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[Critical Jeff]

Thats what my cuz did on the first week (scotch not duct) and he never had a problem since. It does look ghetto though.

But still some people are really mad (and some of them even own the phone).

Does it look that bad? Scotch tape nearly becomes invisible on a surface if there are no bubbles under it.

 

[Gary Whitta]

What podcast?

Tested failed at streaming live so we recorded it and I imagine it'll go up tonight.

 

[D4Danger]

You missed the CNN article showing you how to put duct tape on your phone didn't you.....

nobody reads CNN

 

[Gary Whitta]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2G9eYX77i4

I love Woz but man does it take it too far sometimes :lol

 

[jonnybryce]

Despite news coverage, I really thought this was mostly a nerd problem.

Today at work, a coworker told me that she just cancelled her iPhone 4 order because "it's broken, all the programming formulas are wrong and it basically can't make calls. I'll wait until they fix it." Another coworker just got a 4 today and chuckled saying that he got the phone today, when they're going to recall it tomorrow.

Mainstream consumers are more informed nowadays. I felt like I was in bizzarro land. They're not supposed to know or care about these kinds of things.

P.s. I vote that tomorrow they'll just re-iterate how they've solved the signal bar problem and that's that. I doubt they'll be a recall, free bumpers (this is a horrible solution to the problem) or free monies.

 

[bionic77]

Does it look that bad? Scotch tape nearly becomes invisible on a surface if there are no bubbles under it.

Nah, nobody ever notices it, but I love to give him shit over it.

 

[Gary Whitta]

wrong thread

 

[Jamesfrom818]

I really don't know how you guys are looking at that graphic and concluding that the new Apple bars is in line with Android. And the bars aren't just for calls. They also give some indication of data speed...

I think he's saying the old bars look similar to Androids which is a crock of shit because 1 bar on Android could almost be 3 bars on iOS 4.0

 

[nib95]

I should note given my accusations regarding Apple and the bar display that the iOS 4.0 bars are in-line with android (although this graphic may only be representative of some android phone/OS):

and re-iterate my support for a digital display: can I make a call? yes/no

God all of this is just making me lose respect for Apple more and more. originally one whole bar Androids covers nearly 3 of Apple's. That's Apple cheating consumers as it is. Then with the new OS, an exceptionally low 1 bar rating of up to -121db from -113db? It's a joke. Apple are a joke. My damn iPhone 4 feels like a half arsed product.

List of issues I've had so far.

- Antenna signal issue
- Sensor issue leading to my cheeks constantly pressing the wrong thing and dropping calls.
- Uploading vids to Facebook causing my phone to freeze/crash.
- Top right button was loose on my old phone, and fine on my new replacement till I dropped it earlier and now it wiggles too!
- When you delete pictures, instead of them disappearing you sometimes just get a blank black box.

Anyone else having any or all of the above?

 

[borghe]

I really don't know how you guys are looking at that graphic and concluding that the new Apple bars is in line with Android. And the bars aren't just for calls. They also give some indication of data speed...

Who's saying that. Clearly the new bars are a bit harsher than android. According to the newer formula you could get 4 bars on android but only 3 on 4.1. Of course that doesn't address the underlying issue that you are effectively getting the same signal strength.

Hence why they need to go to a binary symbol for voice calls. There's more of a need for bars for data, but unless all cellphone manufacturers band together for a standard on bars, they're still meaningless if one company wants to make their bars more accurate or another buffs theirs up a little to make it look like it handles signals better. Etc.

 

[jambo]

- Top right button was loose on my old phone, and fine on my new replacement till I dropped it earlier and now it wiggles too!

My Prius was fine until I drove it in to a tree, now it won't start. Fucking Toyota!

 

[santouras]

Let's also not forget that the dbm reading is not linear, but logarithmic, and also that you can have 60% loss and still get perfect calls. The android and older Apple calculations made the most amount of sense from a laymans perspective.

