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[TrebleShot]

They can't buy Ubisoft.

They can the streaming rights in the uk won’t stop it they’d just sell them to anyone if the other bidders

 

[Codes 208]

I still remember how buying bungie felt like a knee-jerk reaction to MS’s original bid last year (the year before? I forgot how long ago this shit started)

 

[simdog461]

They can the streaming rights in the uk won’t stop it they’d just sell them to anyone if the other bidders

Possibly, but it's probably too much of a headache having to renegotiate the deal with the CMA.

There's a condition on the deal where neither company can invest in one another for 10 years.

 

[ResilientBanana]

Sony as a whole has $14b to spend. Its not likely they will make a purchase higher than $3b

 

[simdog461]

Sony as a whole has $14b to spend. Its not likely they will make a purchase higher than $3b

That's only for this financial year though.

 

[ResilientBanana]

That's only for this financial year though.

I don’t think that’s how cash on hand works. That’s how much the have in the bank. It’s not profit from the year. For instance, Microsoft had $111b before the Activision purchase as of June ‘23.

 

[DrFigs]

Sony as a whole has $14b to spend. Its not likely they will make a purchase higher than $3b

There was never a law that Sony could only spend 18 billion dollars or whatever. This was a number they decided on and could always change.

I don’t think that’s how cash on hand works.

Companies borrow money, they can sell stock. Acquisitions don't need to be made with cash.

 

[simdog461]

I don’t think that’s how cash on hand works.

Agreed, but cash on hand is not the only way you can buy stuff.
Most big acquisitions are usually a combo of cash, stocks and debt.

As an example, look up how Disney financed their Fox purchase, certainly wasn't all cash.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

I wouldn’t speak so soon. Fact of the matter is If T2 go up for sale MS would pay comfortably more than Sony for them.

Literally why do people keep saying this? MS is not about to blindly open their wallet every time some studio/publisher is available simply to get them before Sony does. There is way more to it than that.

 

[ResilientBanana]

There was never a law that Sony could only spend 18 billion dollars or whatever. This was a number they decided on and could always change.

Companies borrow money, they can sell stock. Acquisitions don't need to be made with cash.

Borrowing money for a purchase such as a studio/publisher is a dumb move and would incur interest over time or make them have to pay a debt. Sony won’t be making any huge investments in the near future. Only smaller ones. Which is a smart move for them.

 

[DrFigs]

Borrowing money for a purchase such as a studio/publisher is a dumb move and would incur interest over time or make them have to pay a debt. Sony won’t be making any huge investments in the near future. Only smaller ones. Which is a smart move for them.

Taking on some debt or selling stock to finance investments is a normal part of doing business for every other company other than Microsoft.

 

[simdog461]

Borrowing money for a purchase such as a studio is a dumb move and would incur interest over time. Sony won’t be making any huge investments in the near future. Only smaller ones.

That's literally how M&A's happen though.

You run the numbers and if the investment gives you a positive return (including interest payments), and it meets the company's requirements for how big of an ROI is required, it's a good purchase.
Right now, interest rates are quite high, so they'd want to borrow as little as possible, so selling stocks or assets (like how they are actively looking to spin off their financial arm) would be key.

Sony is a very very asset heavy company for their size. They have around 1/2 the total assets that Microsoft does, despite being worth over 20x less on the stock market.

 

[UltimaKilo]

Square is garbage. Maybe for 1bn or less.

Capcom, CDPR and EA only relevant stuff that worth the money.

Square loses so much money, nobody is going to take that company on.

CAPCOM would be interesting for SNY.

Sony doesn’t have the money to acquire EA.

CDPR is probably, if I were at Xbox, what I would make a move on.

Sony’s other option is to open up new studios and acquire smaller companies.

 

[skit_data]

Great, this consolidation of the industry means that in the end more multiplatform games becomes bricks in the strategy to have some kind of pull factor for consoles.

Either there will be some kind of "mutually assured destruction" policy established to avoid people leaving the console space for PC due to console having fewer games overall or it will lead to a faster decline in competitors in the space. Just great.

 

[ResilientBanana]

That's literally how M&A's happen though.

