thismeinteil
Member
Good competition is good for the industry. We don't need to continue to prop up a failing brand just for the sake of competition. Besides, Sony already has competition from PC and Nintendo.
If competition is good for the industry, why does everyone want Xbox to fail?
- Thread starter DR3AM
- Start date
Dorfdad
Gold Member
the want their team they backed to win, so they can feel better about themselves and that they were right. If Microsoft was to die an ENORMOUS hole in gaming would be gone. They own the biggest and most beloved franchises for a TON of gamers. Imagine No Halo, COD, Forza, GEARS, Diablo, WOW, etc...
I think most people want the console and system to die and that Microsoft goes third party. I want a revised emphasis on POWER from Microsoft. They are capable of making a great console and tech, and would ensure Sony continues to innovate. I feel the PS6 has already stepped back their R&D based on no competition for the high end. We will get a PRO 1.5 as the PS6 now instead of a 2x system IMHO.
Think slight spec bump
I think most people want the console and system to die and that Microsoft goes third party. I want a revised emphasis on POWER from Microsoft. They are capable of making a great console and tech, and would ensure Sony continues to innovate. I feel the PS6 has already stepped back their R&D based on no competition for the high end. We will get a PRO 1.5 as the PS6 now instead of a 2x system IMHO.
Think slight spec bump
Hector Hall
Member
Xbox has been in the red for 25 years now.
It doesn't matter how much they gross, they spend more.
After the last data, MS Gaming right now grosses are inferior to what the sum of Xbox, Zenimax and ABK would have been prior to the buyouts.
If now MS has more development power is because they hace spent 80 billion dollars in those buyouts.
The value is subjective. If you give all for 1 dollar the perceived value is very low. In any case, gamers have opted for buying games, not rentals with GP.
Ar¢tos
Member
If there is no jump in tech, consumers won't buy it. They obviously need to make the system the best they can even if there is no competition, otherwise people will just stick to their PS5s and won't upgrade.
Nydius
Member
Maybe a hot take (or just a lukewarm one), but I don't think the gaming industry can realistically support three hardware players. Look back at the last 50 years.
Until PlayStation came on the scene, gaming was almost always a duopoly. Atari 2600/Intellivision. Atari 5200/Colecovision. Nintendo/Sega. A few other companies tried venturing in with products (TurboGrafix, Neo-Geo, Atari again) and couldn't make any headway. PlayStation's entry into the market was the death knell for Sega, who floundered to compete and made multiple missteps. Then, briefly, we had just Nintendo/PlayStation until Microsoft decided to try.
Xbox isn't competitive outside of North America and the UK and even there they've been losing ground since the back half of the X360 generation. In the rest of the world, console gaming is already a duopoly between Nintendo and Sony.
It's not so much "wanting" Xbox to fail as it's simply a natural market correction. The only reason they have been able to stay around as long as they have is thanks to their parent company's very deep pockets.
Until PlayStation came on the scene, gaming was almost always a duopoly. Atari 2600/Intellivision. Atari 5200/Colecovision. Nintendo/Sega. A few other companies tried venturing in with products (TurboGrafix, Neo-Geo, Atari again) and couldn't make any headway. PlayStation's entry into the market was the death knell for Sega, who floundered to compete and made multiple missteps. Then, briefly, we had just Nintendo/PlayStation until Microsoft decided to try.
Xbox isn't competitive outside of North America and the UK and even there they've been losing ground since the back half of the X360 generation. In the rest of the world, console gaming is already a duopoly between Nintendo and Sony.
It's not so much "wanting" Xbox to fail as it's simply a natural market correction. The only reason they have been able to stay around as long as they have is thanks to their parent company's very deep pockets.
Hector Hall
Member
Microsoft is a company with very little talent. They didn't even make MS-Dos, but bought it and changed it's name from QDOS to MS Dos. That's just so you see how innovative they have always been. Windows was also a steal as proved on court, and has been shite since late 2000s to be frank. Windows Phone, Zune, internet explorer or Edge now, their handling of Skype, Messenger, Xbox well you get the idea.
They basically have a golden touch but on the inverse, they ruin most of what they touch.
Yet with the Windows and Office monopoly and now with Azure and servers , AI etc they remain massively rich. They just can't do anything right aside those activities they have been first on or could buy their position into.
Having them as competency to Sony and Nintendo as this ultra rich behemoth that is always chasing after you was somewhat useful to keep them focused. But as long as it just "was there", a clear third wheel, the Art Garfunkel of video games.
