PROMETHEUS UNMARKED SPOILER THREAD!
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SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
It was just cheesy to me, it wasn't elegant. I guess it fits the movie.
It reminded me of the intro to one of the X-Men movies.
I would probably do an engineer but it would just destroy any human with snu snu.
might be worth it...
I can fix that
REVERSE ENGINEERING
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
People called me crazy when after having first seen it I said it would have been better under Cameron.
I would still think that you're crazy even if I had hated the film
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
It's time to turn in, Salsa. Avatar has smarter scientists than this crack team of scientific pioneers.
too bad they're in a terrible film
while suspension of disbelief might affect how you think upon a movie and what you think of it, at the end of the day I consider Avatar to be terrible even if it were incredibly accurate and super realistic. I dont watch movies for that.
I do know that you love Cameron and that's totally fine, you dont have to defend the movie for the 99th time
Discotheque
Banned
u
Man I don't even enjoy Avatar that much but I can certainly acknowledge he would have made a much better film here.
Man I don't even enjoy Avatar that much but I can certainly acknowledge he would have made a much better film here.
Any movie would be better under Cameron.
ThatObviousUser
ὠαἴÏÏιÏÏÎ¿Ï Ïαá¿Ï εἶ
The director wasn't the problem. The movie wouldn't have looked as good as it did under Cameron. The problem was the script, and Cameron's done shoddy scripts before (Avatar.)
Please, this is quite the insult to JC. Avatar's script is aeons away from Prometheus's.
Nappuccino
Member
Well, he had better scripts to ape.
ThatObviousUser
ὠαἴÏÏιÏÏÎ¿Ï Ïαá¿Ï εἶ
Exactly. He had 10 years after Dances to come up with his spin, and then he sat on the script for another 10 I believe.
more polished? maybe. More interesting and original to begin with? lol
Avatar's problem is that it's basically a beautifully shot and polished souless piece of boring story turd.
Their shortcomings are in different aspects, and from what I look forward to in movies; I vastly prefer Prometheus.
It's entirely a matter of taste and perspective, so discussing further is kinda pointless.
I disagree, and I think Prometheus has serious flaws, however it had the potential to be awesome, avatar is just ... well, avatar.
This nonsense about Cameron is ridiculous, he would have made this film even more terrible, stop talking about absurdity and go back to argue how bad the script of the movie is.
It's not really a matter of taste at all. Or perspective. Or polish. It's quite simple really. Avatar's characters have motivations and make decisions that make sense. You're not constantly to yourself "what the fuck, why", like in Prometheus. The basic plot, while not original(although neither is Ancient Aliens, just so you know), again, works, makes sense, and is not ridden with plot holes. Unlike, Prometheus.
edit: now that I think about it, the main gist of Prometheus is extremely similar to 2001. Only done horribly, of course.
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
Again, Prometheus' most interesting story is what is happening in the background. What isn't seen. Whilst the surface narrative that we're following is executed very, very poorly.
Avatar might be missing the deeper themes, but it is far more enjoyable to watch because what is on screen in executed like a fucking pro.
It reminds me of that scene in The Simpsons:
Lisa: You have to listen to the notes she's not playing!
Man: I can do that at home.
Avatar might be missing the deeper themes, but it is far more enjoyable to watch because what is on screen in executed like a fucking pro.
It reminds me of that scene in The Simpsons:
Lisa: You have to listen to the notes she's not playing!
Man: I can do that at home.
Contrary to what jett says above: these arguments are both entirely made from a matter of taste AND perspective.
People look and appreciate different things in movies. I get the simpsons comment, but I dont necesarelly associate with it to that point, I still think there's true to what Lisa says, wich most would diss as "lol pretentious".
Even if you bring it down to simple terms: Avatar did nothing for me. I watched it and thought "well that sure looked pretty" and forgot all about it the next day. Im still thinking about Prometheus. It's a much more subtle film, and I could even give you that it's less polished, less realistic, more hard to believe in terms of character interactions, but at the end of the day it sayed with me more than Avatar ever did. And believe me, if I have something against Cameron now: I never did before watching Avatar, I love T2 and Aliens, a lot. I went with no made-up mind about it.
