Splatoon |OT| Squidstyler

Did they add new colors (or different shades of the same color) to the game with the new ranked battles? Some of them look new to me, but that might be my tv.
 
Zemm said:
This game has the most baffling game design decisions I've ever seen. It has such a good foundation then gets shit on by forcing you to play with 200-300 latency, only being able to play two maps every 4 hours, random attributes on gear, and so on.
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My general feeling as well. The base gameplay is so good and fresh, like the demo they had at E3 or the testfires, but then there's everything else slathered on top. It's a total mismatch.

The biggest overall problem is randomness and lack of choice. Take the 4 hour 2 map scheme. Why is it here? Why not just let us play the map we want to play or at least have all maps in the rotation? Because then you'd get what you want. When the next 2 maps come up and they're not what you wanted do you put the game down? No, you'll more likely play those maps, possibly for a shorter duration, then you'll be left wanting the maps you didn't play giving you manufactured incentive to come back.

It's the same for gear. The shops add some* (if you don't buy one it doesn't get replaced it seems like) new gear every 24 hours, randomly chosen of course. When will you get the hat with the main perk you want? Who knows, come back tomorrow maybe you'll get lucky. This wouldn't be so bad in a game like Animal Crossing, I know a lot of posters like to remind us that this game is made by the AC team. In an online shooter though a random allocation of perks is bad design. A few players might get exactly what they want, but everyone else is left hoping they'll stumble across that fabled gear. And then you have to deal with random sub-perks and re-rolling (though the Judd/Spyke glitch deals with that nicely, I hope that doesn't get patched).

I believe the gameplay is good enough to stand on its own, the manipulative systems are unnecessary and only add frustration to the experience.

There is more to cover. Much much more, but I don't have the time. Despite all of the poor design decisions and shortcomings I still enjoy the game (as expected). I'd rather be playing than typing up an analysis.
 
superbank said:
It's the same for gear. The shops add some* (if you don't buy one it doesn't get replaced it seems like) new gear every 24 hours, randomly chosen of course. When will you get the hat with the main perk you want? Who knows, come back tomorrow maybe you'll get lucky. This wouldn't be so bad in a game like Animal Crossing, I know a lot of posters like to remind us that this game is made by the AC team. In an online shooter though a random allocation of perks is bad design. A few players might get exactly what they want, but everyone else is left hoping they'll stumble across that fabled gear.
Click to expand...

There are chances that other players on the plaza wear the gear you want, then order from Spyke. There are much fewer pieces of gear than in Animal Crossing, you can get them all quite fast even with the random shops.
 
I don't know why people are so stressed about getting the exact perks they want. So far I've just been buying the gear that looks good. Even been using some 1 or 2 star gear because it looks better than the 3 star gear I've got available. All perks seem rather useful and between ordering stuff in the plaza and the shops I can't imagine it will take long to find the loadouts you want.
 
PotionBleue said:
There are chances that other players on the plaza wear the gear you want, then order from Spyke. There are much fewer pieces of gear than in Animal Crossing, you can get them all quite fast even with the random shops.
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I am aware of the ordering system. The point is that you have to jump through hoops laid out by the designer instead of having instant access to abilities that effect online multiplayer. How many pieces of gear are there?
 
superbank said:
My general feeling as well. The base gameplay is so good and fresh, like the demo they had at E3 or the testfires, but then there's everything else slathered on top. It's a total mismatch.

The biggest overall problem is randomness and lack of choice. Take the 4 hour 2 map scheme. Why is it here? Why not just let us play the map we want to play or at least have all maps in the rotation? Because then you'd get what you want. When the next 2 maps come up and they're not what you wanted do you put the game down? No, you'll more likely play those maps, possibly for a shorter duration, then you'll be left wanting the maps you didn't play giving you manufactured incentive to come back.

It's the same for gear. The shops add some* (if you don't buy one it doesn't get replaced it seems like) new gear every 24 hours, randomly chosen of course. When will you get the hat with the main perk you want? Who knows, come back tomorrow maybe you'll get lucky. This wouldn't be so bad in a game like Animal Crossing, I know a lot of posters like to remind us that this game is made by the AC team. In an online shooter though a random allocation of perks is bad design. A few players might get exactly what they want, but everyone else is left hoping they'll stumble across that fabled gear. And then you have to deal with random sub-perks and re-rolling (though the Judd/Spyke glitch deals with that nicely, I hope that doesn't get patched).

I believe the gameplay is good enough to stand on its own, the manipulative systems are unnecessary and only add frustration to the experience.

There is more to cover. Much much more, but I don't have the time. Despite all of the poor design decisions and shortcomings I still enjoy the game (as expected). I'd rather be playing than typing up an analysis.
Click to expand...