 

[giga]

God all of this is just making me lose respect for Apple more and more. originally one whole bar Androids covers nearly 3 of Apple's. That's Apple cheating consumers as it is. Then with the new OS, an exceptionally low 1 bar rating of up to -121db from -113db? It's a joke. Apple are a joke. My damn iPhone 4 feels like a half arsed product.

If you read the actual article, you'd understand why they increased the range up to -121dBm.

It's odd that you guys are having a hissy fit over the mapping of the lower bars as that wasn't even the issue. It was the fact that the 5 bar reading encompassed more than 50% of the spectrum and large amounts of attenuation were causing a misunderstanding over how much signal loss there really was.

- Top right button was loose on my old phone, and fine on my new replacement till I dropped it earlier and now it wiggles too!

Not sure if serious?

 

[Marty Chinn]

If you read the actual article, you'd understand why they increased the range up to -121dBm.

It's odd that you guys are having a hissy fit over the mapping of the lower bars as that wasn't even the issue. It was the fact that the 5 bar reading encompassed more than 50% of the spectrum and large amounts of attenuation were causing a misunderstanding over how much signal loss there really was.

I think the only hissy fit to have over the bars is the fact that they used this algorithm to begin with. They clearly had to know how much signal degradation would cause each bar to drop and its clear that once you lose 5 bars, it drops pretty quickly with so little range.

 

[borghe]

God all of this is just making me lose respect for Apple more and more. originally one whole bar Androids covers nearly 3 of Apple's. That's Apple cheating consumers as it is. Then with the new OS, an exceptionally low 1 bar rating of up to -121db from -113db? It's a joke. Apple are a joke. My damn iPhone 4 feels like a half arsed product.

List of issues I've had so far.

- Antenna signal issue
- Sensor issue leading to my cheeks constantly pressing the wrong thing and dropping calls.
- Uploading vids to Facebook causing my phone to freeze/crash.
- Top right button was loose on my old phone, and fine on my new replacement till I dropped it earlier and now it wiggles too!
- When you delete pictures, instead of them disappearing you sometimes just get a blank black box.

Anyone else having any or all of the above?

Ok, this is what I'm talking about. You have the two known issues, an issue with a 3rd party app, and an issue because you dropped your phone, and even though only the two known issues have anything to do with apple, all of them are reasons why apple is losing your respect. :/

In regards to the bars, even anandtech showed that the phone can hold onto a low signal like a champ. That was never the concern. So if it can hold onto a -121dBm signal, wouldn't you want it to tell you it has one vs. saying you have no signal at all? Outside of that, apples new algorithm is even stricter than google's, so I guess I'm missing the problem.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Just updated my 3GS...
...so you're telling me that this entire time that it was showing the full 5 bars in my apartment, that it was actually 2 this entire time? What the fuck. :lol

Pwnt.

 

[nib95]

If you read the actual article, you'd understand why they increased the range up to -121dBm.

It's odd that you guys are having a hissy fit over the mapping of the lower bars as that wasn't even the issue. It was the fact that the 5 bar reading encompassed more than 50% of the spectrum and large amounts of attenuation were causing a misunderstanding over how much signal loss there really was.


Not sure if serious?

Dude, the first one shipped wiggling (my house mates and another friends wiggled from launch), my replacement took a mild drop from about 1 metre tops to a carpet floor and now wiggles too. I've dropped phones countless times (including my 3GS) and they've never immediately caused a problem let alone ever caused one.

I'd ask you guys all to see if your top right button wiggles. Surprising how many iPhone 4's do it.

 

[Raistlin]

Yes, my guess would be a very minor hardware revision - probably a non-conductive coating on the bezel - and free replacement for anyone who wants it. They could revise any returned units and sell them as refurbs to mitigate the cost.

Unfortunately, that sort of 'fix' has been tested and failed to solve the problem.

It was the exact same broken measurements since the first iPhone. Apple didn't do anything to make the 4 seem better. It was the same.

While true the formula didn't change, it is interesting they decided to drop the numerical dBm display from iOS 4.0.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Unfortunately, that sort of 'fix' has been tested and failed to solve the problem.