You run the numbers and if the investment gives you a positive return (including interest payments), and it meets the company's requirements for how big of an ROI is required, it's a good purchase.
Right now, interest rates are quite high, so they'd want to borrow as little as possible, so selling stocks or assets (like how they are actively looking to spin off their financial arm) would be key.

Sony is a very very asset heavy company for their size. They have around 1/2 the total assets that Microsoft does, despite being worth over 20x less on the stock market.

Yeah but not super long ago, Sony wasn’t doing so hot credit-wise. Either way. Why put Sony in debt when they could comfortably purchase a well thought out acquisition? Sony is successful in the gaming market already, they don’t NEED to acquire anyone. But if they did, there’s no reason to go in debt .

 

[simdog461]

Yeah but not super long ago, Sony wasn’t doing so hot credit-wise. Either way. Why put Sony in debt when they could comfortably purchase a well thought out acquisition? Sony is successful in the gaming market already, they don’t NEED to acquire anyone. But if they did, there’s no reason to go in debt .

They don't need to acquire anyone today, it's about future proofing.
You're better off making these moves from a position of strength rather than a position of desperation.

If they look back in 10 years time when microsoft potentially owns: Call of Duty, Minecraft, all blizzard IP, GTA, Red Dead, the 2K games, Elder scrolls, fallout + more, it will be too late.

And you're right, they could sell off more assets/ stocks to buy someone debt free. But usually it's a combo.

Say for a $30bn purchase- 1/3 cash, 1/3 stock and 1/3 debt ($10bn in debt isn't a lot for a company of Sony's size).

 

[Heisenberg007]

You're crazy if you think Sony(Playstation) doesn't care about Microsoft(Xbox).

None of their actions shows that they care. PlayStation doesn't see Xbox as a serious competitor anymore because of the huge gulf between the two, which keeps growing.

 

[poodaddy]

I truly do think Sony will get Square at some point. Don't know that it will be soon, but I honestly believe it will happen at some point. I'm somewhat ambivalent on whether that's ultimately good or not, but I got a feeling that it's gonna happen.

 

[StueyDuck]

Consolidation yaaaaay.

Sony don't have a casual 70bil to drop however so I think these people's dreams of Sony trying to compete won't happen to the extremes people think.

 

[simdog461]

None of their actions shows that they care. PlayStation doesn't see Xbox as a serious competitor anymore because of the huge gulf between the two, which keeps growing.

I think square is a horrible purchase.

Yes they have final fantasy, but not a lot else that generates mega sales.

 

[daninthemix]

As a PC gamer, it's wonderful that that will have no effect on me <smugface>

 

[Heisenberg007]

I think square is a horrible purchase.

Yes they have final fantasy, but not a lot else that generates mega sales.

Yeah, I don't think Sony will prioritize SquareEnix either. I think their next big acquisition will be a Korean hybrid publisher that gives them content across console games, F2P GaaS, mobile, and PC.

 

[Heisenberg007]

As a PC gamer, it's wonderful that that will have no effect on me <smugface>

 

[Heisenberg007]

Consolidation yaaaaay.

Sony don't have a casual 70bil to drop however so I think these people's dreams of Sony trying to compete won't happen to the extremes people think.

The thing most ignore is that it is not Sony that's trying to compete. Sony is comfortably sitting on the #1 spot with 0 risks and continuing to grow. Spider-Man 2, their next release, will be one of the biggest launches of the 9th generation.

It is Microsoft that's trying to compete and, therefore, buying companies in a desperate attempt to do so.

 

[sinnergy]

The thing most ignore is that it is not Sony that's trying to compete. Sony is comfortably sitting on the #1 spot with 0 risks and continuing to grow. Spider-Man 2, their next release, will be one of the biggest launches of the 9th generation.

It is Microsoft that's trying to compete and, therefore, buying companies in a desperate attempt to do so.

MS doesn’t care, has enough money. I don’t think they are desperate at all, they like to be in gaming and want to grow , so that that future is secure.

 

[balls of snow]

Depends on their new playstation head hancho after Jimbo exits. They probably will gobble up a japanese publisher if not only to secure their stranglehold on the console markets. I dont know if its still true but playstation is probably the only pillar making fuck you money for sony.

