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[ElectricBlue187]

Yes, if we stopped trying to be the world police we would not have the issues we have and we could slim down the military. There's no need for us to care so deeply about owning everything and being the #1 big guy. Let our economy, civil liberties and so on do the talking.

If you don't think Sweden is important then how about Japan? They don't do what we do, they don't even have a proper military anymore. There is no excuse for how much we spend on the military and how many bases we have around the world period except for military industrial complex.

Lets just completely ignore the humongous reason why Japan and Europe can avoid maintaining a large military force

 

[Trakdown]

That's awesome!

I missed the debate. Who won?

 

[Incognito]

after countless hours researching the positions and visions of each respective candidate and taking into account the past four years, i have to say romney's performance tonight solidifies my vote for him. i was leaning towards obama throughout the summer but his first debate performance left a bad taste in my mouth and i was just disgusted that a sitting president would show up to one of the biggest stages of his life basically unprepared. while obama did come off stronger the last two debates i think he was making up ground for his admittedly horrific performance on oct 3. further, mitt's promise that he'll create 12 mill jobs over the next 4 years has credibility given his exemplary experience as a private businessman. moreover, romney did nothing tonight that dissuaded me from supporting him. his positions were calm, measured, and resolute. a clear and stark divergence from the neo-con years of the bush administration. in addition, he supported president obama a number of times which i believe made him appear very presidential and adult.

 

[ThisWreckage]

And who has provided Japan's defense since occupation?

We have, but only because no one else is stupid enough to do such a thing.

 

[DY_nasty]

Yes, if we stopped trying to be the world police we would not have the issues we have and we could slim down the military. There's no need for us to care so deeply about owning everything and being the #1 big guy. Let our economy, civil liberties and so on do the talking.

If you don't think Sweden is important then how about Japan? They don't do what we do, they don't even have a proper military anymore. There is no excuse for how much we spend on the military and how many bases we have around the world period except for military industrial complex and imperialism.

You can't just separate historical context from this. Why isn't Japan a military power now? Why isn't Sweden?

You can't name too many global superpowers that did not need and did not have a top tier military.

We have, but only because no one else is stupid enough to do such a thing.

Again, historical context still applies. We were to leave Japan to its own devices right next to Russia and China?

 

[Kabouter]

Lets just completely ignore the humongous reason why Japan and Europe can avoid maintaining a large military force

Yes, without the United States to guard us here in Europe, foreign invasion would be inevitable.

 

[Jim E. Rossler]

We all know Romney is nice to his son

But what about his debate with Obama tonight?

 

[koryuken]

after countless hours researching the positions and visions of each respective candidate and taking into account the past four years, i have to say romney's performance tonight solidifies my vote for him. i was leaning towards obama throughout the summer but his first debate performance left a bad taste in my mouth and i was just disgusted that a sitting president would show up to one of the biggest stages of his life basically unprepared. while obama did come off stronger the last two debates i think he was making up ground for his admittedly horrific performance on oct 3. further, mitt's promise that he'll create 12 mill jobs over the next 4 years has credibility given his exemplary experience as a private businessman. moreover, romney did nothing tonight that dissuaded me from supporting him. his positions were calm, measured, and resolute. a clear and stark divergence from the neo-con years of the bush administration. in addition, he supported president obama a number of times which i believe made him appear very presidential and adult.

Incognito
Troll
(Today, 09:57 PM)

 

[heliosRAzi]

after countless hours researching the positions and visions of each respective candidate and taking into account the past four years, i have to say romney's performance tonight solidifies my vote for him. i was leaning towards obama throughout the summer but his first debate performance left a bad taste in my mouth and i was just disgusted that a sitting president would show up to one of the biggest stages of his life basically unprepared. while obama did come off stronger the last two debates i think he was making up ground for his admittedly horrific performance on oct 3. further, mitt's promise that he'll create 12 mill jobs over the next 4 years has credibility given his exemplary experience as a private businessman. moreover, romney did nothing tonight that dissuaded me from supporting him. his positions were calm, measured, and resolute. a clear and stark divergence from the neo-con years of the bush administration. in addition, he supported president obama a number of times which i believe made him appear very presidential and adult.

