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2013 NBA Finals |OT| The "Big 3" looks to hang another banner... against the Heat

V

Vahagn

Member
I am Michael Bolton said:
Kobes amazing but he had the luxury of Shaq. Hakeem didnt have that. TD didnt have that. LeBron doesnt have that.
Click to expand...

Kareem and Magic have the luxury of each other, Lebron has Prime Wade and Bosh. And while I understand Shaq is better than Wade, LA's third player wasn't anywhere near as good as Bosh.


Lebron-Wade-Bosh
Kobe-Shaq-Horry
Kobe-Pau-Lamar
Magic-Kareem-Worthy

You're prepared to say Lebron had the worst caliber of talent and Kobe had the best? And remember Kobe with Shaq was before his prime. 21-24 year old. Lebron/Wade/Bosh are prime.

You're just not objective on this issue. What Kobe lacks is MVP's and while I know you think that he only deserved one. He was voted the best player in the league by every GM survey and every player survey for the greater part of a decade.

We saw how badly the Decision and being on a good team affected Bron getting MVP over Rose in 2011. Imagine that kind of national hate that Kobe's endured much of his whole career. There's not a single player that would say Kobe only having one MVP isn't a god damn travesty.
 
I

I am Michael Bolton

Banned
Vahagn said:
Lebron needs more help yo!
Click to expand...

LeBron had prime Wade for maybe a year. At this point its LeBron, Bosh, and Wade in name only.

Kobe has had prime Shaq and prime Pau
Hakeem had *crickets*
TD has never had a force like Kobe. Robinson was a shell of his prime when TD arrived. TP/Ginobli were never the dominating force of Shaq.
LeBron has never been able to depend and lean on a teammate like Kobe had in Shaq.

Take comfort that Kobe can be argued into the top 10. Its a crazy great achievement.
 
V

Vahagn

Member
28-32 year olds are the athletic prime of players. Shaq dealt with injuries and missed 15-20 games a season too. If you all don't think that Wade isn't in his prime, you're oblivious.


He's more in his prime than the Boston Big 3 were when they came together. He's more in his prime than the Kareem that Magic mostly had. He's more in his prime than a 22 year old Kobe was (but he's not half as good).

Lol at you all thinking Prime = best statistical year. The 03 class has been in their prime from about 2009 till now.

Edit: his PPG has gone down since Lebron joined, surely he's not in his prime!
 
G

GaimeGuy

Volunteer Deputy Campaign Director, Obama for America '16
Kobe is rather one-dimensional compared to guys like Jordan, Pippen, Bron, Duncan, KG, Hakeem, Robinson, and Shaq. And that's just looking in the last 20 years off the top of my head.

I wouldn't put him near my top 10 for that fact alone.

Can he score? Yes. But that's pretty much it. He's average-ish in all other aspects of his game. (Hasn't stopped him from being the most decorated player of all time in terms of all-defensive team appearances. wtf)

BTW, why are we discussing kobe in the finals thread?
 
V

Vahagn

Member
GaimeGuy said:
Kobe is rather one-dimensional compared to guys like Jordan, Pippen, Bron, Duncan, KG, Hakeem, Robinson, and Shaq. And that's just looking in the last 20 years off the top of my head.

I wouldn't put him near my top 10 for that fact alone.

Can he score? Yes. But that's pretty much it. He's average-ish in all other aspects of his game. (Hasn't stopped him from being the most decorated player of all time in terms of all-defensive team appearances. wtf)

BTW, why are we discussing kobe in the finals thread?
Click to expand...

It's good to know you know nothing about basketball my good man
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
Kobe is just a less efficient chucker version of Reggie Miller.
 
Z

Zeus Molecules

illegal immigrants are stealing our air
Honestly I think we're talking more about kobe (who wont even be back at the beginning of the season) than the Spurs winning or Lebron regression into his triple double = losing mode. Vag and bolton plz stfu with this debate.

I mean come on we all knows where this road leads...... Gay Kobe Fan Fiction.....
 
M

MorisUkunRasik

Member
Generally speaking 30+ years old is about the decline period for most guard players. Big men have 'primes' going into their 30s because they can still play well as they slow down, especially if they go from SF to PF or PF to C.

