NOLA_Gaffer
Banned
Asked my eBay seller if he'd take $150 for the PVM that he wanted to $500 for, and about 8 hours have passed, so either I offended him or I just haven't heard back yet. 
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Upscalers, CRTs, PVMs & RGB: Retro gaming done right!
- Thread starter IrishNinja
- Start date
- Status
depending on the games you have, there could be zero glitches with Nintendont. some games work 100% as in original GC hardware.
also, technically the Wii U hardware that runs the games is as much native GC hardware as the Wii since both have the same base chipset. all it's missing is I/O interfaces.
I think they're really old BVMs but probably worth looking at anyway. Give it a shot.
Yeah, I've yet or run into any issue. I mean I guess you might not be able to play Donkey Konga with drums... I think... But wasn't it rereleased with Wii controls. So far though Ive played everything from big tittles like Twilight Princess to Chibi Robo. I glanced at a the compatibility list just now and it's all green. The only issue I saw was Zoids. Plus it has a healthy scene behind it and it gets constantly updated and improved... Heck it updates automatically by clicking a link. No fuss.
Yep, Nintendon't is freaking awesome. I plan on using it for more youtube playthroughs.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
There are mostly little issues but if you have a perfectly backwards compatible Wii anyway I don't see much value in it. And you might as well given how cheap Wiis are. Plus no GBA link cable support is kind of a bummer for some games.
I also really didn't like the controller options last time I tried to use it. Setting up anything custom is a pain, the way they configured Classic Controllers feels wrong, and I ended up just plugging in a GC controller anyway.
HDMI>Wii Component though! Hell Wii Component has a softer picture! I even took screenshots! Plus Gamecube games that weren't in 480p before(like Bloody Roar Primal Fury) can now have it which is nice as I hate interlacing with a passion.
I use Gamecube controllers as well.
Given the context of the original conversation though I think the WiiU still makes the better option. Especially if one already has one, but buying one isn't too much of a problem either. I think Nintendo still sells refurbished ones unless I'm mistaken and I bought one last year for $150 off craigslist. That's all beside the fact that now you own a system in which games are going to be super duper astronomically collectible for. lol
As for controllers... I use my GameCube controllers on the WiiU. C'mon, Sheep. Join us in this goodness. I know you want to.
geniusbits
Member
Wife introduced me to it. It's...ok.
NOLA_Gaffer
Banned
I didn't get the video monitor I wanted in time, but I'm not coming home tomorrow until I get a CRT of some kind to play a few games on, even if it's a thrift store rescue.
I didn't get the video monitor I wanted in time, but I'm not coming home tomorrow until I get a CRT of some kind to play a few games on, even if it's a thrift store rescue.
Sounds like you have a mission. Be a warrior out there. Good luck.
I didn't get the video monitor I wanted in time, but I'm not coming home tomorrow until I get a CRT of some kind to play a few games on, even if it's a thrift store rescue.
I was walking home from work tonight and saw a CRT TV on the sidewalk. First one in a long time because sanitation no longer takes them. Weird that someone would't know you can't do that here anymore. Toshiba,flat screen, looked to be composite only.
sir_kevith
Member
If youre just after a CRT you can always type in "Free TV" on craigslist and people are actually grateful if you take them. I harvested a 25" tube from one for my MVS.
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
A rough test I did a few months ago suggests that the Wii U's Virtual Wii mode (i.e. the Wii backward compatibility mode) has a 1-frame buffer, and thus 1 frame of lag to go with it.
Basically, I tested the input lag on these setups:
- Melee on a Gamecube (control test, 0 lag)
- Melee on a Wii running natively (equal to Gamecube)
- Melee on a Wii running via Nintendont w/ the Wii U Gamecube controller adapter (~3ms lag)
- Melee on a Wii U running via Nintendont w/ the Wii U Gamecube controller adapter (~20ms lag)
Now, I have to stress that the testing equipment I had on hand was really rough, so I hesitate to say that the numbers were exact to the millisecond or anything, but the difference between Gamecube and Wii U was significant enough to note. Those numbers also "look" right to me when thinking about the hardware logically. The polling rate on the USB controller adapter isn't going to be quite as high as native controller ports, so that 3ms difference on the Wii+Nintendont setup makes sense to me. And I really would not be surprised if that extra 17ms jump from Wii to Wii U is due to the Virtual Wii mode itself; after all, vWii is limited to the Wii U's output options and does not actually support the same settings that the Wii uses (e.g. no 240p support).
