Are developers phasing out Wii U on purpose?
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Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
I have seen a remarkably disproportionate number of posts like this over the past several weeks, to the point that it is sheer torture to even consider opening a thread that is even tangentially related to Nintendo. It's not the "Nintendo is hosed" sentiment that I mind, it's the sheer vitriol and pleasure in Nintendo's suggested failure that sticks out to me. Just bile, overflowing from every sentence. No real constructive thought, just ad hominem and pride, impossible to actually have a dialog with.
And what I really find bizarre is that, at least from my anecdotal experience, a huge majority of these posts are from junior members. What is it about these new people? Do they just not understand how to function in a valuable way on the forums? Is there a reason we haven't been seeing more action from our new crop of moderators to keep things constructive? These drive-by shootings are making it really difficult to talk to anyone about anything.
unholyrevenger72
Banned
Nintendo will be fine. They make a profit on everything they sell because they are structured that way. Yes they lost money last year but that was a major manufacturing year. Nintendo won't die or disappear, you'll just have another gamecube
Maybe, but I doubt it.
Wii U was built for families with children under 13 or whatever the age is when kids stop wanting to play games with their parents, period. Nintendo's Wii U specific games, ads, and core console features back this up. In the coming months, we are going to see this focus driven home through marketing. I believe there is a decent market for that kind of product. Not Wii-sized, or even PS3-sized, but that market is there.
Yes, Ninty tried to attract some of the gamers who don't want that kind of game through the promise of Bayo2, X, and some third party stuff at launch. They wanted another big time selling console, and tried to graft on some core stuff onto the FamiCom soul in order to maximize 1st year install base.
So, going forward, if a third party has a game that has a family-funtime selling point, then they will look at putting it on the Wii U. Big blockbuster games not suited to that will skip the Wii U.
If some people here don't want that kind of console, that's fine. That does not mean however that there is no market for the console or that the console is worthless. Now, if after the fall marketing blitz, even the family funtime market rejects the Wii U, then I guess it will be game over.
At the same time you could argue Nintendo isn't even trying at this point. Does that speak more to Nintendo's mismanagement? Perhaps. But I've seen zero proper marketing push and zero system sellers for Nintendo fans themselves. Never mind anyone else. I don't expect the system to rocket but a magnitude better then it's current trajectory with even the littlest of shits given from Nintendo.
lwilliams3
Member
Yes. At least we will have a better idea on how this will go soon. Pikmin just came out in Japan, and I suppose that can be considered as the first step to Nintendo's plan on waking up the Wii U from marketing hibernation.
Does Nintendo want the "core" gamer anymore? They don't seem to want to what it takes, and the likes of Bayonetta 2, X, and whatever else almost seem as if they're lip service and Nintendo's real priorities lay elsewhere.
Triggerhappytel
Member
Please explain to me a scenario where it would make even the slightest bit of sense for Nintendo to actively discourage third party support. They need all the software they can get on the machine, even if it's unloved or belated ports.
Steve Youngblood
Member
Would you like some honest feedback, Tethanen? Generally speaking, my preferred method as I attempt to get a feel for things has been to do things like make cautionary posts, and delete things that I don't necessarily are ban worthy, but potentially detailing to the conversation. But that's only useful if I'm active in the thread as its going down. After the fact, it's not always easy to attempt to salvage a thread if it seems to have gone off the rails.
As it pertains to the post you quoted, I'd agree that it isn't the most constructive criticism, and I'd like to see less of it here. However, as a corollary to that, I'd also like to see less of people being completely unable to ignore low hanging fruit.
And by that, I often find that both sides contribute to bad discussion. Someone makes a shitty troll post that may or may not be ban worthy, and in response, someone makes a shitty passive aggressive condemnation of that post that escalates the situation and keeps the cycle going.