If you're being generous with how you use 'prime', Bron played 1 season with 'prime wade'.
 
P

Psychological Intellect

Banned
you're an idiot vag.

Jesus Christ. even prior to wades current knee thing.he can hardly beat his man off the dribble or break his man down any more. he can't finish at the rim any where near as well as he used to. you can even argue that he can't even shoot as well as he used to.

but he's in his prime?

edit: that's not to say that he's not a really good player because he is. he was pretty awesome most times this past regular season. he can still pass really well and make plays but there are just things he can't do or do as well as he used to because he's losing his athleticism.
 
G

GaimeGuy

Volunteer Deputy Campaign Director, Obama for America '16
wade's biggest problem is that he cares more about flopping than he does about playing basketball. As a result, easy layups are taken off-balance. He's not squared up on his fadeaways. His form is terrible because he's a little bitch trying to get the refs to do everything for him

He's been getting to the rim plenty of times these playoffs.
 
M

MorisUkunRasik

Member
Psychological Intellect said:
you're an idiot vag.

Jesus Christ. even prior to wades current knee thing.he can hardly beat his man off the dribble or break his man down any more. he can't finish at the rim any where near as well as he used to. you can even argue that he can't even shoot as well as he used to.

but he's in his prime?
Click to expand...

Prior to his knee there were tons of other injuries. If he was more durable he could have been in his prime still currently. But injury took a couple seasons off his prime. I wouldn't be surprised if he looks like a new man to start next season.... but ya know he's gonna try and go ham and end up crippled by playoff time again.
 
V

Vahagn

Member
The fact that Wade isn't as Durable is Kobe or Lebron isn't the damn measurement PI.

As I said, Wade is more in his prime than a 22 year old Kobe, than old man Kareem, than the Boston Big 3. He's the second and some still argue the best SG in the game behind Kobe.

You're ludicrous. You're acting like Wade hasn't been injury prone his whole career. That's just who he is. So was Shaq. Wade is still good enough to be considered Prime. So is Bosh. So is Lebron.

Remember how bad Wade looked against Chicago in 2011. Y'all thought he was past his prime. Then he lit up Dallas. He's taken a back seat to Lebron (in year one there was still that struggle of who's team it was) and he's had some injury concerns, but he's been more efficient than ever.

As I said, Lebron has Wade and Bosh closer to their prime, more in their prime, than any other super team ever assembled. Stop this nonsense.
 
M

MorisUkunRasik

Member
Vahagn said:
If you all don't think that Wade isn't in his prime, you're oblivious.
Click to expand...

Vahagn said:
Wade is more in his prime than a 22 year old Kobe, than old man Kareem, than the Boston Big 3.

Wade is still good enough to be considered Prime.

Wade and Bosh closer to their prime, more in their prime, than any other super team ever assembled. Stop this nonsense.
Click to expand...

In his prime.

More in his prime than X

In his prime

Closer to his prime than X

More in his prime than X


You must not have watched younger Wade. He's not in his prime.
 
V

Vahagn

Member
Psychological Intellect said:
You know what guys


I got vagd
Click to expand...

The fact that you're bitching after assembling literally the most broken team in history because your dude has some knee issues is just insane. Two top 5 players in their absolute prime joined another franchise player who can get you 25 a night easy and you're complaining about Lebron needs more help.

Have some damn perspective yo
 
G

GaimeGuy

Volunteer Deputy Campaign Director, Obama for America '16
Vahagn said:
The fact that you're bitching after assembling literally the most broken team in history because your dude has some knee issues is just insane. Two top 5 players in their absolute prime joined another franchise player who can get you 25 a night easy and you're complaining about Lebron needs more help.

Have some damn perspective yo
Click to expand...

Not to mention all the bench guys who joined for chump change...
 
V

Vahagn

Member
MorisUkunRasik said:
In his prime.

More in his prime than X

In his prime

Closer to his prime than X

More in his prime than X


You must not have watched younger Wade. He's not in his prime.
Click to expand...