While true the formula didn't change, it is interesting they decided to drop the numerical dBm display from iOS 4.0.

Um, I have the numerical dBm on my iPhone 4. Idk.

 

[Tobor]

Pwnt.

Yeah, man, he's pwnt. All those calls he made over the years never really happened.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Yeah, man, he's pwnt. All those calls he made over the years never really happened.

We just looking to start arguments?

Take a break. I'll tag you out.

 

[Tobor]

We just looking to start arguments?

Take a break. I'll tag you out.

Just joking. Relax. Extra smileys to make up for leaving it off the last post.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Just joking. Relax. Extra smileys to make up for leaving it off the last post.

lol. I was joking too. With the comment to him as well.

 

[Tobor]

lol. I was joking too. With the comment to him as well.

Hugs and kisses! You'll be around tomorrow I presume? I'll be checking in on my soon to be collectors edition iPhone 4!

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Hugs and kisses! You'll be around tomorrow I presume? I'll be checking in on my soon to be collectors edition iPhone 4!

Gonna try to be. Honestly...if the os update fixes the proximity issue, I'm keeping the phone. It's been a champ.

 

[Raistlin]

Um, I have the numerical dBm on my iPhone 4. Idk.

Did they hide it? I've seen all sorts of people bitching about it not being there - in all the antenna threads?

 

[giga]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/16/technology/16apple.html?_r=3&partner=yahoofinance

One person with direct knowledge of the phone’s design said Thursday that the iPhone 4 exposed a longstanding weakness in the basic communications software inside Apple’s phones and that the reception problems were not caused by an isolated hardware flaw.

Instead, the problems emerged in the complex interaction between specialized communications software and the antenna, said the person, who agreed to speak on the condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss the matter.

The person said the problems were longstanding but had been exposed by the design of the iPhone 4. All cellphones can be affected by the way a hand grips the phone, but well-designed communications software compensates for a variety of external factors and prevents calls from dropping, the person said.

Mr. Jobs did not learn about the software problem until after the iPhone 4 shipped last month, the person said.

The glitch could presumably be fixed with a software update, and it appears to be unrelated to one that affected the display of the phone’s signal strength.

Might be what Marty keeps bringing up with Mossberg's review.

 

[scorcho]

i'm so pissed at Apple. i dropped my iphone in the toilet and now the damn thing won't turn on. it worked before it fell!

shoddy craftsmanship, and it gets worse each generation.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Did they hide it? I've seen all sorts of people bitching about it not being there - in all the antenna threads?

Not sure. Mine were there on my jailbroken iPhone and when I restored my i4 to that backup, the dBm was there instead of bars.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

i'm so pissed at Apple. i dropped my iphone in the toilet and now the damn thing won't turn on. it worked before it fell!

shoddy craftsmanship, and it gets worse each generation.

Interesting I dropped and submerged my iPhone 2G completely in water. It was acting weird for a day. But all was well after that.

 

[wolfmat]

So he's basically saying that there's an issue with the physical layer interpretation, like the line code or whatevs?

If yes, no good show coming from a bleeding-edge company like Apple.

 

[Srider]

i'm so pissed at Apple. i dropped my iphone in the toilet and now the damn thing won't turn on. it worked before it fell!

shoddy craftsmanship, and it gets worse each generation.

Wait, the Iphone4 isn't waterproof? Another reason to skip it.

 

[Tobor]

So he's basically saying that there's an issue with the physical layer interpretation, like the line code or whatevs?

If yes, no good show coming from a bleeding-edge company like Apple.

Well, it would be good in the sense that it could be corrected without a recall. Who knows what to believe anymore. Everyone has a source saying something different. I guess we'll find out tomorrow.

 

[Gary Whitta]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/16/technology/16apple.html?_r=3&partner=yahoofinance



Might be what Marty keeps bringing up with Mossberg's review.

So... software fix after all?

 

[Lord Error]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/16/technology/16apple.html?_r=3&partner=yahoofinance

Might be what Marty keeps bringing up with Mossberg's review.