On the other hand, it could just be a difference in how things are handled by Nintendont on one system versus the other.
I'd have to hack up a Wii controller and do some tests on an actual Wii game to come up with something more conclusive. But I don't really feel like doing that.
Thought I'd post this on Neogaf since info about this is scarce and there might be people in the same situation as I am.
What I'm trying to do: Get an unmodded PAL N64 to work with a HDMI PC Monitor. I typically play it on my CRT in the bedroom but I wanted to get it working on a LCD PC Monitor in the study mostly because I spend more time in there. While modding the system would be ideal, I simply couldn't justify spending that much plus I'd need to ship my childhood console to the US and I'd be distraught if it got lost. So I decided to go down the cheap-ass route and find a simple/quick easy solution. I tested both PAL and NTSC games (using a region converter). There wasn't much info about these video converters to go by apart from a couple of paragraphs on other forums and some youtube/amazon comments.
So for my first test I decided to buy a cheap AV to HDMI converter to start things off. Outcome? It's AV Composite so I wasn't expecting a fantastic picture quality. PAL games worked fine on it. Picture looks about the same as you'd get on a normal CRT using composite. Slightly darker perhaps but it's passable. NTSC games were horrible. Picture quality looked worse. muddy colours. a bit more blurry. and the screen was mis-aligned to the far right. Half the picture was missing. Some games allowed you to align the screen but - let's be honest - that's a pain in the ass to do everytime and other games don't have this option. Horrible stuff. Mind you, this could be just my PC monitor. Didn't bother to try it on anything else. Verdict: If all you're interested in is playing PAL games with composite cables then you can't go wrong with this. Don't expect anything great with the picture aside from the fact that your games will appear on an lcd screen.
After that, I figured that I could perhaps try another converter and invest in a S-Video cable since you guys say it's worth it. I managed to find an ebay seller from Sweden that made decent PAL N64 S-video cables for a reasonable price so I went with it. HOLY SHIT, S-Video on a CRT looks unbelievably great. I refuse to go back to shitty AV cable now. Colour so vibrant! Picture so crisp! It's definitely worth the money ppl. Alongside the S-Video cable, I purchased my second converter (This time an S-Video to HDMI). Outcome? The previous NTSC games issue has been resolved...sadly using the composite cables This thing was able to handle NTSC and PAL games on composite without any issues. However, S-Video on this thing is a fucking joke! Both PAL and NTSC games showed grainy/blurry picture quality and there's this horrible white ghosting/smudge effect. Being that it could've been many factors to this, I took the liberty of trying this thing on the LCD TV in the living room which had a native S-Video port. With the S-Video cable plugged straight into the TV worked like a charm. ha, still can't get over how great it looks in S-Video. The converter though still looked like shit and that horrible smudge/ghosting issue was present.
I've included pictures here just for comparison's sake. Please excuse the dust particles:
So crisp. So vibrant. Thank you Swedish dude on ebay for this! I'll now remember Sweden for hot chicks and premium N64 analogue video cables.
Looks at the stars. That ghosting... Ugh, just...yuck!
Verdict: If you got a sweet S-Video and you want to use that bad boy on a LCD monitor/TV that doesn't have an S-Video port then avoid this like the fucking plague. If you want a converter that handles NTSC and PAL games on a PAL console using AV composite then this should do the trick but it's not worth it to be honest.
So where do I go from here? I've picked up one last converter that I've heard (from one youtube video) that might actually work on an N64 using S Video but I'm highly doubtful. I'll let you guys know how I get along if anyone is interested. Like I said, I struggled to find any info about this so hopefully this'll come in use to someone out there. If this third attempt turns out to be a dud too then I'll just have to move the heavy CRT to the study and learn my lesson haha.
Update 02/02/2016: I received the 3rd converter I mentioned earlier today and I can confirm that it works! Both NTSC and PAL games display flawlessly on a PC monitor and LCD screen. Finally, I can now play my games As mentioned numerous times in the thread, there is a slight delay/lag with the controls on HDTVs but it's not incredibly noticeable. Overall, if you want to play your un-modded N64 on a non-CRT television using S-Video then go for this thing and forget the rest of the ones I reviewed
Case closed.
