Ar¢tos
Member
Why not?
Nintendo recently invented the mouse.
WC/Jez: Microsoft's ambitious new Xbox: Your entire Xbox console library, the full power of Windows PC gaming, and no multiplayer paywall
- Thread starter RetroGamingUK
- Start date
Nintendo recently invented the mouse.
mayham2199
Member
That's not a green rat. Your joining the PC master race. Using an APP doesn't make you a green rat anymore than using Steam makes you a blue walrus.
Mister Wolf
Member
You're going PC. Your new color is gold. Congratulations in advance.
awwr999999
Member
That's the whole point.
You can make your own Windows PC for much less and do all of those same things.
The point is to make Windows PC the best value option.
dgrdsv
Member
I'm about 99% sure that it won't be easy to use the thing for "PC purposes".
People expecting this h/w to just run your regular Windows don't really understand the model MS is pursuing.
This will likely still be a console with its own OS and own UI.
It just doesn't make any sense for MS to try and make a PC prebuilt - this market has close to negative margins as is, they won't be able to compete with huge OEMs on either price or margins.
So the h/w being closer to PC parts is fine - cuts down on R&D, allows for less platform specific optimizations needed, could potentially run a full Windows to allow running competitor's titles on the machine (for those who will care enough).
But the main s/w I'd still expect to be a console specific OS/SDKs.
bitbydeath
Gold Member
Xbox Series sold 2M last year.
Likely around 1M (or less) this year given numerous stores around the world have either dropped them completely or severely reduced their stock in that time.
Who knows if there will even be a store presence for them by 2027, two years is a long time for Xbox with the current burning state it is in, and it's only going to continue getting worse, January is looming.
Shareholders will see it getting worse and continue to tear more shreds, who knows if Magnus will even be allowed to release once they're done, again, two years is a very long time.
bender
What time is it?
Team Andromeda
Member
I don't follow you, but I don't believe MS is they're trying to make out they're still losing up to $300 per Series X
BlackTron
Member
It's likely that the ability to customize, swap parts or run any software you wish will be traded off with being a simple box with console UI. Which is fine, until the price comes in. $1200-2k for a box destined to become dated with no way to limp it along with upgrades will only seem appealing to a niche. They know this which is why their success has been de-coupled from hardware with it. Wanna pay for a niche product? Great. Don't? Also great, that's why Halo is multiplat.
Punished Miku
Gaslighter Pro: 16.7 Fireflops
Pretty much. I could live with it, if it seems somewhat fair price wise and lasts at least 7 years. I spent $1000 already this gen on PS5 and Xbox together, and had PS+ for a while. For a very niche audience, it could be super cool.
HeisenbergFX4
Member
That's the question, would people spend more up front on a much higher powered system that you likely get a full generation out of vs those of us (like myself) who grab mid gen refreshes like the PS5 Pro because we want more power
I think the casuals will clearly say no but enthusiasts?
I dunno
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
reinking
Gold Member
Depending on where I am with Xbox, I will end up doing both. I am viewing I the next Xbox purchase as a mini/TV PC more than I am a console. It seems like it will offer me more of what PC gaming on a TV does now. I can see this being a big deal for gaming enthusiasts but passing by the traditional console market. I am excited to see what MS offers but sad if it weakens the overall console market.
Humdinger
Gold Member
Yeah, that's my question, too. MS doesn't have a great track record with regard to Windows or the Windows Store, and this is going to be all about Windows. They're promising a "curated" console-like experience, smooth as a baby's bottom, but it's easy to make promises, and it's easy to get excited about plans on paper. We'll see how smoothly the actual product functions.
BlackTron
Member
Therein lies the problem...casuals don't want that much expense/power, they want to get their foot in the door. Meanwhile enthusiasts don't want to spend big money on a PC with all its PCness stripped away. You're left with a niche enthusiast audience caught between both.
It's better for them to target a niche with hardware and serve that one segment they can profit on very well than targeting everyone and ending up underwater (just ask men in boxes)
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
You were talking about the hit MS was willing to lose on the console in the old days. They were losing $200-$300 per Xbox Series sold, not $50.
