SCART was a thing sure, but why has the american scene latched on to it...

Not trying to hate or anything, it's just always seemed weird.

What other type of RGB cable are you going to buy for your consoles, exactly?

I suppose it's feasible to make VGA cables, but it's not like any typical monitor or TV would take 15 KHz RGB over that format either, still necessitating specialized equipment. And the Framemeister doesn't even have a VGA port.

 

[catabarez]

You can't even get on a wait list. I just got a Hama scart switch and ordered a second one to have a couple more inputs. Who knows how many months until he starts taking new orders and then to wait until you get it. It does look awesome however.

I can wait for a nice high quality. Until then I'll just switch out the cables.

 

[Cyrix]

What other type of RGB cable are you going to buy for your consoles, exactly?

I suppose it's feasible to make VGA cables, but it's not like any typical monitor or TV would take 15 KHz RGB over that format either, still necessitating specialized equipment. And the Framemeister doesn't even have a VGA port.

if you are insistent on buying official cables then sure that's your option, but plenty of consoles have to be modded in the first place to even get rgb out, hence no need to adhere to the SCART connector.

I didn't suggest that anyone try to plug an RGB wired cable into a VGA monitor?

Heres where im coming from, most RGB capable monitors in the states don't use SCART anyway and have to be converted usually to some form of RGB separated BNC or the like, so really if you are in the US you are just using SCART as an intermediary connection. It just seems to me that using something like a DB-25 (vga style) connector or even some kind of mini din similar to s-video (the kind used for keyboards even has enough conductors to carry the audio too though maybe interference would be a problem) would make for smaller, cleaner setups.

Even the frammiester you mention dosent actually have a SCART port on it, it has that kinda DIN looking thing that is then adapted to SCART, we could just be using that.

 

[BONKERS]

Pretty sure if isn't. It's a very low interlaced resolution like 250i or something like that.

It is 240p. HDTVs that don't accept 240p will not accept the signal.

Is it possible to get a PS3 to output 240p over s-video?

Big fat NOPE

 

[Sixfortyfive]

if you are insistent on buying official cables then sure that's your option, but plenty of consoles have to be modded in the first place to even get rgb out, hence no need to adhere to the SCART connector.

I didn't suggest that anyone try to plug an RGB wired cable into a VGA monitor?

Heres where im coming from, most RGB capable monitors in the states don't use SCART anyway and have to be converted usually to some form of RGB separated BNC or the like, so really if you are in the US you are just using SCART as an intermediary connection. It just seems to me that using something like a DB-25 (vga style) connector or even some kind of mini din similar to s-video (the kind used for keyboards even has enough conductors to carry the audio too though maybe interference would be a problem) would make for smaller, cleaner setups.

Even the frammiester you mention dosent actually have a SCART port on it, it has that kinda DIN looking thing that is then adapted to SCART, we could just be using that.

How would any of those alternatives be less niche or complicated than SCART, though?

Pretty much no consumer video equipment in the US utilizes 15 KHz RGB in the first place. If you're into this stuff, then you're going to be buying dedicated enthusiast equipment for it in one capacity or another.

 

[Cyrix]

How would any of those alternatives be less niche or complicated than SCART, though?

I didn't say they would be?
The fact that this is all niche and silly is part of WHY it seems weird that there is this adherence to that particular connector when there are smaller more compact alternatives.

Pretty much no consumer video equipment in the US utilizes 15 KHz RGB in the first place. If you're into this stuff, then you're going to be buying dedicated enthusiast equipment for it in one capacity or another.

I'm not sure sure what point you are trying to make here as I never suggested that using these different connectors would somehow make anything more compatible?

 

[Sixfortyfive]

I'm not sure sure what point you are trying to make here as I never suggested that using these different connectors would somehow make anything more compatible?

Then why are you confused?

it baffels me why the whole console rgb community has decided to adopt SCART as the one true connector

 

[Cyrix]

Then why are you confused?

The rest of that post gave important context.

it baffels me why the whole console rgb community has decided to adopt SCART as the one true connector when it so huge!

There are tons of other connectors that could be used that would shrink all this stuff down immensely, if you live in a place where SCART was a thing sure, but why has the american scene latched on to it...

Not trying to hate or anything, it's just always seemed weird.

