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[Bishop89]

TPM is in the top 3 SW movies, and aotc is the worst

 

[Adam_Vania]

Let's not forget The Phantom Menace is the one that introduced the concept of midichlorians.

 

[Ecotic]

Attack of the Clones felt like the production team realized Star Wars was ruined so they gave up completely. The Phantom Menace at least felt like effort was behind it. It was almost a mediocre film.

 

[Forerunner]

TPM is in the top 3 SW movies...

 

[Clint Beastwood]

I mean they basically had to re-do the rest of prequel trilogy because TPM was so bad. That 10 year time skip wasn't for shits and giggles. It was because they fucked up HARD.

well the whole point of prequels was to show you how Vader came to be.

You kind of need a time skip when you have an 8 year old Anakin unless you're gonna have a 12 year old Vader

 

[phanphare]

TPM is in the top 3 SW movies, and aotc is the worst

there are more than 3 star wars movies tho

 

[SuperSah]

AotC.

The whole romance plot was terrible and comprised around 1/3rd of the movie.

 

[tanooki27]

phantom menace is a better watch.

 

[akileese]

The HAL edit of TPM actually isn't that bad of a movie. It was fluid and told a good story. Dare I say I enjoyed it? The HAL edit of Attack of the Clones was still a shitty movie, but it was slightly less shitty.

 

[Surfinn]

The Force Awakens.

Edgy.

Attack of the clones is unquestionably worse. There are absolutely no redeeming qualities.

All of the PT has aged horribly, but AToC is total shit. The C3PO assembly line scene is the lowest point in SW movie history.

 

[GitarooMan]

Attack of the Clones felt like the production team realized Star Wars was ruined so they gave up completely. The Phantom Menace at least felt like effort was behind it. It was almost a mediocre film.

I agree with this. Also the anticipation with seeing a "grown up" Anakin and the famed Clone Wars and then to have all the hope so thoroughly destroyed was an astounding accomplishment. And then there was Yoda hopping around with a light saber which ranks for me as one of the worst Star Wars things ever.

 

[Zombine]

The Phantom Menace is a deeply flawed but incredibly fun movie to watch. Attack of The Clones is a boring mess and it looks terrible in 2016. It's the absolute worst film out of all of them with the exception of the Jango x Kenobi bits.

 

[Erevador]

If you've ever seen the original drafts of the first SW, you can really see the problems of the prequels in them. There's lots of tedious politics and exposition, and it's not very focused or polished. The characters seem very vague. I absolutely believe that George had a TON of help turning those original ideas into a tight, explosive film. One place he obviously got saved was in the editing room, they did what is probably the finest editing job of our time on a very uncertain pile of film.

So, basically the first films are collaborative, and the sequels are what we get when he works completely on his own. Kind of like that first draft.

There are two narratives on this. One is that George is a lone genius, and one is that George is a moron and was constantly saved by others (Huyck and Katz, Kurtz, Marcia).

I don't think either of those is true.

Have you read Rinzler's book on the making of A New Hope? I think it provides the best account of the process the film went through, and I came out of it with both more appreciation for George than ever before, AND a lot of appreciation for his gifted collaborators.

I think the prequels are the way they are because George Lucas became a mogul. He struggled to see his own films as an organic piece of storytelling, aware as he was of the degree to which Star Wars was a larger media "brand" that the film was only a part of. I also think that after spending 30 years innovating in effects with all of his companies it became difficult for him to separate that from what the film actually needed. I think James Cameron and Peter Jackson have had some similar difficulties with recent films.

 

[Zukuu]

Phantom Menace is a fun film. It has pretty memorable scenes and is more light-hearded, while also having some tragedy and a bad-ass villain. All in all, it's actually one of the better Star Wars films. Clone on the other hand is tedious, dumb and a bore and easily the worst of the entire franchise.

 

[DragonSworne]

Attack of the Cringe

 

[Surfinn]

There are two narratives on this. One is that George is a lone genius, and one is that George is a moron and was constantly saved by others (Huyck and Katz, Kurtz, Marcia).