And yes, there are ways to fuck that up, easily (before someone says: "oh but then you're only interested in the concept and nothing else!"), and Ridley didnt go as far as to screw up the movie for me, not even with it's shortcomings.
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
I completely get where you're coming from, because I come from the same mindset. But to me there is a difference between a film that encourages further investigation into the narrative that is being subtly painted in the background and a film that requires that self-edification for any sort of enjoyment because it fails on the most basic narrative level.
It tells me that the filmmakers didn't have the skill or the brass to tell the more interesting story, so they told it in a way that didn't force them to confront it's finer details. They hid it behind this really poorly written surface story that apparently they didn't care enough about to explore to it's full extent. That annoys me because if they won't invest in the characters and situations that the film is spending it's time with, then why should I?
And Pocahontas and Ferngully. Avatar was totally original in its lateness to the subject.
Insane Metal
Member
Okay, now I can ask.
What the hell does that xenomorph have to do with the ones we actually know? Is it the original? The first of its kind? Because it's so different. Its head resembles a dolphin, lmao
And the first engineer creating life on Earth. If there was fresh water running and breathable air, there should already be life. They should have showed a more hostile environment where life was beginning to strive, shouldn't they?
And Vickers running away from a rolling ship was really annoying. Just do like Shaw did.
Well, these are some things I had to ask before going to bed. I'll be back tomorrow
What the hell does that xenomorph have to do with the ones we actually know? Is it the original? The first of its kind? Because it's so different. Its head resembles a dolphin, lmao
And the first engineer creating life on Earth. If there was fresh water running and breathable air, there should already be life. They should have showed a more hostile environment where life was beginning to strive, shouldn't they?
And Vickers running away from a rolling ship was really annoying. Just do like Shaw did.
Well, these are some things I had to ask before going to bed. I'll be back tomorrow
I get that, but again; it's how you look at things. A director avoiding certain aspects of the story they want to tell in favor of ambiguity doesnt necesarelly mean he lacked the skill to do it, but that he chose that path. In this particular case I actually think it fits with the themes Prometheus evokes. I think the film could be (further, according to some of you
) ruined by further explanation and exposure. There are stories that ONLY work in this way, and dont necesarelly have interesting backgrounds that need more diggin, as in: it would actually be mediocre and boring in the end (wich is my Avatar issue)I dont think the film needs further investigation either, it doesnt "require" anything. By the time the movie ended I made up my mind on what it was about and what "happened in the background". There's room there for you to explore and fill with your own thoughts, but the movie doesnt need that to be good, at least not to the point of having to think about it and come up with ideas days after. If Ridley Scott chose this because he prefered it or because he was afraid of confronting his own universe; we'll never now, but proper ambiguity opposed to "I didnt know what to do there so I just did nothing lol" is hard to master (and more often than not vastly criticized and put in a bag along badly done works). Fan theories are always fun, but (as I assume you agree) have no value attributed to the film.
I think it's better for all of us if we disassociate Prometheus from Alien, completely. I mean, really. Gawd.
They created humans, not all life. Maybe. Maybe not. Who knows. Good lawd this movie.
Shaw is a die-hard fan of retro gaming. Peppy told her all about the ways of barrel-rolling.
This is the kind of stuff I dont get. I mean with this line of thinking I dont know how you could ever create a new world around your movie unless you explain how every single thing in it works.
I dont know how people put "plot holes" and "stuff that doesnt need explanation and wouldn't affect the story the movie is trying to tell" in the same bag.
Insane Metal
Member
I didn't say it was a plot hole. I just thought the confusion was funny.
Personally, this movie fails because it explains too much and too little at the same time. The Space Jockey scene in Alien, where absolutely nothing is explained, is infinitely more thought provoking the entirety of Prometheus. The ancient aliens crap in Prometheus, I just shrug my shoulders at.