As did my next post:

It just seems to me that using something like a DB-25 (vga style) connector or even some kind of mini din similar to s-video (the kind used for keyboards even has enough conductors to carry the audio too though maybe interference would be a problem) would make for smaller, cleaner setups.

Just to be clear I'm not trying to be argumentative I just feel like we are having a miscommunication.
I am just talking about using smaller connectors for aesthetic and space saving purposes since the SCART connector is not directly useful to people in the US.

 

[D.Lo]

I agree, I think mini-din like the Framemesiter uses would be more suitable. A 20 port switcher would be the same size as a 4 port Scart switch. Cables could be thinner, cheaper and better shielded too, Scart has 21 pins and we only use six for almost everything!

It's just how it evolved, from official cables. There's no Scart in Australia either, but I was using a scart to component converter for my component CRT in like 1998, and there was no large 'community' back then, I just worked it out myself by fiddling. I used garbage switchers because I could get them from eBay cheap.

 

[televator]

Personally, I hate din type connectors. Delicate pins that can be bent and can only go in one very specific way. Even when they do go in, they are very flimsy and can fall out easily or maybe break the connector.

DB is better mostly due to the portruding female plug. However I haven't seen it used to carry sound.

 

[Khaz]

Scart and RGB have been used for over 20 years in Europe. Until very recently Scart sockets were mandatory in many countries and all TVs had one. It wasn't niche on that continent.

When the niche market of American retro collectors decided to go RGB, it was only logical they also adopt the plug that goes with it.

 

[D.Lo]

Personally, I hate din type connectors. Delicate pins that can be bent and can only go in one very specific way. Even when they do go in, they are very flimsy and can fall out easily or maybe break the connector.

DB is better mostly due to the portruding female plug. However I haven't seen it used to carry sound.

I've never bent a din plug, ever? And 6/8 pin mini-din being used would mean a billion cables already out there for $1 would work right away.

That said, Nintendo cables have always had by far the best cable designs. No scraping metal, plastic connectors with loose cartridge-like pin connections.

So in an ideal world, replace scart with the SNES multi-out plug.

Scart and RGB have been used for over 20 years in Europe. Until very recently Scart sockets were mandatory in many countries and all TVs had one. It wasn't niche on that continent.

When the niche market of American retro collectors decided to go RGB, it was only logical they also adopt the plug that goes with it.

That's why it is what it is, but it is a bit silly that people are making home-made scart cables (e.g. for PC Engine) only to change the termination at the other end anyway.

 

[Peagles]

I'd rather go full BNC over DIN. Wouldn't make my setup any smaller than SCART though, probably bigger actually.

 

[catabarez]

Speaking of the SNES a/v out, I wonder how difficult it would be to mount one to an already RGB modded PC Engine or PC Engine Duo. The nice thing about the SNES cable is that it has 12 pins instead of the typical 8 so composite, s-video, and RGB can all come out of one port.

 

[televator]

I've never bent a din plug, ever? And 6/8 pin mini-din being used would mean a billion cables already out there for $1 would work right away.

That said, Nintendo cables have always had by far the best cable designs. No scraping metal, plastic connectors with loose cartridge-like pin connections.

So in an ideal world, replace scart with the SNES multi-out plug.

That's why it is what it is, but it is a bit silly that people are making home-made scart cables (e.g. for PC Engine) only to change the termination at the other end anyway.

I have bent dins. Hell, I bent one of the pins for the XRGB mini not long ago. Was fun getting that to line up again...

As a kid I probably FUBAR'd like 4 S-vid cables and today its a connector style that I most often see getting fucked by other people as well.

 

[Cyrix]

I agree, I think mini-din like the Framemesiter uses would be more suitable. A 20 port switcher would be the same size as a 4 port Scart switch. Cables could be thinner, cheaper and better shielded too, Scart has 21 pins and we only use six for almost everything!

I've been poking around, is the port on the FM a mini-din or a full size din. it looks like full size to me from pictures.

Personally, I hate din type connectors. Delicate pins that can be bent and can only go in one very specific way. Even when they do go in, they are very flimsy and can fall out easily or maybe break the connector.

DB is better mostly due to the portruding female plug. However I haven't seen it used to carry sound.

Mini-din can be delicate, but full din isn't that much bigger (and still way smaller than SCART) and the pins in that are pretty hefty! DB does seem the obvious choice though.