 

[balls of snow]

None of those would move any sort of needle. Call of Duty alone is more valuable than all those publishers combined.

They need Take 2 to actually reply. GTA is the only thing that would offset COD.

Capcom can probably go toe to toe with cod. Monster Hunter alone is a system seller that pulls in the hardcore and casuals. Add Resident Evil, Devil May Cry and Street Fighter and you got yourself the best console for japanese diehards.

 

[simdog461]

Capcom can probably go toe to toe with cod. Monster Hunter alone is a system seller that pulls in the hardcore and casuals. Add Resident Evil, Devil May Cry and Street Fighter and you got yourself the best console for japanese diehards.

Nah the only game that can consistently go toe to toe with COD is GTA.

 

[FalconPunch]

True. That’s how MS got ABK after all.




In the case of most devs sure, I don’t think MS will care enough. But we are talking about T2…. GTA. MS would not let that one slip through their moneyed up fingers.

Any attempt by MS to buy T2 would be immediately blocked by the regulatory bodies. Making 2 large purchases like this in a short period of time would draw unwanted negative attention. As it stands right now, if the government were doing its job properly, MS should be under antitrust suits for Office and Windows.

 

[John Wick]

True. That’s how MS got ABK after all.




In the case of most devs sure, I don’t think MS will care enough. But we are talking about T2…. GTA. MS would not let that one slip through their moneyed up fingers.

You keep on blatantly forgetting that the landscape has changed. How are they gonna push this deal through? There will be massive opposition to this. They won't be allowed to own COD and GTA.

 

[Sanepar]

Any attempt by MS to buy T2 would be immediately blocked by the regulatory bodies. Making 2 large purchases like this in a short period of time would draw unwanted negative attention. As it stands right now, if the government were doing its job properly, MS should be under antitrust suits for Office and Windows.

How naive u need to be to believe in regulators after AbK deal? They will just need to pay the "right price" to buy it. Ea ans t2 are on ms pocket. Just a matter of times.

 

[Roxkis_ii]

Why does Sony need to buy a 3rd party studio? They aren't having issues releasing games.

 

[Jigsaah]

At this point, why the fuck not...Microsoft broke the seal...time for Sony to piss all over the walls. Sony goes for EA...let's see it. I need another 1600+ page thread about the nuances of acquisition law.

The hypocrisy will be delicious.

 

[mejin]

Sony can't burn money for decades like MS. But they need to secure some iconic ips for PlayStation.

 

[CosmicComet]

They need something.

Buying Bungie ended up being the most toothless acquisition of all time.

 

[Godot25]

They need something.

Buying Bungie ended up being the most toothless acquisition of all time.

Maybe because that acquisition was not about "having a tooth" in fantasy land of console wars.
It was to give Sony expertise for live service games for their live service games push. Yes, Sony could "organically" create live service studio, but it would take years or even decades to get them where Bungie is today.

Thanks to Bungie, Sony did not embarrass themselves with TLOU "Factions 2" and they also canned Deviation new project that probably also didn't look so hot.

So that purchase did exactly what Sony was hoping it would do.

 

[Flutta]

They need something.

Buying Bungie ended up being the most toothless acquisition of all time.

Eh we don’t know that yet. Let’s wait till Marathon and their other IP releases first.

Regarding the topic at hand i don’t believe Sony can go for the big pubs like T2 or EA to go toe and toe with ABK and Beth, maybe in the size of SE or something of that nature. Imo they should go for the smaller studios instead it’s more cost effective that way.

 

[bitbydeath]

Nah the only game that can consistently go toe to toe with COD is GTA.

Fortnite is up their I think, possibly even bigger.

 

[ResilientBanana]

They don't need to acquire anyone today, it's about future proofing.
You're better off making these moves from a position of strength rather than a position of desperation.

If they look back in 10 years time when microsoft potentially owns: Call of Duty, Minecraft, all blizzard IP, GTA, Red Dead, the 2K games, Elder scrolls, fallout + more, it will be too late.

And you're right, they could sell off more assets/ stocks to buy someone debt free. But usually it's a combo.