But when it started to use the MS matrix money not just to cover losses but to buy whole publishers, destroy phisical market to turn everything "gloriously digital", and specifically tried to undermine the Premium market with their GP strategy, it turned themselves into a menace that many are somewhat relieved to see failing.
Now they will build gaming PCs with some Xbox stickers and boot screens and to revamp Games for Windows into Xbox PC. Sooner or later they will be competing for the PC gaming money and royalties with Valve, that won't gain them much love either.
They basically have a golden touch but on the inverse, they ruin most of what they touch.
Yet with the Windows and Office monopoly and now with Azure and servers , AI etc they remain massively rich. They just can't do anything right aside those activities they have been first on or could buy their position into.
Having them as competency to Sony and Nintendo as this ultra rich behemoth that is always chasing after you was somewhat useful to keep them focused. But as long as it just "was there", a clear third wheel, the Art Garfunkel of video games.
But when it started to use the MS matrix money not just to cover losses but to buy whole publishers, destroy phisical market to turn everything "gloriously digital", and specifically tried to undermine the Premium market with their GP strategy, it turned themselves into a menace that many are somewhat relieved to see failing.
Now they will build gaming PCs with some Xbox stickers and boot screens and to revamp Games for Windows into Xbox PC. Sooner or later they will be competing for the PC gaming money and royalties with Valve, that won't gain them much love either.
rodrigolfp
Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
Because 2 are enough. PC + 1 console.
Fess
Member
Everybody? It's just fanboys invested too much on other platforms.
At this point new Xbox related sprouts are popping up all over the place. I wouldn't worry about it going anywhere. I'd be more worried about it spreading too fast. Seems like they've studied how invasive plants survive when you try cutting them down…
At this point new Xbox related sprouts are popping up all over the place. I wouldn't worry about it going anywhere. I'd be more worried about it spreading too fast. Seems like they've studied how invasive plants survive when you try cutting them down…
Kataploom
Gold Member
And also Xbox? What's the problem? PC is more expensive so many people will prefer consoles, and they may prefer Xbox for different reasons like controller, Game Pass, UI, whatever and not give a shit about Sony exclusives.
yet_another_alt
Member
They introduced paid online. So in the spirit of competition, Sony and Nintendo joined in as well. Thanks Microsoft.
lastmessiah
Member
Microsoft has already done everything that GAF wanted. They are going 3rd party and their next "console" is actually a "PC".
And yet they still don't seem pleased
.
And yet they still don't seem pleased
.
cinnamonandgravy
Member
just fun watching xbox fall down the stairs again and again
dont want them to die though
dont want them to die though
diffusionx
Gold Member
Is Microsoft good for the industry?
They seem to be a parasite that gobbles up developers and releases middling games, while trying to get people to use their value-destroying subscription service.
They seem to be a parasite that gobbles up developers and releases middling games, while trying to get people to use their value-destroying subscription service.
Xbox 360 slim
Member
Like how playstation is memberrries for you, because you got a PS1 in 1997?
Gambit2483
Member
How well did Xbox really do this generation?
Take away every Bethesda/ Activision game from their slate and there's your real answer. They did jack shit this generation. Reminder, Fable is STILL showing PRE-ALPHA footage (all 53 seconds of it). That's what Failure looks like.
Take away every Bethesda/ Activision game from their slate and there's your real answer. They did jack shit this generation. Reminder, Fable is STILL showing PRE-ALPHA footage (all 53 seconds of it). That's what Failure looks like.
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Xbox 360 slim
Member
They're just taking after their cult leaders, sony. Who moneyhatted sega out of business, even refused to give PS2 devkits to devs who were making dreamcast games. Always funny hearing sony fanboys cry about "Xbox is anti-comp". Sony has been following the same business strat since the 90s. Moneyhat all the comp out of business, they thought they did it too. And that's why we got a 600 dollar PS3, with barely any launch games.
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BlackTron
Member
Sorry this post just seems a bit disingenuous...
Likewise it's MS that blessed us with a fee to play multiplayer games you already purchased on a console. Whatever obscure online service or function you are thinking of, it's not what we mean when we say "paid online", it's that. Xbox used their 15 minutes of fame with software like Halo to normalize paid online, if there's any silver lining maybe Sony and Nintendo will be more rewarded than them for it.
This feels like saying N64 didn't do the analog stick first because of Atari or arcade versions from before...but we know when someone says "they did analog first" they mean analog thumb stick design in a handle and the rest is getting into semantics.