I can tell you why they are doing the rotation. Matchmaking. They fear with the low userbase of the Wii U that users wouldn't get to get matched quickly enough, so they limited it to two maps per 4 hour slots, and random matchmaking. That way, a user is almost guaranteed a full lobby without much of a wait. If they allowed players to pick their own map, this would be harder to match players together.

As it stands, Splatoon doesn't need this, as it's playerbase is pretty large. So it's possible Nintendo is noticing that and discussing whether or not to let matchmaking be more free-form and user-driven. I think it would be worthwhile for them to go down this path in the future, especially as they add more maps, but I'm just sharing why I think they decided to go about this for launch.
 
Oh man, just had a laggy game. I was painting stuff but the colors didn't change untill seconds later. I kept getting stuck in my opponent's ink before it finally registered I painted the area.
 
superbank said:
My general feeling as well. The base gameplay is so good and fresh, like the demo they had at E3 or the testfires, but then there's everything else slathered on top. It's a total mismatch.

The biggest overall problem is randomness and lack of choice. Take the 4 hour 2 map scheme. Why is it here? Why not just let us play the map we want to play or at least have all maps in the rotation? Because then you'd get what you want. When the next 2 maps come up and they're not what you wanted do you put the game down? No, you'll more likely play those maps, possibly for a shorter duration, then you'll be left wanting the maps you didn't play giving you manufactured incentive to come back.

It's the same for gear. The shops add some* (if you don't buy one it doesn't get replaced it seems like) new gear every 24 hours, randomly chosen of course. When will you get the hat with the main perk you want? Who knows, come back tomorrow maybe you'll get lucky. This wouldn't be so bad in a game like Animal Crossing, I know a lot of posters like to remind us that this game is made by the AC team. In an online shooter though a random allocation of perks is bad design. A few players might get exactly what they want, but everyone else is left hoping they'll stumble across that fabled gear. And then you have to deal with random sub-perks and re-rolling (though the Judd/Spyke glitch deals with that nicely, I hope that doesn't get patched).

I believe the gameplay is good enough to stand on its own, the manipulative systems are unnecessary and only add frustration to the experience.

There is more to cover. Much much more, but I don't have the time. Despite all of the poor design decisions and shortcomings I still enjoy the game (as expected). I'd rather be playing than typing up an analysis.
Click to expand...

I dunno, I guess I just look at it differently. Forcing the stage choice makes you get good at every stage instead of just isolating yourself to the ones you "like." In doing so, I'd imagine a non-crazy person would grow to like pretty much all the stages. They even have tips telling you to look at the stages for the day and equip yourself appropriately, so the intent here is for you to be able to adapt to the various circumstances, not just always tailor a custom experience that you want to play. If that's all you want, wait for the August update I suppose. It makes sense to me why that's so far off. Same reason they make people get to rank 10 before moving to ranked.

I like the random equipment stuff, too. If I could build my perfect loadout right away, what am I gonna do after that? I'd rather piece it together bit by bit as I come across what suits me, getting a little better here and there. There's no point in the splat fests giving out shells as rewards if everyone has already min-maxed their shit before the fest even comes around. There's no way in hell I'm gonna touch that glitch, I really hope they patch it ASAP.

Splatoon is a journey. Put yourself together bit by bit, learn the stages as they're available, and gradually become a Super Fresh Guy. It's a lot more fun for me because they've built in that kind of progression and curation. It feels like a place, an event, not just a video game.
 
So damn, I wasn't paying attention and ordered the gas mask from Spyke. Was thinking it said it cost 3,000 but it was actually 30,000. Goddamn, is it just like a super premo item or something. It does have four slots, which none of the stuff I'm able to buy at this point has.
 
Timeaisis said:
I can tell you why they are doing the rotation. Matchmaking. They fear with the low userbase of the Wii U that users wouldn't get to get matched quickly enough, so they limited it to two maps per 4 hour slots, and random matchmaking. That way, a user is almost guaranteed a full lobby without much of a wait. If they allowed players to pick their own map, this would be harder to match players together.
Click to expand...

Don't let players pick the maps they want. Just put all of the maps in rotation. Matchmaking times would not be affected at all.

I don't understand what the thinking was behind this design.
 
Pappasman said:
Don't let players pick the maps they want. Just put all of the maps in rotation. Matchmaking times would not be affected at all.

I don't understand what the thinking was behind this design.
Click to expand...

The maps in Splatoon are basically characters in themselves. You have to learn them. You have to figure out the best way to get through them, to approach their design. The best way to get good at all this is repetition. Playing the same two maps for a good stretch of time is the only reason I've developed any kind of strategies. And it keeps individual play sessions feeling Fresh.
 
Yeah it's pretty obvious the map rotation is due to them not wanting to split everyone up between a bunch of different maps, especially considering you need 8 players to a game before they start.