Scart and RGB have been used for over 20 years in Europe. Until very recently Scart sockets were mandatory in many countries and all TVs had one. It wasn't niche on that continent.

When the niche market of American retro collectors decided to go RGB, it was only logical they also adopt the plug that goes with it.

I get what you are saying, but is it really logical to use a connector that doesn't actually appear on any of your TVs?

I've never bent a din plug, ever? And 6/8 pin mini-din being used would mean a billion cables already out there for $1 would work right away.

That said, Nintendo cables have always had by far the best cable designs. No scraping metal, plastic connectors with loose cartridge-like pin connections.

So in an ideal world, replace scart with the SNES multi-out plug.

That's why it is what it is, but it is a bit silly that people are making home-made scart cables (e.g. for PC Engine) only to change the termination at the other end anyway.

Good point on the availability of ready made cables I honestly hadn't considered that with regards to the mini-din stuff, just DB.
We should write a new open standard based on the nintendo av out form factor be the next displayport.
This guy gets it.

I'd rather go full BNC over DIN. Wouldn't make my setup any smaller than SCART though, probably bigger actually.

Bayonet Neill–Concelman 4 lyfe! Yeah that would be huge too, but at least BNC makes all your shit look all sciencey and pro as fuck.

Side note, the first time i ever saw a BNC i immediately became enraged at whoever decided that F-Connectors would be the standard for home television coaxial. All those years scraping up my knuckles trying to screw on cables could have been the most pleasant experience ever, but someone wanted to save a few bucks. History's greatest monster right there.

 

[Cyrix]

I have bent dins. Hell, I bent one of the pins for the XRGB mini not long ago. Was fun getting that to line up again...

As a kid I probably FUBAR'd like 4 S-vid cables and today its a connector style that I most often see getting fucked by other people as well.

Do you associate primarily with cavemen?
I have certainly seen some messed up mini-dins in my day as well, but i guess i just figure that if you are messing with RGB modded consoles and whatnot you are probably careful enough for it not to be a HUGE issue.

The bigger problem with mini-din would probably be availability of off the shelf switches. with say VGA there are a ton of VGA switches out there in surplus, i don't know that they would necessarily work great but i would guess they would. I had some trouble with some VGA switches i bought at a goodwill back in the day but that was related to trying to feed higher res signals than they were designed for, Would think lower wouldn't be an issue.

 

[Peltz]

I have bent dins. Hell, I bent one of the pins for the XRGB mini not long ago. Was fun getting that to line up again...

As a kid I probably FUBAR'd like 4 S-vid cables and today its a connector style that I most often see getting fucked by other people as well.

Eh... the XRGB Mini's build quality is utter shit though. I've never seen cheaper plastic or another port with quite as much "give" as that of the Mini.

 

[theSlacker]

I'd rather go full BNC over DIN. Wouldn't make my setup any smaller than SCART though, probably bigger actually.

Yeah, I don't think I've ever seen a small BNC switch. The plus though is how much stronger of a connection type BNC is. Not gonna break anything with constant plugging and unplugging unlike SCART.

 

[Khaz]

Yeah, I don't think I've ever seen a small BNC switch. The plus though is how much stronger of a connection type BNC is. Not gonna break anything with constant plugging and unplugging unlike SCART.

But the purpose of a switch box is to stop constant plugging and unplugging though, and to prevent breaking stuff. In that regard, the fact that BNC is much stronger doesn't really matter, both connections will be left alone once plugged once.

BNC (and RCA to a lesser extent) strength is in the field when you're filming stuff and keep going back to the monitor to check what you got, or assembling a studio every morning, effectively putting a strain on the connector several times a day for years.

 

[psylah]

An $80 13 inch PVM popped up on craigslist nearby, but I am afraid buying it will send me down a horrible, expensive retro-modding hole.

I'm not huge on scanlines but I'd like to see what playing something super-sharp like that is like.

 

[televator]

Do you associate primarily with cavemen?
I have certainly seen some messed up mini-dins in my day as well, but i guess i just figure that if you are messing with RGB modded consoles and whatnot you are probably careful enough for it not to be a HUGE issue.