The Troll returns

 

[speculawyer]

Holy shit:

http://1980scalling.com/

Scroll all the way down and try out the game. :lol :lol

Asteroids! Yes! Obama delivers.

 

[ElectricBlue187]

We have, but only because no one else is stupid enough to do such a thing.

It's not as though we gain some sort of advantage with being stronger than the next few countries combined...no, couldn't be.

 

[The Librarian]

I think I may vote Romney too. Obama was a little too mean in the debate. He came off as very arrogant. It seems that undeserving Nobel Peace Prize awarded to him has gone to his head.

 

[PrivateWHudson]

Well I guess you're still up and just aren't going to respond to anyone else.

just too many line items for me to really get into it tonight, but all of those internet tests that give you a bunch of scenarios to figure out your political bias always have me in the right/libertarian quadrant. I still voted for obama, but maybe my conviction was lacking four years ago. Maybe it's just coming back the more I'm prodded.

 

[C4Lukins]

Nobody won that one.

 

[Darknight]

Guys, Im an independent and clearly Romney won. All these posts make me sick. Them liberal commie bullies be hatin'.

 

[Angry Fork]

And who has provided Japan's defense since occupation?

Because Japan basically asks us to (at least their government does, the people may have a different opinion), but 1. that's not our responsibility anymore we're long past post-WW2 and 2. even if it was that doesn't make it okay to go everywhere else too.

 

[Stinkles]

The Troll returns

Hudson is chasing the crown from a different direction.

 

[7he Talon]

Obama's foreign policy plan clearly won.

I guess it comes down to who you want to carry out that plan, Mitt Romney or Barack Obama. Either way it's pretty well the same according to this debate, lol.

I guess we'll find out in a couple of weeks.

 

[Realyst]

Wait..is this sarcasm? Because my 10 years living in the south pretty much matches up with this perfectly

Well, in my 30 years of living in the south (30 - 10 is 20, you see?), I've been around people that you just KNEW were hardcore republicans. My Finance and Business Policy professors are my favorite examples of this. It turns out that they were quite moderate and somewhat liberal in most of their views. They voted for Obama in 2008. I've known a number of people like this. Now, don't get me wrong. There is a terrible amount of cognitive dissonance around here when it comes to politics. People continually vote against their best interests. It can be very disheartening. But, every now and then, you'll see something that can affect your perspective. No lie, I once saw a "redneck for Obama" sticker on one of those obnoxiously loud Chevy trucks. Totally made my day!

 

[Veezy]

Yes, without the United States to guard us here in Europe, foreign invasion would be inevitable.

Well.... you're welcome.

It's good to hear you guys actually start to admit that. We were feeling a bit taken advantage of.

 

[Canuck76]

My last foreign policy class, we discussed how after the cold war Donald Rumsfeld had tried advocating that the military slim down, become more mobile, and more agile as America was the only remaining super power and we'd have no need of conventional armies, that we'd be fighting NGOs etc, but he kept getting blowback from the military/hawks. Then a decade later he's having the same fight with Bush II and eventually lost.

America needs more spec ops and information, less tanks and soldiers.

Actually there's a whole documentary (forget what it's called) about the invasion of Iraq and donald rumsfield was all about "force multipliers" fewer soldiers more information/technology and more agile.

However after the invasion this didn't work as you need basic security in a classic counter insurgency operation. Thus led to the long, built up insurgency, partly because we didn't flood the country with troops and provide basic security everywhere. We didn't have enough people to cover enough ground, and so we could only do raids on places and not really "hold" places.

Once the surge happened (in Iraq) this was super helpful as you could provide basic security everywhere and people would have the confidence to go places and buy things and build up the economy and not be afraid.

There's good arguments for slimming down, and being more agile but you look at Afghanistan and Iraq, maybe we won't have more of those conflicts, maybe we will, but they were really screaming for people at one time during those conflicts.

 

[ElectricBlue187]

Yes, without the United States to guard us here in Europe, foreign invasion would be inevitable.

Cold War sez hello

 

[ThisWreckage]

Again, historical context still applies. We were to leave Japan to its own devices right next to Russia and China?

