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[bitwise]

It's a yes -- IF you buy the bundle that includes the "XPod," or obtain (note: Not "purchase," as that's still being worked out) it separately. There won't be an Xbox Next with a built-in, non-removable HDD, and one with a "bay" for one. There's one machine with a slot.

interesting! if true

but im sure people will find a way to complain about it :lol

 

[mj1108]

Even though it may be meaningless to US, it is a HUGE selling point to parents who are purchasing the console for their kids or to the average "Joe Q. Public". Anyone who has worked retail can vouch that it is a selling point (see PS2 and GBA).

 

[bishoptl]

Yes I have.

Then you missed an excellent opportunity to expand your education. Justifying continued allocation of shelf space for previous-gen titles only makes sense from the store's point of view if the newer consoles can support those titles through BC. That's why you can catch PS One titles with decent - not great, but decent - positioning in your local EB or Gamestop to this day, while Dreamcast and N64 titles are piled in the back, if they enjoy any sort of presence at all.

 

[wipeout364]

It's a yes -- IF you buy the bundle that includes the "XPod," or obtain (note: Not "purchase," as that's still being worked out) it separately. There won't be an Xbox Next with a built-in, non-removable HDD, and one with a "bay" for one. There's one machine with a slot.

I would gladly accept this though I have to wonder if Revolution and PS3 are BC out of the box is Microsoft going to price point well below revolution and PS3? Afterall they are charging me for something their competitors offer as a pack in?

 

[Azrael]

Multiconsole ownership is great when you add that second or third console to your collection, but once you're up to five or six systems the thought of having even more systems cluttering my entertainment center or collecting dust in my closet starts to become unacceptable to me. I'd prefer the industry to eventually consolidate to a single console standard, but the next best thing is BC consoles. At least then I only need one MS console, one Nintendo console and one Sony console to have access to my whole library.

 

[KeithFranklin]

Then you missed an excellent opportunity to expand your education. Justifying continued allocation of shelf space for previous-gen titles only makes sense from the store's point of view if the newer consoles can support those titles through BC. That's why you can catch PS One titles with decent - not great, but decent - positioning in your local EB or Gamestop to this day, while Dreamcast and N64 titles are piled in the back, if they enjoy any sort of presence at all.

This has nothing to do with the fact tht you can purchase a PSone for $49.99 (or is it cheaper?).

 

[fullmetalzero]

I would gladly accept this though I have to wonder if Revolution and PS3 are BC out of the box is Microsoft going to price point well below revolution and PS3? Afterall they are charging me for something their competitors offer as a pack in?

That's definitely something MS has to weigh. The tricky thing with Xbox Next BC is that it requires an HDD, something Sony and Nintendo don't need to worry about. With the XN, the HDD "accessory" will be there to facilitate BC, content download, etc.

BC on the XN (enough acronyms?) will, as pitched to developers, enhance the visuals of Xbox games "substantially more" than PS2 did for PS1 games.

 

[Mrbob]

It's a yes -- IF you buy the bundle that includes the "XPod," or obtain (note: Not "purchase," as that's still being worked out) it separately. There won't be an Xbox Next with a built-in, non-removable HDD, and one with a "bay" for one. There's one machine with a slot.

Great, the $300 barrier is about to be shattered with this seperate Xbox 2 release. No way do I see MS packaging the basic model at $199 and the HDD/BW Compatible model at $299. I forsee $299 and $399.

I really want Xbox 360, and will more than likely be there at launch, but I'm not too big a fan with what I'm hearing about the next Xbox. Xbox 360 is going to be the console that breaks the $50 game barrier ($59.99+ game prices) and will be breaking the $299 hardware pricepoint barrier. MS isn't even the market leader either but I guess when you launch early you can dictate things a little better when the 1000 pound behemoth isn't out till the next year.

 

[fullmetalzero]

Great, the $300 barrier is about to be shattered with this seperate Xbox 2 release. No way do I see MS packaging the basic model at $199 and the HDD/BW Compatible model at $299. I forsee $299 and $399.