I have. 09. Scoring title season. Remember when LA got Pau, and Kobe scored like 7 points less from a couple years ago and broke his index finger? Was he "not in his prime?" or was he 30/31... Still in his prime, just dealing with nagging injuries and on a more loaded team.

Wade is 31. His body isn't as durable as Lebron's so you're mistaking playing hurt for being past his prime. Shaq in 2002-2003 was still in his prime. But he played hurt and his numbers went down a bit.

Unless you define "prime" as one season, than of course Lebron won't have Wade in his "prime". But that's not how athletes primes work
 
P

Psychological Intellect

Banned
You're insecure
Don't know what for
You're turning heads when you walk through the door
Don't need make up
To cover up
Being the way that you are is enough

Everyone else in the room can see it
Everyone else but you

[Chorus]
Baby you light up my world like nobody else
The way that you flip your hair gets me overwhelmed
But when you smile at the ground it aint hard to tell
You don't know
Oh Oh
You don't know you're beautiful

If only you saw what I can see
You'll understand why I want you so desperately
Right now I'm looking at you and I can't believe
You don't know
Oh oh
You don't know you're beautiful
Oh oh
That what makes you beautiful

So c-come on
You got it wrong
To prove I'm right I put it in a song
I don't know why
You're being shy
And turn away when I look into your eyes

Everyone else in the room can see it
Everyone else but you

[Chorus]
Baby you light up my world like nobody else
The way that you flip your hair gets me overwhelmed
But when you smile at the ground it aint hard to tell
You don't know
Oh oh
You don't know you're beautiful

If only you saw what I can see
You'll understand why I want you so desperately
Right now I'm looking at you and I can't believe
You don't know
Oh oh
You don't know you're beautiful
Oh oh
That's what makes you beautiful

[Bridge]
Nana Nana Nana Nana
Nana Nana Nana Nana
Nana Nana Nana Nana

Baby you light up my world like nobody else
The way that you flip your hair gets me overwhelmed
But when you smile at the ground it aint hard to tell
You don't know
Oh Oh
You don't know you're beautiful

[Chorus]
Baby you light up my world like nobody else
The way that you flip your hair gets me overwhelmed
But when you smile at the ground it aint hard to tell
You don't know
Oh oh
You don't know you're beautiful

If only you saw what I can see
You'll understand why I want you so desperately
Right now I'm looking at you and I can't believe
You don't know
Oh Oh
You don't know you're beautiful
Oh oh
You don't know you're beautiful
Oh oh
That's what makes you beautiful
 
M

MorisUkunRasik

Member
Vahagn said:
Shouldn't you be betting someone your liver that Heat in 5?



That's an awesome "I have no rebuttal so. Class clown time"
Click to expand...

My rebuttal is: you're dumb. Real dumb. It's hard to read the dumb shit you post it's so dumb.

I can't muster an actual response anymore because you'll never stop, you'll move goalposts and say something is fact just cause. You'll say shit like "i'm obviously right, you're obviously wrong", you'll cherry pick stats, you'll pull hypotheticals for no god damn reason from your ass, you'll strawman an argument to death.

At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if you overheard someone say they just had the best turkey sandwich ever and felt obligated to explain to them that if Kobe Bryant was a turkey sandwich he'd be better and more clutch and that their sandwich benefited from being paired with a prime beverage.

HUQIKZT.gif
 
V

Vahagn

Member
MorisUkunRasik said:
My rebuttal is: you're dumb. Real dumb. It's hard to read the dumb shit you post it's so dumb.

I can't muster an actual response anymore because you'll never stop, you'll move goalposts and say something is fact just cause. You'll say shit like "i'm obviously right, you're obviously wrong", you'll cherry pick stats, you'll pull hypotheticals for no god damn reason from your ass, you'll strawman an argument to death.

At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if you overheard someone say they just had the best turkey sandwich ever and felt obligated to explain to them that if Kobe Bryant was a turkey sandwich he'd be better and more clutch and that their sandwich benefited from being paired with a prime beverage.
Click to expand...

That was actually pretty hilarious.