For instance, let me encourage you not to make posts like this. You don't have to ignore it, but the conversation flows better if you simply take the post at face value and explain why the points are bad or why you think it's disingenuous, as opposed to going on some meta-rant about the forum.
Because if I was in the mood to see some names grayed out right now, I'd consider banning the post you quoted for being a poor-quality troll post, but then I might follow up by banning you for backseat modding. I don't necessarily think that's what you want.
It's always worth noting that -- even with additional mods -- we aren't omnipresent. If you think a thread might require mod attention, I encourage sending a PM to a mod.
Jokes and Riddles
Neo Member
This.
I dare say you sir just did a drive by to the noise pollution.
Your avatar is very fitting.
Wii U - with its execution issues solved - is a natural choice for families. If you have kids. Wii U is undoubtly an amazing console to own.
As a second console, with its exclusives, off tv, and no charge to play online, it will also reach the gamer audience at some point.
Nintendo was badly late, which resulted in 9 months that they will pay far longer than that (in terms of 3rd party confidence to regain and public image to restore).
But these are temporary issues, and foundations for Wii U are excellent. I'm a firm believer Wii U design fills a void. This edge it has on off tv AND local multiplayer is a great value prop, both for families and core gamers, who can expand situations to play console games.
Nintendo can afford to be patient, to build on the long term. Both their Wii U platform and miiverse network will get better, and better.
Soon enough, there won't be anything to laugh at with Wii U. People not having one will miss great things. And people will start knowing that, talking about that.
Will it happen this fall after the complete OS update, wonderful 101, key mascots appearing (including earthbound
, a potential price cut?
Will it be next spring with Mario Kart, later next year with Bayonetta 2, Smash, X, Nintendo new IP? Who knows, but the time will come.
As a second console, with its exclusives, off tv, and no charge to play online, it will also reach the gamer audience at some point.
Nintendo was badly late, which resulted in 9 months that they will pay far longer than that (in terms of 3rd party confidence to regain and public image to restore).
But these are temporary issues, and foundations for Wii U are excellent. I'm a firm believer Wii U design fills a void. This edge it has on off tv AND local multiplayer is a great value prop, both for families and core gamers, who can expand situations to play console games.
Nintendo can afford to be patient, to build on the long term. Both their Wii U platform and miiverse network will get better, and better.
Soon enough, there won't be anything to laugh at with Wii U. People not having one will miss great things. And people will start knowing that, talking about that.
Will it happen this fall after the complete OS update, wonderful 101, key mascots appearing (including earthbound
, a potential price cut? Will it be next spring with Mario Kart, later next year with Bayonetta 2, Smash, X, Nintendo new IP? Who knows, but the time will come.
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
Fair. And I don't make a habit of that, I've been trying to either ignore those posts for the last weeks or attempt to respond to them rationally when I see them, but those attempts are typically failures, or are followed immediately by another person ignoring my post and posting the same kind of shit as the first post I responded to, making it seem like I'm talking to nobody. Little one-and-done defecations. Thus my frustration.
That said, I certainly don't plan on harping about it any more than this. Thanks for the response, I'll keep on topic with any future posts.
metalslimer
Member
I don't think Wiiu has a shot recovering to sell over 100k a month in the usa non holiday or more than 15k a week in japan. However, I think nintendo cansalvage the wiiu and start building towards the next system with real accounts, a vast digital catalog, and indie support. I think the nintendoomed posts are dumb, but it would take 3 miracles to turn wiiu around
The severe lack of 3rd party support will still be there. Nintendo's games of course will begreat but not everyone cares about nintendos games to buy a system where the vast majority of the games are theirs.
The severe lack of 3rd party support will still be there. Nintendo's games of course will begreat but not everyone cares about nintendos games to buy a system where the vast majority of the games are theirs.
That1BlackGuy
Member
I don't think there is a conspiracy at all, 3rd party publishers are doing what's in the best interest of their business and if market research dictates that there is no real market or odds for success for their games on the Wii U, then it what it is. We could discus the back-and-forths however that just brings us to a chicken/egg situation real talk.