What if the HDD/BC bundle also included a wireless Live Communicator, a 1 year Live subscription, and a Live-enabled Xbox Next game?

 

[Teddman]

I could forsee a scenario where the more expensive hard-drive version of the Xbox 360 has bw compatibility, or if it's only enabled when you buy the hard drive add-on, etc.

They could enable backwards compatibility in much the same way the Xbox enabled DVD playback: an optional add-on device or software pack.

It's a yes -- IF you buy the bundle that includes the "XPod," or obtain (note: Not "purchase," as that's still being worked out) it separately. There won't be an Xbox Next with a built-in, non-removable HDD, and one with a "bay" for one. There's one machine with a slot.

Wow, didn't take long for that prediction to come true.

 

[fullmetalzero]

Wow, didn't take long for that prediction to come true.

Glad I could help.

 

[Mrbob]

What if the HDD/BC bundle also included a wireless Live Communicator, a 1 year Live subscription, and a Live-enabled Xbox Next game?

Too many ifs and what are we talking in price?

I'll tell you what:

Xbox 360 w/ HDD w/ Perfect Dark Zero w/ a one year subscription that extends my current one (Better not be a deal for new subscribers only) @ $399 and I'm interested

 

[CrimsonSkies]

What I don't understand is if the support of older games costs a company resources, money, development time, hardware, etc on their console. Why is that not taken into account when discussing the power of the next gen systems? If one console clearly positions itself away from this support and the others target it. I would think there would be pros and cons to both approaches correct?

 

[PhatSaqs]

I really dont care but I can see why some people would. It would be cool to have the ability to go back and play some of the older games. Not having that ability aint a huge knock but it becomes a blemish when your competitors have it.

 

[fullmetalzero]

I'll tell you what:

Xbox 360 w/ HDD w/ Perfect Dark Zero w/ a one year subscription that extends my current one (Better not be a deal for new subscribers only) @ $399 and I'm interested

Don't forget the wireless Live Communicator. Sweeten that deal! :lol

 

[Mooreberg]

I'm not interested. Unless they say they're supporting it, in which case it is a brilliant idea.

 

[cvxfreak]

Considering the relative lack of GameCube owners this gen, backwards compatibility can only help.

 

[KeithFranklin]

Great, the $300 barrier is about to be shattered with this seperate Xbox 2 release. No way do I see MS packaging the basic model at $199 and the HDD/BW Compatible model at $299. I forsee $299 and $399.

Actually they wont market it that way. They will market it the same way Sony marketed the PS2 at $299 and the GCN at $199 when they launched when the real launch prices were $335 and $230 because they both required a storage device. Thats what MS is really doing this time, accept giving you the opportunity to choose a storage device that holds much more information. So Xbox 2 retails for $299.99 and you choose what storage device you want and there will be several options from basic storage card that allow several game saves to a HD that allows hundreds plus allows you to keep a music collection and all sorts of other stuff. The key is they can market it at $299.99. Same thing if they choose to offer BC for say $30-$40.

 

[Teddman]

I'm cool with that add-on price, if it really comes with all the trimmings mentioned.

One good thing is that Xbox devs will no longer be able to tie savefiles to the hard drive only. I used to hate how you couldn't copy save files to memory cards in games like Burnout series or Tecmo's titles. Now they will have to support all save options, and I can bring a save file over to a friend's house easily.

 

[ecliptic]

Xbox fans are on a full defensive right now.

Eh?

Let's call it pre-emptive damage control.

And all the reasons listed above are very good points, not to mention the space issue.

Like there is something be defensive about? We never bought the Xbox with expectations of it being backwards compatible with any system. It's not like we are new console owners. Sure BC would be nice but in no way necessary. I would rather have some other feature then MS spending money on backward compatibility.

Even though it may be meaningless to US, it is a HUGE selling point to parents who are purchasing the console for their kids or to the average "Joe Q. Public". Anyone who has worked retail can vouch that it is a selling point (see PS2 and GBA).