Yeah its been speculated that some baseband software could be updated to help filtering out the antenna interference. One can only hope, but if that was true, they would have told so, instead of making a press release and subsequent OS update with ridiculous signal strength calculation change.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Well, it would be good in the sense that it could be corrected without a recall. Who knows what to believe anymore. Everyone has a source saying something different. I guess we'll find out tomorrow.

My thoughts exactly.

 

[wolfmat]

Well, it would be good in the sense that it could be corrected without a recall. Who knows what to believe anymore. Everyone has a source saying something different. I guess we'll find out tomorrow.

It makes sense though. I mean, you can fuck shit like line codes up easily. Especially if there's advanced magic going on.

So... software fix after all?

Maybe, eh? Would be quite the save in terms of PR.

 

[PhoncipleBone]

It makes sense though. I mean, you can fuck shit like line codes up easily. Especially if there's advanced magic going on.

Maybe, eh? Would be quite the save in terms of PR.

But what would the haters do then?

 

[scorcho]

Yeah its been speculated that some baseband software could be updated to help filtering out the antenna interference. One can only hope, but if that was true, they would have told so, instead of making a press release and subsequent OS update with ridiculous signal strength calculation change.

i can't believe that it's a software fix alone - one would think that the 4.1 beta would've at least contained it, then.

 

[Gary Whitta]

But what would the haters do then?

They'll just keep on hating, nothing can stop them.

 

[nib95]

All I know is OS 4.0.1 has not solved the signal loss problem. And at 500mb I'm kind of curious to know what it does beyond just a signal display fix. Does anyone know whether it's fixed the sensor issues during calls? Past 4am here, so too late for me to test call anyone.

 

[Tobor]

All I know is OS 4.0.1 has not solved the signal loss problem. And at 500mb I'm kind of curious to know what it does beyond just a signal display fix. Does anyone know whether it's fixed the sensor issues during calls? Past 4am here, so too late for me to test call anyone.

The firmware is always over 500MB, no matter what they change.

 

[StuBurns]

All I know is OS 4.0.1 has not solved the signal loss problem. And at 500mb I'm kind of curious to know what it does beyond just a signal display fix. Does anyone know whether it's fixed the sensor issues during calls? Past 4am here, so too late for me to test call anyone.

You in the UK? You can call me, I won't speak to you, but I'll leave it on for you.

 

[nib95]

You in the UK? You can call me, I won't speak to you, but I'll leave it on for you.

PM me your number. You can talk to me if you want dude lol.

 

[MassiveAttack]

They'll just keep on hating, nothing can stop them.

 

[nib95]

Just tested the sensor thing with Stu. I think the issue has been sorted. As far as I can tell I didn't accidental press any buttons on the screen whilst stupidly flailing the phone about on my cheek lol. Woohooo! This was bugging the hell out of me.

 

[StuBurns]

Just tested the sensor thing with Stu. I think the issue has been sorted. As far as I can tell I didn't accidental press any buttons on the screen whilst stupidly flailing the phone about on my cheek lol. Woohooo! This was bugging the hell out of me.

Damn, now everyone is going to figure out the riddle of my username. I thought that was going to die with me.

 

[Raistlin]

But what would the haters do then?

Bitch about the proximity sensor

 

[StopMakingSense]

Not sure. Mine were there on my jailbroken iPhone and when I restored my i4 to that backup, the dBm was there instead of bars.

Yeah, for some reason backup restores of jailbroken iPhones can bring back the dBm metering.

 

[teacupcopter]

They'll just keep on hating, nothing can stop them.

You know I'm just one person and I know there are rabid fans on both sides of the camp but

as a somewhat apple hater myself if they had a software fix it'd be pretty great

My main thing is if I had bought one of the iphone 4s that had a problem and they made me put a bumper on it I'd be sad They look so sexy why cover it up?

Anyway is there any chance they'll announce new touches at this conference thing? I want one but I heard a rumour new touches based on iphone 4 might be out in sept?