I will say that I'll be interested to see the Wii U 1 year from now as then we can form a much clearer picture of where the Wii U truly stands after their first party hitters have been out. If indeed Nintendo has to shoulder producing content for their console then they've best start pushing their indie offerings and VC + deals to fill in those droughts, that's one advantage they didn't have with the N64 and GameCube.
I will say that I'll be interested to see the Wii U 1 year from now as then we can form a much clearer picture of where the Wii U truly stands after their first party hitters have been out. If indeed Nintendo has to shoulder producing content for their console then they've best start pushing their indie offerings and VC + deals to fill in those droughts, that's one advantage they didn't have with the N64 and GameCube.
The Librarian
Banned
Not sure what I can add to this discussion but I do hope that Nintendo does have more success with the console because I'm picking up a Wii U for Pikmin 3. As has probably been said dozens of times in this thread, third parties have never been overtly supportive of Nintendo, and they won't this generation even if the Wii U's sales pick up. As we saw with the Wii, even when it was selling like no other console had been, third-party support was lackluster.
No doubt this has been said before, but I do think the main problem with the Wii U is that, aside from its HD prowess, it's not distinctive enough from the Wii. I think Nintendo's top priority going forward should be to differentiate the Wii U from the Wii give Wii owners reasons beyond the games to upgrade.
No doubt this has been said before, but I do think the main problem with the Wii U is that, aside from its HD prowess, it's not distinctive enough from the Wii. I think Nintendo's top priority going forward should be to differentiate the Wii U from the Wii give Wii owners reasons beyond the games to upgrade.
Vane_MagicCity
Banned
Given the last 3 consoles from Nintendo, are people really expecting the Wii U to suddenly gain third party support?
I don't think Wii U can survive only on first party games this time, Nintendo has little experience with HD and games will take longer to develop this time.
I don't think Wii U can survive only on first party games this time, Nintendo has little experience with HD and games will take longer to develop this time.
Platinum exclusives, Sonic exclusive, some indie exclusives, unannounced exclusives through similar Nintendo deals. Wii U will have its share of love, its street cred will grow. And yes, the vast majority of its games will come from Nintendo, which is the first reason people buy a Nintendo console.
I believe a few devs have stated here that working with Nintendo is not exactly a smooth process (at least, when you consider things beyond indie developers), so although I don't think said devs are intentionally phasing out the WiiU, I do think Nintendo's policies with third-parties may play some part on their take on the console
That said, I wanted to make a few comments on some of the things said on this thread. I've noticed some people are labeling the WiiU's failure on different aspects (weak hardware, no marketing or games, etc) and while I do believe these issues are tangentially related, I don't think they are necessarily on the terms proposed here.
Regarding the hardtware criticism, I do believe Nintendo missed the mark by not giving a considerable jump from the PS360, but not because they missed the "hardcore". I believe a considerable amount of people don't consider graphics the main highlight of a console, however, I do believe they mind when a new console doesn't seem to be a considerable jump from their older ones, because it devalues the perceived value of said new console (that is, I'm speaking solely of the big part of the PS360 group).
As for the public not getting the WiiU, I think the problem is the gamepad itself. It is clear it was designed as the main point of the WiiU, but at least to me (and I believe, a huge part of the casual public), it doesn't seem to be something new and exciting like playing Wii Sports was. It surely is different and can be fun, but perhaps its similarities with the mobile gaming that many casuals are now used to removed some of the excitement over it, and devalued the experience.
Now, regarding its sales... I don't think the WiiU will be a moderate success based solely on delivering games. It will cater to the fans who want a console to play Nintendo games, but I don't think it will be able to present to the mainstream buyers something like Wii Sports, which frankly, was probably what truly moved Wiis. And even when you think about these loyal fans, it's worth noting the Gamecube went though a similar sales problem, and although it received several quality titles, the console itself didn't sell much.
