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[EVH]

So I didnt play the game and don't plan to buy it but i got some questions as im reading this thread out of curiosity. I cannot hear the tapes because I don't have the game.

Why is Psycho Mantis there? Where does he come from and why?
Why is also Volgin there? He was an awesome bad guy in MGS3 and i feel he has been underused in MGS5.
Why does Big Boss build OH in MG2 if he was supossed to be the good guy?

 

[ZeroX03]

The Skulls ground raise attack is annoying. It's inconsistent in how fast it explodes, occasionally being an unavoidable kill.

 

[Zakard]

I can't express how much I disagree. Quiet like every other buddy is a gameplay mechanic, and if used correctly, then yes, she can be OP.
That doesn't mean we should justify her being taken from the player's hands like this. Some people actually intended to use her exclusively. Buddies are a mechanic, not simply or mostly story elements.
As i said before, if we are to strictly follow story, then we shouldn't be able to use buddies in missions taking place before we could originally use them, we shouldn't be able to replay boss missions, and ultimately, we shouldn't be able to select missions to replay.
But the truth is that the game is designed about replaying missions and taking different approaches each time, and removing 1/4 of the buddies is just stupid.

It is not supposed to be fair or good for the player. The player is supposed to feel angry and sad for loosing her. Loosing something important is supposed to hurt. Like I said before, Snake loosing an arm didnt impact the game in a bad way at all. So now the player can experience what "loss" means.

 

[Ushojax]

So I didnt play the game but i got some questions as im reading this thread.

Why is Psycho Mantis there? Where does he come from and why?
Why is also Volgin there? He was an awesome bad guy in MGS3 and i feel he has been underused in MGS5.
Why does Big Boss build OH in MG2 if he was supossed to be the good guy?

 

[Hasney]

So I didnt play the game but i got some questions as im reading this thread.

Why is Psycho Mantis there? Where does he come from and why?
Why is also Volgin there? He was an awesome bad guy in MGS3 and i feel he has been underused in MGS5.
Why does Big Boss build OH in MG2 if he was supossed to be the good guy?

Good questions. Maybe we'll know one day.

 

[nOoblet16]

So I didnt play the game but i got some questions as im reading this thread.

Why is Psycho Mantis there? Where does he come from and why?
Why is also Volgin there? He was an awesome bad guy in MGS3 and i feel he has been underused in MGS5.
Why does Big Boss build OH in MG2 if he was supossed to be the good guy?

Just cause....

It is not supposed to be fair or good for the player. The player is supposed to feel angry and sad for loosing her. Loosing something important is supposed to hurt. Like I said before, Snake loosing an arm didnt impact the game in a bad way at all. So now the player can experience what "loss" means.

I still think you're just overthinking it.
Gameplay comes first...especially with a game design that MGS5 has.

 

[ZeroX03]

Good questions. Maybe we'll know one day.

The answer to the first two at least are in tapes. Maybe when he buys the game he can listen in.

 

[EVH]

The answer to the first two at least are in tapes. Maybe when he buys the game he can listen in.

Do I have to buy the game to be able to ask about its plot in the internet?

 

[Lernaean]

It is not supposed to be fair or good for the player. The player is supposed to feel angry and sad for loosing her. Loosing something important is supposed to hurt. Like I said before, Snake loosing an arm didnt impact the game in a bad way at all. So now the player can experience what "loss" means.

And you lose her in the story, message delivered.
Removing a gameplay mechanic is literally gimping the gameplay, simple as that, and very counter-productive for this kind of game design.

 

[hammertomb]

So I didnt play the game but i got some questions as im reading this thread.

Why is Psycho Mantis there? Where does he come from and why?
Why is also Volgin there? He was an awesome bad guy in MGS3 and i feel he has been underused in MGS5.
Why does Big Boss build OH in MG2 if he was supossed to be the good guy?

Listen to the tapes.Its all answered there.

Edit: Boss building outer heaven isn't answered, but the rest is.

 

[ZeroX03]

Just lost on #42 because I had a penetrating bullet go through the head of a Skull and hit Code Talker in the head. I'm somewhere between amused and annoyed.

 

[GringoSuave89]

So, if I want to prevent Mission 45 from happening, I know I need the butterfly emblem on. But does that mean I can never change it?

 

[Hasney]

The answer to the first two at least are in tapes. Maybe when he buys the game he can listen in.

Well unless I'm missing something, the Psycho Mantis thing isn't really explained other than being the third child. Volgin is pretty well explained though.

 

[EVH]

So I didnt play the game and don't plan to buy it but i got some questions as im reading this thread out of curiosity. I cannot hear the tapes because I don't have the game.

Why is Psycho Mantis there? Where does he come from and why?
Why is also Volgin there? He was an awesome bad guy in MGS3 and i feel he has been underused in MGS5.
Why does Big Boss build OH in MG2 if he was supossed to be the good guy?