I don't think either of those is true.

Have you read Rinzler's book on the making of A New Hope? I think it provides the best account of the process the film went through, and I came out of it with both more appreciation for George than ever before, AND a lot of appreciation for his gifted collaborators.

I think the prequels are the way they are because George Lucas became a mogul. He struggled to see his own films as an organic piece of storytelling, aware as he was of the degree to which Star Wars was a larger media "brand" that the film was only a part of. I also think that after spending 30 years innovating in effects with all of his companies it became difficult for him to separate that from what the film actually needed. I think James Cameron and Peter Jackson have had some similar difficulties with recent films.

Good post. This is where I stand too. I think he just really lost his way. He seems like a different person completely in early interviews.

 

[Dirca]

That's because Padme was a freak.

I never understood why the hell she wore something like that for dinner with a "friend".

 

[Schlorgan]

There are two narratives on this. One is that George is a lone genius, and one is that George is a moron and was constantly saved by others (Huyck and Katz, Kurtz, Marcia).

I don't think either of those is true.

Have you read Rinzler's book on the making of A New Hope? I think it provides the best account of the process the film went through, and I came out of it with both more appreciation for George than ever before, AND a lot of appreciation for his gifted collaborators.

I think the prequels are the way they are because George Lucas became a mogul. He struggled to see his own films as an organic piece of storytelling, aware as he was of the degree to which Star Wars was a larger media "brand" that the film was only a part of. I also think that after spending 30 years innovating in effects with all of his companies it became difficult for him to separate that from what the film actually needed. I think James Cameron and Peter Jackson have had some similar difficulties with recent films.

The famous interview with Kurtz basically describes this. At some point Lucas changed

Spoiler

(or was replaced with a lizard person).

 

[-shadow-]

The Phantom Menace is still somewhat enjoyable even with terrible acting, directing and Jar Jar Binks. A lot of stuff was still done practical, editing was still somewhat logical, CG was still mostly fine because it wasn't the main focus. And it still feels like people had some say so in the project and had just slightly input into the project. You see them actively asking and judging Lucas during the test screening at first and even Lucas admits that he's gone a bit far. But later it's an 'artistic direction' and you see the hope just sinks with everyone else and I think that after that no one cared about the other two films.

I've watched TPM multiple times and still watch it at times whenever I'm in the mood. TCW is the film I've watched twice. Once on DVD because I've never seen it and once on Blu-ray because, well Blu-ray. I've never watched it again since. It's such a terrible film from beginning to end and I just can't bring myself to watch it again.

 

[Spoo]

I preferred TPM. I mean, neither are good movies, but TPM had pod racing, which was visually cool for the time, and a lot of the places Obi Wan and fam visited in the movie were relatively exciting. Darth Maul fight was a good cap. Whole thing seemed a bit more aloof than what came after with it's dreaded seriousness.

 

[Terrorblot]

It's Attack of the Clones for sure. Granted I was still a young kid when PM came out, but at least I have memories of leaving the theater having enjoyed myself, I remember my feelings about Star Wars were still positive before Clones, after leaving the theaters THAT time however, THAT was the beginning of "Star Wars is bad now". Don't get me wrong, Phantom Menace wasn't that great, but it felt like it could have been a fluke, like if Clones / Sith had actually have lived up to OT expectations we could have gotten over Phantom Menace, but no, Clones will forever be a stain on the legacy.

 

[JordanN]

I liked the battle scenes as a whole it made it feel like "Star WARS." Emphasis on the wars part, with millions of troops fighting across the galaxy on different planets and systems rather than just a small band of rebels and the big Empire.

I always thought when I was a kid and I saw this movie, it had the "War" I wanted in a sci-fi flick, maybe that's just my opinion.

By the way the Clone Wars TV Show and Ep. 3 had good scenes of the clone wars.

So I guess Ep. 2 may be bad as a whole but it set up a great period/ arc in the series in my opinion.

Loved Geonosis. I remember spending so much time playing that map in Battlefront 1 and being able to fly the ships or taking control of the walking tank.