What I'm trying to do: Get an unmodded PAL N64 to work with a HDMI PC Monitor. I typically play it on my CRT in the bedroom but I wanted to get it working on a LCD PC Monitor in the study mostly because I spend more time in there. While modding the system would be ideal, I simply couldn't justify spending that much plus I'd need to ship my childhood console to the US and I'd be distraught if it got lost. So I decided to go down the cheap-ass route and find a simple/quick easy solution. I tested both PAL and NTSC games (using a region converter). There wasn't much info about these video converters to go by apart from a couple of paragraphs on other forums and some youtube/amazon comments.
So for my first test I decided to buy a cheap AV to HDMI converter to start things off. Outcome? It's AV Composite so I wasn't expecting a fantastic picture quality. PAL games worked fine on it. Picture looks about the same as you'd get on a normal CRT using composite. Slightly darker perhaps but it's passable. NTSC games were horrible. Picture quality looked worse. muddy colours. a bit more blurry. and the screen was mis-aligned to the far right. Half the picture was missing. Some games allowed you to align the screen but - let's be honest - that's a pain in the ass to do everytime and other games don't have this option. Horrible stuff. Mind you, this could be just my PC monitor. Didn't bother to try it on anything else. Verdict: If all you're interested in is playing PAL games with composite cables then you can't go wrong with this. Don't expect anything great with the picture aside from the fact that your games will appear on an lcd screen.
After that, I figured that I could perhaps try another converter and invest in a S-Video cable since you guys say it's worth it. I managed to find an ebay seller from Sweden that made decent PAL N64 S-video cables for a reasonable price so I went with it. HOLY SHIT, S-Video on a CRT looks unbelievably great. I refuse to go back to shitty AV cable now. Colour so vibrant! Picture so crisp! It's definitely worth the money ppl. Alongside the S-Video cable, I purchased my second converter (This time an S-Video to HDMI). Outcome? The previous NTSC games issue has been resolved...sadly using the composite cables
This thing was able to handle NTSC and PAL games on composite without any issues. However, S-Video on this thing is a fucking joke! Both PAL and NTSC games showed grainy/blurry picture quality and there's this horrible white ghosting/smudge effect. Being that it could've been many factors to this, I took the liberty of trying this thing on the LCD TV in the living room which had a native S-Video port. With the S-Video cable plugged straight into the TV worked like a charm. ha, still can't get over how great it looks in S-Video. The converter though still looked like shit and that horrible smudge/ghosting issue was present. I've included pictures here just for comparison's sake. Please excuse the dust particles:
S Video cable straight to TV said:
So crisp. So vibrant. Thank you Swedish dude on ebay for this! I'll now remember Sweden for hot chicks and premium N64 analogue video cables.
S Video cable plugged into that POS converter said:
Looks at the stars. That ghosting... Ugh, just...yuck!
Verdict: If you got a sweet S-Video and you want to use that bad boy on a LCD monitor/TV that doesn't have an S-Video port then avoid this like the fucking plague. If you want a converter that handles NTSC and PAL games on a PAL console using AV composite then this should do the trick but it's not worth it to be honest.
So where do I go from here? I've picked up one last converter that I've heard (from one youtube video) that might actually work on an N64 using S Video but I'm highly doubtful. I'll let you guys know how I get along if anyone is interested. Like I said, I struggled to find any info about this so hopefully this'll come in use to someone out there. If this third attempt turns out to be a dud too then I'll just have to move the heavy CRT to the study and learn my lesson haha.
Update 02/02/2016: I received the 3rd converter I mentioned earlier today and I can confirm that it works! Both NTSC and PAL games display flawlessly on a PC monitor and LCD screen. Finally, I can now play my games
As mentioned numerous times in the thread, there is a slight delay/lag with the controls on HDTVs but it's not incredibly noticeable. Overall, if you want to play your un-modded N64 on a non-CRT television using S-Video then go for this thing and forget the rest of the ones I reviewed 
Case closed.
theSlacker
Member
Whatever you prefer really. I have mine set up with a little amp, but I've known other people to use just powered PC speakers. Anything will be better then no speakers, and most things are better then just standard TV sound.
The input lag doesn't seem that bad to me and I'm someone who is very, very sensitive about that stuff. I'm able to play fighters with it so that says a lot.A rough test I did a few months ago suggests that the Wii U's Virtual Wii mode (i.e. the Wii backward compatibility mode) has a 1-frame buffer, and thus 1 frame of lag to go with it.