Say for a $30bn purchase- 1/3 cash, 1/3 stock and 1/3 debt ($10bn in debt isn't a lot for a company of Sony's size).

Sorry, no , this won’t happen. Not a single purchased Microsoft has made was done this way. Sony won’t do it either. Just like at Sony’s purchase history. They bought Bungie for $3.6b which was their biggest expense in some time.

List of acquisitions by Sony - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Ev1L AuRoN]

<_<

>_>

Spoiler

I'm an analyst IRL

Same, IT Analyst here, . But I don't do predictions.

 

[Ic3man]

Whatever they buy it won't be nearly as impactful as Bethesda or Activision-Blizzard-King.

 

[Gavon West]

This guy expects Sony to make a huge purchase as impactful as ABK but, Sony were given the same opportunity when ABK pitched the deal to them and they denied it. Yet, Sony is gonna take another huge deal as impactful as ABK.

Um....okay?

 

[Nankatsu]

At the end of the day they are just gonna buy Kojima's Studio

Capcom would be huge, but I don't see it happening. They output 3rd party bangers after bangers and are financially healthy.

 

[Godot25]

Sony were given the same opportunity when ABK pitched the deal to them and they denied it.

Source?

 

[Gavon West]

Source?

Do you really need one? Lol. You can't be serious.

 

[Godot25]

Do you really need one? Lol. You can't be serious.

If I really need source for information that Sony was in the "mix" to buy ABK?

Yeah. I want it...

 

[Gavon West]

If I really need source for information that Sony was in the "mix" to buy ABK?

Yeah. I want it...

I did some research and it doesn't look like Sony was ever offered the deal. Not to sound sarcastic but, they couldnt afford it. My apologies. I assumed since Sony and Activision were so such bed fellows, Sony would have been offered the deal by default. Guess that wasn't true. Again, my bad.

 

[Godot25]

I did some research and it doesn't look like Sony was ever offered the deal. Not to sound sarcastic but, they couldnt afford it. My apologies. I assumed since Sony and Activision were so such bed fellows, Sony would have been offered the deal by default. Guess that wasn't true. Again, my bad.

I mean. Sony of course could "outbid" Microsoft same way that EA outbid Take-Two for Codemasters (Take-Two even announced purchase of Codies, but then EA offered more). But it was not a realistic scenario. There were maybe 2 companies that could outbid Microsoft for ABK - Apple and Google.

From what I understand, when this "sexual harassment" stuff happened and shares of ABK plummeted to 58$, Spencer started talking to Bobby and when he was willing to sell, he talk to Nadella to get it through Microsoft board.

 

[IllegalLemon]

From what I gather, the Zenimax acquisition didn't move the needle by any observable margin. Why should Sony focus on publishers? Go for independent studios instead and try to aim for those Microsoft is doing partnerships with. Asobo & VicariousVisions are great candidates, especially the latter when it comes to support studios(which are beneficial for Sony 1P). They lack Rpg's, so trying for Eidos Montreal would be great since Embracer is open for selling some of their own. Why not aim for Crystal Dynamics as well, they'd be a great addition and having the Tomb Raider next to Nathan Drake? Killer combo. Their roots are Japanese, so maybe they can cut Kadokawa a deal they can't refuse and nab FromSoft as well. Remedy is a good candidate too, so why not go for them as well? Perhaps even try to go after CDPR, but I doubt they'd accept. Honestly, I was hoping the gaming industry wouldn't come to this, but here we are. Sony will be forced to respond, keeping their arms crossed isn't really an option at this point.

 

[IllegalLemon]

I mean. Sony of course could "outbid" Microsoft same way that EA outbid Take-Two for Codemasters (Take-Two even announced purchase of Codies, but then EA offered more). But it was not a realistic scenario. There were maybe 2 companies that could outbid Microsoft for ABK - Apple and Google.

From what I understand, when this "sexual harassment" stuff happened and shares of ABK plummeted to 58$, Spencer started talking to Bobby and when he was willing to sell, he talk to Nadella to get it through Microsoft board.

Meta tried to outbid Microsoft for ABK, but were out of their league.