I sincerely don't think the WiiU will do too hot. It seems to be affected by many factors at the same time, and although a sales increase might happen, the console itself will probably still deliver very low numbers for the Wii successor, and although I'm hesitant to give a prediction on the upcoming consoles, I can see it selling poorly compared to the main seller between the Xbone/PS4.
That said, I wanted to make a few comments on some of the things said on this thread. I've noticed some people are labeling the WiiU's failure on different aspects (weak hardware, no marketing or games, etc) and while I do believe these issues are tangentially related, I don't think they are necessarily on the terms proposed here.
Regarding the hardtware criticism, I do believe Nintendo missed the mark by not giving a considerable jump from the PS360, but not because they missed the "hardcore". I believe a considerable amount of people don't consider graphics the main highlight of a console, however, I do believe they mind when a new console doesn't seem to be a considerable jump from their older ones, because it devalues the perceived value of said new console (that is, I'm speaking solely of the big part of the PS360 group).
As for the public not getting the WiiU, I think the problem is the gamepad itself. It is clear it was designed as the main point of the WiiU, but at least to me (and I believe, a huge part of the casual public), it doesn't seem to be something new and exciting like playing Wii Sports was. It surely is different and can be fun, but perhaps its similarities with the mobile gaming that many casuals are now used to removed some of the excitement over it, and devalued the experience.
Now, regarding its sales... I don't think the WiiU will be a moderate success based solely on delivering games. It will cater to the fans who want a console to play Nintendo games, but I don't think it will be able to present to the mainstream buyers something like Wii Sports, which frankly, was probably what truly moved Wiis. And even when you think about these loyal fans, it's worth noting the Gamecube went though a similar sales problem, and although it received several quality titles, the console itself didn't sell much.
I sincerely don't think the WiiU will do too hot. It seems to be affected by many factors at the same time, and although a sales increase might happen, the console itself will probably still deliver very low numbers for the Wii successor, and although I'm hesitant to give a prediction on the upcoming consoles, I can see it selling poorly compared to the main seller between the Xbone/PS4.
test_account
XP-39C²
Do you have any examples of this?
Lack of quality games, lack of power, slow UI, the complete lack of the motion controls that made the Wii so unique, to name a few. Any one of those things could be forgiven, but all of them combined make it rather disappointing.
That isn't true at all. Read this, it has quotes talking about wanting to attract the core audience BEFORE the casual with the Wii U:
http://www.computerandvideogames.co...attract-core-gamers-before-casual-with-wii-u/
And here, Nintendo talks about the Wii U being the preferred console for the core gamer:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/new...i-U-The-Preferred-Console-for-Hardcore-Gamers
So, they (and their defenders) can spin it any way they like now, but it was never their intention for the Wii U to be casual only console for children. That's what it's going to end up being, most likely, but that wasn't ever the goal.
Aw yeah, I had that backwards. I should have remembered the math on rotating discs. Long day!
I also just remembered the GameCube was CAV.
coinoperatedboy
Banned
Nintendo didn't get their ducks in a row for the launch but games are rolling out now and I must disagree that there aren't any good titles. MH3, zombieu, and trine 2 are my top picks among sevral quality title.
The OS is faster now and I expect will will be snappier after the next update.
Regarding power I think there are many threads and replys about that. The sum of it all is that Nintendo can't compete pound for pound with Sony or Microsoft that have alternative ways of generating cash. If they went all out they would be even more screwed. Then third parties would say nay cause of demographic or something else and they themselves would have bigger problems making their own games for the console.
Your complaint regarding the lack of motion control leads me to believe that you haven't played the wii u at all.
It has sevral controllers that can be used if so desired by devs.
I think Nintendo have done some for the more HC gamers cause what they have done with bayonetta and X (also w101).