Basically, I tested the input lag on these setups:
- Melee on a Gamecube (control test, 0 lag)
- Melee on a Wii running natively (equal to Gamecube)
- Melee on a Wii running via Nintendont w/ the Wii U Gamecube controller adapter (~3ms lag)
- Melee on a Wii U running via Nintendont w/ the Wii U Gamecube controller adapter (~20ms lag)
Now, I have to stress that the testing equipment I had on hand was really rough, so I hesitate to say that the numbers were exact to the millisecond or anything, but the difference between Gamecube and Wii U was significant enough to note. Those numbers also "look" right to me when thinking about the hardware logically. The polling rate on the USB controller adapter isn't going to be quite as high as native controller ports, so that 3ms difference on the Wii+Nintendont setup makes sense to me. And I really would not be surprised if that extra 17ms jump from Wii to Wii U is due to the Virtual Wii mode itself; after all, vWii is limited to the Wii U's output options and does not actually support the same settings that the Wii uses (e.g. no 240p support).
On the other hand, it could just be a difference in how things are handled by Nintendont on one system versus the other.
I'd have to hack up a Wii controller and do some tests on an actual Wii game to come up with something more conclusive. But I don't really feel like doing that.
I wouldn't say those are two types, maybe the two extremes?
This post is what puts me off the HDMI NES. I likely wasn't going to get one anyway because I already have RGB but yeh, not a fan of that particular look. Plus light guns hehe.
You would be sincerely wrong then. The GC's Component out is much better than the Wii's. The DAC chip used in the GC's component cables is really good, honestly the GC probably has the best Component output of any pre-hdmi console.
I'm not going to say it's worth 250 bucks as that's up to the individual to decide, but it is definitely superior to the Wii.
I might be going crazy, but I want to say that shot was somewhat debunked in this very thread. I think there was a difference but it wasn't that extreme? Maybe? I'll have a look back through this thread when my PC is up and running again (too hard on mobile bleh).
NormalFish
Banned
Here's the definitive NGC/Wii Component comparison:
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=51789
Oh, I should note that it's very easy to get a solid picture out of the Wii using a Mini. I prefer how it looks to 480p from a PS2. I up the color settings a bit so it doesn't look quite as muddled.
http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=51789
Oh, I should note that it's very easy to get a solid picture out of the Wii using a Mini. I prefer how it looks to 480p from a PS2. I up the color settings a bit so it doesn't look quite as muddled.
elmalloc
Member
That's interesting about the green pixels.
But playing with my SNES through the framemeister, I prefer the hi-def NES purely because the digital signal is superior. I have to toy too much with the FM and some solid colors still have analog to digital conversion noise in them. It's definitely a good device, but I'm also seeing what I saw on youtube videos - it appears the FM has a look that appears like artificial sharpening (even after ensuring sharpness is at zero) around the edges. It looks like a halo if you look very close. It may not be sharpening at all and related to their Analog to Digital conversion process, but it looks just like your TV would if you crank the sharpness up higher than what is considered "no added sharpness". That combined with the solid color AD noise does not let me give it a 10/10 rating. I'd hope through firmware updates the FM would get better. The HDN can also get firmware updates but I doubt Kevtris cares much now as he's concentrating on other ventures I believe. They can "fix" scaling issues like 4x/5x, or odd pixel sizes that are non-integer if they want, since CRTs were horizontally stretching pixels (not perfect squares) vs. HDTVs today.
It's easy to see in the YT videos showing LTTP closeups of different connections. RGB/scart for HDTV through the Framemeister is not perfect. I would pay for an SNES digital HD device, as far as I can tell, the framemeister is the best HDTV HDMI users can do for 240p consoles.
I think most people in these threads (those with CRTs, too) are looking for the best retro experience, so the video quality matters. Otherwise we would all be using composite cable. Now the price comes into the equation for some, and others probably not.
But playing with my SNES through the framemeister, I prefer the hi-def NES purely because the digital signal is superior. I have to toy too much with the FM and some solid colors still have analog to digital conversion noise in them. It's definitely a good device, but I'm also seeing what I saw on youtube videos - it appears the FM has a look that appears like artificial sharpening (even after ensuring sharpness is at zero) around the edges. It looks like a halo if you look very close. It may not be sharpening at all and related to their Analog to Digital conversion process, but it looks just like your TV would if you crank the sharpness up higher than what is considered "no added sharpness". That combined with the solid color AD noise does not let me give it a 10/10 rating. I'd hope through firmware updates the FM would get better. The HDN can also get firmware updates but I doubt Kevtris cares much now as he's concentrating on other ventures I believe. They can "fix" scaling issues like 4x/5x, or odd pixel sizes that are non-integer if they want, since CRTs were horizontally stretching pixels (not perfect squares) vs. HDTVs today.