Maybe that way someone can answer if they know?

 

[Lernaean]

So, if I want to prevent Mission 45 from happening, I know I need the butterfly emblem on. But does that mean I can never change it?

Yes, until they get some sense and patch it at least

 

[Genryu]

Just lost on #42 because I had a penetrating bullet go through the head of a Skull and hit Code Talker in the head. I'm somewhere between amused and annoyed.

Burt is that you?

 

[GringoSuave89]

Yes, until they get some sense and patch it at least

That suuuuuucks

 

[Hasney]

Honestly need to listen to the final tapes again. Had them on in the background during sideops after playing for about 12 hours that day. I'll see if I can get the Android app working to listen to them.

Really hope if they bring Quiet back, it's a story patch/DLC. I'd hate for her to just be selectable again after that mission. Even if the patch makes her selectable, but the story DLC is still an optional purchase.

 

[Lernaean]

That suuuuuucks

I know. Probably the stupidest design choice in ages.

 

[VulpX]

Just get over it, Quiet leaving is not going to be patched. It is a very concious decision that was made. It's not as they decided "HAHAHA, let's just get rid of this buddy for story reasons!". I'm sure they had a lot of internal debate about the whole thing as well. And I do think it's done for deeper reasons like making the player feel real loss in the game.

 

[GringoSuave89]

I know. Probably the stupidest design choice in ages.

I mean, narratively it's cool and all, but I mean, even after getting the true ending you can't use her? Wtf?

The chances of it being patched is slim though. If it's narrative based, Kojima would never change it.

Spoiler

Unless he makes a sequel then he changes everything

 

[TyrantGuardian]

I can't express how much I disagree. Quiet like every other buddy is a gameplay mechanic, and if used correctly, then yes, she can be OP.
That doesn't mean we should justify her being taken from the player's hands like this. Some people actually intended to use her exclusively. Buddies are a mechanic, not simply or mostly story elements.
As i said before, if we are to strictly follow story, then we shouldn't be able to use buddies in missions taking place before we could originally use them, we shouldn't be able to replay boss missions, and ultimately, we shouldn't be able to select missions to replay.
But the truth is that the game is designed about replaying missions and taking different approaches each time, and removing 1/4 of the buddies is just stupid.

Well, there's a mechanic to avoid losing the buddy with the butterfly emblem, but I see what you're saying. I think your approach is a bit off though. Gameplay and story aren't separate entities. The thematic approach to loss is inextricably linked to you permanently losing Quiet as a buddy. It's supposed to feel like you're missing out on something, because that's what loss is. Is that a good design decision in a game so focused on high scoring and such? That's highly debatable, but again - if that's your main goal with this game then you have the option to use the butterfly emblem.

 

[Claude]

What's up with the demon ranking in this game? How does it work? Why isn't it explained in-game?

 

[Hasney]

What's up with the demon ranking in this game? How does it work? Why isn't it explained in-game?

Ha, just had that in the OT.

You can't see the demon score, but the strategy guide lays out what affects it. Building a nuke, killing enemy soldiers and being aggressive to diamond dogs and your buddies give you demon points. As they get higher and higher the horn grows. Eventually you will become Demon Snake. To get rid of demon points you need to extract wild life, (the rarer the more points it takes away) as well as children and prisoners.

I don't think something like that needs to be explained though, I like that being evil secretly increases your evil.

 

[ZeroX03]

Anyone had any experience animal catching? Any good guides?

What's up with the demon ranking in this game? How does it work? Why isn't it explained in-game?

You do more evil things, the horn grows bigger. I'm not sure it was all that necessary to explain, it's a secret thing.

 

[Papercuts]

Well, there's a mechanic to avoid losing the buddy with the butterfly emblem, but I see what you're saying. I think your approach is a bit off though. Gameplay and story aren't separate entities. The thematic approach to loss is inextricably linked to you permanently losing Quiet as a buddy. It's supposed to feel like you're missing out on something, because that's what loss is. Is that a good design decision in a game so focused on high scoring and such? That's highly debatable, but again - if that's your main goal with this game then you have the option to use the butterfly emblem.

Which is unbelievably obtuse for such a large impact, there's pretty much no way someone is going to luck their way into actually wearing this at the right moment on their first playthrough, it does nothing but ADD to the frustration that there is actually some sort of preventive measure.

So for me, I can still go back and replay/S-rank missions since I knew about this ahead of time. Other people who kept in the dark(something you typically want to do) are frustrated and have less options than I do in a gameplay sandbox where all I'm doing at this point is repeating content. It's poorly conceived and should have never made it in the final product.