Likewise it's MS that blessed us with a fee to play multiplayer games you already purchased on a console. Whatever obscure online service or function you are thinking of, it's not what we mean when we say "paid online", it's that. Xbox used their 15 minutes of fame with software like Halo to normalize paid online, if there's any silver lining maybe Sony and Nintendo will be more rewarded than them for it.
Forced MTX is kind of a throwaway line, but uh yeah again DRM. Depends on the context. There is online DRM for ereaders...whatever...we're talking about video games. You can't un-see the 2013 E3 where Xbox was lambasted for all their draconian DRM decisions whereupon Sony trolled them with "how to share your game on PS4". It was so bad that MS had to walk back many decisions (only to slowly move back in the direction of their dream world step by careful step in the years since). Again Xbox is a trailblazer not for making great games but making the status quo worse.
My death is inevitable so we may as well get it over with.
It's apparent he is blaming MS for making a choice bad for gaming not for being the first ever to make that choice. They do have a habit of buying up assets, firing everyone and keeping the IPs. Has Sony done it before -yes. With MS it's a cancer that spreads every other Wednesday.
BlackTron
Member
I didn't get a PS1 in 1997, and back then I hated them "for killing Sega", though I have to respect their accomplishments today (I suffer through the controller design that I can't stand to play quite a few PS games). It is true Sony seems to be losing the plot the last few years but they still have plenty of wiggle room for penance and have contributed far more to the overall good of gaming than MS cancer.
I feel bad because I love Halo but you can't coast on past accomplishments and good will forever.
Aenima
Member
MS turn to shit everething they touch. Xbox was one of they best efforts that brought some positive and negative things to the videogame industry. The only good competition they provided was forcing Sony to also be competitive, but that changed the moment they started purchasing big publishers with the intension to "spend Sony out of business". It did not work, cuz to recoup all the billions they wasted they were forced to go 3rd party as they domisticated they fanbase to not purchase games with the gamepass renting service they pushed the entire Series S/X gen.
I bailed out of MS consoles after they killed the OG Xbox in 4 years, i already knew MS dosent give a shit about they player base. They did a good job during the X360 gen, but then again proved me i was right with the following gens.
After the big publisher aquisitions, all i wanted was MS to fail and fuck off out of the console business. But going 3rd party is fine for me. They just have to start making good games, cuz outside Forza Horizon, they still delivers more misses than hits.
I bailed out of MS consoles after they killed the OG Xbox in 4 years, i already knew MS dosent give a shit about they player base. They did a good job during the X360 gen, but then again proved me i was right with the following gens.
After the big publisher aquisitions, all i wanted was MS to fail and fuck off out of the console business. But going 3rd party is fine for me. They just have to start making good games, cuz outside Forza Horizon, they still delivers more misses than hits.
Xbox 360 slim
Member
All of these compete in the same market. Set-top, powerful consoles, that can play modern AAA games at 60+fps, is Xbox and PS. Which is the "duopoly" you have right now. Even sony agrees that Nintendo isn't comp, because Nintendo does it's own thing and is it's own market.
Xbox 360 slim
Member
Which is why cloud saves are free on steam and Xbox, but paywalled on PS? Wait a minute...
Xbox 360 slim
Member
Most of these are on PC and DS2 will be on PC eventually as well...
Hero_Select
Member
Did you see those leaked sales from their biggest franchises? Lol, they can't afford it. Their best selling Sonic game couldn't even hit 5 million despite their games being available everywhere
Crayon
Member
This has been my number one issue for a long, long time. This and the related brand of "outreach" as it's evolved over the years.
Geometric-Crusher
"Nintendo games are like indies, and worth at most $19" 🤡
Persona almost 8 million , you only saw what you wanted to see.Did you see those leaked sales from their biggest franchises? Lol, they can't afford it. Their best selling Sonic game couldn't even hit 5 million despite their games being available everywhere
franchises whose popularity reaches 3,4,5,8 million are more than enough to sustain a platform in the market.
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Sooner
Member
There's a lot less green in that chart now.
Gambit2483
Member
Safe to say no more brunches in Xbox's future...?
Crayon
Member
Not at all. It's a whole culture they've been working on for 20 years. If nothing else, it would go on without input from ms just on momentum for quite a while.
Gambit2483
Member
UltimaKilo
Gold Member
Not "most" at all. If Microsoft were to buy Ubisoft and force them to make good games again, "most" people would love that. MS problem is that they are directionless and have a moron at the helm.
That being said, this is quietly their best gen since X360.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
I didn't want XBox to fail really, but I wanted them to change direction long ago. Instead they came into the market, did some pretty cool stuff, then just corporate-bullshitted there way through the last 2.5 gens with bad decision after bad decision.