It's easy to see in the YT videos showing LTTP closeups of different connections. RGB/scart for HDTV through the Framemeister is not perfect. I would pay for an SNES digital HD device, as far as I can tell, the framemeister is the best HDTV HDMI users can do for 240p consoles.
I think most people in these threads (those with CRTs, too) are looking for the best retro experience, so the video quality matters. Otherwise we would all be using composite cable. Now the price comes into the equation for some, and others probably not.
While I'm sure there's some difference, that comparison is BS. The Wii pic is out of focus: the fine detail of the display panel itself, as seen on the left pic, is lost on the right pic.
The second picture in the same retrorgb article is closer to the truth.
In actual practice (game running with person at a normal distance, not inches from the screen with the game paused), I doubt anyone could tell the difference between GC and Wii component in blind tests. I personally see no such severe blurriness on Wii BC at 480p on my CRT.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
That's a more realistic comparison at this point. I'm not using a Wii on a CRT, but I still find the picture to be waaaaay too blurry for its own good. If you look at some of the details on the frames in that F-Zero shot, a lot of it is more obscured. I still find the difference to be very noticeable, especially on bigger displays.
Pretty nice comparison there. Probably the best one out there, though not entirely "definitive." It's too bad about the color timing on the capture device, but both consoles have the handicap. The color tests clearly show more color bleed and ringing in high contrast on the Wii which is typical of what most comparisons show how edges are less defined on Wii games. The white balance is more gray on the Wii at higher values as well. Probably what contributes to the muted colors simply upping saturation won't be a proper fix, I think.
Oh and I'm seeing this 6 feet away on my 50 inch plasma. Inches my ass.
NormalFish
Banned
that OP + the discussions that follows it pretty much* covers all the bases, I'd say.
Yeah, I'm gonna devour this whole thing. Thanks a lot for posting it.
I have a 50" plasma too but I'm not referring to Gamecube and Wii on a large fixed pixel display. I think that level of clarity + image grabs from digital capture devices would obviously expose the difference on Component quality between the two to a greater degree than the sub-HD displays these consoles were intended for.
I have a launch Wii on Component hooked up to my HD CRT and I'm hoping to get a Gamecube component cable from a Gaffer soon. I can't say for certain yet, but I'm not expecting a big difference, although I'd love to be pleasantly surprised by nice jump in picture quality.
Speaking of the 8-way SCART Switch, I'm curious which systems everyone currently has via RGB. Mine would be:
1) NES - NESRGB installed, currently using the component adapter board instead
2) SNES - 1Chip original SNES
3) N64 - RGB-modded with amp
4) PS2 slim - for PS1/PS2 games
5) Sega Genesis
6) Sega Saturn
7) Open
8) Open
Does anyone actually have 8 systems to hook up? I think my sweet spot is 5
1) NES - NESRGB installed, currently using the component adapter board instead
2) SNES - 1Chip original SNES
3) N64 - RGB-modded with amp
4) PS2 slim - for PS1/PS2 games
5) Sega Genesis
6) Sega Saturn
7) Open
8) Open
Does anyone actually have 8 systems to hook up? I think my sweet spot is 5
Yes! More than 8 on a matrix switch.
1. AV Famicom (NESRGB)
2. SNES (1-Chip)
3. N64 (RGB amp)
4. Gamecube (S-video for now)
5. Wii (Component)
6. PS1
7. PS2 (Component)
8. Genesis 2
9. Dreamcast
10. PC Engine Duo-R
11. Consolized MVS
12. MAME PC
13. Hama scart switch for a few more inputs
I'm glad this is coming out. There are just about no solid options left for new people who want to get into the hobby and hook up multiple consoles.
1. AV Famicom (NESRGB)
2. SNES (1-Chip)
3. N64 (RGB amp)
4. Gamecube (S-video for now)
5. Wii (Component)
6. PS1
7. PS2 (Component)
8. Genesis 2
9. Dreamcast
10. PC Engine Duo-R
11. Consolized MVS
12. MAME PC
13. Hama scart switch for a few more inputs
I'm glad this is coming out. There are just about no solid options left for new people who want to get into the hobby and hook up multiple consoles.
sixteen-bit
Member
I have a Bandridge RGB SCART switch with the following 5 systems hooked up:
1. Genesis (HDG Model 1)
2. SNES
3. Saturn
4. PS1
5. NGCD
My PS2 is on component at the moment but sometimes I just swap the PS1 cord if I wanna use the PVM for Tate games. Dreamcast sometimes switches in for the few 240p titles as well.