But I won't say that Nintendo are going for western males, the whole concept of the wii u is that of a family console for local multiplayer. That is where it will shine.
I'm pretty much reading you just want another clone of PSMS...
shinra-bansho
Member
Pretty much. It's not so much that software like Mario 3D World won't obviously be beneficial, or that a price cut won't make the value proposition more attractive overall.
But the way some people post seems to imply a miraculous turn around to the levels of, for example, PS3 or 360 historic sales in the realm of 200 and 300K, without realising that even a turn around to the GCN levels of 100-150K would be a massive turnaround.
Post-purchase rationalisation is a funny thing. I bought it, I like it. Therefore there's nothing wrong with it. The wider market place is "wrong" in their rejection of the product. If you've bought it and see value in it, alongside the 33K others in May who bought it, there's nothing wrong with that. Nobody is judging your purchasing decisions. That doesn't make the product well-suited to the wider market.
People who are saying that these things won't help the system at all are completely wrong.
But the degree to which these things can turn around the product is another issue, that people skirt around.
What exactly do people think the system will end up selling in non-holiday months? 70K would be a doubling of May sales. 100K a tripling. 150K would be 4-5x. 200K would be a phenomenal 6-fold improvement. Getting to 300K would require an almost 10-fold.
The PS3 in 2010, at $299, rebranded with better advertising, with many key software titles coming out, v. the $499/$599, no games, crying creepy baby ads of 2007 saw an overall increase of around 2.5x.
More than one. More than 100. More than 10,000. All more factual and objective statements than any of the hyperbole and vitriol you are spouting. For all of your "the system is dead. No one wants it." the fact remains tat people do want it and the system isn't dead. Can Nintendo dramatically increase sales? Who knows? But the constant rhetoric and belligerence offered by you and others with similar posts in this thread contribute nothing worthwhile to discussion and essentially amount to dog piling and mob mentality for nothing more than the sake of entertainment.
shinra-bansho
Member
When someone says "no one wants it." They don't literally mean not a singular soul on the face of the planet wants it. There are clearly some people who want it, considering they have bought it.
If I say that "no one cares about the GamePad" I do not mean that no person could possibly be interested remotely in the features that the GamePad offers. There are people on here very satisfied with the GamePad and with the Wii U. There are people effusive about off-TV play. Or asymmetric gameplay. That's fine. That's someone's prerogative; buy the things you like.
But the features are not resonating with the wider market place, as witnessed by the very very poor sales. More than 10,000, yes. More than 10,000 a week in the largest gaming market? No. In very general terms, "people do not want the Wii U," if they did, it would be selling more.
People don't want to use Bing. People don't want the Vita. People don't want Windows 8. People don't want Sony TVs. And people don't want the Wii U.
metalslimer
Member
Even the 3DS, with its recovery has not doubled the baseline outside of japan. Anything under 100k a month in the US would not be a recovery. And let's say the wiiu does manage to sell 100k for a few moths post holiday. Once Nintendo uses the Mario Kart card they will essentially be out of evergreens. The system will collapse once again because even the wii couldn't hold on forever. By around April of next year Nintendo will have released 2d Mario, 3d mario, mario kart, and donkey kong.
Lets take a trip back to about a year ago, Reggie was interviewed about hardware power and 3rd parties.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-06-14-nintendo-hits-back-at-wii-u-power-concern
They've failed at the above.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-06-14-nintendo-hits-back-at-wii-u-power-concern
They've failed at the above.
As a recent buyer, I know where everyone is coming with the Gamepad. I was just as disinterested in it as everyone else. With 3 iPhones and 3 iPads in the house, a faux tablet held no interest for me. I basically bought the system on word of mouth for the usual games (Lego, NSMBU, ZombiU) and for much of the fall lineup.
But honestly, it's not a faux tablet. The way the screen and controls meld with the TV is genuinely often brilliant. It is hard to explain this to anyone, yet my friends who have played it now (all in the original camp as me and many of you) all agree that the Gamepad DOES work incredibly well and isn't gimmicky and useless.
