excelsiorlef
Member
Now they've gone too far... Mana Ruth is gonna miss her flight home to Reno.
Black Lives Matter activists chain themselves to road at Heathrow Airport, UK
- Thread starter Napoleonthechimp
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Gary Johnson got booed at his own convention for saying he'd have voted for the Civil Rights Act.
jesus
Ok what percentage of the airport do you think decided to join their cause after being disrupted today, give me a ball park guess.
While racism definately still exists in UK (and apparently has increased in wake of Brexit vote in terms of hate crime incidents) I have to say I feel this isn't the right approach and is trying to fit something with heavy US associations to UK in a way that will not accomplish as much as building on the already solid progress and integration movements already in place would.
If anything this feels like a relic from past in terms of UK now.
The biggest issue I see in UK isn't institutes liked racism anyway: the issue is the catch 22 of poorer black communities in average being locked out from progressing.
Marcheing in London with hands raised saying "don't shoot" seems hopelessly out of touch in a country with low incidents of police shootings point blank and making a point that's mostly redundant now.
The issues UK has are now better dealt with through local communities, voting and policy makers than protests of this kind IMHO.
That said if these protests do remind people racism still exists and do contribute to progress then fair enough. But I'm not of the view yet that will be the case.
Disruption of civil amenities: roads, trams, etc I'm convinced is not a good approach. Matches such as the Lonfon one are more productive (I wouldn't have gone for the "don't shoot" angle as though they were in Baltimore though).
If anything this feels like a relic from past in terms of UK now.
The biggest issue I see in UK isn't institutes liked racism anyway: the issue is the catch 22 of poorer black communities in average being locked out from progressing.
Marcheing in London with hands raised saying "don't shoot" seems hopelessly out of touch in a country with low incidents of police shootings point blank and making a point that's mostly redundant now.
The issues UK has are now better dealt with through local communities, voting and policy makers than protests of this kind IMHO.
That said if these protests do remind people racism still exists and do contribute to progress then fair enough. But I'm not of the view yet that will be the case.
Disruption of civil amenities: roads, trams, etc I'm convinced is not a good approach. Matches such as the Lonfon one are more productive (I wouldn't have gone for the "don't shoot" angle as though they were in Baltimore though).
Spring-Loaded
Member
Just from looking at their social media accounts, it seems like they're protesting how all of those problems are disproportionately affecting people with darker complexion.
Is your confusion stemming from what constitutes "black" then? Showing solidarity with the US Black Lives Matter movement isn't undermining their spreading of awareness, and anyone who takes a moment to listen to what they're protesting about can see
And again, for posterity, the Black Lives Matter movement in the U.S. isn't strictly about police killings — those are just among the most egregious problems there. "Black lives matter," should be a statement applicable in myriad circumstances, and it seems silly that people find that a point of contention, despite having (supposedly) looked into what the movement is about.
The bolded is what I was asking about.
So you actually think this is what protesting is all about?:
MilkyJoe
Member
The bigger question is whether this was needed and if "being in the news" accomplishes anything better than the existing movements and policies for equality already in place.
I'm not convinced the UK is in a place with regards racism that warrants this approach at all (I mean the disruptive protests not organised marches).
Also worth pointing out that, while racism is obviously a problem everywhere in this country, police shootings of BAME people are massively focused in London.
In the last 25 years only one BAME person has been shot dead by police outside London (2002).
In that period there were 32 police shootings outside of London, so 97% of people shot dead by police outside of London in the last 25 years were white.
In the last 25 years only one BAME person has been shot dead by police outside London (2002).
In that period there were 32 police shootings outside of London, so 97% of people shot dead by police outside of London in the last 25 years were white.
Audioboxer
Member
I said in my last post above to another GAFer is getting in the news for the BLM name drop really all that effective these days? It's already known globally.
Like I said above you have to shift from simply doing publicity stunts to focusing your protests and disruptions on places of contention. A movement needs to mature.