I have a sepatate 3-input RGB switch in reserve that will probably get some use if I ever RGB mod my NES and PCE.
1. Genesis (HDG Model 1)
2. SNES
3. Saturn
4. PS1
5. NGCD
My PS2 is on component at the moment but sometimes I just swap the PS1 cord if I wanna use the PVM for Tate games. Dreamcast sometimes switches in for the few 240p titles as well.
I have a sepatate 3-input RGB switch in reserve that will probably get some use if I ever RGB mod my NES and PCE.
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
Well so far I'd go with:
1) Sega Saturn
2) Sega Genesis
3) Super Famicom
4) Twin Famicom *near future acquisition*
5) Unknown
6) Unknown
7) Unknown
8) Unknown
Honestly don't really know what to go for after the Famicom really.
1) Sega Saturn
2) Sega Genesis
3) Super Famicom
4) Twin Famicom *near future acquisition*
5) Unknown
6) Unknown
7) Unknown
8) Unknown
Honestly don't really know what to go for after the Famicom really.
Gotcha. I can see that your mileage could very well vary from mine if you're applying the cable on a CRT. The very nature of a CRT could mask the edge issues of the Wii as the light passes through the shadow mask.
Kinda like my setup except I have RGB AV Famicom and the Model 1 Megadrive, otherwise the same.
I'm using a 5 RGB SCART slot Joytech AV Control center. Awesome device. I will probably get a Dreamcast in the near future, so if I get more consoles with RGB, I'll have to work something else out, since I'll be out of slots.
Oh. Let's see...
RGB: SC-3000, Master System, Megadrive + Mega-CD, Saturn, PS1, CPC 6128, DVD Player
Component: PS2, XBox, Wii
Composite Famicom
RF( Atari 2600
And I'm still looking forward to getting several systems like an SNES, an Amiga and a ZX Spectrum. I think I'll keep the consoles to the switch (which would be exactly 8 once everything is modded, am I not lucky?) and keep the computers on a separate CRT and/or only plugged when needed. These keyboard-computer beasts take way too much space to be displayed under the TV anyway.
RGB: SC-3000, Master System, Megadrive + Mega-CD, Saturn, PS1, CPC 6128, DVD Player
Component: PS2, XBox, Wii
Composite
FamicomRF
( Atari 2600And I'm still looking forward to getting several systems like an SNES, an Amiga and a ZX Spectrum. I think I'll keep the consoles to the switch (which would be exactly 8 once everything is modded, am I not lucky?) and keep the computers on a separate CRT and/or only plugged when needed. These keyboard-computer beasts take way too much space to be displayed under the TV anyway.
Oh, we're listing other than RGB? Well.
N64-Svideo
Sega Saturn-Svideo as an alternative to RGB
Sega Dreamcast-VGA
PS1-Component(through PS2)
PS2-Component and svideo
Xbox-Component(svideo will be used for a few 480i games)
Gamecube-HDMI through Nintendon't, svideo for the main system
N64-Svideo
Sega Saturn-Svideo as an alternative to RGB
Sega Dreamcast-VGA
PS1-Component(through PS2)
PS2-Component and svideo
Xbox-Component(svideo will be used for a few 480i games)
Gamecube-HDMI through Nintendon't, svideo for the main system
NOLA_Gaffer
Banned
Dropped in at my usual Thrift Store to see if they had put any new stock out and spotted this Phillips set. It has component, composite and s-video so it's likely the best non-pro monitor set in going to find. If everything else falls through I'll likely go back and nab it. If I wasn't so dead-set on getting something a bit smaller I probably would have gotten it today.
Truth be told though I'm kinda in love with this old Zenith I found. Judging by all the inputs ok the back it likely was a pretty high-end tv in its day. It's so freaking retro.
Then of course these two Trintrons. The bigger one had S-Video but is a bit too big and the smaller one only had composite. Phooey.
The hunt continues. I'll be able to see my JVC pro display on Tuesday morning so hopefully that's in good shape.