It wouldn't be the first time we decimated Japan. I do not believe in pouring resources into policing the world. I'm not even that big on worldwide aid. We've got way too many homeless, sick, and poor people here that we need to take care of first. We have taken up the task of policing the world and playing Mother Teresa and we don't have the resources to do either one of those things. No one envies that.

 

[speculawyer]

New Obama site went up.

http://cavalrymenforromney.com/

This site went live during the debate. How the fuck did they do that? Artwork and DNS registration in real-time?

 

[Kabouter]

Cold War sez hello

Yes, without the United States, the Soviet Union would have been eager to go to war with Europe's two nuclear powers.

 

[Veezy]

This site went live during the debate. How the fuck did they do that? Artwork and DNS registration in real-time?

He has a solid team.

They knew that Romney would say something about ship and air force numbers. The prepped Obama on a rebuttal. Soon as they head the reference, put it online.

Some tight work in the President's camp.

 

[IrishNinja]

eastern europe

while i agree that those bases as they are right now are indeed money sinks and its definitely time for further changes to be made, they're still important to more than just us.

id argue specifics but that's for another thread - still, if we're serious about cuts and financial priorities, how high do you think they should be? for me, if we had a proper healthcare system in place, id say they're on the table.

after countless hours researching the positions and visions of each respective candidate and taking into account the past four years, i have to say romney's performance tonight solidifies my vote for him. i was leaning towards obama throughout the summer but his first debate performance left a bad taste in my mouth and i was just disgusted that a sitting president would show up to one of the biggest stages of his life basically unprepared. while obama did come off stronger the last two debates i think he was making up ground for his admittedly horrific performance on oct 3. further, mitt's promise that he'll create 12 mill jobs over the next 4 years has credibility given his exemplary experience as a private businessman. moreover, romney did nothing tonight that dissuaded me from supporting him. his positions were calm, measured, and resolute. a clear and stark divergence from the neo-con years of the bush administration. in addition, he supported president obama a number of times which i believe made him appear very presidential and adult.

this was pretty good, but you missed an opportunity with apology tours

I think I may vote Romney too. Obama was a little too mean in the debate. He came off as very arrogant. It seems that undeserving Nobel Peace Prize awarded to him has gone to his head.

i don't know many kenyan muslims, admittedly, but the ones in my head are all much more humble

Well.... you're welcome.

It's good to hear you guys actually start to admit that. We were feeling a bit taken advantage of.

no bro
they're not welcome till france says it

Cold War sez hello

cheney is busting out that shit-eating grin somewhere right now, i can feel it

 

[DY_nasty]

Yes, without the United States to guard us here in Europe, foreign invasion would be inevitable.

A lot of people act as if a military's sole purpose is to protect against foreign invasion. That isn't true. For some countries it is... yeah, but that isn't what the US does. And it isn't so much being "world police" as it is protecting interests and keeping things flying smoothly (something many people don't appreciate).

I'm all for a downsizing and getting hands out of cookie jars though. Being spread too thin is a bitch, but at the same time isolationism and staying back at home just isn't a practical option.

 

[Red Blaster]

Yes, without the United States, the Soviet Union would have been eager to go to war with Europe's two nuclear powers.

Without Ronald Reagan (best president ever) the entirety of Europe would be speaking Russian

 

[ElectricBlue187]

Yes, without the United States, the Soviet Union would have been eager to go to war with Europe's two nuclear powers.

Guess the American militaries bases in every goddamn country had nothing to do with it

 

[bishoptl]

ann coulter is way out of line with that twitter post

 

[MasterShotgun]

This site went live during the debate. How the fuck did they do that? Artwork and DNS registration in real-time?

That shit was planned. But I think Romney was extremely generous in giving Obama an opening for that attack.

 

[PrivateWHudson]

One minute you're not sure about party plans and the next you're voting because of them. Now it's because you're butt hurt about liberals scalding you on being ignorant on party plans, especially so late in the game. Which is it?

When did I say that I was unsure of party plans? I was unsure of who I thought should be the leader of our country. I was told that party policy has been set for years, and I should have got off my ass and made up my mind a couple of years ago.

 

[Kunan]

I think I may vote Romney too. Obama was a little too mean in the debate. He came off as very arrogant. It seems that undeserving Nobel Peace Prize awarded to him has gone to his head.