The 4 hour interval is way too long though
 
Timeaisis said:
I can tell you why they are doing the rotation. Matchmaking. They fear with the low userbase of the Wii U that users wouldn't get to get matched quickly enough, so they limited it to two maps per 4 hour slots, and random matchmaking. That way, a user is almost guaranteed a full lobby without much of a wait. If they allowed players to pick their own map, this would be harder to match players together.

As it stands, Splatoon doesn't need this, as it's playerbase is pretty large. So it's possible Nintendo is noticing that and discussing whether or not to let matchmaking be more free-form and user-driven. I think it would be worthwhile for them to go down this path in the future, especially as they add more maps, but I'm just sharing why I think they decided to go about this for launch.
Click to expand...


That makes sense for the number of modes, but not for the map. They could easily put all 6 into rotation or allow you to vote and so fourth. The rotation thing has nothing to do with playerbase.

So far, I don't have a problem with the map rotation. I think when there are 10 or so maps and 3 in the rotation, it won't be a big deal.

I also think it's safe to say the 'major update' in August will address a number of gaffer issues. I expect:

-saveable custom gear load-outs (maybe switchable in-lobby?)
-ability to exit a lobby once in one
-voice chat or custom d-pad commands within custom friend matches
 
Pappasman said:
Don't let players pick the maps they want. Just put all of the maps in rotation. Matchmaking times would not be affected at all.

I don't understand what the thinking was behind this design.
Click to expand...
They said in the direct it was so you could tailor your build to those specific maps because you can't do it on the fly in the lobby

They would need to allow you to change your gear in lobby if all the maps were available. If they did that they would need to increase the time before matches.
 
Tathanen said:
I dunno, I guess I just look at it differently. Forcing the stage choice makes you get good at every stage instead of just isolating yourself to the ones you "like." In doing so, I'd imagine a non-crazy person would grow to like pretty much all the stages. They even have tips telling you to look at the stages for the day and equip yourself appropriately, so the intent here is for you to be able to adapt to the various circumstances, not just always tailor a custom experience that you want to play. If that's all you want, wait for the August update I suppose. It makes sense to me why that's so far off. Same reason they make people get to rank 10 before moving to ranked.

I like the random equipment stuff, too. If I could build my perfect loadout right away, what am I gonna do after that? I'd rather piece it together bit by bit as I come across what suits me, getting a little better here and there. There's no point in the splat fests giving out shells as rewards if everyone has already min-maxed their shit before the fest even comes around. There's no way in hell I'm gonna touch that glitch, I really hope they patch it ASAP.

Splatoon is a journey. Put yourself together bit by bit, learn the stages as they're available, and gradually become a Super Fresh Guy. It's a lot more fun for me because they've built in that kind of progression and curation. It feels like a place, an event, not just a video game.
Click to expand...
Excellent post, Tathanen.
 
Question:

Wasn't there an update recently? I'm still at 1.00 version, is that normal?

How do we trigger the update if so?
 
Pappasman said:
Don't let players pick the maps they want. Just put all of the maps in rotation. Matchmaking times would not be affected at all.

I don't understand what the thinking was behind this design.
Click to expand...

Well that we both agree on. Possibly to encourage players to get familiar with all the maps? The reasoning behind the rotation escapes me. But the lack of player selection of maps does not.
 
lol, this one made me laugh.
wiiu_screenshot_tv_0155jfp.jpg
Click to expand...
 
Tathanen said:
The maps in Splatoon are basically characters in themselves. You have to learn them. You have to figure out the best way to get through them, to approach their design. The best way to get good at all this is repetition. Playing the same two maps for a good stretch of time is the only reason I've developed any kind of strategies. And it keeps individual play sessions feeling Fresh.
Click to expand...

There aren't many maps in general though. Having all of them (or at least more than 2) wouldn't cut back on "time to learn the map".
 
Holy fuck we just managed to make a total comeback in a ranked battle. Enemy had 1 second on the clock and we outlasted them from the 20 second mark the entire way. No way to beat them in a time advantage; it was get it down to 0 or bust. So goddamn exhilarating.

Also whoever said that there was different colors - you're not just imagining it. The Ranked Battle I just played had me on a sky blue colored team. I haven't seen this one before.

Vampirolol said:
Splatoon |OT2| Prepare to Dye Edition
Click to expand...

Actually had this one in mind and I quite like it haha
 
I enjoy Ranked, as frustrating as it can be at times i've now managed to hit C after an awful run of games, however i feel it needs a little randomisation in the placement of the capture zones.
 
Pappasman said:
There aren't many maps in general though. Having all of them (or at least more than 2) wouldn't cut back on "time to learn the map".
Click to expand...

It launched with five. I think five is definitely too many to cycle through randomly if the goal is to teach via repetition. And the fact that there's ONLY five means that if they cycled between groups larger than two, there'd always be at least one map that persists between two sequential four-hour sessions. And that'd be a bit overkill.

Once the total selection increases to 7+, I can see them increasing the rotation to 3 per cycle.
 
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