Truth be told though I'm kinda in love with this old Zenith I found. Judging by all the inputs ok the back it likely was a pretty high-end tv in its day. It's so freaking retro.
Then of course these two Trintrons. The bigger one had S-Video but is a bit too big and the smaller one only had composite. Phooey.
The hunt continues. I'll be able to see my JVC pro display on Tuesday morning so hopefully that's in good shape.
RadarScope1
Member
I'm finally jumping into RGB and a pro monitor. Wanted to double check my cable selection with the gurus here. I posted this question in the SNES thread but I figure this a better place. So in order to jump into a monitor setup this and this are sufficient? And I have a M1 Genesis so I want this one for stereo sound, right? I'll pipe the audio out of the monitor into a small 2-channel amp with bookshelf speakers.
Are any of these computers lap-friendly? The Spectrum looks tiny but does it need a bunch of other stuff connected to it? I seriously have no idea!
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
Honestly not sure what system I should check out after the Famicom really I'm mostly tempted by interesting librarys and I don't really know that much on other older consoles that'd benefit from RGB.
Not really, they were supposed to be put on a desk, and most kids just put them on the carpet in front of the TV. You rarely had to touch the keyboard if it was used as a console to play games with a joystick, but some games had to be played with the keyboard and you were better on a chair and a desk. You need to connect it to the mains and the TV so that's at least two cables, then you add the controller, and for the Spectrum you need another connection to the cassette player.
The Spectrum is a lovely little computer. I was blessed with the superior Amstrad as a child, but I have to admit that its tiny look and its shitty rubber keyboard is quite iconic. And most multiplatform games originated on it, blessing the other platforms with many quick and dirty inferior ports.
That is correct.
I don't feel comfortable enough to answer your other points, but iirc 16-235 is an NTSC specification, initially designed for aerial TV. The pictures were sent in a compressed colour space but the TV all while decoding the signal would also expand the colour space to fit the 0-255 colour space they can display.
This is the basis for modern TV normal and expanded colour space, which is meant to correct whatever signal they receive. If they are sent a limited NTSC signal, they would expand it and everything would look fine. If they are sent an expanded signal and display it at full range everything would look fine again. But if they receive a full range signal and treat it as a limited one, they would throw away 0-15 and 236-255 and expand the reset of the colour space, resulting in crushed blacks and cutoff whites. If the signal is limited and is treated like full range, there is no blacks or whites, only greys.
Back in the day there was no such consideration, and everything received through RF or Composite was expanded to be displayed correctly, and everything received via RGB Scart was left alone. But every TV ever was able to display a full colour range, their NTSC decoding algorithm taking into account the need for expanding the limited colour range.
I can't speak about Component.
Please correct me.
Damn, too bad. I would have liked to get into something completely new and interesting if it did not take up much space. The microcomputer stuff looks like gaming from an alternate timeline that most of us in the States with regular consoles never even glimpsed. Maybe they're worth emulating on the MAME PC...
My list:
1) RGB-modded AV Famicom
2) Region-modded Snes
3) Master System 1 (thankfully region-free without modding)
4) Region-modded Mega Drive w Mega CD and 32X (swap the cord for when I use this).
5) Saturn (jp, but have the region free cart)
6) RGB-modded jp N64 (plays NA carts as well)
7) Playstation 1 (Pal, need to mod this).
8) European Gamecube for the Game Boy Player
I also want to get into PC Engine, if so I guess I need to order another one.
Doing Dreamcast on VGA. Wii, PS2, PSP and Xbox on Component. PS3, 360, Wii U, Vita TV on HDMI.
1) RGB-modded AV Famicom
2) Region-modded Snes
3) Master System 1 (thankfully region-free without modding)
4) Region-modded Mega Drive w Mega CD and 32X (swap the cord for when I use this).
5) Saturn (jp, but have the region free cart)
6) RGB-modded jp N64 (plays NA carts as well)
7) Playstation 1 (Pal, need to mod this).
8) European Gamecube for the Game Boy Player
I also want to get into PC Engine, if so I guess I need to order another one.
Doing Dreamcast on VGA. Wii, PS2, PSP and Xbox on Component. PS3, 360, Wii U, Vita TV on HDMI.
They definitely are worth emulating. But be warned, the games are rough. Forget all the conventions of gaming, they were not yet invented and Japanese gaming had yet to get a full grip on the market. Controls were not standardised and were all over the place, as were the difficulty. Fairness was a foreign word in gaming at the time.
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