What do you expect honestly? Romney has flip flopped large numbers of times this campaign and stood there and said he never said what he said. Is Obama supposed to not grill him over flat out lying? I would want Romney to do the same to Obama if necessary as well. And did you happen to miss the other debates where Romney was vicious himself?

Ignoring real reasons like policies, basing your vote on which one seems more mean in the debate is pointless as both have been on the offensive in different debates. You would vote against someone for grilling the other over lying? What is the point of any of this election process then?

 

[Phoenix]

This site went live during the debate. How the fuck did they do that? Artwork and DNS registration in real-time?

Good graphic artists can work really quickly, but I'm RALLy surprised they were able to get DNS resolution so quickly. They definitely had prewarmed some stuff with a dynamic DNS server.

 

[DjRoomba]

lol, and to think people doubted Obama after the first debate.

my word. I cant believe Bill Maher had her on last week and didnt ask her much or get into it with her at all

 

[EatinOlives]

That shit was planned. But I think Romney was extremely generous in giving Obama an opening for that attack.

Romney didn't really "give" anything to Obama, he was just played like a fiddle.

 

[strobogo]

I have to be honest. I didn't really pay super close attention to this one. With in the first 5-10 minutes when everyone was talking over each other I started tuning out. A few things stood out to me, though. Mitt Romney won't let the Cold War go. His foreign policy seems to be "Fuck China, Fuck Russia, and Fuck Iran, and fuck you if you don't agree". He and Ryan continually talk so much shit about Iran right up until they are asked point plank if they want to start a war, and then they kind of back off, only to go back to it later.

Seemed like at least half of the debate had zero to do foreign policy. "Where will you get the money?" "Check the website." "What are your plans?" "Check the website." "What is your opinion on ___?" "Check the website."

The one part that really caught my ears and was hilarious was when Obama was talking about Romney's support to let GM fail with no nets. Romney says "that's not true, he's wrong" Obama is all "check the transcripts" and after 10-15 seconds Romney blurts out "he's right" and Obama just keeps going. I loled hard at it.

 

[alphaNoid]

Romney taking Obama's stance on every foreign policy issue is fucking brilliant, really.

Obama's greatest strength is is foreign policy (which makes sense, 2008 was a foreign policy election until about six weeks to go), so what's the easiest way to disarm him? Make yourself identical in as many regards as possible. This way, the only difference between the two is on domestic issues, which Romney is hoping the election will hinge on.

This was definitely his goal tonight and it worked I think. Swing voters are voting on the om domestic issues, considering Obama has a strong foreign policy record, Romneys best bet was exactly what he did.

Domestic policy and the economy will make the election. NBC had it as a 47 percent split tonight, going to get interesting soon.

Anyone's race, and either guy can win.

 

[littleworm]

after countless hours researching the positions and visions of each respective candidate and taking into account the past four years, i have to say romney's performance tonight solidifies my vote for him. i was leaning towards obama throughout the summer but his first debate performance left a bad taste in my mouth and i was just disgusted that a sitting president would show up to one of the biggest stages of his life basically unprepared. while obama did come off stronger the last two debates i think he was making up ground for his admittedly horrific performance on oct 3. further, mitt's promise that he'll create 12 mill jobs over the next 4 years has credibility given his exemplary experience as a private businessman. moreover, romney did nothing tonight that dissuaded me from supporting him. his positions were calm, measured, and resolute. a clear and stark divergence from the neo-con years of the bush administration. in addition, he supported president obama a number of times which i believe made him appear very presidential and adult.

I-I-I-Wanna get it on record that Incognito admitted to voter fraud.

Spoiler

Your trolling is worse than Mitt's debate performance.

 

[Steelrain]

my word. I cant believe Bill Maher had her on last week and didnt ask her much or get into it with her at all

It's because he knows her game.

They're friends ffs.

 

[pigeon]

This makes me question if Romney even wants to be president anymore. He just seemed tired and not really into it.

The truth is, I think Romney's realizing that it really doesn't matter if he wants to be president or not.