The bitch for Nintendo is that going to every single potential buyer and letting them run through the system for a few hours... Yeah. And even worse, for security needing to keep the Gamepad bolted to a stand. Some of the most impressive aspects.. Scanning for stuff in Lego, or all of the panorama video apps available. These are the things really impressing my friends, and all things that are impossible at the store kiosks.
Long story short, an extra system was sold after a night of playing it at my house.. By people who ignored and even ridiculed the kiosk displays. This tells me a lot of the same as what's being said in here. Nintendo has a perception problem, and with normal retail sales setups I don't know how they can possibly fix it.
But honestly, it's not a faux tablet. The way the screen and controls meld with the TV is genuinely often brilliant. It is hard to explain this to anyone, yet my friends who have played it now (all in the original camp as me and many of you) all agree that the Gamepad DOES work incredibly well and isn't gimmicky and useless.
The bitch for Nintendo is that going to every single potential buyer and letting them run through the system for a few hours... Yeah. And even worse, for security needing to keep the Gamepad bolted to a stand. Some of the most impressive aspects.. Scanning for stuff in Lego, or all of the panorama video apps available. These are the things really impressing my friends, and all things that are impossible at the store kiosks.
Long story short, an extra system was sold after a night of playing it at my house.. By people who ignored and even ridiculed the kiosk displays. This tells me a lot of the same as what's being said in here. Nintendo has a perception problem, and with normal retail sales setups I don't know how they can possibly fix it.
shinra-bansho
Member
Over the first four years, the GCN had a non-Holiday monthly average of 115K.
I think it's not implausible that they "recover" to such a level and ultimately sell around the same amount (about 11.5M over ~5 years in the US, 1M in non-holiday months, 1-1.5M in Nov/Dec, 2-2.5M/year). But again, even that would be a doubling and a historically pretty big recovery at this stage.
metalslimer
Member
Sure, I also think the Gamecube had many advantages over Wiiu in terms of 3rd party support, pricing, and to be honest I think Nintendo had a better image with core gamers back then even if they failedwith the mainstream. If they can get the price down to 199 for an SKU i think they could pull 12 million in the US. However, i doubt nintendo gets that low anytime soon. I also dont see Wiiu having life for 5 years
shinra-bansho
Member
Well for one thing, a product in which people need to own it to actually see the benefit of it, is really a flawed product to begin with. It's simply not feasible. I've played it in-store for about an hour, and I didn't see the magic. It was fun, sure. But a lot of things are fun. It didn't make me feel a "need" to buy it. I'm not sure what a few more hours with it would do exactly. But then, one anecdote isn't really any more valid than another; the plural of anecdote is not data.
It's not ultimately really about whether the GamePad works or is gimmicky or not or is useless. It no doubt works and has its uses. But it's about making it a compelling case for it as a unique selling point.
Thus far, nothing Nintendo has done has made it such. Their best attempt thus far at showing people "this is why you need this second touch screen," what was meant to be the system's Wii Sports equivalent, fell flat. It couldn't move the system.
And a USP that isn't compelling, really isn't worth much in the end. They do not offer an easily distinguishable hardware "upgrade," so why does one buy a Wii U to replace their current system or why does one buy a Wii U over other alternatives. They have not made a compelling case to consumers for the touchscreen controller. So that leaves Nintendo games.
Competing systems have much more tangible selling points, lower price, large back-catalogs, more upcoming games, more fleshed out and populated online infrastructures. So a person's purchasing decision ultimately comes down to how much they must have Nintendo's games, which is presumably why we see a 70% attach rate for New Super Mario Bros U.
Getting back onto the topic at hand, given the above, it's perfectly reasonable for a publisher to have been unconvinced prior to release in what the Wii U was offering, and being now vindicated in their platform allocation decisions by the poor sales.