For the last few years they've just been trying to market-disrupt by spending 10's of billions to acquire devs, feed GamePass or try to make fetch/cloud gaming a thing.
Market disruptors kinda suck in the long run for consumers. Especially when it's a big company that got their trillions from decades of anti-competitive behavior and "in at the right time"-ness. They are nto your friend, they didn't let that GamePass loophoole exist for years so you could get a good deal.. they are trying to make game subs the primary form of how consumers consume games, and trying to become the largest so they can keep you around when price hikes happen.
For the last few years they've just been trying to market-disrupt by spending 10's of billions to acquire devs, feed GamePass or try to make fetch/cloud gaming a thing.
Market disruptors kinda suck in the long run for consumers. Especially when it's a big company that got their trillions from decades of anti-competitive behavior and "in at the right time"-ness. They are nto your friend, they didn't let that GamePass loophoole exist for years so you could get a good deal.. they are trying to make game subs the primary form of how consumers consume games, and trying to become the largest so they can keep you around when price hikes happen.
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Drell
Member
Remember Microsoft Didn't create any of these franchises and just bought them. Knowing this, your argument sounds more like an hostage-taking: "If microsoft disappear, everything you love will too". But the truth is that all the creative heads behind all these franchises fled from their studios as soon as MS bougt them and since then, most of their sequels are bad. So yeah, I'd rather for MS to fail, have all these franchises disappear and see some good spiritual successor not cursed by MS shitty management.
It's litterally just Gaf bro… that's it
Gambit2483
Member
No one is "hoping and praying" Xbox goes away.
We are merely all watching their slow and steady transition into a 3rd party digital only quasi-hardware brand/entity.
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Rhazer Fusion
Member
Actually, gamers were not buying games long before Gamepass. Mass Effect Collection, FF15 and MGS5 to name a few for example sold much worst on XBox compared to the PlayStation versions. The ratio was something like 20/80 in sales for both consoles with the percentage favoring the PlayStation.
JayK47
Member
I don't know. Every week someone posts how low their hardware sales are and how that must mean the end is near. Not to mention the endless "they do not know what the fuck they are doing" posts about management there, because people here know better.
Personally, I do not care what happens to them. I can't remember the last time I wanted to play an Xbox game. If I didn't love Xbox controllers, I wouldn't have anything good to say about them. I just tire of the endless Xbox doom threads being posted around here like Sony and Nintendo's shit doesn't stink.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
Valid point and I definitely understand that, but this has been going on long before Gamepass even existed and it's still going on for games that have never even been on the service. For example, FF16 which is a major release that only sold 22,000 copies and it's not on Gamepass. PS5 version sold over 3 million copies in a few days. I know it's a later port, but that's absolutely abysmal. Let's see how Black Myth Wukong does on XBOX. I don't think they will buy that either unfortunately. Games like Lies of P, Wuchang and Ninja Gaiden are day one on Gamepass which is great and all, but even the companies know none of those games are going to sell well on XBOX.
PlayStation has a similar subscription service to Gamepass while not quite as good, but PlayStation owners still buy games even with a subscription service that provides something similar to what XBOX offers.
KimDongHwan
Member
Competition is good, but Microsoft was like the first (don't quote me on this) in bringing almost all the bad practices for gaming we see today, because they ultimately are looking at gaming as any other business they own, while Sony and Nintendo literally had CEOs or presidents that were developers, programmers or general gamers. So Microsoft in particular doing well almost always will mean more of this business driven game development
Valonquar
Member
Honestly I don't feel like Xbox competed with either Nintendo nor Sony. I also don't feel like Nintendo and Sony are direct competitors. Being a "gamer" these days is too broad a term.
The markets for all 3 consoles have intersections sometimes, but largely everyone picks the system based on the particular exclusives give them the good feels. Xbox had PC as a direct competitor for the same games. PC nearly always performed better, with all the mods, and whatnot you also get from PC and without needing to pay extra to be online. So if you already have a PC with a graphics card from this decade, buying an Xbox is kinda dumb. PC + Nintendo or Sony just makes more sense. .
The markets for all 3 consoles have intersections sometimes, but largely everyone picks the system based on the particular exclusives give them the good feels. Xbox had PC as a direct competitor for the same games. PC nearly always performed better, with all the mods, and whatnot you also get from PC and without needing to pay extra to be online. So if you already have a PC with a graphics card from this decade, buying an Xbox is kinda dumb. PC + Nintendo or Sony just makes more sense. .
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
I'm tired, boss.