Who wants Nintendo to fail?
- Thread starter missAran
- Start date
are you equating faliling with leaving the hardware business? they could leave the hardware business and could still be profitable producing just software.
though i dont think nintendo would fare very well as a 3rd party publisher for sony/ms. nintendo is better off staying in the hardware race, they have the fanbase they could live off of.
though i dont think nintendo would fare very well as a 3rd party publisher for sony/ms. nintendo is better off staying in the hardware race, they have the fanbase they could live off of.
Catchpenny
Member
Belfast said:
Want to explain how? I seriously can't see how the Eyetoy, even a more advanced one, would be used to control almost any standard game of today, not without other peripherals and a controller. Nor do I see the compelling interest in doing so. It's a fun little device where you can look goofy on the TV screen for a while, and scan your face to have it mapped onto a character. Camera control is an extremely gimped version of VR.
Yes, and it's already more successful than the Eyetoy. Thanks for making my point.
Nintendo has been in the gaming industry longer. We could take a look at Sony's non-gaming failures and gimmicks, if you want.
The Eyetoy has been out a year and relies SOLELY on mini-games. I would say what you can do with the touchscreen is already deeper than that, and it has a ton of potential when it comes to strategy games, RPGs, FPS and so forth. Advance Wars isn't a mini-game. Yoshi Touch & Go isn't a mini-game.
My one DS playing experience was at a kiosk that was running the Metroid Hunters demo, and didn't have a stylus. Wanna guess how I controlled it?
Funny that you mention the mouse, though. There are a lot of PC games that are controlled primarily with it! Can't say I know of too many that are controlled by webcam, though.
Despite the fact that a lot of PCs have cams.Che said:
No I am not. Zelda 64 is one of the most overrated gams ever. It is good, but not THAT good. And bored the hell out of me, the endless running across fields got boring fast and the dungeons weren't that great either. Majora's Mask was better.
Metroid Prime was just dull, I am sorry, everyone who disagrees is just plain wrong. Though the warping effects own.
Mario 64 was the very first mind numbing collectathon, sure it has it's one or two moments of genius, but most of the game was just boring.
Catchpenny said:Want to explain how? I seriously can't see how the Eyetoy, even a more advanced one, would be used to control almost any standard game of today, not without other peripherals and a controller. Nor do I see the compelling interest in doing so. It's a fun little device where you can look goofy on the TV screen for a while, and scan your face to have it mapped onto a character. Camera control is an extremely gimped version of VR.
Yes, and it's already more successful than the Eyetoy. Thanks for making my point.
Nintendo has been in the gaming industry longer. We could take a look at Sony's non-gaming failures and gimmicks, if you want.
The Eyetoy has been out a year and relies SOLELY on mini-games. I would say what you can do with the touchscreen is already deeper than that, and it has a ton of potential when it comes to strategy games, RPGs, FPS and so forth. Advance Wars isn't a mini-game. Yoshi Touch & Go isn't a mini-game.
My one DS playing experience was at a kiosk that was running the Metroid Hunters demo, and didn't have a stylus. Wanna guess how I controlled it?
Funny that you mention the mouse, though. There are a lot of PC games that are controlled primarily with it! Can't say I know of too many that are controlled by webcam, though.
Your whole argument hinges on the idea that Eyetoy and the DS are comparable. I don't even know why I'm getting into an argument about this. One is an accessory, the other is a stand-alone unit. You do realize how stupid this argument is? But I'll bite anyway.
The eyetoy is a forerunner for future VR, that's what I'm getting at. You may not be standing in front of a camera or anything in the future (and this is far, far in the future, I'm not talking in a gen or two), but you'll be able to use full-body motion to control things. VR, as a concept, has been around for awhile now, but the technology was never there to make it reliable enough or very fun. The Eyetoy is just that small little thing in the beginning which could allow people to begin re-evaluating and reconditioning VR for future, popular use. The touchscreen, on the other hand, is tech we already have in a reliable form. The eyetoy does rely on mini-games mostly, and that has me very disappointed. I guess there's Anti-Grav and maybe some Japanese games, but that's about it. However, once again an accessory relying on mini-games is one thing, a full unit relying on them is something completely different. Will all games for the DS be mini-games? I hope not, but we do not yet know the quality of these games. Perhaps they will be good, but perhaps they will only be fun for a couple hours before the novelty wears off, perhaps they will suck.
I brought up the mouse as a rough analogy, but lets not bring PC gaming into this. We're already stretching it far enough comparing the Eyetoy and the DS.