Their last gen lasted over 10 years (wii was a GC in new clothes). That's about the time Sony intends PS4 to be supported, and I expect it to be the same for Wii U. Nintendo needs this time to get familiar with HD development.
When a process - any process- is inefficient, the root cause is either a design or an execution fault. We all know Wii U isn't selling because Nintendo executed its system sellers launch badly. Their time to market was mishandleld. The OS used to be far slower than a PS3 and prone to crashes. They were clearly not ready.
Just as Wii sales were unpredictable to all analysts and gaffers, who called it a fad even after 2 years on the market, Wii U sales potential are far more complex to predict as a mere GameCube sales pattern comparison.
Wii U is a work in progress, with a vision that seems cleverly designed. By end of this year, something looking like a complete, final product will be at last on the market. We'll see over the next years how Nintendo will manage to attract the 100 milions people with wiimotes and/or balance boards at home, the +150 millions with Nintendo franchises on their DS/3DS.
We'll see how their Indie/HTML5 focus will play out for them. In the long run. Cause that's what makes the most sense for Nintendo. Have a long term strategy plan.
They designed an intriguing console, that people learn to appreciate with time, that is both different enough to other products... and familiar, extending value of equipments people already have.
Nintendo is an old company, that defies time. And analysts. And Gafers. They are rich enough to buy time. They will use this privilege to go for new kids and Wii/DS/3DS owners, solving one execution issue after another.
metalslimer
Member
What? Or maybe just maybe its a badly designed product that no one outside of nintendo hardcore fans will care about. You make it sound like the wiiu is some genius console. Reminds me of Skyzord posting about vita. And we can already see Nintendo's master Wiiu plan. Make sequels to what sold on wii and hope to god that's enough. If anything the gamepad will look ancient in 5 years let alone 10.
I agree with you completely. It's just not a tablet. If someone were to draw up a venn diagram of the functional uses behind a tablet and the gamepad then show those to a third party, no one would ever say they were the same product. I had the same experience as well with a friend coming over to play games and then going out and buying a console right away. They just need to get consoles into houses and get people playing with their friends, which I assume they realize because most of their games are multiplayer so far.
You don't really need to own it to begin with. You just need to experience it in a setting where you're actually experiencing it. You don't get to see any of the system features in-store. The console is basically a Wii in HD there. There's no off-screen play. There's no Miiverse. There's no multiplayer. You touch that tablet in store and you're like, oh cool, then you look back up at the big screen to continue playing the game and never look back down. They don't let you carry it around the store to play with it. They don't let you fight with your friends over who gets the big boy controller next.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
After reading a lot of posts here, my view is mostly reinforced that the biggest two problems the Wii U has remains marketing and lack of first party content.
About the gamepad being flawed because what makes it interesting isn't immediately obvious: this is a failure of marketing, IMO, not of the fundamental product. The bland, nearly pointless demo kiosks Nintendo has out there are designed with old-world thinking. They by their fundamental nature cannot properly communicate what the thing really is.
Imagine putting an iPad in a dead demo kiosk with no net connection and no apps loaded. And no real explanation of what it is or what it could offer as a lifestyle product. (Oddly enough, I seem to recall a lot of people saying the iPad was pointless at first glance, until it became clear what touch tablets could accomplish.)
I remain convinced the angle of the Wii U wasn't to be a Wii 2. And sell itself based entirely on one shining "gimmick" that would get everyone to rush over to pick it up and marvel. Where Nintendo has failed is in capitalizing quickly enough with software (due to, evidently, a billion things going wrong), and in figuring out how to market the thing. Honestly, Nintendo's marketing has never been that good, in the west at least. Their stroke of inspiration with the initial Wii campaign was probably the best thing they'd ever done before and since.
The 3rd biggest problem, almost complete lack of 3rd party support, is by itself potentially fatal but is in part a result of the first two problems.