The problem with that assumption is that most parents are ignorant.

 

[Duckhuntdog]

*turns to his Xenon SDK* Do you have backwards compatability?
Xenon SDK- No.
Will you have it in final hardware kits?
Xenon SDK- Probably not.

 

[Mrbob]

I'm cool with that add-on price, if it really comes with all the trimmings mentioned.

One good thing is that Xbox devs will no longer be able to tie savefiles to the hard drive only. I used to hate how you couldn't copy save files to memory cards in games like Burnout series or Tecmo's titles. Now they will have to support all save options, and I can bring a save file over to a friend's house easily.

Yup, and this is why I really don't care too much about BC for Xbox 360. I have everything unlocked in Ninja Gaiden. It took a ton of time and faq guiding to accomplish it! Wasn't easy unlocking the original trilogy but I got it done! Don't want to go through that again just want to play the games!

It would be cool once Gaiden goes Platinum Hits Tecmo unlocks everything from the start! That way I could play the original NES trilogy on Xbox 360!

 

[Kai Dracon]

I'd wager BC is also more important to some of the hardcore gamer set than they think at first glance, if they happent to collect games. Games for the last couple gens and here on out, are largely on long-lasting optical discs. Hardware is much more prone to failure. I have a nice collection of PSOne and now PSTwo games. My PSOne is LONG gone. In five more years, when PS4 appears, it'd be just slightly nice if I didn't have to worry about my ten-year-old PSTwo chugging along to keep my game library from being more than a useless collector's shelf.

 

[human5892]

I would rather have some other feature then MS spending money on backward compatibility.

This line of thinking needs to stop. The PSOne emulator inside the PS2 does more than just run old PSX games, you know...

 

[Pedigree Chum]

The problem with that assumption is that most parents are ignorant.

What do you think sales people are there for? I know that BC made a difference when parents bought PS2's over XBox's. But I found in most cases built-in DVD playback was a BIG factor for some odd reason, if MS has any sense they'll make it standard next gen (without having to buy a remote).

 

[Ozchin]

I have a modded Xbox as my home media center, and that's not going to be gotten rid of anytime soon, so I don't care about BC. Besides, all the new online games I will be playing will be on my Xenon.

BC is important for PS3 and "Revolution" because it sounds like everyone is going to dump the old hardware for the new.

 

[Pedigree Chum]

This line of thinking needs to stop. The PSOne emulator inside the PS2 does more than just run old PSX games, you know...

Well it's not an emulator...Isn't the PSX hardware inside the PS2, like on a small chip that handles PSX games, or I/O on PS2 games?

 

[human5892]

Well it's not an emulator...Isn't the PSX hardware inside the PS2, like on a small chip that handles PSX games, or I/O on PS2 games?

Yeah, sorry. Poor choice of word on my part.

 

[evilromero]

One thing people fail to realize is that GameCube software won't look as dated two years from now like PSone soft did by the advent of the PS2. We've come to a point where visuals won't drastically improve year-to-year.

 

[Monk]

- BC is important to consumers who already have a large collection of games
- BC is important to parents/children/price conscious consumers who are satisfied with budget titles
- BC is important to developers knowing they can reuse old engines for future games
- BC is important to publishers who can keep on rereleasing older games as budget titles
- BC is important to publishers who want to cater for budget, mid and high price range consumers
- BC is important to retailers who have old stock to shift and shelf space dedicated to older games
- BC is important to retailers who want to cater for budget, mid and high price range consumers
- BC is important for the media because it means your console is launching with a back catalogue of hundreds (GCN) to thousands (PS3) of games and variety = sales.

I'm not interested in BC personally (although it means not having so many consoles hooked up at one time) but all those important participants of the videogame industry are.

Add guys like me who havent bought and Xbox and still would like a couple of games from the Xbox.

 

[Fatghost]

Ken Kutaragi and others from Sony have said many times that PS3 will play PS2 and PS1 games.