The bigger problem with mini-din would probably be availability of off the shelf switches. with say VGA there are a ton of VGA switches out there in surplus, i don't know that they would necessarily work great but i would guess they would. I had some trouble with some VGA switches i bought at a goodwill back in the day but that was related to trying to feed higher res signals than they were designed for, Would think lower wouldn't be an issue.

You know humans dweled in caves too right? How does it feel to know you are a racist. Huehuehue

I could be more delicate when it comes to that damn mini din... But every time i go for it... I line it up, attempt to plug it in... Doesn't go... Hmmm... Okay turn it another way and attempt to plug, doesn't go. Okay, okay. How abot I turn it 180 degrees? Nope. Rage intesifies. Mothafucka, I got some Kid Dracula to play on my jumbotron and I AI'NT GOT TIME FO DIS MINI DIN BUSINESS. Dis bitch gonna go in some fucking how!

Yeah that's how it plays out in my head. Lol

 

[Peltz]

An $80 13 inch PVM popped up on craigslist nearby, but I am afraid buying it will send me down a horrible, expensive retro-modding hole.

Welcome to our hole.

 

[sixteen-bit]

$80 is expensive for a 13. Offer $50 tops.

 

[psylah]

$80 is expensive for a 13. Offer $50 tops.

Good, I won't feel bad about passing it up then.

 

[theSlacker]

But the purpose of a switch box is to stop constant plugging and unplugging though, and to prevent breaking stuff. In that regard, the fact that BNC is much stronger doesn't really matter, both connections will be left alone once plugged once.

BNC (and RCA to a lesser extent) strength is in the field when you're filming stuff and keep going back to the monitor to check what you got, or assembling a studio every morning, effectively putting a strain on the connector several times a day for years.

Yes, the two things I posted were in contrast to each other. The fact that it is harder to find a good switch box for BNC over SCART is mitigated by how much more durable it is so you don't have to worry about it breaking from switching it around.

 

[Mega]

Yeah, I don't think I've ever seen a small BNC switch. The plus though is how much stronger of a connection type BNC is. Not gonna break anything with constant plugging and unplugging unlike SCART.

I briefly looked into this and the BNC switches scared me away because they look like enormous metal boxes jammed with rows of plugs in the back and a look fit for a broadcast studio. Apparently they're not all too bad. I may go down this route in the future because some are really cheap on ebay and even with two (overpriced) scart switches chained together I only have a meager 5 inputs.

This Extron matrix switch has 12 inputs! and wouldn't look too bad resting on a boxy monitor:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7bZaYwuVd8

My one concern was that most RGB cables for consoles are already set up for Scart, but Retro Gaming Cables sells Scart-to-BNC adapter cables. Not cheap but not terribly pricey either if taking into consideration the alternative of hunting for a good scart switch (expensive) with only a handful of inputs. I actually wish I'd known about these bnc switches sooner.

 

[televator]

An $80 13 inch PVM popped up on craigslist nearby, but I am afraid buying it will send me down a horrible, expensive retro-modding hole.

I'm not huge on scanlines but I'd like to see what playing something super-sharp like that is like.

One of us! One of us!

 

[Khaz]

I'm not huge on scanlines but I'd like to see what playing something super-sharp like that is like.

You will soon discover the true power of RGB.

 

[Timu]

You will soon discover the true power of RGB.

Once you go RGB you can't go back.

 

[theSlacker]

I briefly looked into this and the BNC switches scared me away because they look like enormous metal boxes jammed with rows of plugs in the back and a look fit for a broadcast studio. Apparently they're not all too bad. I may go down this route in the future because some are really cheap on ebay and even with two (overpriced) scart switches chained together I only have a meager 5 inputs.

This Extron matrix switch has 12 inputs! and wouldn't look too bad resting on a boxy monitor:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7bZaYwuVd8

My one concern was that most RGB cables for consoles are already set up for Scart, but Retro Gaming Cables sells Scart-to-BNC adapter cables. Not cheap but not terribly pricey either if taking into consideration the alternative of hunting for a good scart switch (expensive) with only a handful of inputs. I actually wish I'd known about these bnc switches sooner.

Turn back now. Unless you are making your own custom cables that end with BNC then just go with SCART. Because as you say, the most common, and best quality, custom cables out on the market now are all SCART. You only ever want one of those SCART to BNC adapter cables if you are using a PVM/BVM and only one of them.