 

[IrishNinja]

A lot of people act as if a military's sole purpose is to protect against foreign invasion. That isn't true. For some countries it is... yeah, but that isn't what the US does. And it isn't so much being "world police" as it is protecting interests and keeping things flying smoothly (something many people don't appreciate).

I'm all for a downsizing and getting hands out of cookie jars though. Being spread too thin is a bitch, but at the same time isolationism and staying back at home just isn't a practical option.

i cant recall if it was TTC or TED talks, but a year ago or more, i recall an economist talking about global realities in store for america in the coming decades as china - and eventually india - outgrow our economy, and logically start to dwarf our influence after that.

what do you think happens then? does the world fall apart without us rushing in to protect our interests? moreover: when the sun set on the british empire and they had to let go of their colonies & the like, do you think their economy dwindled, or grew after that burden was lifted?

granted, different times/circumstances and like it or not there's commitments like japan, isreal etc we'd not be able to shake even if we wanted to, but the narrative you're supporting here is one that's going to take a beating in a rather inevitable - and not very long from now - future.

Anyone's race, and either guy can win.

which electoral college are you looking at though

 

[Link]

after countless hours researching the positions and visions of each respective candidate and taking into account the past four years, i have to say romney's performance tonight solidifies my vote for him. i was leaning towards obama throughout the summer but his first debate performance left a bad taste in my mouth and i was just disgusted that a sitting president would show up to one of the biggest stages of his life basically unprepared. while obama did come off stronger the last two debates i think he was making up ground for his admittedly horrific performance on oct 3. further, mitt's promise that he'll create 12 mill jobs over the next 4 years has credibility given his exemplary experience as a private businessman. moreover, romney did nothing tonight that dissuaded me from supporting him. his positions were calm, measured, and resolute. a clear and stark divergence from the neo-con years of the bush administration. in addition, he supported president obama a number of times which i believe made him appear very presidential and adult.

This is how it's done, people.

 

[DjRoomba]

I think I may vote Romney too. Obama was a little too mean in the debate. He came off as very arrogant. It seems that undeserving Nobel Peace Prize awarded to him has gone to his head.

Serious post? Probably not but if so Mitt Romney has worn the douchebag smile for every debate and has been the interrupting disrespector of the president. If anyone is arrogant it is most certainly him. But way to vote based on manners instead of policies

 

[DY_nasty]

id argue specifics but that's for another thread - still, if we're serious about cuts and financial priorities, how high do you think they should be? for me, if we had a proper healthcare system in place, id say they're on the table.

the defense budget is only out of control because our defense policies are

There's a big misconception regarding military use that simply doesn't apply to many of today's issues. Certain goals and missions shouldn't be treated or funded like full-on war-time deployments. That's the real issue. For example, If Germany is going to be treated like a jumppad - it should be funded like one. Not another fully capable base. A lot of the positions and attitudes we have in place just aren't practical for what the military does (or tries to do) now. A transition needs to happen - and its happening already. Most (who haven't been forced to retire) are glad to see it.

It wouldn't be the first time we decimated Japan. I do not believe in pouring resources into policing the world. I'm not even that big on worldwide aid. We've got way too many homeless, sick, and poor people here that we need to take care of first. We have taken up the task of policing the world and playing Mother Teresa and we don't have the resources to do either one of those things. No one envies that.

I'm not even sure how to respond to the bolded...

 

[Forever]

Serious post?

:lol

 

[Rentahamster]

If you think that's just a liberal thing then I don't know what to tell you. I'd be willing to bet on a conservative board they'd still be saying the same stuff about people undecided right now, too. They'd be saying that obviously that person should pick their guy, but they'd probably still be frustrated that someone hasn't looked at things yet and made a decision.

Cursory googling of Free Republic would agree with that assessment, but partisan condescension from either political spectrum seems tactless to me.

There are many reasons to be an undecided voter aside from laziness. Who can say, really, that they are 100% fully informed about anything? No one really is. Most who claim to be "fully informed" are mostly "informed" with the information that supports their preferred candidate.

 

[Owzers]

i'll take serious obama and laughing joe over the smirk twins any day.

 

[pigeon]

For the record, if Free Republic is saying that Romney blew it, that's not going to be a good sign for him.