So it's pretty safe to assume PS3 will be backwards compatible.

 

[ImNotLikeThem]

One thing people fail to realize is that GameCube software won't look as dated two years from now like PSone soft did by the advent of the PS2. We've come to a point where visuals won't drastically improve year-to-year.

exactly. Theres a big difference between the two generations, and the main reason why people don't play ps1/n64 games right now is that compared to the average game released today, the average game from last gen looks like "Crap". 3D gaming was just coming into it's own, people were getting used to the ins and outs, and the hardware was not really capable of what people were looking for.
The current gen is much more accessible when it comes to not only graphics (including frame rate, models, textures) but just general "together"ness; the audio, video, the game engine itself. Seriously now. Go back and look at, for example, FF7. Then look at FFX. I find it much easier to picture myself playing a game like FFX 5 years from now, than say playing FF7 today. Last gen didn't really age well overall. I hope that makes sense at least...

 

[acidviper]

I don't care about BC unless they can actually improve graphics/loading times. Unlike teh PS2 which did nothing to PS1 games. Then again when a system is 2 generations behind they are great to play on PC emulators. ZSNES owned when it was launched and still rocks and PS1 emulators do a great job cleaning up jaggy games like FFIX and Vagrant Story. Chrono Chross looks fantastic. And saving wherever you want/speeding up text is just a godsend.

 

[human5892]

Unlike teh PS2 which did nothing to PS1 games.

Actually, the PS2 does filter PS1 games a bit, and I believe many load noticably faster, as well.

 

[Ranger X]

Actually, the PS2 does filter PS1 games a bit, and I believe many load noticably faster, as well.

If ever the PS3 takes PS1 games or emulate them, i truly wish they would not only filter it but use other effects and whatnot from it's GPU like AT LEAST some perspective correcting and display higher res.

 

[Ghost of Bill Gates]

So what is the deal with BW compatibility in XENON

Is it a no for sure?

# Question: Will Xenon have backwards compatibility?

Answer: This is, by far, the most common question that you guys have been asking. The short answer is that it's still being determined.

From what I've heard (and what several outlets have been reporting already), the original plans were for the system not to have backwards compatibility. From a numbers standpoint, it makes sense. More than a few publishers have told me that the feature isn't nearly as important as enthusiasts think; publishers feel that it's vital for the first year of the console's lifespan at best and only if the launch lineup is weak.

Sources tell me that Microsoft is now considering a backwards compatibility solution, mostly because of the marketing hit the system would take for not having it. It's almost not worth the trouble to omit the feature.

Question: Why is there only 256 MB of RAM?

Answer: The mistake many readers are making is to equate the amount of RAM to that of a PC. A console does not need as much RAM as a PC because it's a specialized device that serves a specific function and it does not need to run a full operating system.

That said, a few developers pulled me aside to tell me that they think Microsoft is upping the RAM to 512 MB.

Question: Will gamer profile information be used for sales and marketing purposes?

Answer: From what I've heard, there will be some opt-in features for gamers to receive information on products they might enjoy. The choice is entirely up to each user of the console and the selection will be saved in the gamer profile.

Question: Will there be 1080i games for Xenon?

Answer: Yes for sure.

Question: Will Xenon have wireless controllers standard?

Answer: More than a few sources have said that wireless controllers will be standard. A few have said that the design is pretty similar to the Type-S controller, but with the black and white buttons placed in a more optimal position.

Question: Since the hard drive is optional, will downloads be stored online or will the hard drive be required for downloadable content?

Answer: Nobody I asked knew anything about Internet-stored content. They all are under the impression that the hard drive will be required for downloadable content.

Question: How much will it cost?