 

[Retro]

Clones is the worst.

Phantom Menace has a pretty great lightsaber duel with great music. Clones has a boring duel, followed by that awful Yoda lightsaber fight.

Hayden Christensen's whining and his awful, creepy dialogue are worse, and take up a much larger block of the movie than both TPM's rotten child actor and awful CGI character.

A thousand Jedi showing up to put on a Pink Floyd laser light show is dumb. Not "Let's try spinning"-levels of dumb, but still pretty dumb.

Obi-Wan spends time on (an admittedly cool-looking) ocean planet investigating a guy we don't know who's misdeed is already done, leading to a convenient army that nobody ever questions the creation of after they realize they need them.

The Fetts feels kinda shoe-horned in there, but whatever.

That god awful factory scene where everything is CGI, R2-D2 can somehow fly magically for reasons, and C-3PO is reduced to Saturday Morning slapstick.

MONSTER ATTACK. RIP. OH, my abs are exposed! That's... convenient?

Death Star reference, for no reason!

Way too much of this;

"Look master!" [points off screen]
<insert CGI shot of battle>.
"You're right, Anakin, look there! [points in different direction]
<insert CGI shot of battle>
"Run! Run for your lives! It's a m-m-m-Monster! [points off screen]
<insert shot of Godzilla trampling Tokyo>​

"Attack of the Clones" is a shit name. Shit. Name.

 

[michaelius]

Clones - TPM is not great and I hate Jar-Jar as much as everyone else but at least it's coherent story kept in SW spirit. Clones on the other hand is just atrocious and only has few moments saving it from total disaster.

 

[DorkLord54]

The Phantom Menace is still somewhat enjoyable even with terrible acting, directing and Jar Jar Binks. A lot of stuff was still done practical, editing was still somewhat logical, CG was still mostly fine because it wasn't the main focus. And it still feels like people had some say so in the project and had just slightly input into the project. You see them actively asking and judging Lucas during the test screening at first and even Lucas admits that he's gone a bit far. But later it's an 'artistic direction' and you see the hope just sinks with everyone else and I think that after that no one cared about the other two films.

I've watched TPM multiple times and still watch it at times whenever I'm in the mood. TCW is the film I've watched twice. Once on DVD because I've never seen it and once on Blu-ray because, well Blu-ray. I've never watched it again since. It's such a terrible film from beginning to end and I just can't bring myself to watch it again.

To be far to TCW, it's a glorified pilot to a far better animated show that should've never been released in theatres.

 

[xam3l]

Take Jar Jar Binks out and TPM its a very decent movie.

The Attack of The Clones tho... Whats really left? That asteroid dog fight is cool. Yep. Thats it.

 

[Strangelove77]

Attack Of The Clones is one of the most boring movies I've ever seen. It's awful on every level.

Phantom is slightly better.

 

[WadiumArcadium]

TPM is better paced, doesn't have a cringeworthy romantic subplot and actually has a pretty good lightsaber duel. The pod race is good as well. There's a few things I enjoy about Clones such as the Obi-Wan v Jango scenes and some of the arena scenes but overall it's just not enjoyable to watch.

 

[cyberheater]

The first one because it's hard to express the depth of bitter disappointment, bewilderment and betrayal I felt walking out of the cinema after watching that utter pile of retconning shite.

#teamextremesalt

 

[Surfinn]

Clones - TPM is not great and I hate Jar-Jar as much as everyone else but at least it's coherent story kept in SW spirit. Clones on the other hand is just atrocious and only has few moments saving it from total disaster.

Which moments?

 

[Bishop89]

U heard me

 

[Surfinn]

The first one because it's hard to express the depth of bitter disappointment, bewilderment and betrayal I felt walking out of the cinema after watching that utter pile of retconning shite.

#teamextreamsalt

I remember walking out of the theater like.. It wasn't that bad..
.. Right?