About the gamepad being flawed because what makes it interesting isn't immediately obvious: this is a failure of marketing, IMO, not of the fundamental product. The bland, nearly pointless demo kiosks Nintendo has out there are designed with old-world thinking. They by their fundamental nature cannot properly communicate what the thing really is.
Imagine putting an iPad in a dead demo kiosk with no net connection and no apps loaded. And no real explanation of what it is or what it could offer as a lifestyle product. (Oddly enough, I seem to recall a lot of people saying the iPad was pointless at first glance, until it became clear what touch tablets could accomplish.)
I remain convinced the angle of the Wii U wasn't to be a Wii 2. And sell itself based entirely on one shining "gimmick" that would get everyone to rush over to pick it up and marvel. Where Nintendo has failed is in capitalizing quickly enough with software (due to, evidently, a billion things going wrong), and in figuring out how to market the thing. Honestly, Nintendo's marketing has never been that good, in the west at least. Their stroke of inspiration with the initial Wii campaign was probably the best thing they'd ever done before and since.
The 3rd biggest problem, almost complete lack of 3rd party support, is by itself potentially fatal but is in part a result of the first two problems.
It's not that you have to own it or tat it's a flawed product. It's that modern retail kiosks are a poor way to market key functionality. Motion frequently plays a big part with the Gamepad yet every kiosk I've seen it in has it on a fixed rigid arm. One of the cooler features is honestly popping in and out of games to like Miiverse or the Internet. Again, features you really aren't going to experience at a kiosk.
It's far from a heavily flawed product. It's more the equivalent from selling a brand new computer, for the first time ever to someone who didn't even barely know computers exist. How do you go over features? Which ones matter to them? You also have to explain each item you are trying show them. And you have like the 3-4 minutes to do this that a person typically spends at a retail kiosk.
Wii was easy. Stick a Wiimote in someone's hand at act like its a baseball bat or tennis racket. All of the biggest hits have that level of simplicity about them. Wii U isn't a failure because it can't be summed up that eloquently.. It's just unlikely to hit that level of success. No duh.
Your last sentence here is spot on. I am in 100% agreement. And honestly, I don't know.. It's almost like Nintendo is going to have to go back to the old days like they've been doing and actually having reps on hand to give you a hands on tour. Anyone I've shown it to walks away impressed, but it's because you actually get to USE the system. Without that, yeah it's a PS3 with a cheap tablet for like $50 more.
You could have made similar points about the 3ds before the ambassador program, price cut, and 3 big hitting software titles came out before christmas. Now it is in a considerably healthier situation, and the WiiU is clearly the focus of a lot of attention.
I don't think this system is judgeable yet, as we are looking at the true doldrums, what will probably be the very worst sales of its whole generation.
rohlfinator
Member
Those things are cool, but ultimately I don't think many people buy a console for OS features, they buy it for games. Features might get you to stick around (maybe you like off-screen play so you buy multiplats for Wii U instead of one of the other consoles) but if the games aren't there, all the cool features in the world aren't going to mean a lot. And Wii U is really lacking in system-seller games right now.
Metallix87
Member
We've had people suggesting Nintendo should abandon ship before the games even come out. People are definitely being short-sighted, whether you choose to believe it or not.
Oppo
Member
But how long should they wait? There's been a dribble in the 7 months since launch and the rest of the release calendar for 2013 is anemic.
Like, people think it's bad, ok, but I'm not sure they comprehend how bad the Wii U release selection has been and will be for the foreseeable future. If you love all those games, great, but man, that is slim pickings indeed.
I think the Wii U will be around for about 4 years. Then they will try to jump to another system. This thing is never going to get momentum short of a miracle - which does happen, but there's no reason to expect one now. I say this as a Vita owner who is experiencing the same thing, just not enough games. The only thing that saves it for me right now are the surprise indie titles that I haven't played yet, with cross-buy.