Answer: None of my sources knew the cost of the system. Everyone expects the answer to this to be revealed this May at E3 2005.

http://xbox.gamespy.com/xbox/microsoft-xbox/595060p1.html

 

[acidviper]

there is no way to measure this or to find any sort of FAQ or anything though. Its just on a try as you go basis

 

[WrathOfOtaibah]

Backwards compatibility is what sold me on the Revolution. So yes, it is important. Vital? Of course not. However in the first few months (or sometimes, one or two years), the software is so dry that you need something to play in the mean time. This is where backwards compatibility or a big ass backlog come in play. Nintendo doesn't deliver games in the fastest of ways so during those many month stretches between great games, you can rely on the GC library for example. Same can be said for the DS wait and that GBA games can be used.

It definitely is important.

 

[PG2G]

Actually, PS3 has never been confirmed to be backwards compatible. Everyone is just assuming that's the case, and probably rightly so. The most Kutaragi has said on the matter is that they were looking into it.

 

[Fatghost]

Actually, PS3 has never been confirmed to be backwards compatible. Everyone is just assuming that's the case, and probably rightly so. The most Kutaragi has said on the matter is that they were looking into it.

From September 2003:

http://www.gamespot.com/ps/news/news_6074473.html

"PSOne runs on the PlayStation 2 through emulation rather than actual hardware. PlayStation 3 will offer the same compatibility for PS2 software, and the format will continue forever," Kutaragi reportedly told Japanese newspaper Asahi Shimbun.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?section_name=pub&aid=2171

This trend - started by Sony with the PS2, as backwards compatibility in home consoles was certainly not the norm before then - is set to continue with the PS3, which will offer emulation for the PS2 and hence for the PSone.

"PSone runs on the PlayStation 2 through emulation rather than actual hardware. PlayStation 3 will offer the same compatibility for PS2 software and the format will continue forever," he explained.

There was some confusion over whether this referred to PS2 compatibility only, but logically, PS2 compatibility would entail PS1 compatibility anyway.

 

[PG2G]

Hrm, guess I missed that one. But I'm pretty sure I remember "We're looking into it." And I'm also fairly sure that it was after September 2003.

 

[Blimblim]

In truth, though, that is a discussion for another thread....I was actually wondering if anyone had any insight (Blimblim) concerning a Yes/No of Xbox BC via XENON??

My reply will be: No comment. Take it as you will

 

[Fatghost]

Hrm, guess I missed that one. But I'm pretty sure I remember "We're looking into it." And I'm also fairly sure that it was after September 2003.

You might be thinking of this one:

Kutaragi also confirmed that work is underway to make the PS3 compatible with previous generation PlayStations, but that challenges lie ahead. "[Backwards compatibility] is our desire and it's something we need to take on. We really want to make backwards compatibility happen--we think that's the beauty of the PS," said Kutaragi.

http://www.gamepro.com/sony/ps2/hardware/news/38193.shtml

From September 2004.

 

[VictimOfGrief]

My reply will be: No comment. Take it as you will

Don't know where you get your information, but all of your signs point to yes so you might as well spill the beans.

 

[Blimblim]

Don't know where you get your information, but all of your signs point to yes so you might as well spill the beans.

This is a very touchy subject for MS, so don't count on me there. I do not like holding information, but on this particular subject I won't tell anything.

 

[Nerevar]

My reply will be: No comment. Take it as you will

seriously Blimblim, what's more important: your job or your gaming board reputation? Spill the beans man.

 

[Hitler Stole My Potato]

MS is very sensitive about Backward Compatibility and their weight.


And for the love of god, please don't talk about how they're going bald!

 

[ironichaos]

I can tell you the main reason Iwata announced Revolution would be backwards compatible is such that 3rd party developers aren't hesitant to continue making games for the GameCube.

 

[Redbeard]

This is a very touchy subject for MS, so don't count on me there. I do not like holding information, but on this particular subject I won't tell anything.

Just create a joke account - a joke account for spilling beans.

 

[Blimblim]

seriously Blimblim, what's more important: your job or your gaming board reputation? Spill the beans man.

My job ? I'm not a MS employee or anything like that. My job is not even remotely linked to Microsoft in any way, even our computers and servers all run linux, except a few test boxes.
But believe me, my friends' trust is much more important to me than telling stuff to strangers on a gaming board.