In addition, the 'loss' a player feels is lopsided considering there's a good chunk of people that don't even like using Quiet. It would have been more clever and feel actually intentional if the game was using the tracked statistics to target your personal clear favorite(though ultimately I am still against losing gameplay options over something like this). Instead, the dude that always rolls with DDog is replaying everything the way they wanted anyway not caring about any loss in buddy options.

 

[Lernaean]

Just get over it, Quiet leaving is not going to be patched. It is a very concious decision that was made. It's not as they decided "HAHAHA, let's just get rid of this buddy for story reasons!". I'm sure they had a lot of internal debate about the whole thing as well. And I do think it's done for deeper reasons like making the player feel real loss in the game.

Well, there's a mechanic to avoid losing the buddy with the butterfly emblem, but I see what you're saying. I think your approach is a bit off though. Gameplay and story aren't separate entities. The thematic approach to loss is inextricably linked to you permanently losing Quiet as a buddy. It's supposed to feel like you're missing out on something, because that's what loss is. Is that a good design decision in a game so focused on high scoring and such? That's highly debatable, but again - if that's your main goal with this game then you have the option to use the butterfly emblem.

Don't worry, I intend to not 100% the game if it means I'll play it as it should be played, with all the tools I struggled to unlock available to me.
But it still is the stupidest decision. The game is built in a way to be played for months, even years. Taking away one of the 4 most interesting tools in the first 30 hours and leaving you with the other 3 for the rest of its lifetime is stupid.
For the record, i'd say the same for every buddy.
Not to mention that these mechanics were advertised as available gameplay elements. The way they did it, Quiet is a gameplay element for a week or two tops. That's a damn waste of resources really.

 

[Hasney]

For the record, i'd say the same for every buddy.

Oh man, they should have done it with D Walker instead. I would laugh so hard if he moped off in an emotional scene for some reason.

 

[Chariot]

What's up with the demon ranking in this game? How does it work? Why isn't it explained in-game?

You bad, you demon. You kill, you nuke, that's bad. Secrets are cool, exploration and surprise feel good.

 

[IMACOMPUTA]

It's hilarious and dumb, but there are more spoilers in the OT than in the last couple pages of this thread.

 

[JawzPause]

I'm laughing at people in the OT getting excited about starting chapter 2. They have no idea

 

[Mengetsu]

Has there been a answer as to why David Hayter is not in the game at all? I figured this was all a troll by him and Kojima and that he would show up in a post credit secret scene with a BB confrontation. Is there bad blood between them that something happened or did Kojima just say fuck it and tossed him aside for someone in Hollywood?

 

[ZeroX03]

Has there been a answer as to why David Hayter is not in the game at all? I figured this was all a troll by him and Kojima and that he would show up in a post credit secret scene with a BB confrontation. Is there bad blood between them that something happened or did Kojima just say fuck it and tossed him aside for someone in Hollywood?

He was replaced. Simple as that. The "it's a troll" thing was always stupid. Hayter publicly dissed Konami over the move because he was upset. As far as I know Hayter and Kojima aren't particularly close either, I think they've only met a couple of times.

 

[Chariot]

Has there been a answer as to why David Hayter is not in the game at all? I figured this was all a troll by him and Kojima and that he would show up in a post credit secret scene with a BB confrontation. Is there bad blood between them that something happened or did Kojima just say fuck it and tossed him aside for someone in Hollywood?

I listened to an interview where he said that he was getting too expensive for "them" since he was in that role for such a long time and that they thought that they could just hire a Hollywood actor for that money.

 

[GoodCoffeeJoey]

Bleh it seems I've lost Quiet forever. I should have read the spoiler thread earlier I guess.

 

[Akiyama_AE]

Bleh it seems I've lost Quiet forever. I should have read the spoiler thread earlier I guess.

same kinda regret it but I always used the doge ..

 

[Death Metalist]

Has there been a answer as to why David Hayter is not in the game at all? I figured this was all a troll by him and Kojima and that he would show up in a post credit secret scene with a BB confrontation. Is there bad blood between them that something happened or did Kojima just say fuck it and tossed him aside for someone in Hollywood?

This upset me more than the twist itself as I didn't care for it lol. I always hoped he'd be in there somehow but eh that's my fault for expecting as such haha.

 

[DSix]

This upset me more than the twist itself as I didn't care for it lol. I always hoped he'd be in there somehow but eh that's my fault for expecting as such haha.

Yeah this is vexing since the twist was a perfect opportunity to get the Hayter voice in.

 

[Mengetsu]

He was replaced. Simple as that. The "it's a troll" thing was always stupid. Hayter publicly dissed Konami over the move because he was upset. As far as I know Hayter and Kojima aren't particularly close either, I think they've only met a couple of times.

I listened to an interview where he said that he was getting too expensive for "them" since he was in that role for such a long time and that they thought that they could just hire a Hollywood actor for that money.