Agent X
Member
Catchpenny said:
EyeToy: Play
EyeToy: Groove
MLB 2005
Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban
Tony Hawk's Underground 2
Get on Da Mic
Dance Dance Revolution Extreme
Nicktoons Movin'
Sega Superstars
Gretzky NHL 2005
EyeToy: AntiGrav
The Urbz: Sims in the City
World Championship Poker
Those are just US games. There are also several other EyeToy-compatible games that haven't been released in the US, like EyeToy: Play 2 and SingStar.
Catchpenny said:
Apples and oranges.
Sony is supporting the EyeToy--5 of the 12 games above are by Sony. Keep in mind that the EyeToy is a peripheral; it's an optional accessory. Nintendo DS, on the other hand is an entire system. You can release PS2 games that don't utilize the EyeToy, but any piece of software that comes out on a DS card "supports the DS" merely by nature of being released on the platform.
Catchpenny said:
Uh, could it be because the DS is a system? See above.
Also, I'd say that the quality of developer support of the EyeToy has generally been more judicious than most of the DS library so far. EyeToy features in games tend to be designed with the functionality of the EyeToy in mind. On the other hand, most DS games so far look like they tacked on use of the second screen "because it is there" and are not really adding anything worthwhile to the gameplay that you couldn't do on other contemporary systems. The applications of the second screen on the DS are still nebulous, but it's clear what the EyeToy can bring to the table.
Catchpenny said:
While most of the EyeToy applications so far have been for mini-games or photographing your face, we're now starting to see full-scale games like EyeToy: AntiGrav.
radioheadrule83
Banned
I gotta agree with you on Eyetoy. Its a good thing. Eyetoy and Singstar both came out of Sony's UK depts IIRC. We've been getting em first, and I've been enjoying what I've been able to play... These things and Donkey Konga on Gamecube are just out and out fun with other people. DDR too actually.
Lest we forget Nintendo was planning a new camera (and may still be). I'd like to see their take on it this gen or next.
With your DS comments.. hmm I dunno. I think the DS is great too. You say the second screen stuff just seems slapped on sometimes, but we are looking at first gen software. Plus even if its just Touchscreen + Game-Screen... they're both being used there. And they aren't DS' only abilities... aside from the potential new software stylus control brings, there's the built in microphone and wireless protocols they have going. It should get really good next year when the right people start making the right things for it...
Lest we forget Nintendo was planning a new camera (and may still be). I'd like to see their take on it this gen or next.
With your DS comments.. hmm I dunno. I think the DS is great too. You say the second screen stuff just seems slapped on sometimes, but we are looking at first gen software. Plus even if its just Touchscreen + Game-Screen... they're both being used there. And they aren't DS' only abilities... aside from the potential new software stylus control brings, there's the built in microphone and wireless protocols they have going. It should get really good next year when the right people start making the right things for it...
SantaC
Member
SomeDude said:
NES overrated? That's stretching it. My best gaming memories are from NES. It's nothing strange that it had the most showelware when it was the dominating console.
Of course you can look back today and say NES was overrated, but back in the 80s it had the best games available.
Catchpenny
Member
Belfast said:
You were the one who started comparing them back on page 3. I merely replied. And you say that the touchscreen is the main appeal of the DS.
Belfast said:
Think you might be interacting with objects on the screen via touch at that point in the future?
My point is that the Eyetoy is about as close to that sort of interaction as the DS touchscreen is. But the DS touchscreen has more functionality today than the Eyetoy does.
AgentX said:
Five games in a year compared to how many Nintendo-published games coming for DS? I covered the add-on/new system argument in my last post...analog control is an example of a control-based add-on that was very successful. If the Eyetoy is so promising, where is the industry support? If the PS3 comes with an Eyetoy packed in, do you think it would be used more than the touchscreen on the DS? I don't.
AgentX said:
Most DS games to date use the touchscreen, and use it to more of an extent than games like Gretzky 2005 and Tony Hawk use the EyeToy.
I'm not dissing the Eyetoy. It's a fun device for what it is. Belfast's claim was that the Eyetoy is a precursor to something huge, while touch control is a novelty. I strongly disagree.
Catchpenny said:
No, you won't be touching things in the future. That would require some kind of stationary object for tactile support. It would not allow the same level of full freedom of movement. Unless you want to get into creating tactile forcefields, but that's a whole OTHER technology that we aren't even close to yet. The Eyetoy is merely the first DECENT implementation of this technology which is why its important. The touchscreen is something we already have. Its not new. Its not innovative. Its not different. And it doesn't lead to any new possibilities. Why aren't we seeing huge, full-fledged games on PDAs yet? Because everybody wants to play Bejeweled. And mini-games.