 

[freenudemacusers]

ppl like to dismiss aotc and tpm but they tried new ideas and pushed the sw audience to new characters and archetypes while something like tfa is just a nostalgia cashgrab remix of safe characters and a tired narrative structure. art vs commerce. commerce always wins in the minds of the masses.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

They're both horrid films but Clones is worse.

 

[Forerunner]

U heard me

 

[Moongazer]

Attack of the Clones is painful to sit through. That fucking Obi Wan diner scene. The whole romance thing or whatever the hell it was. I didn't know what the fuck I was watching anymore. Certainly not Star Wars. For all the crap TPM gets at the very least it has the podracing segment which was the only decent thing out of the whole prequel trilogy.

 

[cyberheater]

I remember walking out of the theater like.. It wasn't that bad..
.. Right?

The first stage is denial...

 

[Majine]

TPM is shitty, but AotC breaks a higher rule. It is boring.

 

[FTF]

Clones is the bottom of the barrel.

No. actually, its the sewage that has leaked outside the barrel and is now poisoning the water supply and giving you Cholera.

TPM at least has Darth Maul and decent effects that hold up to this day unlike the PS2 games that are AotC AND RotS.

This

 

[zerosum]

I can have some cheesy fun with The Phantom Menace, but that middle hour or so of Clones is damn hard to get through.

It should be noted that I'm a sucker for anything Star Wars related.

 

[PdotMichael]

ppl like to dismiss aotc and tpm but they tried new ideas and pushed the sw audience to new characters and archetypes while something like tfa is just a nostalgia cashgrab remix of safe characters and a tired narrative structure. art vs commerce. commerce always wins in the minds of the masses.

then art was a mistake it's nothing but CG trash.

 

[Schlorgan]

then art was a mistake it's nothing but CG trash.

Someone is in denial if they think the prequels aren't the poster boy for commerce over art.

 

[cyberheater]

The only redeeming thing about both films is the music which is awesome. What a waste.

 

[niccoolnic]

Attack of the Clones. Hayden Christensen is so horrible, that it makes any scene where he tries to be better than a plank of wood incredibly laughable. Watch the scene between him and Padmé after he gets back from the sand people. He takes a sharp breath between every word when he is angry and it's hysterical.

 

[JP_]

Isn't clones the one where they say m'lady like 30,000 times? That one is worse.

 

[Rumblebones]

Attack of the Clones is by far the worst Star Wars film.

Phantom Menace was a disappointing film but not THAT bad, Jar Jar or no Jar Jar.

 

[spekkeh]

Unpopular opinion it seems, since people so hate the romance plot in AOTC, but I have always thought The Phantom Menace was massively worse. It simply has no reason to exist.

Attack of the Clones does actually have a plot and a central character arc, whether it is well executed or not. The film has identifiable characters, an actual villain, and relationships that develop.

The Phantom Menace has a couple fun sequences, a lot of messy sequences, no protagonist, no relationships, and absolutely no reason to exist at all.

This is my opinion as well. They're both middling, but at least Attack of the Clones has meaning. Things happen. TPM is complete mediocre fluff. You're watching a bad film and end none the wiser.

This is of course coming from someone who grew up with the original trilogy. I wanted to see the lead up to Vader. I stumbled out of TPM completely nonplussed (as well as mournful for a ruined youth). Apparently Vader is a mentally challenged creepy kid. At least Clones had the clone wars and Anakin crossing over to the dark side. And Coruscant assassins.

 

[PdotMichael]

Someone is in denial if they think the prequels aren't the poster boy for commerce over art.

We are talking about Star Wars here. Of course, it's commerce. The prequels are full of stuff which only exist to sell toys.

 

[Schlorgan]

Isn't clones the one where they say m'lady like 30,000 times? That one is worse.

"Don't look at me like that; it makes me feel uncomfortable."

"Sorry, m'lady."

*keeps looking at her like that*

We are talking about Star Wars here. Of course, it's commerce. The prequels are full of stuff which only exist to sell toys.

I completely agree with you. That person is either trolling or crazy.

 

[Neff]

Both are fantastic.

The Force Awakens.

Yeah, I'll go with this.