Actually, there's really not all that much left to explain in Prometheus. The problems in it are not things that "need to be explained", the problems are things that don't make any fucking sense, and they don't make any fucking sense because of poor, thoughtless scriptwriting where very few fucks were given.
How did I miss redletters video. All so true.
http://youtu.be/-x1YuvUQFJ0
One more thing. Why is it that only the captain came to the sudden realization that the engineers are dangerous? while david and weyland thought they could just wake them up and be best friends forever. The captain didnt even have to know about the alien baby to make that connection.
http://youtu.be/-x1YuvUQFJ0
One more thing. Why is it that only the captain came to the sudden realization that the engineers are dangerous? while david and weyland thought they could just wake them up and be best friends forever. The captain didnt even have to know about the alien baby to make that connection.
Brawndo Addict
Banned
One of my main gripes is the gap between what the audience knows and what the characters know. I really felt that the movie should have opened with the shot of the ship tracking across the emptiness of space. The cave painting scene was totally unnecessary and having the engineer DNA seeding explicitly shown screws up almost everything. It basically plays the entire hand of the movie immediately and then asks you to stick around until the characters catch up to you.
So while the audience is already wondering why the Engineer's made humans 5 minutes in, we have to spend the first half the movie waiting for Shaw and co. to finally confirm the Engineer's did indeed make us. By the time the characters are on the same page we're just exasperated it took this long for the movie to circle back to where it started.
So while the audience is already wondering why the Engineer's made humans 5 minutes in, we have to spend the first half the movie waiting for Shaw and co. to finally confirm the Engineer's did indeed make us. By the time the characters are on the same page we're just exasperated it took this long for the movie to circle back to where it started.
Nice. A barely expressed complain that is actually one of the few I agree with.
It however did not necesarelly make the rest of the movie boring for me, and it wasnt one of those instaces where that dichotomy bothered me, but they just felt unnecesary.
The cave painting scene was just that: unnecesary and pointless. The DNA seeding was too explicit for me, and would have been a better "ohhhhhh" moment later on if you put the pieces together later on.
Funny since most people think the movie is too ambigious
this aspect was too on the nose.I would still have prefered the movie to start with the scene it did, but with not that much exposure to the DNA cgi thing. It creates the opposite to what your problem was.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Eh. There are two kinds of sci fi. Character driven ones and big idea ones where the characters aren't important and are simply a vehicle for exploring the concepts.
This is basically like claiming Asimov sucks because R. Daneel Olivaw is the only character that grows in the Robot novels. Or that McDevitt is unreadible.
I like you
Nappuccino
Member
Many of the questions are very on point. Others have pretty clear answers within the movie and others are intended to be humorous.
I dont know man those face scars threw me off, thought he was a good guy
He is, though.
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
What stupid shit do they do that doesn't make any sense? What character pulls a complete 180 in terms of logic and contradicts how they might have been written thus far?
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
He's fine as long as you like the big idea stuff and can ignore iffy characters.
Heck, the way the academy series ultimately resolved, it has a lot in common with Prometheus.
Add Niven to that list if McDevitt doesn't turn your crank though.
Going further with the Avatar comparission: many of the "plot holes" or "scripting mistakes" or "nonsense" or etc that are attributed to Prometheus are in the same vein as some of those applied to Avatar. Inconsistencies that are so small in terms of mantaining your suspension of disbelief and in adding/taking away anything from the story that's being told that they dont really amount to anything.
Example: Michelle Rodriguez defying orders to attack the tree thing, but apparently her punishment allows her to run around freely so she can later save Scully.
Its the same as Millburn going from scary fucker to wanting to play with the white alien thingie in Prometheus, or them gettin lost when they have a map, etc: its an oversight in terms of rationality that is sacrificed in favor of moving the story to where you need to go. It could be labeled as lazy, but is not undheard of and it's present in pretty much any kind of fiction. It depends on how much you base your appreciation of films in that kind of stuff.
another example:
Prometheus: why didn't they do this or that so they could avoid this or that?