Edit: The rest of your accusations are just dumb, if I don't agree with you and produce numbers to back up my position I'm "cherry picking" stats. If I give you an example to illustrate a position I'm "pulling hypotheticals out of my ass". If I address the implications of things you say I'm "straw manning an argument to death"

You sound like a political puppet reciting spin. You think it's cool to just go "der der he mentioned Kobe again" - ill call you out on being the class clown and constantly trying to get a laugh on a message board of people you'll rarely if ever meet but still trying desperately to impress. Deal with it, I'm not the only one with a "shtick" here.
 
M

MorisUkunRasik

Member
My 'schtick' has never derailed a thread let alone multiple threads. And a lot of my posts aren't attempts at humor....but keep going with this class clown stuff. I can deal with the class clown insult, but you're the one with the face paint.
 
G

giri

Member
theignoramus said:
i know, but his face looked better back then. he looks like hes been through a dozen bar fights since
Click to expand...

he has. it's called Dirk and TD.


To put a less sarcastic tone to it. It's .... amazing how many of the long term talents from the late 2000's that were PF's are coming through at the moment. Dirk. TD. To some extent, bosh. Shame Amare could never stay healthy.

It just proves how much a big really actually means.

Sorry OKC, ibaka doesn't count.
 
J

J2 Cool

Member
theignoramus said:
i know, but his face looked better back then. he looks like hes been through a dozen bar fights since
Click to expand...

orgies

GaimeGuy said:
wade's biggest problem is that he cares more about flopping than he does about playing basketball. As a result, easy layups are taken off-balance. He's not squared up on his fadeaways. His form is terrible because he's a little bitch trying to get the refs to do everything for him

He's been getting to the rim plenty of times these playoffs.
Click to expand...

Confidence. The pump fakes, the flopping are just desperate attempts at making the game easier for Wade. The floor shrinks for a "superstar" who comes up to the 3 point line with a guy playing 5 feet off him, and dishes. This is Wade in just '09 pulling the trigger: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZSFpGlFrGU&t=2m30s

He's also getting room in his mid-game a little to hit buckets, and he's balking at it and passing. As a star shooting guard you can't think twice about putting it up, and that indecision is making him largely useless. I don't think he's as physically gone as people suspect, if anything something physical has him convinced he doesn't feel right. OR possibly he's gained some bad habits deferring to Lebron this season, when he absolutely isn't 100%. Some analysts have praised Wade for learning to give up the #1 role to Lebron, and playing second fiddle, but then what makes then special to any other team if Wade doesn't differ from the average #2?

He may yet have another good game or two good games this series. I don't think that will create any consistency out of the situation. Wade is a little banged up, and the Heat's identity is in the middle of a transformation. On paper and against a lot of regular season teams, they look like a team that has all the parts of an all-time great team, but playoff basketball and pressure puts it in a whole different light. What either has to happen is Lebron shoulders a greater load, especially the last 6 minutes of game time (saving himself a little more; i.e. no more 18 boards) OR Wade and Bosh find something more akin to their true roles as a 2 and 3.

Problem is Duncan is a nightmare matchup for Bosh. I don't think he can physical up Duncan and he certainly can't guard him. I could see him being forcing aggression in spurts and reverting back to jumpers. And Wade, confidence isn't an overnight thing. He has to start hitting shots outside, then work inside once they respect it. Spurs play him real smart, don't get him in any FT rhythm, and largely aren't afraid of him. If he ever makes it to driving again, he still has Duncan down low. I'm just not buying that Wade's banged up that much though. I've seen more banged up, more effective players.

I think Lebron expanding his role in crunch minutes, and hoping his team holds on for other parts of the game that he rests up a little more is the most realistic 'solution'. Although his minds already gone to Bosh and Wade in postgame interviews in the Indiana series, and I'm still a little shocked he is so willingly admitting to being tired in game 1.
 
F

fertygo

Member
Wade's three look miserable today compared to that video lol

He only shot like 8 3pta on this playoff? and only made 2 or 3. Most big shoot more than that today, hurt their spacing..
 
S

SamuraiX-

Member
About to board flight out of Fort Lauderdale back to Cali... wtf is up with the random flash flooding type of weather in Florida??

HeatGAF and MagicGAF, how do you guys put up with this shit for 6 straight months every year???
 
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