SomeDude said:
I don't agree with this assessment. Sure, the NES had some real crap, but there were also some really good games (in my opinion, of course).
I will readily admit that I am a little biased about this, as I consider the NES as my favorite console so far. The simplicity of the controllers... the bases of several still-popular franchises... and I still listen to BGM from a lot of NES games when I can find it (as my HD recently died and I lost everything).
Nintendo's empiric business practices from the NES era certainly can be criticized, and I can certainly understand those arguments... but I'll always have a soft spot for the games from the NES era.
soundwave05
Member
I think SomeDude is overrated. :lol
Hell no, I think we need Nintendo for the well-being of the industry... they single handedly brought back videogames from the brink. Granted their post SNES output isn't nearly as good , having not owned an N64 up until this year, I missed out on Mario 64 and Zelda, and am now replaying them. Zelda kicks ass but it's not as good as LTTP, and I actually prefer Sunshine to Mario 64 
But they still have some fresh ideas in them (I'm enjoying my DS though I will be getting a PSP) and they have so much potential... it's a shame that a lot of it is going to waste. Well, they still have the new Zelda next year, which will hopefully be amazing.
If I could see any hardware developers go away, it'd definitely be Microsoft. I don't really care for their PC products, am sickened at the thought of them trying to monopolize the video game industry (like everything else), plus their console hardware and software output do absolutely nothing for me. DOA, Star Wars RPGs, a bunch of FPS titles (a genre I can't stand playing) and maybe a few obscure games that may or may not be good... just isn't worth the $150 for me.
But they still have some fresh ideas in them (I'm enjoying my DS though I will be getting a PSP) and they have so much potential... it's a shame that a lot of it is going to waste. Well, they still have the new Zelda next year, which will hopefully be amazing.If I could see any hardware developers go away, it'd definitely be Microsoft. I don't really care for their PC products, am sickened at the thought of them trying to monopolize the video game industry (like everything else), plus their console hardware and software output do absolutely nothing for me. DOA, Star Wars RPGs, a bunch of FPS titles (a genre I can't stand playing) and maybe a few obscure games that may or may not be good... just isn't worth the $150 for me.
Every game with Mario in the title isn't a Mario game, let alone citing the same game more than once. If we are to include games in which mario is used to introduce a different game, then I don't see your point.
I love it. Anything Nintendo does? It's been done. Sony makes a peanutbutter sandwich? Insight into the future of cuisine.
Xbox live? Online gaming is something we already have. Its not new. Its not innovative. Its not different. And it doesn't lead to any new possibilities. Why aren't we seeing huge, full-fledged games on Xbox live yet?
Psp? Handhelds are something we already have. Its not new. Its not innovative. Its not different. And it doesn't lead to any new possibilities. Why aren't we seeing huge, full-fledged games on psp yet? Xbox/xbox2? Ps2/ps3? Console gaming is something we already have. Its not new. Its not innovative. Its not different. And it doesn't lead to any new possibilities.
I can play the game as well.
Suppose I grant you that. Then what damn progressive/innovative/special about the psp/ps2/xbox live? You have a double standard when it comes to Nintendo.
I love it. Anything Nintendo does? It's been done. Sony makes a peanutbutter sandwich? Insight into the future of cuisine.
Xbox live? Online gaming is something we already have. Its not new. Its not innovative. Its not different. And it doesn't lead to any new possibilities. Why aren't we seeing huge, full-fledged games on Xbox live yet?
Psp? Handhelds are something we already have. Its not new. Its not innovative. Its not different. And it doesn't lead to any new possibilities. Why aren't we seeing huge, full-fledged games on psp yet? Xbox/xbox2? Ps2/ps3? Console gaming is something we already have. Its not new. Its not innovative. Its not different. And it doesn't lead to any new possibilities.
I can play the game as well.
Man.. this ballooned into something bigger than I thought. Anyway let me catch up.
The worst kind of fanboy is not one who mindlessly praises a company -- this is just a matter of opinion. But mindlessly disliking a company beecause it is a competitor of the one you prefer is terrible, without taste, and ridiculous.