Avatar: why did they bomb the tree from a low height where the flying shitty things could breathe? why didnt they bomb it from higher up?
I could go on, these kinds of complains are everywhere in literally every work of fiction. You go nuts analizing stuff to that degree.
Example: Michelle Rodriguez defying orders to attack the tree thing, but apparently her punishment allows her to run around freely so she can later save Scully.
Its the same as Millburn going from scary fucker to wanting to play with the white alien thingie in Prometheus, or them gettin lost when they have a map, etc: its an oversight in terms of rationality that is sacrificed in favor of moving the story to where you need to go. It could be labeled as lazy, but is not undheard of and it's present in pretty much any kind of fiction. It depends on how much you base your appreciation of films in that kind of stuff.
another example:
Prometheus: why didn't they do this or that so they could avoid this or that?
Avatar: why did they bomb the tree from a low height where the flying shitty things could breathe? why didnt they bomb it from higher up?
I could go on, these kinds of complains are everywhere in literally every work of fiction. You go nuts analizing stuff to that degree.
Nappuccino
Member
It's not a 180 turn, but Sully sure doesn't take orders well considering he's a military boy. I get the whole "OMG, I can walk?" thing must have been nice... but damn it son have a little patience. They aren't going to unplug you just because you waited the extra few min to get everything checked out.
Any military superior would have been flipping shit at his behavior.
(This type of scene is a particular pet peeve of mine so it stands out)
crazy monkey
Banned
Just came back. It was good not great. It was missing that lonelyness and why the fuck avatar is being discussed. That movie had giant dragons and blue people ffs.
Why is this Alien clip featuring Bolaj Badejo rehearsing movements creepier than anything in Prometheus?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpKi41a1rJI&feature=player_embedded#!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpKi41a1rJI&feature=player_embedded#!
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
I don't think so. There is nothing glaring about that. They aren't the army. They're mercenaries and ex-army vets who have signed up for security detail. Sure they operate it like a military operation, but her 'I didn't sign up for this shit.' isn't without merit. What they were being asked to do (torch unarmed inhabitants with no means of resistance) goes beyond the requirements of why she's there.
She may have her flight status revoked and be suspended from all further aerial engagements since she has displayed an unwillingness to comply with their new operations, but they wouldn't suspend her from operating at Hell's Gate tower where she can't effectively do any harm. It wasn't known that she was in cahoots with the science sorties.
Ignoring that example, that is very different from the glaring leaps in logic that characters display in Prometheus.
You have Shaw bleeding, looking a wreck after just having pulled an Alien out of herself. Followed not only by the Weyland scene which renders everybody into unquestioning robots toward him and Shaw, but you then have a scene where Elba's character distinctly and very seriously tells her 'I can't let any of that kind of stuff get on this ship' to which she just nods at. She just pulled an alien out of herself, is stumbling around in a heap and has knocked out two of the other crew members and nobody cares to address the flaws in logic here?
cause he looks like fuckin slender man without the suit
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
What military superior? He was under the supervision of the scientists and they reacted accordingly - yelling that he needed to be sedated and restrained right away. It was shown very clearly that Quaritch and the others didn't give a shit what the scientists were really doing. They viewed them as 'a bad joke.'
- She's heavily drugged and constantly pumping up more drugs onto her body
- They already dropped the idea of the goo doing anything good (probably the reason why Weyland asked David to get a sample and use it as poison; to see if it could be of benefit to dying weyland) so they literally dont give a crap about Shaw anymore. She used the med thing? good for her, whatevs (basically what David says).
- No one gives a shit about the crew beyond accomplishing what they intended to do, wich is for Weyland to meet engineer dude.
- She decides to follow them just out of Engineer curiosity and because that's what her boyfriend would have wanted her to do
- Everyone's just too close to their intended destination that everything else is just background noise at this point
I could keep going.. not saying any of this is legit, but rather that im applying the same logic you're applying to disqualify my Avatar mistake, wich is assuming things and going out of your way beyond what the movie shows in order to understand why what happened there happened.
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