Jeez that sucks to hear :/

Thanks for the responses.

This upset me more than the twist itself as I didn't care for it lol. I always hoped he'd be in there somehow but eh that's my fault for expecting as such haha.

Lol same here. Guy will always be The real boss to me.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

I know this kind of thing is mostly frowned upon here, but I was really disappointed by how thin the connect between TPP and MG1 was, so I created a post-credits sequence that I think would have been amazing. I'll spoiler tag it so you can skip over my fan wankery if you so desire, which you probably do.

Spoiler

1995

OUTER HEAVEN

A battlefield without end

V: Boss, eleven years ago...

BB: The thing with Cipher? You really pulled through for me.

V: Back then, Eli cursed his genes. He was consumed by revenge based on what he'd been told about his heritage. I've never seen a grown man filled with that much hate. To see that in a child...

BB: "Les Enfants Terribles"...

V: He didn't understand you at all, Boss.

BB: You know, I've met "the other one."

V: The other one?

BB: He's a new recruit. Joined up with FOXHOUND just recently.

V: What do you think?

BB: He's too naive. Doesn't understand anything about the way the world works. A typical bright eyed greenhorn - you see it all too often when people first join up with the army.

V: Everyone's eyes were bright once.

BB: ...

V: But still, to make it into FOXHOUND... and he's your-

BB: He's a man, plain and simple.

V: Boss...

BB: A person's life and legacy aren't tied to their genes. They aren't tied to the memes of society. They aren't even tied to the times.

V: Boss?

BB: A person is what they believe in. You should know that better than anybody.

V: What do you believe in, Boss?

BB: Why are you asking me that? You're me. You're my shadow. My true phantom - one created not from my genes, but from my will. Cipher had it at all wrong. Eleven years ago - you saw it yourself.

V: ...

BB: The world as it is has no place for us. The way things are... you can't just put the gun down. To let the world be... do you really think that's possible? Sometimes, fighting is the only answer.

V: ...A world where we're always needed.

BB: I have a new mission for you.

V: I'm listening, Boss.

*Sound of inserting a tape into a cassette player*

*Queue cut tape with Venom talking to Boss*

I know Konami plans to go forward with MGS, and I really kinda hope they go into MG1/MG2 territory.

 

[The Xtortionist]

This upset me more than the twist itself as I didn't care for it lol. I always hoped he'd be in there somehow but eh that's my fault for expecting as such haha.

Part of me was expecting some insane twist in mission 46 where Ishmael would have Hayter's voice or something. Something like that.

It didn't happen.

 

[GoodCoffeeJoey]

same kinda regret it but I always used the doge ..

Her AP sniper could really chew up the skulls.

 

[Hasney]

Her AP sniper could really chew up the skulls.

Heh, that mission with 4 sniper skulls, she got taken out quick. I ended up tranq snipering them all.

That is actually going to be a bitch to s rank without her.

 

[Papercuts]

He was replaced. Simple as that. The "it's a troll" thing was always stupid. Hayter publicly dissed Konami over the move because he was upset. As far as I know Hayter and Kojima aren't particularly close either, I think they've only met a couple of times.

Yeah, I never understood why people held on to faith at something like this. Trolling/fooling the userbase is one thing, but he actively was raking people through coals and you do not just do that for a joke since there's actual blowback for the company image.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

Part of me was expecting some insane twist in mission 46 where Ishmael would have Hayter's voice or something. Something like that.

It didn't happen.

I fully expected to hear Hayter on the Operation Intrude tape. Team B stays losing.

 

[giancarlo123x]

Hands down the most annoying part and most stupid game design decision of the game is losing quiet permanently without any sort of warning. I wasted my gmp making her grey xof suit and could not choose it for some reason. If she isn't selectable due to story missions mind as well not let us repeat missions since that makes no sense either. I hope they patch it and make her usable again even though my buddy of choice is DD.

 

[Broken Joystick]

Did anyone complete the game after killing Quiet instead of letting her live?

 

[Death Metalist]

Part of me was expecting some insane twist in mission 46 where Ishmael would have Hayter's voice or something. Something like that.

It didn't happen.

Lol same here. Guy will always be The real boss to me.

Yeah this is vexing since the twist was a perfect opportunity to get the Hayter voice in.

It's a shame because you know this is like the final chance for him to be in there and after 12 years of voicing Snake/BB, you find out he's not in any shape, way or form. Unless there is some super duper secret very well hidden we haven't found yet lol.

 

[Peff]

Yeah, I never understood why people held on to faith at something like this. Trolling/fooling the userbase is one thing, but he actively was raking people through coals and you do not just do that for a joke since there's actual blowback for the company image.

Well...

You need to remember that some people seem to have a fairly loose grip on reality.

 

[DSix]

#teamcg