Can you get me a high-resolution picture of this?ManaByte said:
Nintendo may have different roots but Nintendo's roots are entirely in videogames whereas Sony and Microsoft has other clear investments. Videogames don't mean much to them except for another profitable branch, to Nintendo, videogames are EVERYTHING. Nintendo merely can't drop videogames and continue on as a successful electronic developer or as a software developer like Sony and Microsoft can. Still failing to see?Belfast said:
This is the truth. Anyone who disagreeds doesn't like videogames. Everyone here should want DS to do well, GCN to do well, and Nintendo to do well. On the same token, no one should wish the demise of anything Microsoft or Sony related. Simple.Amir0x said:
The worst kind of fanboy is not one who mindlessly praises a company -- this is just a matter of opinion. But mindlessly disliking a company beecause it is a competitor of the one you prefer is terrible, without taste, and ridiculous.
SomeDude said:
Considering the large spike in the popularity of video gaming during the 32/64-bit era, it's very likely that the N64 outsold the SNES-- although the N64 was beaten like a government mule by the PlayStation in terms of units sold during the same era.
IMO, the 32/64-bit era was also the real beginning of the "mature games movement", when blood, gore, and other controversial content became not only prevalent, but preferred by the majority.
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The touchscreen is something we already have. Its not new. Its not innovative. Its not different. And it doesn't lead to any new possibilities.
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The touch screen was an excellent idea. Not genre breaking revolutionary cream my pants stuff, but does some things very well. Basically gives mouse like control over everything, which can only be good. Breaks ground in being able to offer a different style of games that will have great control like RTS's and FPS. Too bad nothing out the gate really showcases this.
But that and the Dual Screen idea doesn't make up for the fact that the hardware already feels obsolete. It doesn't make up for the lack of an analogue stick. I've played all the launch games and I can already feel its limits. It's the reason for all of these threads...they f'ed up again and it's easy to see. Even if you love the DS, it's easy to see what it cannot do and what the PSP can. It's going to be interesting to see what happens in March.
It's not about being unique and innovative. It's about giving people what they want. Dudes at Nintendo were thinking N64, dual screens and a stylus. Sony was thinking a kick ass screen, movie/music playing, and PS2 quality. Who got it right?
If Nintendo does fail you can't say it's not deserved. Other companies are looking at what people want and delivering it, while Nintendo is continuing to go the more niche route. Not as bad as Sega, but it's getting very close.
The touchscreen is something we already have. Its not new. Its not innovative. Its not different. And it doesn't lead to any new possibilities.
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The touch screen was an excellent idea. Not genre breaking revolutionary cream my pants stuff, but does some things very well. Basically gives mouse like control over everything, which can only be good. Breaks ground in being able to offer a different style of games that will have great control like RTS's and FPS. Too bad nothing out the gate really showcases this.
But that and the Dual Screen idea doesn't make up for the fact that the hardware already feels obsolete. It doesn't make up for the lack of an analogue stick. I've played all the launch games and I can already feel its limits. It's the reason for all of these threads...they f'ed up again and it's easy to see. Even if you love the DS, it's easy to see what it cannot do and what the PSP can. It's going to be interesting to see what happens in March.
It's not about being unique and innovative. It's about giving people what they want. Dudes at Nintendo were thinking N64, dual screens and a stylus. Sony was thinking a kick ass screen, movie/music playing, and PS2 quality. Who got it right?
If Nintendo does fail you can't say it's not deserved. Other companies are looking at what people want and delivering it, while Nintendo is continuing to go the more niche route. Not as bad as Sega, but it's getting very close.
Well, I wouldn't shed a tear if they were completely erased from the map. But the truth of the matter is that I haven't bought a system from them since the SNES. They basically became irrelevant long ago.
Now as a tribute to classic GA, how about I revive one of my old campaigns?
"Encourage Nintendo to improve themselves: BOYCOTT THEM!"
Now as a tribute to classic GA, how about I revive one of my old campaigns?
"Encourage Nintendo to improve themselves: BOYCOTT THEM!"
DJ Demon J
Banned
Belfast said:
IAW....wait, is that acronym allowed anymore?
OneFiftyOne
Member
Insertia said:
You'd better quit posting this shit, man. Nintendo is supposed to be irrelevant; didn't you know that?
Kanbee-san
Member
I dont actually hate nintendo, but the frothing fanboys make me want to kill someone.
I never liked nintendo much and always preffered sega. Its just like being gay, you dont chose to be gay..... you just are.
I never liked nintendo much and always preffered sega. Its just like being gay, you dont chose to be gay..... you just are.
Kanbee-san
Member
lockii said:
My sarcasm detector just overloaded. It wasnt a joke.