Otherwise your movement just becomes one which "disrupts innocent civilians" to get newspaper headlines. There comes a point where that tactic eats itself alive and you get resentment towards the movement for simply pissing off innocent people trying to in this example go on holiday/travel to family/travel for business.
Disruption is as equally effective as it is self-sabotaging if you continue down a path of simply doing it "because" and having no real targeted goals once you've got your movement known and in mainstream media.
Yeah, I would never have thought the police in the UK could be an issue until I moved to London. Also the only place I've seen police regularly carry visible firearms.
Well, how many people knew there was a BLM branch in the UK before today?
That's probably the most important stat when it comes to this protest.
Honestly, I didn't now they were there. But now I do.
King Gilga
Member
While I'm glad these guys are getting their message out there I think making someone miss their flight is kind of a dick move.
I'm never more stressed than when I think I might be cutting it close to a flight and at that point I feel like I'd just about kill anyone who gets in my way.
I'm never more stressed than when I think I might be cutting it close to a flight and at that point I feel like I'd just about kill anyone who gets in my way.
MilkyJoe
Member
It's a recent thing. Terrists
Spiral Insanity
Banned
We need a MLM in the EU, well, in the US too. (Muslim Lives Matter)
Spring-Loaded
Member
We were talking about 156 black people being killed in the UK since 1993, not "percentage of prison population."
And "comapre proportionately against other groups" means "what percentage of the black population was killed by police during that time compared to the percentage of the white population?"
It's like if black people make up ~5% of the population, and of that 5%, 10% were killed. Then compare that to the percentage of the white population (say, ~76%) and the percentage of that who were killed. Does that make sense now?
Vicetrailia
Banned
It's old arguing about the purpose of this type of protest. Some people will get mad, water is wet. You now know about a BLM chapter in the UK, and that there are issues with how blacks are treated. You're welcome.
What problems are there other than the police killings? Genuinely curious because I thought that was the reason for the movement.
Isn't it 156 BAME people, not specifically black btw?
Shit he got booed for saying you should need a drivers license to operate a car. The Libertarians are as dogmatic as it gets about small government and one of the reasons I don't care for the party anymore.
ClosingADoor
Member
My confusion is two things.
1. Bringing a primarily US problem - police brutality and shootings - to Europe, where we have far less problems with that. And in peoples mind Black Lives Matter is linked to that - which creates a problem for easy dismissal from people which we see now with this protest.
2. Trying to put a lot of different issues under that banner - the refugee thing stand out especially - which doesn't give the movement a clear direction in peoples minds anymore. Which again will lead to easier dismissal by others.
Awareness is good, but if that awareness actually leads to people dismissing the problems - which we are seeing here - it is counter productive.
Regginator
Member
And? Was this best way to do that? Is the movement even relevant in the UK? Are they helping or hindering established anti-racism activity?
Just having a UK BLM and getting on TV with some civil disruption isn't an automatic positive.
Aaronology
Member
Do you think the disruptive protests by BLM in the US have had a positive effect?
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
A lot of activists need to have a long hard think about if they're hurting a cause or helping it.
The old adage of "any press is good press" was in an age before social media and news became more about opinions than event reporting.
The old adage of "any press is good press" was in an age before social media and news became more about opinions than event reporting.
MilkyJoe
Member
I guess if you need someone to look it up for you
156 includes all non whites
Exact number of black deaths is not cited in the report but its less than 156 as that figure includes all no whites
1562 - 156 = 1406 white deaths.
Prison numbers are a representation of the numbers in custody. I fail to see how you cannot see the relevance of that to the conversation.
Brevity is the soul of wit applies to this post. Just put it in the OP so the Birmingham moderates understand.
The diversity of airports doesn't mean anything, that more than likely isn't the point of this protest. BLM as a movement is well known and talked about, but I'm not too sure about how well known BLM UK is (I don't live in the UK so I can't gauge it). This is one of the first times I have heard news about BLM UK, so clearly something is working with this protest. I'm sure that they do many other things than just block highways, the thing is that they don't get on the news for it. Why shouldn't they do something big like this every once in a while to spread awareness while also working on informing people? You can't just raise awareness once and then let everyone forget about you.