Pallas
Member
The removal of the online pay wall has my attention and the complete backwards compatibility. I want to see how Sony does in those two areas with the PS6.
Would it be strong enough to do native backwards compatibility with all the previous gen's? That'd be pretty awesome if they add that to the PS6.
in retrospect could you imagine Sega would be like if they had the IP's they have now back during the Saturn and Dreamcast days?
Would it be strong enough to do native backwards compatibility with all the previous gen's? That'd be pretty awesome if they add that to the PS6.
They have a pretty big catalog these days. It's definitely tempting to get it if that hypothetical ever happened. (it probably won't, but hey?)
in retrospect could you imagine Sega would be like if they had the IP's they have now back during the Saturn and Dreamcast days?
simpatico
Gold Member
Silicon prices could be the wildcard here. Assuming MS is willing to sell it as a loss. DRAM price hike this month is probably a sign of things to come with all the new demand. I'd be open minded to it if there was a true windows layer (just for modding / backward compatibility reasons).
Madjaba
Member
Except it will be a "standard PC" what other thing can it be ?
I'm glad some of you are discovering PC gaming today but stop praising things that are not worth any praises.
I can already use my "productivity controller" which is called a "keyboard" and potentially a "mouse" (mice was cute though).
And when I'm done "productiving" I can use my leisure controller which is called a "controller" to play games.
People are not THAT dumb.
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mayham2199
Member
Why would anyone assume this? This isn't happening.
simpatico
Gold Member
When hasn't a console been sold at a loss at launch?
Tobimacoss
Member
Neither MS, nor Sony are subsidizing consoles any more, especially MS if they allow other PC stores and get rid of online paywall.
At best, they will sell the first party consoles at cost, while OEMs sell higher spec variants for 20% profit.
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simpatico
Gold Member
There will be a nice chunk of budget to play with if they forgo building the digital garden walls. I don't think Microsoft invested as much as they did to go this far and bow out rather than taking a chance on some short-term hardware losses. It would be idiotic. There's a very competitive device that could be brought to market here, and I know there are people at Microsoft who see it. Now, I HIGHLY doubt whatever they end up releasing will be as amazing as it could be (not in terms of horsepower, but in mod-ability and common sense).
Topher
Identifies as young
Being subsidized doesn't necessarily mean they are taking a loss. If it is sold at cost it is still being subsidized by the closed garden system. More than likely Microsoft is going to be making their profits off of the hardware next gen if it is a PC which is why many are projecting significantly higher prices for Xbox.
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kevboard
Member
Tobimacoss
Member
Well, MS trying to make profits on the hardware is also speculation.
Amy hood wants profit margins of 30% for the entire division, not specifically hardware. The Series hardware being sold at $100-$150 loss per unit was cutting into those profit margins. As long as they aren't selling at loss, the division should hit 30% quite easily, especially being multi-platform, their games only need to sell 2-3 million copies to reach that 30%. Anything on top is icing on the cake.
Cloud Gaming costs roughly 3 cents an hour at current Series S profiles, according to the ABK leaked documents. Average 100 hours per month per user, is $3 per month. Even with Magnus based servers, the average costs would likely rise to $5 month but still not too much due to efficiency and server setup gains. So Cloud already has a 20-50% profit margin, based on $10 month subscription, and users buying at least one game.
The purpose of MS making first party consoles isn't really to extract profit but to act as a baseline for Developers to target and to console the Console userbase (pun intended). MS wants OEMs building most of the hardware. OEMs are welcome to make profits off the devices as they see fit based on whatever specs they can sell.
Topher
Identifies as young
K KeplerL2 said Xbox Series stopped selling at a loss a while back. You don't know that would achieve 30% profit margin even if that were not the case. Rest of your post is speculation and guessing as much as anyone's. And yeah, I fully acknowledge I'm speculating. I just don't see a Microsoft developing first party hardware at cost with no close ecosystem to capture profits backing it up. Makes no sense to do that while undercutting OEMs by 20% either.