Kenshin001
Member
What did MLK say about ruining people's vacations? Honestly I have never heard of a precedent of people blocking an airport and successfully achieving their goals. I'm not sure who exactly is refusing to negotiate in this example either. The tourists flying to Mallorca? All white people in the UK?
This is indicative of the silliness of this protest. 1350 of those families are white, so BLMUK is protesting against injustice against white people.
Wrestlemania
Banned
In this thread I learned that the only racist thing police can do that should be protested is shooting black people to death. Don't worry about all the other stuff.
Spiral Insanity
Banned
Because Europe doesn't have a gun/police problem. But xenophobia runs rampant and is overflowing.
smoke um if you got um
that is to say, protest if you feel like you should protest
MLK would have probably your vacation means jack shit over the well being of your fellow man. Probably much more eloquently and without cursing.
Also you do realize BLM has done similar things in the USA as well right? They have protested for the unjust deaths of white people. Surprise surprise
CyberPunked
Member
Those wars may have been a spark which lead to ISIS, but their formation was inevitable due to the ideologies that they're based on.
Spring-Loaded
Member
Maybe — MilkyJoe said "156 black people killed by police," and I took him at his word.
Seriously? Like, that's the impetus for this particular movement, but it hasn't merely been to spread awareness of police killings. Killings of black people by other civilians with no repercussions, general prejudice across myriad circumstances ... We don't need to go into problems faced particularly by black people in the U.S., do we?
The words "black lives matter," don't need to be tied solely to killings by police.
Anyone who seeks to outright dismiss this movement or any movement seeking justice/equality for subjugated groups will find a reason to dismiss it. "I thought 'black lives matter' could only be applied to this one situation in another country" doesn't hold much water. People already ascribe recent shootings of police in America to BLM despite the movement not being about condoning retaliatory violence against police.
If their message seems too general, that doesn't seem like reasonable grounds for dismissal of causes no one in their right mind would oppose. But perhaps I'm not looking at it as if this were a court of law and merely see the issues they want to bring attention to as being inarguably worth protesting.
Thanks.
I figured since you brought it up first, you were going to present it within context, and in a way that's relevant. My mistake
Why is it called BLM then? Legit confused now...
Because we are all in this together. White people have also protested right along side BLM. Insane I know.
Because it's not about making blacks better than everyone else.
It's about making blacks equal to whites.
Until then, there's plenty to remorse.
But we aren't are we?
If the bold was true, then BLM wouldnt exist at all. We ARENT all in this together.
ClosingADoor
Member
I'm not saying it is not worth protesting about or that I am judging them for it. I am just stating that I think that this way of protesting is not the best way to achieve results in the UK and the focus is better of not being put on police brutality, but on other issues. And a different name to prevent confusion with the American movement might then be a good idea.
It's their movement of course and as long as the protests are legal, go ahead. But that doesn't mean that the majority of the population will be convinced by the way their message is delivered.
Regginator
Member
That I cannot disagree with, very true.
Spring-Loaded
Member
The implied part of the name is not "only black lives matter"
The implied part is that it's in response to actions/events/practices that imply that black lives don't matter.
The point of BLM is to get blacks there, to equal
We aren't there yet.
And so
The cosmic ballet
continues
continues
You completely misunderstood me.
Uh... I'm totally fine with white people protesting amongst other ethnic groups to support the idea of BLM. Don't misunderstand my post please. What I'm saying is that if the focus group is the better treatment of black people then why the hell are they also targetting injustices for White people. It's a humane thing to do yes but it's not good organizational focus...
Sorry but that's not how English works. When there are so few words in a phrase it's interpretted with the simplest and most common understood meaning given the arrangement and specificity of the words. Black Lives Matter can mean that but unfortunately that's NOT describing what you really mean honestly. Black Lives Matter literally means that you're saying there is value inherently found in black peoples' lives.
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